Planetarion Forums - Is EU really considering this country for membership?

G.K Zhukov · 2 Sep 2005, 18:41

So much for the progess on human rights and civil liberties!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4205708.stm

Nusselt · 2 Sep 2005, 18:47

If they joined the EU they wouldn't be able to do that.

So lets keep them out.

Nodrog · 3 Sep 2005, 00:08

Dont the Germans have a death penalty for mentioning Hitler or something equally absurd?

Yahwe · 3 Sep 2005, 00:45

since the norwegian (non eu) communist (loony) asked. he deserves a straight answer.

no.

we aren't.

but

yes we are.

tricky international politics aren't they? best you not get involved? eh?

Stew · 3 Sep 2005, 00:55

We need a Muslim country in the EU.
We don't want them though.

Does that cover it Yahwe?

Deffeh · 3 Sep 2005, 02:45

we still have diplomatic relations with the states, who cares about morals really

at0mic.c0w · 3 Sep 2005, 04:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nodrog

Dont the Germans have a death penalty for mentioning Hitler or something equally absurd?

claiming the holocaust never happened is a crime. apart from that i don't know what you could be refering to.

Nodrog · 3 Sep 2005, 05:50

The swastika is banned too afaik, along with other symbols associated with hitler/the nazis. I'm not sure what the inherent difference is between Turkey jailing this guy for claiming a higher number of people were killed during a part of his country's history, and Germany jailing someone for saying that a lesser number of people were killed during the holocaust.

pyirt · 3 Sep 2005, 09:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nusselt

If they joined the EU they wouldn't be able to do that.

So lets keep them out.

I`ve read somewhere the "Vatican" in Rome disagrees with the idea of EU membership for Turkey. (Not that I`m supporting the Vatican btw).

roadrunner_0 · 3 Sep 2005, 09:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nodrog

The swastika is banned too afaik, along with other symbols associated with hitler/the nazis. I'm not sure what the inherent difference is between Turkey jailing this guy for claiming a higher number of people were killed during a part of his country's history, and Germany jailing someone for saying that a lesser number of people were killed during the holocaust.

did you ever read the story linked?????
1 million is not greater than 3 million nod

MAdnRisKy · 3 Sep 2005, 10:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nodrog

Dont the Germans have a death penalty for mentioning Hitler or something equally absurd?

want to add yourself to Mr Ts link Nod?

Nodrog · 3 Sep 2005, 13:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by roadrunner_0

did you ever read the story linked?????
1 million is not greater than 3 million nod

I dont really know what youre talking about but I'm going to suggest you read the article again anyway.

roadrunner_0 · 3 Sep 2005, 13:34

it depends how you take your first post really, although reading it again not in a hurry, i appear to have taken it wrongly, for which i apologise, but it is badly worded

Dante Hicks · 3 Sep 2005, 13:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nodrog

The swastika is banned too afaik, along with other symbols associated with hitler/the nazis.

Myself and T&F are members of a nightclub where a guy comes from Germany (or similar) every couple of months and dances around while dressed as Hitler because he can't do it in his home country. Or something like that.

[/random anecdote]

Also; surely the killing of the Kurds is worse than putting someone in prison for talking about it?

1-X · 3 Sep 2005, 14:10

Quote:

Turkey`s foreign minister reportedly says his country will walk away from the European Union if unacceptable conditions are put on membership.

'Should they propose anything short of full membership or any new conditions, we will walk away,' said Turkish Foreign Minister Abdullah Gul. 'And this time it will be for good.'

oh dear what a pity never mind

wu_trax · 3 Sep 2005, 14:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1-X

oh dear what a pity never mind

well, we promised them some time around the 60s i think. since then there was no progress in the talks. i can somewhat understand if they are pissed now.

wu_trax · 3 Sep 2005, 14:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by MAdnRisKy

want to add yourself to Mr Ts link Nod?

best link ever

All Systems Go · 3 Sep 2005, 20:50

Blair supports their membership.

So does Bush.

Says it all really...

Cmdr_Cyrax · 4 Sep 2005, 00:46

Someone in power is obviously nobbing someone else in power.
When we find out who these two are, this issue will become clearer.

Weeks · 4 Sep 2005, 18:21

Quick question regarding Cyprus:

The Turkish government is said to be supporting the 'break-away Turks' to the north of the island and don't support the 'Greek-Cypriot' government.

So is the government totally Greek? And is the Turkish government just pissed that the Turks aren't represented in the government?

All Systems Go · 4 Sep 2005, 18:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cmdr_Cyrax

Bush is obviously nobbing Blair.

IncubusGod · 4 Sep 2005, 18:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weeks

Quick question regarding Cyprus:

The Turkish government is said to be supporting the 'break-away Turks' to the north of the island and don't support the 'Greek-Cypriot' government.

So is the government totally Greek? And is the Turkish government just pissed that the Turks aren't represented in the government?

Cyprus gained independent status from Britan in 1960, led by the Greek Cypriot President, Archbishop Makarios III, and Turkish Cypriot Vice-President Dr Fasil Kükük.

During the 1960s, Makarios pursued a non-aligned foreign policy, cultivating good relations with the guarantor powers, Britain, Greece and Turkey and taking a leading role in developing the Non-Aligned Movement. However, by 1974 dissatisfaction among right-wing elements in favour of the long-term goal of Enosis - union with Greece - precipitated a coup d'etat against Makarios which was sponsored by the Greek military junta of 1967-1974 and led by the Cypriot National Guard. The new regime named Nikos Giorgiades Sampson as president, and Bishop Gennadios as head of the Cypriot Orthodox Church to replace Makarios. Diplomacy failed to resolve the crisis. Turkey invaded Cyprus by sea and air on 20 July, 1974, asserting its right to protect the Turkish Cypriot minority. Talks in Geneva involving Greece, Turkey, the United Kingdom and the two Cypriot factions failed in mid-August, and the Turks subsequently moved to gain control of 37% of the island's territory. Upwards of 200,000 Cypriots were uprooted, with Greek Cypriots forced to flee from the Turkish-occupied north and Turkish Cypriots displaced from the south. Greece made no armed response to the superior Turkish force but bitterly suspended military participation in the NATO alliance. The tension continued after Makarios returned to become president on Dec. 7, 1974. He offered self-government to the Turkish minority, but rejected any solution “involving transfer of populations and amounting to partition of Cyprus.”The events of summer, 1974 have dominated Cypriot politics ever since and have been a major point of contention between Greece and Turkey

Since 1974, Cyprus has been divided, de facto, into the Greek-Cypriot controlled southern two-thirds of the island and the Turkish-Cypriot northern one-third.

The Republic of Cyprus is the internationally recognised government of Cyprus, which controls the southern two-thirds of the island. Turkey aside, all foreign governments and the United Nations recognise the sovereignty of the Republic of Cyprus over the whole island of Cyprus.

The Turkish Cypriot administration of the northern part of the island, together with Turkey, does not accept the Republic's rule over the whole island and refer to it as the "Greek Authority of Southern Cyprus". They occupy the northern third of the island, following the military invasion by Turkey.

The area occupied by Turkey proclaimed its independence in 1975, and the self-styled Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus was established in 1983. This state was recognised only by Turkey. The Organization of the Islamic Conference granted it observer member status under the name of "Turkish Cypriot State".

Your friend

Weeks · 4 Sep 2005, 19:22

That's nice. I was hoping to get more of a personal insight, but thanks anyway.

And another thing, everyone's bitching that you can't allow Turkey in as they have a land dispute (not like us good ol' brits, *cough* Gibraltar *cough*). But they let Cyprus in didn't they?

wu_trax · 4 Sep 2005, 19:42

after what IncubusGod posted you can harldy blame turkey for that, can you?
basicly it all comes down to them beeing muslims, we dont want that. sure, some people say its economic, but how many countries in eastern europe did we just take in after just a few years? i would hardly call them economical superpowers. others talk about human rights, but seriously who gives a damn? its not like anyone cares how the russian minorities in the three balitc states are treated.

Weeks · 5 Sep 2005, 18:01

o..........k.

JonnyBGood · 7 Sep 2005, 07:09

Isn't it easier to do more good by working inside the system? I suppose this would be a rather backwards interpretation of that saying but I think it's still valid. In response to zhukov's actual question that is. In response to the actual issue of that guy being sent to jail down with this sort of thing.

QazokRouge5 · 7 Sep 2005, 07:14

"Somethin' like this comes along makes you realize just how crazy the world is these days."

The Turnks would fit in well with the rest of Europe. First Germany, then Turkey, next it'll be Russia and the Africas.

JonnyBGood · 7 Sep 2005, 07:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by QazokRouge5

"Somethin' like this comes along makes you realize just how crazy the world is these days."

The Turnks would fit in well with the rest of Europe. First Germany, then Turkey, next it'll be Russia and the Africas.

LARGE QUESTION MARK

CrashTester · 7 Sep 2005, 14:30

Im buying a house in Turkey!

All Systems Go · 7 Sep 2005, 14:42

Everybody makes mistakes thats why pencils have erasers.

Opi · 7 Sep 2005, 18:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by wu_trax

its not like anyone cares how the russian minorities in the three balitc states are treated.

It seems that in theory, they can gain full citizenship through some language/historical tests. No idea how easy this is in reality, but similar concepts are brought up in Germany, too, every now and then regarding foreigners applying for citizenship. Hope we don´t get kicked off the EU.

wu_trax · 7 Sep 2005, 18:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Opi

It seems that in theory, they can gain full citizenship through some language/historical tests. No idea how easy this is in reality, but similar concepts are brought up in Germany, too, every now and then regarding foreigners applying for citizenship. Hope we don´t get kicked off the EU.

its not that bad ( yet ..., lets wait for Beckstein)

zakoff · 7 Sep 2005, 18:26

The EU has already said that Turkey cannot join the EU until it accepts that the Genocide happened etc. They also have been told to sort out all their Human rights issues and wont be even accepted as a potential member until they have done that. Don't forget that EU pressure will help to improve the human rights record and civil liberties - just like it has done elsewhere in Europe.

Croatia - which has pretty good civil and human rights now, is still not allowed to be put forward for membership because it hasn't given up its War Criminals (they say they can't find them) so getting into the EU isn't 'that' easy.

I also suggest you look at other members of the EU, not like our records of Human rights are squeeky clean. Eventhough our Civil liberties are a seemingly better than Turkey.