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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 10:32   #1
Igloo
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Planetarion Radio

I am thinking about making a Planetarion Radio station, to help keep the die hards awake at night. I would like to know what the community think of this, there will be a discussion with the community some time in the near future, to discuss this further, but first i need to speak to jolt.
  • Music (requests and the like)
  • Shoutouts, from alliances or just for the hell of it
  • Recruitment Messages (like instead of advertising) from alliances
  • Interviews with leading planets each week
  • Interviews with alliances, if they have a big defeat or if they are merging and disbanding etc
  • Interviews at the end of the round, with the alliances, to discuss what went well with them, and what they enjoyed / disliked
  • Chance for the alliances to get some good PR done, come and do a show for an hour!
  • oh, and to keep us all up on those all nighters during the round :P

please post your comments.

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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 12:37   #2
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Re: Planetarion Radio

It would be fun if you could get it off the ground (and cleared with Jolt, I suppose).
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 12:55   #3
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Ahh you dont need Jolts permission, just make it unofficial
Igloo is a true DJaaaaaaay
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 13:11   #4
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Re: Planetarion Radio

The problem PA Radio always seems to have is the community has such a diverse taste that you alienate listeners easierly with the DJ's choice in music (or other peoples requests). If they start playing pop music its going to force a bucnh of listeners to put their own music on or go to a station that matches their taste, same if they start playing rock, hip-hop ect ect.

Thats the challenge that really has to be overcome if you want this to be successful
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 13:16   #5
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Since most radios manage to reach out to a broad spectre of audience i am quite sure this one can make it too.
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 13:59   #6
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Would be quite cool if it could be realised We could all spread it around to friends etc and make them listen and maybe they starts playing PA? Who knows
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 14:13   #7
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Re: Planetarion Radio

well it needs a whole crew of DJs and not only 1 to keep it up on a daily basis. i think several alliances have/had their own radios and i am sure there are still ppl who would like to take part and help out!
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 14:19   #8
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Re: Planetarion Radio

i dont think that it'd become official tbh

Of course another thing to think about is all the licensing issues if you're going to be playing commercial music ( and for that reason i dont think its going to be ok'd by jolt officially )
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 14:42   #9
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Re: Planetarion Radio

then lets make it unofficial, i am going to be speaking to jolt, and there will be about 5/10 regular dj's doing all varieties of music

thanks for all the replies people DD
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 16:10   #10
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kargool
Since most radios manage to reach out to a broad spectre of audience i am quite sure this one can make it too.
Most radio stations however do have a core target audience and the music is hence aimed at this group. And many radio statiosn rely on their listeners being somewhat stuck to listening to whats being played for whatever reason. While at your PC to listen to web radio you are surrounded by thousands of choices, you have you CD collection, Your MP3s, probally a radio and millions of net radio stations

THis idea has been done before and it was the music being played that al;ways drove people away because they would think "why am i listening the the last 5 crap songs when i have access to something that suits my tastes better". If people tune in they need to keep them else its a complete waste of time. I guess what might help is if there was a more static schedual and themeing of teh shows so that people are tuning in because that hour suits their taste and will keep them listening to the whole show. But it would need a fair balance really so that pretty much everyone has something they might want to tune into and people wouldnt be able to stray from their theme too much, if it was down as a hiphop show then you couldnt have them playing Girls Aloud records ect ect
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 16:15   #11
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Could be a good idea, especially if the 5-10 DJs were spread around the globe so we had 24hr coverage.

look forward to more info as it comes
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 16:18   #12
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Re: Planetarion Radio

yeah, im looking to get a link put out during creators hour, which links to a form, so i can look at what people want, so i can decide the shows, what music, and so on, this means that if for example, there is alot more hip-hop listened to then for example, rock. there will be more shows based around that style, than anything else.

I think people would listen to it, due to having announcements about the round, downtime problems, and such. We (the dj's) would also be able to create proper shows, not just streamed music, where members of the community would be able to come on and talk, if they so wished.

We could also do discussion groups, about planetarion discussions :P so that we know exactly what can and cant be done. this means that there will be less time spent by PA team going over them, and we can only pass on the ideas that the community like and are viable.

Also this whole Jolt deciding what the community can and cannot do is wrong. moraly wrong, if i want to run a radio station, out of my own pocket, and promote a game i love, why shouldnt i be able to?

(sure there will be some Jolt critism, but thats just the way that things are.

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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 16:25   #13
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Hmm, maybe an idea to appeal to different tastes is have a mix during the day and then in the evenings do say a rock evening one night, then a pop evening etc.
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 17:41   #14
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Igloo they would be well within their rights to prevent you using any reference to Planetarion and if they did it would be understandable as the whole aspect of net radio is a grey area legally as you should actually be paying licencing fees and royalties and they may not want the name Planetarion connected whatsoever to anything illegal. Also they could take offence to anything anti jolt and you would be liable to anything said that wasnt true so they could also stop you that way if your not careful.

Not that I think they would do either, they let the community do pretty much what they want off their own backs, its just when its done by those working officially for them or something done via official channels that they take any real action
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 19:35   #15
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Re: Planetarion Radio

You don't have to refer to PA in the name of the station,
and i doubt its illigal to talk 2 the community about how things are going etc... or about the game even

Why not call ur radio station: Manipulate On Air, Planet Igloo or The Core
or something else crappy... or have a vote on the forum about the radio stations name..
That's also free PR

The idea is good enough to try it out for a while...


[edit] I usually post on a dutch forum and they also broadcast once a week, with interviews and stuff.. its quite cool..
but I doubt u guys can manage to do that every night tho..
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 19:50   #16
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Re: Planetarion Radio

once a week we can do. not every night for definate.
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 19:54   #17
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Or call it TPM, Teh propeganda machine
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 20:07   #18
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Oh no, we dont like your songs, the poor children.... jking mate :P
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 23:35   #19
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Funky idea... But I've got a couple of questions...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iggy

Interviews with leading planets each week
Interviews with alliances, if they have a big defeat or if they are merging and disbanding etc
Interviews at the end of the round, with the alliances, to discuss what went well with them, and what they enjoyed / disliked
While being several good points... I question how exactly you'll plan to interview these guys/people?

1. Full voices, just as most radio shows are done: This maybe hard to do due to time zone differences, technology, and also perhaps language barriers.... how do you propose to get around this?

2. An IRC interview... Definitely more feasible, allows for more time to think... generally the preferred interview format. Problem is, how do you convey that to a radio show? "Person says: .... Person replies.... Person says more..... etc" Becomes kind of awkward doesn't it?

Given these two scenarios... How do you think these interviews could be accomplished?
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 23:42   #20
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Interviews can be set up in advance with the people, taking into account that only english speaking people could come into concideration for interview, or if really important for non english speaking a translator.
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Unread 29 Sep 2005, 23:44   #21
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Quote:
Originally Posted by Orion Treet
Interviews can be set up in advance with the people, taking into account that only english speaking people could come into concideration for interview, or if really important for non english speaking a translator.
While I can appreciate that... If the suggestions of say once a week goes into effect... then there will be some people that will need to be constantly on top of things and working on the show itself on a very regular basis for the whole round...

Given the disappointing amount of effort donated to the uplink some time ago, is this amount of effort going to exist in the radio show? {not to knock igloo or anything... just, setting up voice interviews once a week, carrying them out, and getting a show line-up sounds pretty hefty for a work schedule... Just hope the poor guy won't burn out =p }
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Unread 30 Sep 2005, 00:34   #22
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Re: Planetarion Radio

if I ll listen to it depends on what music is being played yeah.

Also I thought about the same points squiddly raised.

I ll give it a go atleast if u pull it off.

Best of luck, and a good initiative.
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Unread 30 Sep 2005, 01:23   #23
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Re: Planetarion Radio

meant to ask would it be a shoutcast radio or ... ?
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Unread 30 Sep 2005, 14:42   #24
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Re: Planetarion Radio

it will probably be shoutcast. But with an option to load an online version inside a webpage.



thanks for the ideas about the interviews, as i said, im just plucking at ideas at the moment, and i will need to give it more thought. Your views are noted.

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Unread 30 Sep 2005, 16:16   #25
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Rember DJ's!!! control his music choice though...
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Unread 30 Sep 2005, 18:41   #26
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Re: Planetarion Radio

imho this would work better as a podcast. Something which isnt done live gives you alot more control on the quality and makes aspects like interviews easier. Also most podcasts get around the legal aspects by not including music as it isnt really needed but if you do feel the need for some music perhaps it could be used ti showcase some usical talent in the community or the communities circle of friends where the rights to broadcast a track of theirs could be secured. This music track could be played around half way (depending on the length of the show) with the kinds of other things you were talking about including around it. You would then release one a week, maybe two and because of the fact its not done live you can take time mixing it together so it makes interviews ect easier
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Unread 1 Oct 2005, 15:24   #27
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Re: Planetarion Radio

that goes away from my origninal idea, of a music station primarily.

with other things in it, and pod casting invlves having somewhere to load the inforamtion from. so it would be slow if we assume 600 people lsiten to it (i.e. ingame as well).

means that we need a large serevr, wich can cope with the amounts of stata needing to be sent.
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Unread 1 Oct 2005, 17:35   #28
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Re: Planetarion Radio

This would be great fun, imagine the shoutouts when people are being waved by alliances:

'shoutout from <nick> to 1up, well done on twatting me again! ps vengance soon' fun fun.

(oh yeah, assuming co-ords are out that is. )
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Unread 1 Oct 2005, 18:54   #29
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Re: Planetarion Radio

id be a listener for sure, i think its a great idea, gives more life to an already decent community
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Unread 2 Oct 2005, 01:12   #30
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Quote:
Originally Posted by Igloo
that goes away from my origninal idea, of a music station primarily.

with other things in it, and pod casting invlves having somewhere to load the inforamtion from. so it would be slow if we assume 600 people lsiten to it (i.e. ingame as well).

means that we need a large serevr, wich can cope with the amounts of stata needing to be sent.
That however has been one of the reasons PARadio has fallen over on numourous occasions, the focus has simply been wrong. Music tastes are not a common factor between PA Players, which means at anyone time your probally alientaing 80% of potential listeners in the community, Coupled with the fact that timezones will also knock a good percentage of the listeners out also your producing what is in the end a very niche peice of programing. Now products aimed at niche markets arent always a bad thing but PA itself is also a product ina niche market so your aiming your limited appeal product at a userbase which is playing a game thats also a limited appeal product whcih isnt good. Now theres one thing which most people here have in common and which hence has a high levelof appeal and thats Planetarion. It will be these planetarion elements of the radio which are the attraction NOT the music and thats what needs pushed to be a success.

As for distribution of a podcast, its alot easier than you think if you think about it. All you really need is

1) An FTP server on a server with a fairly high speed line.
2) A Bitorrent Tracker
3) Volenteers

Your produce your show and upload it to the FTP server. The FTP server will be accesable to your team of volnteers only. Each of these wil download at a highish speed from your FTP server. Once a few people have the file you will publish the file on your tracker and hand the torrent file over to your volenteers whom will acts as seeds. The torrent will then be released on a larger scale and people will start downloading it. The more people downloading and sharing the easier it is to share it

If you want to offer an archive of shows then after a certain time when the torrent will have died it could be uploaded somewhere to download as the traffic would be lowish

Jolt also could maybe help out with bandwith and if not then something like http://creativecommons.org/ will host anything which doesnt infringe copyright and hence the podcast without copyright music would be fine
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Unread 3 Oct 2005, 15:29   #31
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Re: Planetarion Radio

I would like to suggest some program of 1 hour duration with Intruder/BetrayerOfHope/Heartless as DJs for some specific tastes
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Unread 5 Oct 2005, 14:42   #32
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Re: Planetarion Radio

wakey whilst i know what your saying, and its a percectly good idea, i just find that recording my shows them sending them out is incredibly dull, its just the dj talking, with little or no interaction.

I would much rather take on the pressure and stress of it all.

I am looking for a volunteer who owns a dedicated server (on 100mb burst speed preffered) to host the server,per user, it requires 12kbps. *edit* we can link multiple people together who have high speed connections using a setting in the shoutcast server, called "relaying" they connect to the main server, then pass things on from it, as a secondry server, so if we cannot find someonw who has the high speed requirements, we can allways link 5 or so people via this, and still get enough speed to serve as much of the community as possible. *edit*

so its not a huge drain on bandwidth, but it is for a home user, we could only host 3 maybe 4 people at a time, this would be frustrating for thepeople who want to listen and cant, they probably wouldnt come back to listen again.

i hope to start broadcasting before the new round (a week or so before) so we can do some interviews with PA team and the likes.

I will take all of your ideas on board, thank you, and i shall contact some of the names that you suggested to see what their music tastes are.

It will probably be like this, during the day, a variety of music will be played. and from 6pm till 11 / 12 (midnight) we shall run the shows, for specific types of music, or open dj nights. where anyone who can upload at 12kbps constant, and has a variety of music and some skillz can come and dj to stop it from being the same dj's all the time.

Interviews willmost likely be scheduled for 7pm on friday nights.

There will be a special 2 hour show for the start of the round, talking about the stats, (with maybe even Appocomaster at the mic? ) the code changes (kloopy anyone?), a word from the current head of the multi hunting team, and of course, a countdown to the ticker starting (or not starting, whichever :P )

Thats what it looks like, if i have missed anything you think should be there,let me know either on IRC or here. (irc is sometimes better to discuss things then i can post here).

I think thats all.

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Unread 5 Oct 2005, 14:43   #33
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Igloo - you might want to find Horst somewhere. Hes just bought a dedicated server and if you batter your eyelids lovingly he might let you use it.
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Unread 5 Oct 2005, 14:45   #34
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Re: Planetarion Radio

/me runs off to find Horst to give him some Igloo love
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Unread 5 Oct 2005, 14:45   #35
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Re: Planetarion Radio

(note i too hope to have a dedicated server set up soon (ish) if i can find a good enough data centre :P
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Unread 5 Oct 2005, 20:33   #36
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Re: Planetarion Radio

We could offer a download channel but there's all sorts of nasty legality issues with regards to music so it would have to be talk only.
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Unread 5 Oct 2005, 20:49   #37
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Quote:
Originally Posted by biffy
We could offer a download channel but there's all sorts of nasty legality issues with regards to music so it would have to be talk only.
Question regarding the nasty legal issues involving music.

The music laws that could be used against igloo or PA if used on an internet radio station... Is it a bunch of UK laws threatening the whole music bit here? IE if the server igloo is looking for is located in canada {music sharing is legal there) does that solve anything?

/me not too familiar on the legal system =/
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Unread 5 Oct 2005, 21:59   #38
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Its not legal to upload music in canada ( which is what any radio station would be doing ) , but to download it is, since you already 'pay' for it with a tax on all blank media.
so, im afraid the problem will be the same
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Unread 5 Oct 2005, 22:13   #39
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil^
Its not legal to upload music in canada ( which is what any radio station would be doing ) , but to download it is, since you already 'pay' for it with a tax on all blank media.
so, im afraid the problem will be the same
why have that too and it is still not legal in germany

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Unread 5 Oct 2005, 22:48   #40
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Re: Planetarion Radio

because canada has been pretty good so far in sticking up for the interests of its citizens and not of foreign corporate executives
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Unread 5 Oct 2005, 23:20   #41
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Even if it upsets some very excited people I'd just like to register my prefernce on a podcast. It allows much more control over the content. I know for sure that I wouldn't tune in to a 12k/sec feed every night, I'd much rather listen to my choice of 160kbps mp3s. However, if there was a 30 or 60 minute weekly/bi-weekly podcast with news about the game, the politics, big attacks, new round info, etc and interviews with pateam, alliance leaders, players etc then I'd certainly take the time to listen to that. A podcast that acts as some kind of aggregator of all the PA world news gossip and interesting tid bits would be fantastic.

Not only that but you don't alienate your AU/NZ listeners by playing whilst they're asleep or the US/CA players whilst they're on their way home from school/work. It's all well and good catering to the Europe listeners but I think in a game like PA teh advantages of having a podcast over a radio broadcast are massive.
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Unread 5 Oct 2005, 23:22   #42
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Quote:
Originally Posted by biffy
We could offer a download channel but there's all sorts of nasty legality issues with regards to music so it would have to be talk only.
or copyright free music

Anyway I doubt igloo will take you up on this offer which is a shame because using the podcast method where its not reliant on timezones and removes the music taste of listeners element seems like the perfect way to get a PA audio broadcast to work. I have been around this community long enough to see many attempts to pull the shoutcast model off and every time PAradio has started off with a good start and then dropped off until its the same handful listening and this could have sorted most of the major hurdles it faced. I know you lose some of the edge you get with a live broadcast but the gains are wrth it imho.

As for Squidly question it really doesnt matter what country your from, when it comes to distribution of copyrighed material the laws are pretty much the same ie its illegal. The only thing server location will really effect is how to make your broadcast legal. For example in the UK you can obtain a blanket licence that will allow you broadcast any copyrighted song but this costs an annual fee which is decided based on revenue and audience size. You then have to keep detailed logs of everything you play and report it so royalty fees can be paid to the artists. I believe its the same in the US, although you can signup to live365.com and pay them a monthly fee well below the cost of purchasing a licence and in return you get the same benifit for any music being broadcast via their hosting
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Unread 7 Oct 2005, 10:22   #43
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Re: Planetarion Radio

so you people think that having a podcast for planetarion would be a good thing,

The only reason i didnt really like it, was that
a) when a new podcast is released, it takes alot of bandwidth to serve all the people.
b) They also require quite large amounts of server space.
c) its going to be very hard to get people to download it each week, due to it being solely chat based, some of the younger members might not enjoy listening to that.

If you would like to go ahead with podcast, i am very happy to do this.

BUT Only if Jolt can supply half of the server costs. Because my serever wont be able to cope with waht will opefully be a high demand, (but we need the speed for the people with high speed (and cost :P ) net connections, its not fair and they wont wait for something coming to them at 80kbps if they can download at 300 or more.

See my point?

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Unread 7 Oct 2005, 11:24   #44
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Re: Planetarion Radio

podcasts dont have to use up a lot of bandwith, as i understand it, its simply a largeish mp3 file which gets downloaded by people. Utilize the power of bittorrent to distribute it and it should knock bandwith usage down a little.
assuming ofc that people are nice enough to let the thing seed once they have downloaded it
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Unread 7 Oct 2005, 14:42   #45
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Re: Planetarion Radio

thats the problem Phil^,

we need a server to act as a tracker,

we need the server to act as a seed for 24 hours after release,

We then need members of the community to help seed the file after the server stops.
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Unread 7 Oct 2005, 16:11   #46
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Quote:
Originally Posted by Igloo
we need a server to act as a tracker,
My home machine is a tracker. Getting a tracker isn't hard, anyone with a 'broadband' connection and a no-ip/dyndns account can do that.

Quote:
we need the server to act as a seed for 24 hours after release
My home machine can seed for hours and hours! A seed doesn't need to be on a fat line, though I'll admit it helps.

Quote:
We then need members of the community to help seed the file after the server stops.
I'm afraid I can't help much with that, people being the way they are
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Unread 7 Oct 2005, 17:53   #47
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Re: Planetarion Radio

i am almost sure that radio was done before many moons ago. IT was quite successful at the time if i remember correctly. although i might be wrong because it no longer exists..... (heh)
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Unread 7 Oct 2005, 17:54   #48
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Re: Planetarion Radio

you are correct Jism
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Unread 7 Oct 2005, 17:57   #49
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Quote:
Originally Posted by JammyJim
i am almost sure that radio was done before many moons ago. IT was quite successful at the time if i remember correctly. although i might be wrong because it no longer exists..... (heh)
think it was successful and died out the djs stopped doing it, so was offline a lot
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Unread 7 Oct 2005, 18:16   #50
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Re: Planetarion Radio

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stifler
think it was successful and died out the djs stopped doing it, so was offline a lot
It has actually been tried more than once. What happened in the past is people made an effort to tune in to start with but the lack of music to suit their taste and lack of anything else to hook them starts to shrink the auidence quickly. Not many people are willing to drag themselves out of bed in the middle of the night to listen to a radio show thats mainly music they dont like and not much else or put off doing otherthings to listen and that leads it to being something listened to by a small number of people and it soon stops being worth the DJ's taking time out to do it and then it dies
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