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Unread 21 Feb 2007, 22:18   #51
Forest
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by _Kila_
I was more interested in seeing how priority for top planets with many roids was sorted.
Were top ranked planets (such as Elviz in rounds 14 and 17) given more def than lower ranked ones regardless of defpoints?

If two players had de incoming, the priority goes to the whoever has most def points.

Exceptions were:

Fleetcatches
If one could be safely covered whilst the other couldnt, you cover the one that gets covered properly.
If someone had absolutely no roids and someone else had masses, you would cover the roids, but that was very rare.
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Unread 21 Feb 2007, 22:20   #52
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Re: Flagshipping

Defence in eXilition was dynamic, depending on nesseccity.
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Unread 21 Feb 2007, 22:33   #53
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Re: Flagshipping

I think people lookng for long drawn out wars this round are being unrealistic.

CT and Destiny hit each other, both lost roids.
Destiny and VGN hit each other, bth lost roids.
Vsn and Omen hit each other last night, and lost over 10% roids apiece.

The reason is, the universe is so small that every alliance is getting way more randoms than normal. Targets pick themsleves, and are often triple booked.

Any two alliances at war are going to lose a decent amount of roids to randoms. And that means no drawn out wars, as alliances simply cant keep it up. No alliance is way ahead in skill level, meaning no alliance can keep wars up long enough to make a difference.

I think saying no-one desrves to win is unfair.

This round, alliances are facing 40-50 random incomings every single night. That is way more than 1up/exi would face. Yes in times of war we would face a lot more incming, but never that much random. The MO's in all alliances are working damn hard.
Just because an aliance may not be of high a quality as another alliance, does not mean they dont deserve a win.
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Unread 21 Feb 2007, 22:55   #54
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Re: Flagshipping

who ever has the most points at the end of the round deserves to win, because they outscored everyone else. clearly
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 00:40   #55
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by lokken
I don't see how any of the top alliances can say they deserve to win this round of planetarion. I'm glad I'm out of alliance warfare this round, if people are taking personal offence to their planet being roided then it's not something really worth being a part of.
I agree
All the top 5 allies should disband and let the ones who are actually working as a team (ToF, Orbit, F-Crew) show the rest of the univ how fun the game can be if the Officers work FOR their members, instead of using them as (for lack of a better term) batteries
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 00:59   #56
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by magistar
I agree
All the top 5 allies should disband and let the ones who are actually working as a team (ToF, Orbit, F-Crew) show the rest of the univ how fun the game can be if the Officers work FOR their members, instead of using them as (for lack of a better term) batteries
-Magi (Uber-Demi-HC)
you know what level of teamwork takes place in alliances other than the alliance you play for.... how exactly?

truth is, you don't. You base your opinion on a lot of horseshit ppl post here.

We'll use my alliance for example. In CT's private channels, members work together on a regular basis, discussing fleet composition, helping each other work out targets, teaming up on targets to get max effectiveness, laugh, joke around... matter of fact, we have a good amount of fun. You wouldn't know this ofcourse, as you've never been in our members private channel. In our defence channel. Officers work as a team to effectively handle the calls they recieve. There are no 1 man shows. There are no Officers covering themselves at the expense of the alliance. You wouldn't know this would you? You've never been in our defence channel.


before making such an ignorant post, perhaps you should know what the hell your talking about...there's an idea..

I have no idea what goes on in Destiny's private channel..as I've never been there..... Same fo VGN's private channel, Omen's private channel, VSN's private channel...etc, and any other alliances private channel... how could I presume to know what the hell goes on there when I'm not there?

edit: spelling
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 01:14   #57
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by jerome
but here we are.. once again, i'd like to credit ascendancy by our complete ignorance of alliance ranks since r16 and consistent members in high ranks since must surely have provided inspiration for this
I'll take credit for anything jeremo may achieve in Planetarion!
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 02:42   #58
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by aNgRyDuCk
you know what level of teamwork takes place in alliances other than the alliance you play for.... how exactly?

truth is, you don't. You base your opinion on a lot of horseshit ppl post here.

We'll use my alliance for example. In CT's private channels, members work together on a regular basis, discussing fleet composition, helping each other work out targets, teaming up on targets to get max effectiveness, laugh, joke around... matter of fact, we have a good amount of fun. You wouldn't know this ofcourse, as you've never been in our members private channel. In our defence channel. Officers work as a team to effectively handle the calls they recieve. There are no 1 man shows. There are no Officers covering themselves at the expense of the alliance. You wouldn't know this would you? You've never been in our defence channel.


before making such an ignorant post, perhaps you should know what the hell your talking about...there's an idea..

I have no idea what goes on in Destiny's private channel..as I've never been there..... Same fo VGN's private channel, Omen's private channel, VSN's private channel...etc, and any other alliances private channel... how could I presume to know what the hell goes on there when I'm not there?

edit: spelling
OK but he agrees with me, I've been in plenty of good alliances, so keep your ad hominems to yourself. To attack him on his experience rather than the general point is unfair, in my opinion (and that opinion is as a poster, not as a moderator, so do as you please) It's evident that there are plenty of players around being rather selfish with how they use their alliance positions, especially in the top 3. Examples were cited in this thread.

Essentially all of your arguments are based on the fact that the top three fear losing to alliances not much better than FO/ND last round i.e. each other, which is pretty pathetic. You aren't getting slagged because of the quality of the opposition, far from it. You're being slagged because any one of the top 3 could roll up their sleeves and have a proper go and try and win, but none of them want to.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 03:04   #59
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Re: Flagshipping

None of them want to win? None of them want to try?
It's all nice and dandy to be an outsider telling the top 3 alliances that they are being pansies.
I think the people who are actually involved in the war have a better idea of how tough it is to be at war in this situation, where if 2 alliances go to war for too long, they might just hand the victory over to the third one.
My advise is, go analyse this type of situation, and then come up and say why it would be better for which alliance to go at war with which other alliance.
I believe that no alliance can win a round without fighting a war. But the winning alliance is not the one that wins the most wars, it's the one who knows which wars to start and when, and wins them.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 03:04   #60
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by lokken
OK but he agrees with me
then he must be right... I stand corrected

Quote:
Originally Posted by lokken
To attack him on his experience rather than the general point is unfair
I didn't attack his experience, I attacked his lack of experience, I attacked him on his point about the top 5 alliances in which he maintained only alliances in the lower half of the rankings had the ability to use teamwork and enjoy the game, which is completely rediculous, and his ignorance for posting about that which he knows nothing about. As it turns out, you may be guilty of the same thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lokken
It's evident that there are plenty of players around being rather selfish with how they use their alliance positions, especially in the top 3. Examples were cited in this thread.
fine... attack those 3 players, what the hell does that have to do with the top 5 alliances, alliances which he obviously has no clue about their inner workings, or ability to work together as a team. as for the CT female earlier questioned, your alliance mate has already spoken to her and they have clarified the intent of that particular situation, and the initial intention of this thread.... maybe you should get up to speed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lokken
Essentially all of your arguments are based on the fact that the top three fear losing to alliances not much better than FO/ND last round i.e. each other, which is pretty pathetic. You aren't getting slagged because of the quality of the opposition, far from it. You're being slagged because any one of the top 3 could roll up their sleeves and have a proper go and try and win, but none of them want to.
my post was in response to an ignorant post made by another person..so explain where my logic is faulty.... has that person, or you for that matter been in the private channels of those alliances? have you been in their HC channels and had the opportunity to see their internal discussions?

my guess is the answer is no to both of those questions. So you two are in fact not only making comments about my post that have absolutely nothing to do with the intent of my post, you also clearly have no clue what goes on internally in alliances other than your own. You can guess, like every swingin d*** on the AD can, but you can only guess. No fact there to support your argument.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 03:44   #61
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Re: Flagshipping

show me an alliance playing this round that isn't one of if not both; corrupt and hypocritical alongside being fiercely mechanical and confidently able enough to pull it's weight around in controlling the environment as it is, and i will show you JBG sober.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 03:51   #62
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Re: Flagshipping

This is also a reply to Angryduck, but it's better I address this post:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gio2k
None of them want to win? None of them want to try?
It's all nice and dandy to be an outsider telling the top 3 alliances that they are being pansies.
I think the people who are actually involved in the war have a better idea of how tough it is to be at war in this situation, where if 2 alliances go to war for too long, they might just hand the victory over to the third one.
My advise is, go analyse this type of situation, and then come up and say why it would be better for which alliance to go at war with which other alliance.
I believe that no alliance can win a round without fighting a war. But the winning alliance is not the one that wins the most wars, it's the one who knows which wars to start and when, and wins them.
The analysis in this situation, which I share with a few of my alliance colleagues, is that the top 3 are all pretty evenly matched (equally bad), so it's in their interests to be proactive and do something because the opposition shouldn't be that hard to take out if you do it right. eX has won rounds by getting into horrible wars, losing terrific amounts of roids yet been successful because their attacks had purpose and it had a team that could keep pressing on and they harness value as well as xp.

I mean look at it - we have HC's from all sides justifying why not to hit each other, you might as well get it over with and NAP each other, these justifications sound more out of the book of Fury not hitting Legion when they had an agreement. It's pretty evident that victory in the alliance stakes is going to be pretty irrelevant if it stays as it is, and in the planet stakes isn't going to be about how good that individual player is, but more about how much of your alliance you got to defend you constantly or how much you threw your weight around with the power you hold in it. This is not team work, it is selfishness.

War is profitable, unless the opposition is radically better than you, which it isn't in this scenario. All you need to be is 'consistent'. If you can't manage that one can hardly say you are much of a team.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 04:58   #63
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Re: Flagshipping

I was there present and accounted for in the private channels of...

Bluetuba Round 2, when it was slaughtered and bashed yet some died with the ship and was reborn as TNG the next round.

Fury Round 4, when we were outplayed and it was the saving graces of Cayl's emotional speech to the fury mail servers that we survived. And yet again in Round 6 with Deus Ex Machina and their intent to balance the game and having the pride of tagging up as NotDead.

And yet again more recently taking time without much fresh faces covering the last shift against those with an agenda against Omen in Round 18.

So I might not be a witness to the current rounds private channels and the internal workings of the Top 5. But I can attest from my experience that this current set of leaders on the rankings aren't experiencing anything yet in the form of a War.

This round has been forged from the agenda of a few individuals and their need to settle scores from the past. Maybe this is Round 19.5 for those that couldn't thwart Exilition.

They're creating an environment that is very sluggish, boring, and makes it seem that straight of protection we are at a slow but steady pace of stagnation to Round 21. Thank God that it is a short one.

All I ask is for you to seize the remainder of this round and grasp that victory. I'll be waiting on you at Creator's Hour.

I think we found a new submittion for clawofdarkness pa wiki for Round 20, that of the most undaring, roid hording, undeserving, flagshipping players ever to grace the top of the ranks.

The only action that I have seen is me typing from my PocketPC onto these forums and my post count steadily rise.

P.S. I'm not looking for a long endured war amongst the Top 3. I'm just looking and wanting for more effort than launching on your targets at 3:55GMT and setting you alarm fo 4 hours before landing.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 05:24   #64
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Re: Flagshipping

luckily our duties as HC don't include entertaining people who are not in our alliance.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 05:43   #65
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Re: Flagshipping

It's nothing to do with duties. It's everything to do with ensuring there'll actually be a game you can make absurdly pompous statements in after another round or two.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 05:51   #66
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Re: Flagshipping

no, it's about our responsability as commanders to the members of our alliance, and putting them in the best possible situation to be successful as an alliance, and as individual planets. They don't play to do badly.

has nothing to do with throwing crap around like monkeys at the end of round ceremony. The game is what it is, we have to play them as they lay, simple as that.

Alliances and community members are not responsible for ensuring there is a product to offer in the future. That is the responsability of the games owners, and it's administrators
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 08:59   #67
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by aNgRyDuCk
Alliances and community members are not responsible for ensuring there is a product to offer in the future. That is the responsability of the games owners, and it's administrators
How incredibly short-sighted of you. Perhaps if we had 100k planets then no-one would have any such responsibility, but when there's less than 2k accounts then it should be fairly obvious that we all owe a responsibility to make this game as enjoyable as possible for new players - because they are the lifeblood that will preserve this game past just a few more rounds.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 09:32   #68
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by furball
How incredibly short-sighted of you. Perhaps if we had 100k planets then no-one would have any such responsibility, but when there's less than 2k accounts then it should be fairly obvious that we all owe a responsibility to make this game as enjoyable as possible for new players - because they are the lifeblood that will preserve this game past just a few more rounds.
Thats all fine and dandy if the owners/administrators actually listened to the ppl in the community. Jolt doesn't give a shit, they spend no money on advertisment... Administrators apparently have their own views on how to make the game better and end of the day, don't listen worth a damn.

It's not my responsability as a player in a gaming community to produce a likeable product. My only responsability as the customer is to have integrity in my game play. My Responsability as an Alliance Commander is to provide the membership I represent the neccesary tools and support to be successful.

It's not being shortsighted, its being realistic. I would love for the game to keep improving and attract new customers, sure.. great idea, however I have no responsability to pay for the games advertising. I have no responsability, or ability, as a customer, to design the game in such a way that it is an attractive product.

I can make suggestions, sure.... If those suggestions fall on deaf ears, then there's not a lot I can do. I can suggest it to my friends etc. That however is the extent of my responsability.

"I" meaning the player, in this community


edit: there also comes a time when the dog is dead....you should probably stop kicking it... if in fact we are moving towards that, so be it. I've made some really good friends in this community over the years. If I run into some of those people down the road, great. If I keep in touch with some of them, great. I'll game with those ppl who are still around in this community as long as this game is around, however, it is a game, and sooner or later another game will come along, or this one will have just gone to shit so much that no one cares to play it...whatever the reason, all things end. I have no responsability as a player/customer to Planetarion, other than to be supportive and have integrity in my game play and interaction with other customers. Being supportive, and taking it on myself to attract new players are different concepts. Attracting new players is the responsability of the owners/administrators..perhaps they should get off their asses and do their jobs.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 09:41   #69
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Re: Flagshipping

Ok so the arguments I am seeing here are that war is good for the game? I would argue that prolonged wars are not good for the game.

Wars are with out a doubt the most stressful time for a player and an alliance in PA. They require a large amount of time and dedication. This often involves putting your real life to the side and setting your alarm clock so that you can be online every so many ticks to check for incoming fleets, defense vs. your attacking fleets so you can recall and re-launch. In what way is this fun? Sure for the short term like on a weekend for example it can be exhilarating. However it is never fun to have countless waves incoming on your planet, or to invest so much time into what should never ever be more than a casual gaming experience. After all this is ONLY a text based game that is basically a big calculator. Prolonged dirty wars have made people quit the game altogether and broken the backs of HC and DC’s and in doing so we’ve lost alliances.

Also I find it amusing that some of the main characters in this thread promoting war for the good of PA are in an alliance that is playing PA as it should be played. In a casual, laid back manor enjoying their successes and the competition between their own members for landing good attacks and having the bragging rights that go with it.

Has anyone ever taken the time to imagine how much healthier this game would have been if the elite was not always concentrated in just 2 alliances on a regular bases. If the talent was spread out more evenly through out the alliances there would have been less domination, less stagnation, and with out a doubt more players still playing and having fun.

So please, spare me your self righteous rants and proclamations about what is good for this game. If you want a war then why don’t you go fight an alliance and have some fun, what the other alliances are doing is not effecting your fun is it? Oh wait maybe it is since it would be a lot easier for XP planets to land when the giant value fleets are flying across the universe like mad defending and attacking each other. However it’s just the good of the game you’re all worried about right?

So in conclusion, as long as the players are enjoying themselves then PA is fine. As for certain players in alliances being def whores and selfish. Is this some sort of news flash? To my knowledge this has been the case through out PA history and frankly I don’t care and why should anyone else. Winners of most rounds are there in part to who they know and the influence that carries. WOW shocker.

Oh and for those that want to point to the dwindling numbers and say HEY LOOK it’s NOT FINE. I would like to point you to the simple logic that a MMOG has diminishing returns. It is the natural course of all these games in this genre that player bases will fall off. People get bored, frustrated and frankly a lot of people just grow up and move on with life. The fact that this game still exists in a p2p environment is actually a testament to the communities ability to stay together. The game is now the water cooler that groups of people who would normally not associate with can come together and have an excuse to interact. People are not playing the game anymore they are supporting the community and the game is the common thread. I mean look at the stats and the questionable business model that PA uses. If I ran my Construction company like this I would be bankrupt.

Oh I just remembered something this is AD and coming in here and talking some sense was just a waste of time. Oh well too late it.

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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 10:06   #70
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Re: Flagshipping

it's not about war being profitable, or about the round being interesting/uninteresting, it's about the lack of guts and spirit any alliance currently possesses to drive themselves amongst the higher echelons of alliances that have played planetarion. rounds aren't actually decided by wars, they are usually decided earlier than that, by whoever gets the universe to shift to their needs.

planetarion isn't really a war game, it's a manipulation game. that being said, i can't imagine any of the top 3 alliance really expects to 'just' win - have you people forgotten there's only 1100 ticks this round? roids do NOT pay off as much, not even remotely so, xp is where it's at. no, i do not mean xp whoring exclusively, i've never done that really it's pretty tedious - i mean going for a meatfeast in the universe and being the aggressors, being the ones that are fearless and able to change their surroundings regularly to accommodate their needs.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 10:14   #71
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by jerome
it's not about war being profitable, or about the round being interesting/uninteresting, it's about the lack of guts and spirit any alliance currently possesses to drive themselves amongst the higher echelons of alliances that have played planetarion. rounds aren't actually decided by wars, they are usually decided earlier than that, by whoever gets the universe to shift to their needs.

planetarion isn't really a war game, it's a manipulation game. that being said, i can't imagine any of the top 3 alliance really expects to 'just' win - have you people forgotten there's only 1100 ticks this round? roids do NOT pay off as much, not even remotely so, xp is where it's at. no, i do not mean xp whoring exclusively, i've never done that really it's pretty tedious - i mean going for a meatfeast in the universe and being the aggressors, being the ones that are fearless and able to change their surroundings regularly to accommodate their needs.
again though jer, your asking alliances to shape their actions to your needs, as the observer. Your asking to be entertained. This isn't a responsability of alliances in general. If you want this, build an alliance and go for it. Each alliance command has their own set of goals, short term and long term. If they aren't particularly yours, or mine, atleast what we'd "like" to see....tough

lets also not forget... you cannot win 2, or 3, or 4 rounds, until you've won 1... let's not put the cart in front of the horse
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 10:40   #72
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Re: Flagshipping

i am? where? i'm asking for an alliance to step up as a top-tier alliance. though if noone has their sights set on that..

what difference does a first round make? didn't 1up and exilition change their first rounds to their own needs? infact the best 1up was r11/12 one, the best exilition were their r13/15 ones. what about eclipse? deus? fury and legion? (ignoring their respective cluster alliance forms for the sake of pedantry.) i find that first round is an excuse for the ineptitude and lesser alliances through the years have regularly used it to be so.

all i guess a lot of people are saying is: it's a sad state of affairs in planetarion. i've never really held much weight to notions of friends from different games that say planetarion has much less "skilled" competition but i do now. only other round i can think of with a similar lack of top tier alliances would be r10.5 where fang/phraktos/mistu block won.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 12:40   #73
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by jerome
i mean going for a meatfeast in the universe and being the aggressors, being the ones that are fearless and able to change their surroundings regularly to accommodate their needs.
Totally agree with this point. Especially as the round is much shorter than usual. Unfortunatley i havent seen any aggression from allies, although one or two planets have and it appears to be paying off for them. Its a shame that its going to come down to whoever can roid the top gals the most that is going to decide the winning alliance(grammar?).

Gal raids suck compared to planet picking.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 12:44   #74
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Re: Flagshipping

I'd address a number of quotes, but it would probably be a waste of time and invite pointless remarks. You can work out what's relevant to who and what.

FAO: jer, JBG, Lokken, furball.

Have you actually put any thought into what you're writing? (that's rhetorical).

Much of what you have been saying is incredibly narrow minded, ignorant (and I mean ignorant in the proper sense), either poorly informed, ill informed or entirely uninformed, completely dismissive of other possibilities and clearly biased.

All of which is nothing out of the ordinary for an AD poster. But there's a problem. People take you seriously (maybe not jerome). Why? Partly because you perform either unofficial or official game roles (be that as moderators or commentators). But mainly because you spend hundreds of hours debating generally pointless subjects with another 90 odd self reicheous GD prats, and from this you've mastered the put down and gained your precious green dots. And relatively often, you make a lot of sense.

But now you sit there in #forums, or in Ascendancy goofing about, probably have a completely un grounded conversation about what sandmans has looked like for the past week or two, what rumors you've heard, and who you don't like this week because they're still fake nicked, and decide in your ultimate wisdom that every alliance about is shit and come here to spout it out in chorus.

The great irony already pointed out above is that you regularly criticise people for not being the enlightened souls that you are and are playing this game seriously, and it seems you're the first to complain when it looks to you like you've got your wish. If you were better informed you'd find out that you're prejudices and impressions are unfounded, but there's no point in arguing that point because you've already made your minds up. Just as you don't leave a football match at 1-1 with 10 minutes to play, you shouldn't cast judgement on the worth of a round and the alliances involved before the game is up.

I do respect a lot of what you gents have said in the past. Often I've disagreed. But it's been constructive. Since you are taken seriously, you have an obligation to both the game and to your reputations to properly consider your comments (from my POV, you haven't done so on a lot of what has been said).

Anyway, watch the second half of the show. Maybe you'll be surprised.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 13:00   #75
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Re: Flagshipping

it's been a good while since we've seen an essay of ad hominem and nothing else, but then kjeldoran doesn't post anymore. good work alexis, i am thoroughly impressed by the complete avoidance of every point whatsoever, infact doubly so when you consider the ridiculous irony involved in that post. perhaps it was intentional, the word ignorance was used to reasonably amusing effect at least

but i'm sure we're all looking forward to being surprised. i have been surprised by military power at least once, such as lokken's goddam waves of knights early on in civ 2
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 13:18   #76
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Re: Flagshipping

The example of an essay of ad hominem given in jer's link is stupid though.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 13:33   #77
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Re: Flagshipping

i really wish i had had more than a dial-up connection in old PA so i could have played it for real (i actually named my planet Dreaming of a cable connection ). now that i have the internet, PA is gone, and drifting further away from what i would like it to be with every round.
something either radically changes, or PA dies for real. and im afraid that first scenario is most likely to happen. flagship gals and planets have always existed, its just that now, the flagships are all that remained, and no bulk-players, so big egos are constantly clashing in the detriment of average players.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 14:25   #78
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Re: Flagshipping

Directed to people who should know who they are but probably won't:

There is only one thing worse than having a dodgy system for prioritising defence, and that is feeling so inadequate about it that you have to post in depth on AD explaining how your defence system works. It's your alliance and you can run it how you damn well like.

That, and the fact that it's better to be silent and considered a fool than to speak and remove all doubt

Here's hoping (but not holding my breath) for the 'surprise' mentioned earlier
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 15:25   #79
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by jerome
i am thoroughly impressed by the complete avoidance of every point whatsoever, infact doubly so when you consider the ridiculous irony involved in that post. perhaps it was intentional, the word ignorance was used to reasonably amusing effect at least
Thanks. No point in making or addressing points on AD. And it's not ad hominem. Bringing 'irrelevant' information about posters was not the foundation for any dispute of what has been said earlier in this thread. Everything after the word 'biased' was to point out that some people in particular should know not to speculate with such apparent authority on matters about which (I'm quite sure) they know very little.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 16:20   #80
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by Furyous
Anyway, watch the second half of the show. Maybe you'll be surprised.
Ignoring what the hell that inane rant had to do with me, my sole point in this thread relevant to what you said being that if PA is really dull for a few rounds everyone might stop playing. Furthermore your point about ignorance is completely fallacious. We are talking about alliance interactions and actions, these require no "inside" observation to observe. Merely a few gal statuses and some up-to-date intel. Surprisingly neither of which are that hard to obtain.

Quote:
Originally Posted by angryduck
no, it's about our responsability as commanders to the members of our alliance, and putting them in the best possible situation to be successful as an alliance, and as individual planets. They don't play to do badly.

has nothing to do with throwing crap around like monkeys at the end of round ceremony. The game is what it is, we have to play them as they lay, simple as that.

Alliances and community members are not responsible for ensuring there is a product to offer in the future. That is the responsability of the games owners, and it's administrators
At some point a lot of people found that sometimes it's not just about winning the game. You're perfectly free to feel like it is, hell we're all free to believe whatever we want when it comes to such esoteric questions of purpose. However we're probably all here to enjoy ourselves. And you may find you get more out of playing the game in certain ways than in others.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Troll
So please, spare me your self righteous rants and proclamations about what is good for this game. If you want a war then why don’t you go fight an alliance and have some fun, what the other alliances are doing is not effecting your fun is it? Oh wait maybe it is since it would be a lot easier for XP planets to land when the giant value fleets are flying across the universe like mad defending and attacking each other. However it’s just the good of the game you’re all worried about right?
No, no, you got us there. What we're all concerned about is our planet rankings. I mean, we've had no success at all before this round and we're just desperate for our online recognition in a game with two thousand players. I mean, seriously what?

That said let us avoid such ridiculous ad hominems and let me respond with an even more ridiculous one. I'm a scanner ranked 700 or so, as such with little chance of a high ranking, and nothing would entertain me more than to see everyone in ascendancy fail miserably to achieve anything this round because they weren't good enough. There we go, now we can accuse me of being biased in the other way and ignore everything i say as being representative of an anti-ascendancy viewpoint and dismiss what I have to say based on poorly thought-out reasons using half-assed logic.
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Unread 22 Feb 2007, 17:23   #81
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by Furyous
Thanks. No point in making or addressing points on AD.
then don't post?
but let me guess, you just wanted to be like "everyone else" and "troll" eh?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Furyous
Everything after the word 'biased' was to point out that some people in particular should know not to speculate with such apparent authority on matters about which (I'm quite sure) they know very little.
as jbg's reply covers the "speculation" area, this is off topic but i was expecting you to be aware your ship really isn't very tight, but far be it from me to help your alliance in the how's where's or why's with regards to that.


speaking of tight ships, it brings me onto another point i should've made in my first post: we're also nearly exclusively back to a time, (again this has always existed but i mean now it's ever so more noticeable) where i have seen a lot of people catering for their friends (in other alliances) over their alliancemates - pulling attacks, picking their friends and not launching, leaking intel etc etc. of course i am not condemning this because i am somewhat"guilty" of a couple of these things myself, but then i am in ascendancy and i don't really sacrifice anything. i've not explained this well but what i'm trying to do is draw a parallel between now and the issues between alliances and battlegroups around the times of r8, i believe.
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Unread 23 Feb 2007, 12:02   #82
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by .Disc.
Destinys policy is usually 2 att fleets 1 def fleet, like most alliances im guessing. an alliance with 60 members, 5 or so of which are scanners means 55 defence fleets.
LOL, 20 of those 55 are currently tied up at one planet defending over a 4 tick period
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Unread 23 Feb 2007, 12:28   #83
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

That said let us avoid such ridiculous ad hominems and let me respond with an even more ridiculous one. I'm a scanner ranked 700 or so, as such with little chance of a high ranking, and nothing would entertain me more than to see everyone in ascendancy fail miserably to achieve anything this round because they weren't good enough.

Id love to see everyone in asc fail just for the non stop scan requests.

Oh im a t100 scanner.

:hifive:
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Unread 23 Feb 2007, 14:17   #84
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by aNgRyDuCk
LOL, 20 of those 55 are currently tied up at one planet defending over a 4 tick period
Brilliant DC work

Although said planet claims its mostly from the cluster alliance, heh.


Edit: theres a few more there now
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Unread 23 Feb 2007, 15:25   #85
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Re: Flagshipping

free roids anyone?
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Unread 23 Feb 2007, 20:21   #86
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Re: Flagshipping

the problem with flagshipping is ...

it only takes 1 missile to get through and its sunk.

it only takes 1 disaffected crew member to planet an bomb and its sunk.

if the support ships defect or turn a blind eye its sunk.

if a flagship has ANY issues of activity for whatever unforseen reason its sunk.
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Unread 23 Feb 2007, 22:09   #87
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Re: Flagshipping

in old pa maybe, but not in todays:|
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Unread 23 Feb 2007, 23:13   #88
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Re: Flagshipping

I thought this would be an asc round.

all go etd and take the win ( xp hoeing is even more boring than I thought it would be btw )

Anyway - yeah PA IS boring. Let there be no doubt
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Unread 24 Feb 2007, 01:00   #89
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Re: Flagshipping

I expected better from this round. Seems rather boring to me as I've already fell asleep a few times. Wars that last days rather than weeks, but I don't blame people really.

Also Forest mentioned earlier about some erronous information regarding 1up and random incoming. You'll find that random incoming was actually quite common in 1up - I should know - I was the HC that checked before going to bed how many calls we had and generally informed Sid on how things looked when he came on bright and early. The universe -is- smaller now, but don't make a mountain out of a mole-hill - I seriously doubt that little bit extra of random incoming is that much of a problem.
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Unread 24 Feb 2007, 01:40   #90
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zh|l
Also Forest mentioned earlier about some erronous information regarding 1up and random incoming. You'll find that random incoming was actually quite common in 1up - I should know - I was the HC that checked before going to bed how many calls we had and generally informed Sid on how things looked when he came on bright and early. The universe -is- smaller now, but don't make a mountain out of a mole-hill - I seriously doubt that little bit extra of random incoming is that much of a problem.

I should know also, being the MO that was dealing with it on occasions.
1up certainly did not get 30-50 random incomings, something that the alliances are now facing.
Doubt its a probem this.

Consider this.

40 incomings. Each takes 1.5 fleet to cover. And that is being generous with these shit stats. No, lets say 1 defence fleet covers one attack fleet.

That is 40 defence fleets from an alliance of 60 ppl.
Players generally attack with 2 and defend with 1 fleet. So thats only 60 available defence fleets. Take out 5 scanners, and say 5 people who are afk for whatever reason. Thats only 50 def fleets. You have 40 out defending. So now you have 40/50 fleets taken already. Thats you dry of defence. And that is being generous with 1 fleet per attcker. In reality it takes more, especially with the hordes of attackers suiciding there fleets for huge xp.

You fail to see this being a problem? You are well over dry, and losing roids, and thats from random incomings alone.

Add in a war and another 100 fleets on you.

And you fail to see the problem here?

Take a look at the history of alliances. It is no surprise that when at war (other than the first night), that BOTH alliances LOST roids, when targetting solely each other.

I can't put my finger on why, but galaxies are being double and triple booked. Several CT gals per night getting double booked. And intel suggests everyone is having the same problem.

So few gals to hit means most galaxies get incoming every night.

Its just not normal.

And I believe this will be the last round of planetarion with alliances as we know them, because the game simply cant sustain this any longer.
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Unread 24 Feb 2007, 02:30   #91
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forest
I should know also, being the MO that was dealing with it on occasions.
1up certainly did not get 30-50 random incomings,
.
Yes it did. What crack are you smoking?

The only way to reduce incoming is to grow bigger, as then less planets are -able- to hit you.
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Unread 24 Feb 2007, 02:51   #92
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Re: Flagshipping

Not every single night, it didnt.

And in a war in these gals it is impossible to get big.
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Unread 24 Feb 2007, 05:21   #93
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zh|l
Yes it did. What crack are you smoking?

The only way to reduce incoming is to grow bigger, as then less planets are -able- to hit you.

Ahhh yes. I agree 100% Only problem is with the XP factor now most people tend to not out grow random incoming. Other than Smart Ziks who steal a good cross section of fleet to make it painful to land with out co ordination.

Oh and Hi Zhil
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Unread 24 Feb 2007, 08:50   #94
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Re: Flagshipping

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forest
I should know also, being the MO that was dealing with it on occasions.
1up certainly did not get 30-50 random incomings, something that the alliances are now facing.
Doubt its a probem this.

Consider this.

40 incomings. Each takes 1.5 fleet to cover. And that is being generous with these shit stats. No, lets say 1 defence fleet covers one attack fleet.

That is 40 defence fleets from an alliance of 60 ppl.
Players generally attack with 2 and defend with 1 fleet. So thats only 60 available defence fleets. Take out 5 scanners, and say 5 people who are afk for whatever reason. Thats only 50 def fleets. You have 40 out defending. So now you have 40/50 fleets taken already. Thats you dry of defence. And that is being generous with 1 fleet per attcker. In reality it takes more, especially with the hordes of attackers suiciding there fleets for huge xp.

You fail to see this being a problem? You are well over dry, and losing roids, and thats from random incomings alone.

Add in a war and another 100 fleets on you.

And you fail to see the problem here?

Take a look at the history of alliances. It is no surprise that when at war (other than the first night), that BOTH alliances LOST roids, when targetting solely each other.

I can't put my finger on why, but galaxies are being double and triple booked. Several CT gals per night getting double booked. And intel suggests everyone is having the same problem.

So few gals to hit means most galaxies get incoming every night.

Its just not normal.

And I believe this will be the last round of planetarion with alliances as we know them, because the game simply cant sustain this any longer.
the whole post is a utter load of shit, you're quoting things you almost certainly cant actually keep an eye on, nor make good assumptions.

p.s. You adapt to war, you dont use the ol 2 attack 1 def fleet, you change it
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Unread 24 Feb 2007, 09:41   #95
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Re: Flagshipping

What exactly can't I keep an eye on?

Seeing as 1) I was a 1up MO, 2) I am a CT MO, and 3) I am in constant dialogue with other officers and HC from other alliances.

Even my good friend Disc would back me up on this one
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Unread 24 Feb 2007, 10:51   #96
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Re: Flagshipping

people lie in conversations forest, especially to their enemies. this may be a revolutionary concept to you of course... ;)
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Unread 24 Feb 2007, 11:02   #97
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Re: Flagshipping

I have access to tools.

Unless thats being faked, I think I can talk with some confidence
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Unread 24 Feb 2007, 11:54   #98
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Re: Flagshipping

This much random incomings has been the case r18/19 aswell though, triple booking has been happening since r15 if not sooner.
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Unread 24 Feb 2007, 12:27   #99
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Re: Flagshipping

I'm still trying to grapple how the self-proclaimed biggest warmonger in the universe is justifying pathetic stagnation, even though he's admitted on AD that he's unhappy with it. I wonder why he puts up with it.

btw read the long post of yours and thought "oh noes lost roids which probably won't pay off because you can get them back again"
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Unread 24 Feb 2007, 12:49   #100
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Re: Flagshipping

I am not trying to justify it.

What I am saying is your reasons for wanting it are impractacle.

And it is, for the reasons outlined.

And to be honest, the guys who all ask for war are mainly Ascendency. The same Ascendency that attacks with all sides of the war. The same Ascendency that whine to hell when they get hit. The same Ascendency that want a war so they can pick up easy roids whilst others go at it.

War may well come, but it will be at the choosing of the alliances concerned, and not some alliance thats main objective is to spout as much crap on the forums as they can.
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