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9 Apr 2010, 01:07
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#1
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break it down!
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,087
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Lokken: is he shit?
Due to popular demand!
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I put the sex in dyslexia!
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9 Apr 2010, 01:34
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#2
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You've Seen The Light
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,152
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
There's no poll
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First shalt thou take out the Holy Pin. Then shalt thou count to three, no more, no less. Three shall be the number thou shalt count, and the number of the counting shall be three. Four shalt thou not count, neither count thou two, excepting that thou then proceed to three. Five is right out. Once the number three, being the third number, be reached, then lobbest thou thy Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch towards thy foe, who, being naughty in my sight, shall snuff it.
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9 Apr 2010, 01:56
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#3
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Happy
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Canada eh
Posts: 4,793
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
you're shit for thinking he's shit :\
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Where ever you go, there you are.
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9 Apr 2010, 03:13
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#4
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Apprime Troll HC
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 857
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Noone knows, that was my point. Sure the effort he did 30 rounds ago made an impact on the game back then, but it is absolutely not comparable to now. His arguments are based on what he has OBSERVED from the inside of 1 single alliance, Ascendancy. When he writes about how rounds went on, what would happen if this and that, remember that he has not actually played this round, it is just an opinion he set his mind to, based on circlejerking in a closed environment, a channel called #Ascendancy.
Ive been involved enough, for quite some time now. I have spent so much time on this game, and round 32 was in particular a really hard round. I'm not found of that someone from the sideline tells us that we only won because the "best" alliance did not bother to. Objectively, I am one of the people in this game that has enough knowledge to say what alliance was the best functioning one in each of the rounds from round 32 and on. Round 33 was Ascendancy, but round 32,34,35 Apprime was unmatched on too many levels, which ultimately lead to roundwin.
So we dont even know what kind of a player Lokken is, because compared to most players around him, he has not even tried. He is full of shit on these forums, but it doesnt make him shit, yet.
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9 Apr 2010, 04:25
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#5
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self-entitledly superior
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Finland
Posts: 341
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
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9 Apr 2010, 05:25
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#6
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Paso Leaute
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 919
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by HaNzI
So we dont even know what kind of a player Lokken is, because compared to most players around him, he has not even tried. He is full of shit on these forums, but it doesnt make him shit, yet.
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U seem to be hating on Lokken for his lack of effort compared when the rest of ascendancy has not tried since at least r33. Is this bitterness because Asc never put the effort of r29 or 30 into beating App? Simple fact is that Asc is the only multi round dominating alliance which has not simply recognised its time is up and left the stage. This muddies the waters somewhat in comparisons with the parvenu, ascendancy creeks on and hasnt been at peek efficiency since r31 so it gives the opportunity for some of us to say, but if the old man was in his prime he would pwn the new guy, well who knows? but like the old guy ascendancy is not gonna get younger, its past effectiveness is not going to return, this round seems to demonstrate that quite well, since for the first time since r33 we have the main leaders back but are still useless in spite of them.
The simple fact is that Lokken's expositions of most situations are amongst the best in the business in spite of his narrow viewpoint just think what he would be like if he got 'out' more!
Actually I think the quality in Lokkens posts is that he tends to do a large post summing up positions after most others have spoken so he has the opportunity to evaluate their positions and take them on board. Most people post replying to a couple of posts directly preceding theirs, all Lokken has to do to show wisdom is take the whole picture as laid out in several pages of thread and digest it.
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An optimist may see a light where there is none, but why must the pessimist always run to blow it out?
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9 Apr 2010, 06:59
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#7
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mz.
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,587
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by HaNzI
Noone knows
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I think you're confusing your own ignorance with popular opinion and common knowledge. Lok is one of the most intelligent and well-respected people I know, and I know quite a lot of people. Where this sudden hate is coming from I don't know, but I think there are few less-deserving targets in the PA community.
And if people don't mind me switching to my mod voice for a minute, despite the fact that this topic has just about 0 to do with alliances, I'm leaving it open for now. Behave, though.
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The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
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9 Apr 2010, 08:24
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#8
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Banned
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Lithuania, Vilnius
Posts: 106
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
about lokken, like last 10rounds all he does just opens sandmans from his phone, checks whos been roided who get most roids etc ect, then opens forums and claims he knows something about whats going on, thats pretty much what lokken was doing for a long time to be honest, and to Londo talking about ascendancy tbh everyone knows jbg = ascendancy, if he plays its good( i mean babysit everyone), if its not its even worse than any alliance out of top10, if its not true tell me about it?
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9 Apr 2010, 09:24
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#9
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mz.
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,587
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
OK: it's not true.
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The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
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9 Apr 2010, 09:30
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#10
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Bolivian Alpaca
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 912
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Who's lokken?
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"I throw myself into the sea, release the wave, let it wash over me ..."
MadCowS - Angels - eXilition - Destiny - Wolfpack - Jenova - p3nguins
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9 Apr 2010, 09:41
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#11
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Save energy: Be apathetic
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 228
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk
Where this sudden hate is coming from I don't know
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It's a fairly common method to make yourself look smart/leet/whatever or get you in the public l(L)ight, you start bashing people higher rated than you in hopes that some others will agree and then you'll get some respect or create some interest for your own activities/posts.
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Ascendancy - Land'n'Crash Inc.
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9 Apr 2010, 09:50
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#12
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Jazz Maverick
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 333
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
No. Lokken is a top top bloke.
He just spends too much time playing a very boring web based game.
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9 Apr 2010, 12:11
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#13
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You've Seen The Light
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,152
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ricoshay
It's a fairly common method to make yourself look smart/leet/whatever or get you in the public l(L)ight, you start bashing people higher rated than you in hopes that some others will agree and then you'll get some respect or create some interest for your own activities/posts. ![Smile](images/smilies/smile.gif)
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I dont bash other people very rarely, except call out the Asc troll squad when they arrive. The only time ive actively gone about bashing someone or a direct alliance was the Omen vs Asc round but while i was doing that i was also stating that i'd prefer Asc to win over CT/ND
If you take the last thread, i never bashed anyone.. I just disagree'd with some people and thought the rules should be changed for next round. I started the thread saying that he should be closed under the support rule (not bashing him or insulting him just saying that his tactic is/could be against the rules) but someone pointed out what the support rule actually says and it was clear he was not in violation of it. So i then was trying to argue the point to change the rules for next round.
The only person who actually bashed someone in that thread, was JBG to me (and he had to be moderated and warned). So by your logic, he was bashing on me to get some respect.. but also, isnt your post bashing on me?
I very rarely if ever bash someone or insult them but i do disagree with people on these forums alot of the time (Mainly due to the main posters on this forum being Asc and they openly have the mindset of no restrictions at all) but isnt that what the forums are for?
In Hanzi's case, he isnt so much hating on Lokken as much as he disliked Lokkens posts which tried to imply that Apprime was never the best alliance in the rounds they won as Asc could of won if they tried. To which, i agree with Hanzi, the fact Asc didnt have the members willing to put in the effort directly means that Asc was not the best alliance that round. By that logic, any alliance is the best ever alliance, if only there members and HC were willing to put in all the effort required.
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First shalt thou take out the Holy Pin. Then shalt thou count to three, no more, no less. Three shall be the number thou shalt count, and the number of the counting shall be three. Four shalt thou not count, neither count thou two, excepting that thou then proceed to three. Five is right out. Once the number three, being the third number, be reached, then lobbest thou thy Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch towards thy foe, who, being naughty in my sight, shall snuff it.
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9 Apr 2010, 12:19
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#14
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Apprime Troll HC
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 857
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
I dont hate lokken, I am saying that he is not doing anything, and he has no business in giving any round summaries like it was the truth.
Londo, when did you actually do anything useful in Asc? You just talk aswell, but you have never worked hard for your alliance. Like Izverg say up here, ascendancy only works when JBG is on duty, and babysit everyone. Think it over, who else in Ascendancy have put down the effort like this man? And how successful were you when he was idle?
Londo you seem to forget that Apprime is a multi round dominating alliance aswell. It has been harder to succeed after round 29, exactly because of the dominance of ascendancy in r28 and 29, the universe let you run away with it, which is why Ascendancy had to work so hard for its win in round 30, and Apprime certainly did not get any wins for free. You also seem to forget that JBG and his pokemon jesterina kicked out a bunch of people from Ascendancy after round 31, and you lost a lot of valuable players who would be able to keep Ascendancy at its round30 level.
The discussion is not about lokken as a person at all, its about the posts he make, and how he tries to make it look like any other alliance then Ascendancy was dominant. Londo you are in this category aswell.
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9 Apr 2010, 16:26
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#15
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mz.
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,587
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Your entire point rests on one single logical fallacy. Don't fall off.
__________________
The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
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9 Apr 2010, 17:14
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#16
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Save energy: Be apathetic
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 228
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by HaNzI
You also seem to forget that JBG and his pokemon jesterina kicked out a bunch of people from Ascendancy after round 31, and you lost a lot of valuable players who would be able to keep Ascendancy at its round30 level.
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That sounds a bit bitter. Maybe jester was mean to you at some point and you felt hurt by it? Maybe he didn't show you enough respect after ship-jumping in r30? What was it, Hanzi? What made you call jester a "pokemon" and hate on Lokken? Share with us, we are all willing to listen and take you seriously. I swear!
On other note, funny how you feel attacked by posts relating to Apprime's wins. Though Apprime certainly earned them, I will give credit to Cardi and his politics over anything you might have done. Clarification, not sure what you've done exactly, I wasn't Apprime. But from I've heard, you were no shining beacon.
PS: Light, the only reason I included you into my post was because "getting into l(L)ight" seemed a bit funny. No need to attention whore here. :P
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Ascendancy - Land'n'Crash Inc.
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9 Apr 2010, 18:25
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#17
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Apprime Troll HC
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 857
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Ricoshay are you trying to make it look like i want to be in Asc? You have some good people in there, people who do things without screaming out for credit, the backbone of your alliance. Don't pretend you are one of them.
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9 Apr 2010, 19:06
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#18
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Save energy: Be apathetic
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 228
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
I am not too sure where I pretended to be one of the "people who do things without screaming out for credit, the backbone of your alliance". But hey, this is the forums, everyone is free to speak whatever they like. You are free to throw random junk, while I am free to point out the obvious. :]
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Ascendancy - Land'n'Crash Inc.
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9 Apr 2010, 19:11
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#19
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Apprime Troll HC
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 857
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ricoshay
I am not too sure where I pretended to be one of the "people who do things without screaming out for credit, the backbone of your alliance". But hey, this is the forums, everyone is free to speak whatever they like. You are free to throw random junk, while I am free to point out the obvious. :]
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Then perhaps you should let people who does not have to pretend, to speak. You may call the things i write junk, but it is certainly not random junk, and there is nothing obvious about anything you write. While i write because i want to disarm lies on these forums, you only write because you want attention.
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9 Apr 2010, 19:45
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#20
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Save energy: Be apathetic
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 228
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by HaNzI
You have some good people in there, people who do things without screaming out for credit, the backbone of your alliance. Don't pretend you are one of them.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ricoshay
I am not too sure where I pretended to be one of the "people who do things without screaming out for credit, the backbone of your alliance".
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HaNzI
Then perhaps you should let people who does not have to pretend, to speak.
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Fail of logic or failing at formulating your thoughts using the english language? ![Smile](images/smilies/smile.gif)
And nah, I am not posting for attention, so I'll let you get back to being bashed without my interference.
Cheers!
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Ascendancy - Land'n'Crash Inc.
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10 Apr 2010, 00:29
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#21
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 296
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
I can´t agree with Hanzi. I usually enjoy reading Lokkens posts, they´re well thought through and usually interesting summaries with a touch of nasty humor and slapping people around with the obvious.
As to alliance achievements: While Apprime certainly is a top quality alliance, to me they´re still the (let´s reuse the picture here) "young kid" looking for fame. They´ve had some well played round wins (credit where it is due!), but they still lack some achievements Asc got on the scoreboard. Total domination like in r28, fighting an alliance like Omen r30 (slightly lacking quality but made up by durability), backed by the whole active universe, having rules and game mechanics changed because of your tactics. That´s the slim difference between a top alliance and an (almost?) historical one. The impact you had on the game, which is not just mesaured by the number of roundwins.
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10 Apr 2010, 00:49
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#22
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Finn.. who's drunk.
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Finland
Posts: 285
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
bored after incomings.. just going to ask, what has this topic to do with alliance discussion... Maybe move it elsewhere and hmm lokken is Ok.
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r2 Thieves
r3: top100(p0rks0da rox) r4: top400(excadrix, pcmaster+me=gal 99th) r5: top150(before giving up, nocex didn't rock) r6:evu and drunk dwarf (top50)
r7: wasted c27 gal, sucky luck in clus. r8: In real Finnish infantry.. 270days r9: boring round as hell
r9.5: Top60(small playerbase=easy)
Few won R's in PIA, r26 top15 First/Last Pax round.
[OLMIT] / [TreKronor]
10 lines max for signature I heard.. so
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10 Apr 2010, 09:20
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#23
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Apprime Troll HC
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 857
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by rUl3r
I can´t agree with Hanzi. I usually enjoy reading Lokkens posts, they´re well thought through and usually interesting summaries with a touch of nasty humor and slapping people around with the obvious.
As to alliance achievements: While Apprime certainly is a top quality alliance, to me they´re still the (let´s reuse the picture here) "young kid" looking for fame. They´ve had some well played round wins (credit where it is due!), but they still lack some achievements Asc got on the scoreboard. Total domination like in r28, fighting an alliance like Omen r30 (slightly lacking quality but made up by durability), backed by the whole active universe, having rules and game mechanics changed because of your tactics. That´s the slim difference between a top alliance and an (almost?) historical one. The impact you had on the game, which is not just mesaured by the number of roundwins.
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I dont know what you put in total domination, but round 28 you had no opponents. Round 35 was surely a total domination by Apprime, and comparable considering the opposition, dont you think?
Both being in omen round 30 (5 days hurrah), and then fighting omen round 30 with Ascendancy, i know this from the inside. Fighting P3nguins in round 32 was certainly comparable to Omen in round 30.
If you talk about the nerfing of fortress galaxies, then you are clearly taking too much credit. This one must be shared between asc and apprime, as neither is any better then the other at building strong pure gals.
And what happened last round, when fortress gals were supposed to be impossible/harder to create? Apprime successfully created them anyways. Resulting in round 36 being private gals, so everyone could make "fortresses" without any effort or thinking. Coincidence? Then i must say the changing of xp-formula after round 16 was a coincidence as well.
1 point to Apprime and half a point to ascendancy, for the changes in game mechanics to nerf fortress gals.
Lets also talk about the defense system, and the changes in game mechanics we had here. If you remember round 34, which was the last round we could defend whoever we wanted to. Apprime was fighting multiple alliances way before Ascendancy even smelled war, more precisely around 700 ticks into the game. Facing new problems with the support planet rule, thanks to the opposition consisting of mainly CT/ND/SUBH/DLR/ND. They all defended eachother, without caring about the support planet rule, which was very clear on how much defense you were allowed to send outside your alliance/gal. Apprime met no sympathy among the multihunters, and the multihunters answer was they would monitor the fleet movements, and give warnings to people who broke it. A warned planet would not be allowed to defend anyone else then his/hers own alliance/gal. A week later, no warnings were issued.
Now i do know App/asc/vision worked together later this round, but the pressure on the multihunters, the hundreds of newsscans used to document breaking of the support planet rule, the actual dedication into forcing the multihunters to do something about it, was all Apprime. This resulted in a hardcoded change, leaving the support planet pretty much impossible to break.
So you see Apprime is getting there, having played 4 rounds, won 3 of them, actively contributed to changes in game mechanics, total domination in round35. We will see where this ends, but clearly Apprime have proved my now that Ascendancy cant simply pull the "we would have won if we tried" card on Apprime.
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10 Apr 2010, 09:47
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#24
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Paso Leaute
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 919
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
respect your elders!
oops! *bows to Old Dawn*
__________________
An optimist may see a light where there is none, but why must the pessimist always run to blow it out?
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10 Apr 2010, 09:48
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#25
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 296
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by HaNzI
I dont know what you put in total domination, but round 28 you had no opponents. Round 35 was surely a total domination by Apprime, and comparable considering the opposition, dont you think?
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I´m talking about sheer numbers: Almost twice the #2 allies score, almost thrice it´s roids ... read them up in the wiki, and you´ll notice what I mean by total domination. I might be wrong, but I can´t remember App dominating a final ranking _that_ badly (yet?). At least I wasn´t at the stage yet I thought "man, this show shouldn´t be repeated because it certainly is bad for the game and completely demotivating for everyone else around".
As for r35, I seriously can´t remember a thing, had a lazy scanner account and studied, so I missed about everything that happened and certainly didn´t try to keep anything of the bits I read in mind. My focus was just elsewhere in life.
Quote:
Both being in omen round 30 (5 days hurrah), and then fighting omen round 30 with Ascendancy, i know this from the inside. Fighting P3nguins in round 32 was certainly comparable to Omen in round 30.
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Having been part of p3nguins in r32 (and taken care of a shitload of internal quarrels behind the stage) I think they´re comparable in overall quality, but I also think Omen had the longer breath. p3ng seemed a bit unorganised and clueless to me at times, with Asc basically putting in some good effort to organise the block that fought Apprime. Clearly in round 30 this was not the case. Omen started going for Asc earlier and longer then p3ng. I still respect their attempt as "hopeless but incredibly enduring".
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If you talk about the nerfing of fortress galaxies, then you are clearly taking too much credit. This one must be shared between asc and apprime, as neither is any better then the other at building strong pure gals.
And what happened last round, when fortress gals were supposed to be impossible/harder to create? Apprime successfully created them anyways. Resulting in round 36 being private gals, so everyone could make "fortresses" without any effort or thinking. Coincidence? Then i must say the changing of xp-formula after round 16 was a coincidence as well.
1 point to Apprime and half a point to ascendancy, for the changes in game mechanics to nerf fortress gals.
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One could call the fortress gals an "Asc invention" or say Asc were the first to use them on large scale, before App even existed. People complained about them back then already :P I certainly know I was annoyed like hell by an almost pure Asc fortress in r26 as Nox HC. That´s 6 rounds before App even formed.
We had salvage changed after r30 because Asc gained from hostiles crashing around the clock. I could try to think of more, but I think you should get the picture.
Quote:
Lets also talk about the defense system, and the changes in game mechanics we had here. If you remember round 34, which was the last round we could defend whoever we wanted to. Apprime was fighting multiple alliances way before Ascendancy even smelled war, more precisely around 700 ticks into the game. Facing new problems with the support planet rule, thanks to the opposition consisting of mainly CT/ND/SUBH/DLR/ND. They all defended eachother, without caring about the support planet rule, which was very clear on how much defense you were allowed to send outside your alliance/gal. Apprime met no sympathy among the multihunters, and the multihunters answer was they would monitor the fleet movements, and give warnings to people who broke it. A warned planet would not be allowed to defend anyone else then his/hers own alliance/gal. A week later, no warnings were issued.
Now i do know App/asc/vision worked together later this round, but the pressure on the multihunters, the hundreds of newsscans used to document breaking of the support planet rule, the actual dedication into forcing the multihunters to do something about it, was all Apprime. This resulted in a hardcoded change, leaving the support planet pretty much impossible to break.
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To be honest, in my perception I´d have given credit for the hardcode def change to App/Asc combined, it always felt as if the other allies complained about us defending each other quite effectively during r34. I didn´t really know how much you probably complained about the hostile block using OOT def. Probably thought you didn´t give too much about it because they got owned anyway. That´s pretty much what I felt like
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So you see Apprime is getting there, having played 4 rounds, won 3 of them, actively contributed to changes in game mechanics, total domination in round35. We will see where this ends, but clearly Apprime have proved my now that Ascendancy cant simply pull the "we would have won if we tried" card on Apprime.
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It certainly wasn´t my intention to belittle Apprimes effort and success. I´m sorry if you think it was. Londos comparison to the old guy and the new guy fits rather well in my oppinion. Apprime clearly is the new guy, young, fresh, powerful, yet not at its peak. Ascendancy might have passed its peak already, we´ve got quite some players not motivated for hardcore gaming for one reason or the other. As usually with old and new guys, you´ll probably never know who´d win if both fight in top condition, just because those peak levels have been at different times.
Apprime certainly is an alliance that will be remembered as one of the top shots, but I think you can still do better.
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10 Apr 2010, 09:51
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#26
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Banned
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Lithuania, Vilnius
Posts: 106
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
pretty much everyone saw how shit ascendancy is without JBG putting effort for you all.
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10 Apr 2010, 10:06
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#27
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a bucket
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Chatham, UK
Posts: 1,073
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by rUl3r
As usually with old and new guys, you´ll probably never know who´d win if both fight in top condition, just because those peak levels have been at different times.
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of course you wont, asc was at its peak in round 30 when it had some of what is now app in it, most obviously elviz and cardi. Essentially there is a group of players that changes slowly over time who can totally dominate the game when they get together, they did it in asc in round 28/30/31 and then again in app in 35.
As to changes: The biggest one asc has caused has been in alliance organisation rather than anything ingame.
Quote:
Originally Posted by izverg
pretty much everyone saw how shit ascendancy is without JBG putting effort for you all. ![Salute](images/smilies/salute.gif)
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in round 34? I think it was the opposition who decided who won that one not either asc or app.
I dont think that asc is likely to be top again for some time (if ever), everyone can no longer be bothered, just look at today where we must have had 50+ incs reported late. (btw even jbg cant save you from late reported incs!)
__________________
Proud to have been TGV!
aargh! died in Jenova! | idled in ROCK | disappointed in Audentes | been Roguish | p-p-previously a p-p-p3nguin
Ascendancy
Otterly an Otter.
Last edited by booji; 10 Apr 2010 at 10:15.
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10 Apr 2010, 10:12
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#28
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Banned
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Lithuania, Vilnius
Posts: 106
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
everyone that is "jbg" once again
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10 Apr 2010, 10:27
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#29
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Paso Leaute
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 919
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
It is undeniable that JBG's activity certainly correlates with Ascs success or failure quite closely.
HaNzI why the hate, this whole thread from your perspective seems based on personal attacks, on Lokken, on rico and on me.
The forum is open to all to air their views WHETHER THEY ARE ACTIVE IN THEIR ALLIANCE OR NOT. I will DC for my gal when it has incs, Ascendancy asks no more.
When I said Ascendancy is the only dominating alliance not to have left the stage i in no way meant to imply that it was the last dominating alliance, indeed the whole metaphor was meant to imply that the stage became apprimes but ascendancy clings on without the right to be there.
I was saying that Apprime is the current Ascendancy in power terms but we hang around anyway - you totally misinterpreted my post.
__________________
An optimist may see a light where there is none, but why must the pessimist always run to blow it out?
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10 Apr 2010, 10:34
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#30
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Banned
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Lithuania, Vilnius
Posts: 106
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
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10 Apr 2010, 10:43
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#31
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self-entitledly superior
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Finland
Posts: 341
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by izverg
pretty much everyone saw how shit ascendancy is without JBG putting effort for you all. ![Salute](images/smilies/salute.gif)
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a comparable statemement would be that pretty much everyone see how shit liths are without vnc
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10 Apr 2010, 10:46
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#32
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You've Seen The Light
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,152
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by rUl3r
As to alliance achievements: While Apprime certainly is a top quality alliance, to me they´re still the (let´s reuse the picture here) "young kid" looking for fame. They´ve had some well played round wins (credit where it is due!), but they still lack some achievements Asc got on the scoreboard. Total domination like in r28, fighting an alliance like Omen r30 (slightly lacking quality but made up by durability), backed by the whole active universe, having rules and game mechanics changed because of your tactics. That´s the slim difference between a top alliance and an (almost?) historical one. The impact you had on the game, which is not just mesaured by the number of roundwins.
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Wtf is this crap.
I love how you're trying to change the goalposts, the discussion was weither Apprime was the best alliance in the rounds they won which they was. Yeah, Asc did some stuff in the past but that was in the past and its certainly not that historical. An alliances main aim is to win, Apprime had a domination round, Apprime would of been fighting Asc in previous rounds but Asc failed to muster any competition, and having rules changed means nothing in the grand scheme of things.
__________________
First shalt thou take out the Holy Pin. Then shalt thou count to three, no more, no less. Three shall be the number thou shalt count, and the number of the counting shall be three. Four shalt thou not count, neither count thou two, excepting that thou then proceed to three. Five is right out. Once the number three, being the third number, be reached, then lobbest thou thy Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch towards thy foe, who, being naughty in my sight, shall snuff it.
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10 Apr 2010, 10:49
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#33
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a bucket
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Chatham, UK
Posts: 1,073
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by izverg
ascendancy need many more years to become in the level apprime is
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are you willfully ignoring the posts? the whole point is that asc has been where app is now and is not likely to get back there for some time if ever as it is a natural cycle whereby players move on.
__________________
Proud to have been TGV!
aargh! died in Jenova! | idled in ROCK | disappointed in Audentes | been Roguish | p-p-previously a p-p-p3nguin
Ascendancy
Otterly an Otter.
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10 Apr 2010, 10:50
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#34
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self-entitledly superior
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Finland
Posts: 341
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by booji
Essentially there is a group of players that changes slowly over time who can totally dominate the game when they get together, they did it in asc in round 28/30/31 and then again in app in 35.
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Yes, the whole talk about total domination of alliance x comes down to this, even in r35 apprime had a large number of ascendancy players.
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10 Apr 2010, 10:51
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#35
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Banned
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Lithuania, Vilnius
Posts: 106
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
i just joked there ! and i like how ascendancy this round says "round is decided already" ascendancy gave up without any fight already because JBG is offline once again. good job to show again what you guys for real are
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10 Apr 2010, 10:54
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#36
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Paso Leaute
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 919
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Light
An alliances main aim is to win
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This is a curious round to state that in an apprime orientated thread, it appears App isnt looking to win this round in the same way Asc gave up winning again as a goal at the end of r31.
An alliances main aim is to give what its members want from it - often that includes winning.
I know ascendancy has said what you said many times before in the hopes of goading competition in the 2nd or 3rd allies but it dosent make it any more true!
__________________
An optimist may see a light where there is none, but why must the pessimist always run to blow it out?
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10 Apr 2010, 11:02
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#37
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a bucket
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Chatham, UK
Posts: 1,073
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Light
Yeah, Asc did some stuff in the past but that was in the past and its certainly not that historical.
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hmm how is it not historical?
indeed I think that statement calls for quoting you back at yourself:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Light
Wtf is this crap.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Light
An alliances main aim is to win, Apprime had a domination round, Apprime would of been fighting Asc in previous rounds but Asc failed to muster any competition, and having rules changed means nothing in the grand scheme of things.
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Planetarion is a game so I think the main aim should be to have fun rather than win, many in ascendancy think round 32 was the best recent round as we had fun.
I assume you mean last round? How is asc supposed to provide competition when our best players were in app?
__________________
Proud to have been TGV!
aargh! died in Jenova! | idled in ROCK | disappointed in Audentes | been Roguish | p-p-previously a p-p-p3nguin
Ascendancy
Otterly an Otter.
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10 Apr 2010, 11:19
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#38
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Up The Hatters!
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Kenilworth Road
Posts: 3,012
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
I just love how this thread have turned from: is Lokken shit to Apprime is better than Ascendancy.
Credit to Light, Isverg and some morons who actually picked up a fight with these ludicrus people who make every post a pro Asc or pro App thread.
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Planetarion veteran
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10 Apr 2010, 11:40
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#39
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Apprime Troll HC
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 857
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Ascendancy is one of the best alliances that has existed, if not the best, and i never tried to belittle them. What i did was to react on posts that was pro asc, and that the same time belittled Apprimes efforts as alliance.
Both alliances have dominated, Asc have existed a bit longer and achieved a little more in total, but Apprime has achieved a lot in the 4 rounds they played. Most of the posters have no insight in the last 4-5 rounds, but they still post like they know it all, and this is the reason we have these stupid arguments. This is the reason i reacted, because lokken have no ****ing clue about what has been going on the last rounds. He indeed writes good posts, but that does not mean his facts are right.
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10 Apr 2010, 11:50
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#40
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a bucket
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Chatham, UK
Posts: 1,073
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by HaNzI
Londo, when did you actually do anything useful in Asc? You just talk aswell, but you have never worked hard for your alliance.
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As the other half of Lonji or bondo or whatever asc is calling us at the moment I think I have to take issue with this. Londo has dcd for a semi-fortress gal every round he has been in asc (we dont exile enough ppl to make full fortresses). Sure we dont put up many raids and dont have anything to do with politics but dcing for an asc gal is what asc tends to need from us.
And as you specifically say he has never worked hard for an alliance Londo was practically the only dc on duty every day for Subh in round 25, and again was pretty much the only dc for Audentes in round 29 as the rest of us had given up (if waking up practically every day for a round at 4:30 and dcing until 10 or 11 is not working hard for you alliance I dont know what is). When a dc in round 26 for jenova and in round 28 in TGV with me he did every other day. You might say that ascendancy is our retirement where we get to only dc for a gal every so often when it gets incs!
__________________
Proud to have been TGV!
aargh! died in Jenova! | idled in ROCK | disappointed in Audentes | been Roguish | p-p-previously a p-p-p3nguin
Ascendancy
Otterly an Otter.
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10 Apr 2010, 11:57
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#41
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Paso Leaute
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 919
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by HaNzI
Most of the posters have no insight in the last 4-5 rounds, but they still post like they know it all, and this is the reason we have these stupid arguments.
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No.
Most of the posters have a different insight into the last 4-5 rounds, as long as they paid a modicum of attention through those rounds it is valid.
The pity of these boards is that there are so few differing perspectives, so many of the posters come from ascendancy, whether asc was owning or not has no relevance to whether its members can put forward a decent analysis from their own viewpoint. Whenever any one of us, Lokken, JBG, Mz, anyone puts forward the facts they are still as we see them, that people take them to heart is up to them and the posters long record of posting well reasoned and/or credible information will be the deciding factor on how that information is taken. The simple fact is Lokken and those mentioned above have a long and fairly creditable record so people pay attention when they write in a way that people may not when I write, or you write.
__________________
An optimist may see a light where there is none, but why must the pessimist always run to blow it out?
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10 Apr 2010, 12:48
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#42
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mz.
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,587
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Light
the discussion was weither Apprime was the best alliance in the rounds they won which they was.
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This is true by definition.
Quote:
Originally Posted by izverg
i just joked there ! and i like how ascendancy this round says "round is decided already" ascendancy gave up without any fight already because JBG is offline once again. good job to show again what you guys for real are
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Are you quoting anyone in specific, here? Because personally I haven't seen anyone say this. Quite the opposite, in fact. Yesterday afternoon/evening, when the topic in #ascendancy was changed to "Expect DLR/App inc tonight", people were going "it's about time!".
Quote:
Originally Posted by booji
Planetarion is a game so I think the main aim should be to have fun rather than win, many in ascendancy think round 32 was the best recent round as we had fun.
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In fairness, winning is pretty entertaining.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HaNzI
because lokken have no ****ing clue about what has been going on the last rounds. He indeed writes good posts, but that does not mean his facts are right.
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This does not actually become more true the more often you say it. That said, I would be interested in your view of which of his points over the last rounds have been incorrect and why.
__________________
The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
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10 Apr 2010, 13:12
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#43
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Apprime Troll HC
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 857
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Lets generalize it and say he draws conclusions without facts, or the facts are twisted to make them pro ascendancy. He idles in #Ascendancy and is colored by general opinions in there, so its expected. He was simply the victim in my post because i have seen him doing this before, and hopefully i don't have to address everyone. He can take this somewhat of a burden on his own!
Most posters are from Ascendancy, which is why its important that i respond. My view might be a bit colored by Apprime, but i have the ability to reflect on things i say and think, mainly because i have been wrong about stuff in the past and corrected. This is what separates me from an arrogant prick, to being just a prick. If i don't correct a few Ascendancy posters, when they march into fields i have knowledge of, they will eventually drown in their own arrogance.
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10 Apr 2010, 13:55
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#44
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Paso Leaute
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 919
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by HaNzI
Lets generalize it and say he draws conclusions without facts, or the facts are twisted to make them pro ascendancy.
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The Problem we all have is this entirely - you made accusations without linking any posts by Lokken that demonstrated your proposition.
The forums do not require heavy footnoting generally but accusations against individuals should be backed up.
Arguments on these boards are seldom about facts actually, what people did and didn't do is usually fairly easily and quickly resolved. What people should have done and whether a course of action is a correct one tends to be what forms most argument, and that is thankfully all opinion, though point granted that Asc does make a point of trying to make its opinion seem like it is the correct one to the point of overbearing arrogance on occasions, made all the worse by a chain reaction of a dozen ascendancy posters.
__________________
An optimist may see a light where there is none, but why must the pessimist always run to blow it out?
Last edited by [B5]Londo; 10 Apr 2010 at 14:00.
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10 Apr 2010, 14:02
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#45
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Banned
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Further to the right
Posts: 19,441
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
This is a hell of a thread, even for Ascendancy Discussions. Responding to multiple points in no particular order. I disagree with lokken that ascendancy were the best alliance in r32. I thought apprime were hyper-efficient and although we certainly held the political initiative for a lot of that round I don't think that's enough to call an alliance "the best". Would we have beaten apprime if we fought them that round? No. Maybe if everyone plays up to their full potential or some shit like that but you can't judge things that way, you can only go off what happened and how people actually played.
In terms of comparing omen r30 to p3nguins in r32 I'd have to say omen were a lot better. The main issue with r30 was more about getting hit early on though. Our average value didn't catch up for ****ing ever. R32 apprime's actual fleet value never dropped below p3nguins or ct. That's what made that round so hard in my opinion. Personally I think it's one of planetarion's better rounds, and one of its toughest round victories alliance wise. I do think it was tougher than apprime's r32 but I might be wrong. I don't think anyone was in a good enough position both rounds to comment, possibly cardi might know enough to call it either way if anyone can get him to answer seriously!
For the idea that ascendancy are shit without me I wasn't even there in r34, nor were a lot of the people who made up ascendancy during our winning rounds, and they finished second. So izverg the idea that ascendancy aren't a t10 alliance without me is retarded. Ignoring that one would also like to know how good apprime would be without cardi. I'd imagine it's pretty similar to be honest. To, well hanzi I guess, getting kicked from ascendancy after r31 wasn't an insult or anything to your pa playing abilities. We kicked a fair few people who I thought were excellent players. That direction just wasn't where we wanted to go.
I think it's great that pa has almost certainly moved on from ascendancy being the best alliance out there, evolution is good for the game. I'd prefer it if someone, like DLR say, genuinely rose up and seized control of the game but I guess that's relatively unlikely. At the minute the game really feels it's just drifting along with nothing game-changing actually happening. Last round's travesty was as bad as it's gotten for a while, and it was worse for the fact that everyone saw it coming. Like all egotistical maniacs I blame myself though, if I hadn't joined apprime and if the part of ascendancy that felt like being active hadn't followed me maybe the round would have been different. It was literally like we put 90% of the competent value players in pa into one tag though. Actually losing last round would have been virtually impossible for apprime. That's a pretty shit way for a round to be decided.
On the actual point this thread is here for lokken's opinions on pa are generally pretty good in my experience. The idea that you can't have an informed political opinion without being some sort of 24/7 active dc is risible at best. As for ascendancy this round I'd like to refer to an old post jester made in round 16 or something like that. We don't need excuses for how we play. We play how we want and we get what rank we deserve. After that, **** you all.
PS The direction we wanted to go was towards your mother's house.
__________________
Some might ask what good is life without purpose but I'm anticipating a good lunch.
Last edited by JonnyBGood; 10 Apr 2010 at 14:12.
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10 Apr 2010, 14:08
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#46
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self-entitledly superior
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Finland
Posts: 341
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
jesus has spoken
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10 Apr 2010, 14:37
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#47
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break it down!
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 2,087
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordNieminen
bored after incomings.. just going to ask, what has this topic to do with alliance discussion... Maybe move it elsewhere and hmm lokken is Ok.
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Lokken is an AD mod and a fairly prominent figure in the development of alliances/alliance politics throughout the history of the game - whilst his role in the past 20+ rounds may not be noticeable, I'm pretty sure his advice has been taken into account by numerous decision makers in top alliances in the PAX era.
Also it's Ascendancy Discussion nowadays...
__________________
I put the sex in dyslexia!
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10 Apr 2010, 14:50
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#48
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 54
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by HaNzI
Lets also talk about the defense system, and the changes in game mechanics we had here. If you remember round 34, which was the last round we could defend whoever we wanted to. Apprime was fighting multiple alliances way before Ascendancy even smelled war, more precisely around 700 ticks into the game. Facing new problems with the support planet rule, thanks to the opposition consisting of mainly CT/ND/SUBH/DLR/ND. They all defended eachother, without caring about the support planet rule, which was very clear on how much defense you were allowed to send outside your alliance/gal. Apprime met no sympathy among the multihunters, and the multihunters answer was they would monitor the fleet movements, and give warnings to people who broke it. A warned planet would not be allowed to defend anyone else then his/hers own alliance/gal. A week later, no warnings were issued.
Now i do know App/asc/vision worked together later this round, but the pressure on the multihunters, the hundreds of newsscans used to document breaking of the support planet rule, the actual dedication into forcing the multihunters to do something about it, was all Apprime. This resulted in a hardcoded change, leaving the support planet pretty much impossible to break.
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I remember clearly you guys crumbled on the pressure untill Asc joined your side ( Dont care for what reason we did that ) and the pressure got shifted to Asc for the large remainder of the round. Dont take credit where the effort wasnt 1 sided. You did amazingly well that round, Ill give you that, but without the interference from Asc, both alliances would have died in the end.
Oh and to answer the question in the title: Ofcourse.
__________________
Pre round 29: To many ROCK rounds to mention
Round 29 Denial Round 30 ROCK peon Round 31 ROCK HC Round 32 ROCK HHC Round 33 Ascendancy.
HEROES
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10 Apr 2010, 14:57
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#49
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mz.
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,587
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Lokken is not a moderator anymore (and hasn't been for 4 months now, do keep up).
__________________
The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
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10 Apr 2010, 15:20
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#50
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Apprime Troll HC
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 857
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Re: Lokken: is he shit?
Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
PS The direction we wanted to go was towards your mother's house.
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No more surprises like this one when i drink my afternoon coffee please. Coughing and laughing is rarely a wanted combination!
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