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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 10:41   #201
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Originally Posted by Zoro View Post
Personally I don't see anything to admire when a group of the best players all gang together when the game is at its lowest (in numbers terms). I suppose we all have to accept that this will be another ASC dominated round.

I'm still looking foward to it though. As always.

I still stand by my comments in another thread where I stated that such domination is bad for PA.
This is really the sort of post that sickens me. So Zoro I assume from tick 72 all of your fleets will be headed towards Ascendancy? I mean you personally, 3 fleets for the first week against ascendancy, or until the sunday so thats monday - sunday x18 fleets from you. Most of the first few days attacks get through anyway especially since salvage has been reduced and everyone knows to attack and Ascendancy especially try to aim at that 280~ or so mark compared to the big 300, so they can fully utilise there attacking fleets. Make sure you dont crash and take every damn willing player with you. It should be easy to spot the Ascendancy galaxys, if at tick 72 you cant find any, pm me on here.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 11:14   #202
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Originally Posted by CBA View Post
This is really the sort of post that sickens me. So Zoro I assume from tick 72 all of your fleets will be headed towards Ascendancy? I mean you personally, 3 fleets for the first week against ascendancy, or until the sunday so thats monday - sunday x18 fleets from you. Most of the first few days attacks get through anyway especially since salvage has been reduced and everyone knows to attack and Ascendancy especially try to aim at that 280~ or so mark compared to the big 300, so they can fully utilise there attacking fleets. Make sure you dont crash and take every damn willing player with you. It should be easy to spot the Ascendancy galaxys, if at tick 72 you cant find any, pm me on here.
My rulername/planetname will be THE GLUE UNDERNEATH of MY AWESOME PEDAL.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 11:17   #203
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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My rulername/planetname will be THE GLUE UNDERNEATH of MY AWESOME PEDAL.
The trouble is, will your planet even be over the 100 roid mark, therefore worth hitting!!

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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 11:18   #204
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Re: R31 rumour thread

finally i shall make a proper reply, however i am slightly sleep deprived so apologies if at any point i dont make sense. to start:

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood View Post
but I do remember when Omen hit 9.1 the fat f-crew planet was on the other list. So I'm not sure in what sense he was a "high priority target" or maybe that was just a once-off.
im at uni again now and read through my logs and this certainly was a 'once-off' as you call it.
this was around the time that ascendancy had been piggying omen attacks (which you had done for 2/3 nights). in this case i put up the f-crew as high priority due to his large roid count, i wanted to make sure omen got those roids, not ascendancy. i didnt want us draining f-crew def (on what was probably a defsink) with poor attacks allowing ascendancy to swoop in for easy roids.

please dont flame me here on bad tactical decision-making, i wouldnt describe myself as a master tactician all the time and its not really what we're discussing here

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
I believe you were on 1 attack channel by then. Certainly what I saw was 2 parser links, one with the fat f-crew and either 1 or 2 others and 1 with the rest of 9.1.
at this time:

2 attack channels
2 parser links
2 targets total in the 2nd attack group

this example of 2 targets split between 20-30 (i cant really remember how large monzetsu was anymore) players (not all officers) clearly shows officer favouritism so we could all get fat and achieve high planet ranks! i really enjoyed the 20-30 roids i was getting from such teamups. i still cant believe my preferential targets of 20-30 roids at a time due to being hc didnt win me #1 planet

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
One public attack chan. Which was my point. I mean in this case here the 2 fattest planets, one of which was f-crew, were removed from the "public" target list and set aside for the more "active members". We're not exactly talking about the sort of planets which require 10 man teamups here heh.
depends on what you mean by public. we started off with like 4 attack chans, then 2, then 1, then 2 etc. but i dont think the monzetsu chan we used after kaifux joined for high value players was ever a big secret.

and in this instance the f-crew was deemed worthy of 10 man teamups, due to the context of that period of the round (covered above)

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
Didn't you just acknowledge there was a second channel?
omen had all sorts of attack channels for different purposes throughout the round.
to clarify in this 9.1 example omen had 2 channels: #hamas and #monzetsu - we operated in this way for a while.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
It sounds like the sort of comforting lie people like to tell each other.
i refer to my earlier sarcasm about the great riches we drowned in through our sharing 2 targets between 20-30 players

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
Well basically I'm going off the way I responded. There's almost zero chance I would have confirmed it unless I had heard something else (and I did have my sources!)
i continue to wait to hear what you heard that confirmed this /o\

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
The fact that you actually had a separate attack channel for the fattest targets reserved for your more active members doesn't exactly leave me with a "holy shit I was miles off" reverberating around my head though.
what we're arguing here is that we DIDNT have a seperate attack channel for the fattest targets for our more active members. as explained previously, it was for our higher value/size players to hit higher value planets in gals we hit, rather than them farming the fatter, yet lower value targets (which we wanted the smaller guys to be hitting). ofc it was also used for 'high priority' targets which included: defleeches, ascendancy planets (in non-fortress gals), and in the example discussed - an uber-fatty who i wanted us to roid before asc got there

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zotnam
This was the 1 example where we found out (different parsers pretty clearly shows the a and b team), for all I know it could have happend alot more.
no one is denying different attack channels and different parsers.
what i am arguing against here is the motives and context YOU put behind these with no shred of evidence to support it. the motives/context you put behind omen operations seem only to be the way you WANTED to interpret it and portray it, which makes us look like bad guys...rather than view the facts from an objective perspective, or simply not comment at all beyond the facts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zotnam
At this point Omen was pretty much falling apart, instead of giving the "normal" members an easy chance of a scoreboost and decent roids on a 3k f-crew cath, it's reserved for "important" people.
heh, at this point omen may have been falling apart, but we didnt give up. the attack was planned in an attempt to give us an advantage over ascendancy in that nights 'roid-race', i cant recall if it was successful or not, but we still actively tried to compete against you rather than rolling over and dieing.

i didnt want to give the 'normal' members a chance of a 'scoreboost' or 'decent roids', i wanted to get a fat planet in a galaxy i knew asc would roid hit before you got there - thus making it high priority. therefore i let our higher value players teamup on it, as there would be little INDIVIDUAL roid gain.

like i say: you're portraying what you percieve to be omen official's intentions as fact based on your own biased perspective. when in reality you have massively misinterpreted the situation to suit your own agenda.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zotnam
Call that what you want tbh, its clear favouretism right that, possibly even hurting alliance score.
like i say, 20-30 planets doing 6 waves on 2 planets is hardly favouritism to benefit those people.

i dont see how a guaranteed +1500ish roids for omen hurts our alliance score either

it might have been a shit tactical move by me....but favouritism it certainly was not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zotnam
Fairly sure this guy ended up with 0 def, as predicted.
ergo the objective was fulfilled as had been intended

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zotnam
I've said this before, the lower ranked members of your alliance are those you need to take care off, if they start losing motivation it will spread upwards quickly. Yeah, maybe they are noobs and poor players but they are in your alliance all the same and if you keep reciting equality to them, you best actually show it too.
not really sure how this is relevant to this particular discussion but i shall reply anyway.

in omen we really did try our best to motivate people. i did numerous things to try and help our lower ranked members. 1 was that i spoke to the people who regularly organised teamups privately and asked them to help out getting others involved on their attacks. There was also the channels i set up for each attack class with more motivated members as ops to help with teamups.

unfortunately neither really worked. im happy to admit failures in methods and tactics...my only issue is accusations of favouritism, which are total rubbish

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zotnam
Fuzzy mentioned that the lower ranked players in omen were actually willing to team up, but since they were only in a channel with other low ranked players, the team ups turned out pretty weak.
again you have totally manipulated what i have said.

"our attack efficiency was terrible most of the round, selfishness was a problem. small planets were organising small attacks on big planets etc. the 2nd attack channel was for our higher value planets, to target higher value planets in the galaxies we were hitting."

what could/should be taken from my original statement was that lower ranked players (not exclusively) WERENT willing to team up - hence why they had small teamups on big planets. hence why a second group was made to ensure high priority targets got hit properly.

the main attack channel had the majority of our targets for lower ranked value players to get roids in the usual fashion. there was also the assurance that the higher value planets were properly covered and our big guys were using their fleets well to help the alliance, and not themselves. that said - 'lower ranked' presents the wrong image as most of the ally was in hamas, and monzetsu was only for the very high value kids.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zotnam
While I can understand where you are coming from here, you are way wrong.
false. my point wasnt that 'OUR TACTICS WERE GREAT' or 'INFORZA IS AWESOME'. my point was quite clear in stating that our officers made a lot of selfless decisions in their positions, my example of inforza putting up his own galaxy raids IS an excellent example of that, thus making my point correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zotnam
There's about 100 other small things in omen which went wrong I could point out, but since people rather not look at their own mistakes and try to improve them for next time I'll just shut up.
who is arguing that omen was a success or that we didnt make mistakes? im certainly not.

"you won the round, we've had our humiliation...no need to further piss on our bonfire by posting post-round false 'propaganda' (SORRY LOKKEN!) about horrible things omen leaders did."

im happy to look at our mistakes (even though its irrelevant as we arent playing again) but this discussion hasnt been about omens successes and failures. its been about your accusation that "in Omen they even went a step futher and put up the most easy, fat targets as a reward for their officers" - which is a load of "boo-hockey".
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Last edited by Fuzzy; 17 Apr 2009 at 11:26.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 11:20   #205
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Originally Posted by CBA View Post
The trouble is, will your planet even be over the 100 roid mark, therefore worth hitting!!

Who knows, maybe I'll init roids all round again for the greater good.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 11:26   #206
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Re: R31 rumour thread

Do we have to read that all, or can we just give Fuzzy the win?

Edit: And before lokken pwnts me, i did read it.
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Can people please stop pretending they have no chance of winning at tick 300, you just end up looking retarded later.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 11:26   #207
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Re: R31 rumour thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuzzy
"you won the round, we've had our humiliation...no need to further piss on our bonfire by posting post-round false 'propaganda' (SORRY LOKKEN!) about horrible things omen leaders did."
Just to clear things up. If you post this, around a post that's actually of good quality, I don't give a flying one. If people make a good post with arguments and justification, they get a lot more rope in terms of stuff like this as at least they went out of their way to explain why they're saying it. So you've nothing to apologise for here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by [JungleMuffin] View Post
Do we have to read that all, or can we just give Fuzzy the win?

Edit: And before lokken pwnts me, i did read it.
Am I really that feared

But really I don't see the point of the argument despite it being a high quality discussion. Having HC'd my own alliance and played in others with the same structure Omen have and only having knowledge of what people have said in the thread (which I'm not sure makes me an oracle!), this is what I think.

It screams of a couple of officers being a bit selfish and taking a few 'perks' quite honestly. Which like Ascendancy say is a touch corrupt but really not that much of a big deal if you're Omen. The advantage of Ascendancy is that everyone has the tools to root this kind of behaviour out and if we didn't like it, we could do something about it.
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Last edited by lokken; 17 Apr 2009 at 11:35.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 12:15   #208
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Originally Posted by CBA View Post
This is really the sort of post that sickens me. So Zoro I assume from tick 72 all of your fleets will be headed towards Ascendancy? I mean you personally, 3 fleets for the first week against ascendancy, or until the sunday so thats monday - sunday x18 fleets from you. Most of the first few days attacks get through anyway especially since salvage has been reduced and everyone knows to attack and Ascendancy especially try to aim at that 280~ or so mark compared to the big 300, so they can fully utilise there attacking fleets. Make sure you dont crash and take every damn willing player with you. It should be easy to spot the Ascendancy galaxys, if at tick 72 you cant find any, pm me on here.

Bombing of innocent civilians, people being decapitated by terrorists live on the web, suicide bombers, people being shot for demonstrating, hyjackers flying planes into building - these things sicken me.
I think choice of words is a little OTT.

And the answer is yes.
If someone wants to point me at some ASC targets from tick 72 I'll gladly do it. What difference I'd make is another question.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 12:28   #209
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Originally Posted by Zoro View Post
Bombing of innocent civilians, people being decapitated by terrorists live on the web, suicide bombers, people being shot for demonstrating, hyjackers flying planes into building - these things sicken me.
I think choice of words is a little OTT.

And the answer is yes.
If someone wants to point me at some ASC targets from tick 72 I'll gladly do it. What difference I'd make is another question.
I'm not playing but I will try to sort something for you. However I would suggest rallying your alliance, gathering your friends and battering the common enemy!

Which alliance are you out of interest? If its a competing one, it's goals should be to take ascendancy down, as all alliance goals should be to defeat ascendancy before aiming to win.

Ascendancy main and best propaganda seems to be, dont aim to take us down, aim to win! And we all know how this turns out.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 13:06   #210
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Re: R31 rumour thread

I spent all of last round to attack asc, and I spose I ll spend next round hitting the idiots which didnt hit asc last round
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 13:08   #211
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Re: R31 rumour thread

another asc dominated round, the thought is hardly thrilling, but not shocking either.

the question is...where does it end?
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 13:13   #212
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Re: R31 rumour thread

It ended in R30. The Ascendancy tag will not be present in R31.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 13:15   #213
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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It ended in R30. The Ascendancy tag will not be present in R31.
TheStoom?

edit: never mind...i see it is likely to be Transcendency
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 13:30   #214
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Re: R31 rumour thread

Neither.....
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 13:31   #215
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Re: R31 rumour thread

A good post Fuzzy and I'll admit that, in the light of your explanation (unfortunately still no logs ) I was almost certainly misinformed. I'll still post what I was I told when I manage to find it! On one issue I thought I should respond though

Quote:
and in the example discussed - an uber-fatty who i wanted us to roid before asc got there
This didn't actually happen. I suppose it's hard to get a good overview but what we did on the nights we did piggy you was hit the planets you weren't hitting, the omens, the vgn, the fat factory guy in whatever gal that was, the cts when you couldn't hit them etc. This was the only time we actually hit a planet you guys did have as a target, which I suggested solely due to the fact I genuinely thought it was omen officers creaming off the best targets for themselves and I felt a good "**** you" was appropriate for such behaviour.

Quote:
Ascendancy main and best propaganda seems to be, dont aim to take us down, aim to win!
If I was running an alliance aiming to stop Ascendancy next round I don't think I'd spend the entire round hitting Ascendancy. I think we saw with VGN the problems of such an approach on a mid-ranked alliance. You're hitting hard targets the entire round, there's no actual benefit for your alliance (you won't win even if Ascendancy doesn't) and your members either get depressed and bored and crash or they get annoyed and hit targets outside your raid. Both of which aren't good for your alliance and aren't even good for beating Ascendancy. By the last "war" of last round (us vs the collective with ND as the challenger) vgn weren't relevant at all. Timing is everything.

So how do you get other mid-ranked alliances involved? Simple, you appeal to their self-interest. At some point next round I think it's fairly safe to say Ascendancy will be the #1, and certainly the #2, alliance and we'll probably have a ton of heroically fat planets. When that happens is when you need to beat us. The closest competitor needs to go around, talk to every other alliance there is, or even have pre-arranged agreements, and say "here's what we can do for you" if you help us. Give them the better targets, help them with the problems they have and take the hit yourself.

My personal views on this are massively shaped by my first major involvement in alliance politics in round 26 where Ascendancy went out of its way to keep other alliances on our side. We'd hit Nox because CT wanted us to, we'd hit vgn because ToF wanted us to and we'd take whatever racial selection people didn't want for themselves. Because that's what every other alliance wants. You want to win it, man up, take the hit and you'll find yourself rewarded. Because you don't need a 10 alliance block hitting us every night of the round and although obviously that would defeat us it's pointless to even try for it because it won't last. You need to defeat an alliance when it's going for the win. Sometimes the point when that happens is early on, like in r28 for ascendancy, sometimes it's retardedly early, like r23 for exilition, and sometimes it's really late, like last round for us or r15 for exi.

Your aim has to be to win the round. Of course that's going to involve beating us but you have to keep a clear vision of your end goal in mind or else you're just going to get bogged down. That doesn't mean go in with some stupid plan and refuse to alter it, no battle plan survives contact with the enemy (!). What it means is every decision you have to take needs to be taken in light of how this is going to win you the round.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 14:47   #216
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Re: R31 rumour thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

Your aim has to be to win the round. Of course that's going to involve beating us but you have to keep a clear vision of your end goal in mind or else you're just going to get bogged down. That doesn't mean go in with some stupid plan and refuse to alter it, no battle plan survives contact with the enemy (!). What it means is every decision you have to take needs to be taken in light of how this is going to win you the round.
Lets get one thing straight. Ascendancy have proven now, with users of the forum backing, that they are the best, they have won 3 rounds in a row and this has never been done before. For an alliance to win Round 31, what I believe has to be done, considering the facts, that Asc will come back from almost anything. The aim of every alliance with a win *possibly* in there sights, therefore I think DLR,xVx,ROCK can all be included with ToF/FanG/CT/ND, should all, full force hit Ascendancy, by hitting Ascendancy I mean, those 7+(more hopefully) Split Ascendancy targets up from tick 72 and hit them continuously for the entire round. What this will mean is, those alliances will get hardly any incommings, and may the best, most effective roids win. Obviously once this has gone on for 6 weeks as a minimum in my opinion, then the alliances can think about hitting Ascendancy, IF and only IF there score is below that of PATSA.. If its not, keep hitting Ascendancy, make agreements now, and actually for god sakes save the planetarion community from being humiliate by Ascendancy once again.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 15:01   #217
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Re: R31 rumour thread

My god. What part of that won't happen don't you understand. I mean the alliance that would then be in the best position, even if everyone followed that and christ knows what's actually in it for the alliances that clearly aren't contending for #1 as the round goes on, would then be the alliance that lets its members go off and bash newbies for roids as early as possible because christ knows you wouldn't actually need 7 alliances to keep one alliance down. I mean we all know no alliance could actually survive being ptargetted by everyone else for the entire round, what on earth would that actually prove.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 15:29   #218
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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My god. What part of that won't happen don't you understand. I mean the alliance that would then be in the best position, even if everyone followed that and christ knows what's actually in it for the alliances that clearly aren't contending for #1 as the round goes on, would then be the alliance that lets its members go off and bash newbies for roids as early as possible because christ knows you wouldn't actually need 7 alliances to keep one alliance down. I mean we all know no alliance could actually survive being ptargetted by everyone else for the entire round, what on earth would that actually prove.
It would prove that salvage is too high still, since Asc would grow unbelievably from that amount of crashers
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 15:29   #219
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Re: R31 rumour thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
My god. What part of that won't happen don't you understand. I mean the alliance that would then be in the best position, even if everyone followed that and christ knows what's actually in it for the alliances that clearly aren't contending for #1 as the round goes on, would then be the alliance that lets its members go off and bash newbies for roids as early as possible because christ knows you wouldn't actually need 7 alliances to keep one alliance down.
Chill out JBG, for christ sakes, you'll have a heart attack. All I'm suggesting is what needs to be done for win a round in my opinion. I understand how you (an ascendancy), player feels about there alliances being targetted by every other alliance and such. But in my opinion whats good for the game is a royal gangbang continuously throughout the whole round, on ascendancy. Sorry if this offends you. Look at confident all of your players are anyways!

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I mean we all know no alliance could actually survive being ptargetted by everyone else for the entire round, what on earth would that actually prove.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 15:33   #220
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Re: R31 rumour thread

I don't understand how someone could have played the most part of R30, albeit in a non-competing alliance, and still not understand why things went the way they did.

CBA, you're not part of the solution man and if that's the case...
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 15:44   #221
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Originally Posted by CBA View Post
those 7+(more hopefully) Split Ascendancy targets up from tick 72 and hit them continuously for the entire round. What this will mean is, those alliances will get hardly any incommings, and may the best, most effective roids win.
Your logic for 'everyone' to gangbang one alliance first before playing for real is flawed.

Hypothetically, if i am leading a top 10 quality alliance. I won't join the gangbang. I'll play this spreadsheet internet game wisely. I would think that the 8 other alliance is more than enought to take Ascendancy down.

Then while they're gaining 10 roids each due to their crazy teamups, my alliance is roiding rank 11-20 alliance' fat / easy planets (my members gaining 100-400 roids each) - avoiding risky crashes as well in the process. Of course, i won't do it as flat as that - ill try to be a bit dodgy, sending a few fleets hitting Asc just to make the mega block happy. It's not such a bad tactic to get ahead in score early thru easy roids while the rest is bringing the previous round winner down.

Also, a top notch will bring down one of the eight or so alliances that are annoying them - with them. That's the next logical move a creative and respected alliance would do, and i wouldn't risk my alliance/members of being the unlucky chosen ones to be that alliance.

I mean, it's not in the general member's interest to play a planet just to make a previous round winner loose. This game is still about roiding to gain score, and building many cool ships. Espciallay, without a guarantee to be rewarded well in roids (piggying sucks from last i remember when i was still playing) or win - because the 9 of us will still fight it off after Asc is down.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 15:51   #222
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Re: R31 rumour thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cocteau View Post
Your logic for 'everyone' to gangbang one alliance first before playing for real is flawed.

Hypothetically, if i am leading a top 10 quality alliance. I won't join the gangbang. I'll play this spreadsheet internet game wisely. I would think that the 8 other alliance is more than enought to take Ascendancy down.

Then while they're gaining 10 roids each due to their crazy teamups, my alliance is roiding rank 11-20 alliance' fat / easy planets (my members gaining 100-400 roids each). Of course, i won't do it as flat as that - ill try to be a bit dodgy, sending a few fleets hitting Asc just to make the mega block happy. It's not such a bad tactic to get ahead in score early thru easy roids while the rest is bringing the previous round winner down.

Also, a top notch will bring down one of the eight or so alliances that are annoying them - with them. That's the next logical move a creative and respected alliance would do, and i wouldn't risk my alliance/members of being the unlucky chosen ones to be that alliance.

I mean, it's not in the general member's interest to play a planet just to make a previous round winner loose. This game is still about roiding to gain score, and building many cool ships. Espciallay, without a guarantee to be rewarded well in roids (piggying sucks from last i remember when i was still playing) - because the 9 of us will still fight it off after Asc is down.
This is exactly what happened last round, Cocteau didn't even play and can still predict it. You did though CBA. I honestly think trying to destoy asc in that way again, would hurt the game more than asc actually winning.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 15:54   #223
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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This is exactly what happened last round, Cocteau didn't even play and can still predict it. You did though CBA. I honestly think trying to destoy asc in that way again, would hurt the game more than asc actually winning.
how do you think asc being stopped from winning will be less detrimental than them winning the 4th round in a row?
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 16:01   #224
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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how do you think asc being stopped from winning will be less detrimental than them winning the 4th round in a row?
Because you can have fun without winning. There is a time and a place to hit any alliance, but doing it for 7 weeks straight is no fun for anyone involved. Ask an alliance like VGN if its benificial to hit the best alliance constantly through a whole round. That's a top5 alliance (or was), I don't even want to imagine how a smaller one would do
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 16:12   #225
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Re: R31 rumour thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mek
how do you think asc being stopped from winning will be less detrimental than them winning the 4th round in a row?
Because it's an ineffective strategy? This issue has been widely discussed before, during and after last round. Trying to band people together with a dual loss philosophy runs contrary to many of the vital ingredients needed to actually win. It's a short-sighted strategy that has no viable endgame and fails to consider human self-interest at all. If you could get an actual army of pure zealots then, sure, go for it. If not then perhaps trying something rational might be the better.

I honestly think this should be evident to anyone who's genuinely tried to deconstruct last round. This was the strategy that was tried. People did their best to execute it. It failed. Not for lack of effort but for lack of foresight. Proposing the exact same plan again is, as a better man than me has said, retarded.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 16:16   #226
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Re: R31 rumour thread

The problem with the tactic of 'blocking to kill Asc' isnt that its bad for the game, Its that no alliance wants to do it. Every alliance in the block would stop attacking Asc if Asc threatend to target them.. Its a case of 'ND/CT/Fang' block to kill Asc, If Asc target ND everynight in retals.. how long until ND says 'this isnt worth it, we have no chance at #1,#2,#3 if we continue to be hit by Asc'.

Every alliance knows they have 0 chance to win if they dont target Asc but they also know that they have 0 chance to win if Asc decide they are the ones they're going to target. Last round was the best opportunity to beat Asc, simply as Omen was more than willing to take all the flak from Asc.

I'd also like to point out that its much more fun to join a war vs the #1 alliance, than it is to get bashed by the #1 alliance Its why you always have smaller alliances joining in the wars (Like Rock) as they can afford to hit the bigger planets (and feel like they are contributing to the round) with little chance of retals.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 17:12   #227
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Re: R31 rumour thread

I'm going to simplify a lot of these posts, which I believe are saying "stop thinking in terms of hitting Ascendancy, just cut out your own political mistakes".

Obviously I am Ascendancy but it does seem rather obvious what these long rafts of quite beautiful text are trying to say when you boil it down.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 17:20   #228
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Re: R31 rumour thread

I thought light's post summed it up very nicely
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 17:28   #229
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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I dont see how ND can be losing too much, are you just saying, since the 'denial' in ND are moving on, ND will suffer? Because didn't they do better the round before the 'denial' came?

Although if Disc is moving anywhere, ND is bound to suffer immensely
I'm not sure whether to take ur comment sarcastically or not, but i'm no longer ND contrary to what VenoX says. Neither am i "Denial BG". I made alot of friends in ND though, and i wish them well, nice people, good players (few absolutely shit ones too).


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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 18:13   #230
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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for now i have one question - can someone tell me which planet # in 9.1 was the f-crew one which was allegedly given to the omen officers as preferential treatment?
imperial (#11), although iirc nothing ever landed on him from Omen.

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Originally Posted by a bunch of whiney losers
snip ascendancy dominance snip
if you're tired of ascendancy winning too much, or being selfish, or saying "ignorant" things about other alliances giving us a challenge, why dont you stop crying and do something about it, rather than folding before tick start and starting some shitty little battle group instead
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 18:42   #231
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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if you're tired of ascendancy winning too much, or being selfish, or saying "ignorant" things about other alliances giving us a challenge, why dont you stop crying and do something about it, rather than folding before tick start and starting some shitty little battle group instead
You had a challange last round
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 18:50   #232
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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You had a challange last round
and?
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 18:55   #233
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Re: R31 rumour thread

Ok

Right Lets explain things again.

THE ONLY WAY FOR AN ALLIANCE TO WIN ROUND 31 THAT ISNT ASCENDANCY IS TO DESTORY ASCENDANCY

Ok thats clear but I think many people understand that.

My suggestion is simple and not complicated but people are missing the point.

Every single alliance that could possibly have a shot at winning needs to stand united. Thats bring ND/CT/xVx/FanG/ROCK/ToF into the picture. Other alliances that dont want to be dominated to lose high ranking planets/galaxys Orbit/Denials BG/DLR/HR/HA Should stand united. All of these alliances will be destroyed by Ascendancy as we have seen there capabilities so many times before.

[ I WILL NOT STATE WHY THEY ARE A THREAT BECAUSE 3 WINS IN A ROW SHOULD PROVE THIS]

So what i propose is that, all of the HC of the alliances that want to compete in round 31 join a coalition to take down Ascendancy from the start. There has to be disipline, i.e. A rule in the coalition that states, each alliances HAS to muster 5 waves on 3 Ascendancy planets EVERY SINGLE night. And all alliances must not target each other, 2 targets with 3 waves a night is ok though, something like that. And more rules similar to this. If someone wants me to right the law for the coalition, I will!

Now there has to be a time when Ascendancy has been 'beaton'. I propose this time be when Ascendancy does not have 1 associated player over 100 roids. Lets work on roids not value as killing value is very hard. But without roids from tick 72+8/9/10 I doubt Ascendancy will have much value. So when all of Ascendancy has been absolutely gangbanged to the ground. This needs to be fully determined, not half wit assumptions, as i suggested previously at a minimum of 6 weeks into the round ATLEAST.

Benefits to alliances targetting ascendancy:

1) Little incommings on themselfes = high morale, satisfaction
2) More attacking to take place = high morale, happiness
3) Working with others = sense of gratification, friendship brings happiness to a certain degree.
4) Friendly Galaxies = People can be at ease with each other for a common goal.

Negative Impacts to targetting ascendancy:

1)less targets to hit = lowering morale

Benefits to Ascendancy being gangbanged from tick 72 (ASCENDANCY PERSPECTIVE

1)start the work from the word go = high morale/motivation at the *very* start

Negative impacts to Ascendancy being gangbanged from tick 72 (ASCENDANCY PERSPECTIVE)

1) Lose all roids = low morale
2) low income = unhappiness, low morale
3) ship jumpers = simply not handling the pressure, Asc loosing members

So you ask youself, should my alliance hit Ascendancy from tick 72?

The answer is obvious but incase you missed it, lets have some facts which i previously did not disclose.

#1 Ascendancy have the best players in PA (According to numerous sources, even thouse in Ascendancy)

#2 Ascendancy are so cocky and full of self belief that they will win R31

#3 Ascendancy have won 3 rounds in a row

#4 Ascendancy have proven time after time that they can come back from a "gangbang"
(hence the continuous part of it)

The common problems associated with this method I'm proposing

"Ahhh no , what if Ascendancy hit our alliance!!!"

Answer = Ascendancy wont be able to target any alliance because they will be too weak, so there threats will be meaningless.

All of this in my opinion will result in a better community spirit, more people posting on AD, more people enjoying PA, new friends being made, more people being brought to the game.

Thats about it for now.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 18:59   #234
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Originally Posted by Light View Post
You had a challange last round
I think that was his point! I mean our two solutions proposed here are a) accept Ascendancy winning r31 and everyone else just dies (in which case I'd rather not sit through that and can we start r32 please) or b) CBA's "solution" whereby everyone hits Ascendancy all round (in which case I'd rather not sit through that and can we start r32 please). Why not start, or modify a current, alliance aimed at beating good enough to actually beat us? Wish tried last round and it's certainly the closest anyone has come to actually "defeating" ascendancy in recent times. That's what planetarion is actually about.


Edit: Good to see you set up your stall CBA. I personally hope to see you HCing an alliance aimed at defeating Ascendancy as you have set out. Otherwise any self-respecting alliance is going to tell you to take your rules, turn them sideways and shove them up your ass.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:00   #235
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Originally Posted by Light

Every alliance knows they have 0 chance to win if they dont target Asc
Correct

Quote:
Originally Posted by Light
but they also know that they have 0 chance to win if Asc decide they are the ones they're going to target. Last round was the best opportunity to beat Asc, simply as Omen was more than willing to take all the flak from Asc.
Wrong. If Ascendancy are hit from t72 by multiple alliances, they cant do anything about it.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:01   #236
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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I think that was his point! I mean our two solutions proposed here are a) accept Ascendancy winning r31 and everyone else just dies (in which case I'd rather not sit through that and can we start r32 please) or b) CBA's "solution" whereby everyone hits Ascendancy all round (in which case I'd rather not sit through that and can we start r32 please). Why not start, or modify a current, alliance aimed at beating good enough to actually beat us? Wish tried last round and it's certainly the closest anyone has come to actually "defeating" ascendancy in recent times. That's what planetarion is actually about.
You gotta make use of the tools you got.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:01   #237
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Re: R31 rumour thread

There are better ways to play the game than to gangbang one alliance into the ground for 7 weeks. Hell, there are better ways to win than to do that. Any alliance that chooses to run as tight a ship as Asc does can take a win if Asc experiences even slightly heavier pressure than normal. Your plan assumes that none of ND/CT/xVx etc can actually step up and just play a solid, controlled round, even when presented with clear evidence that they need to. What, pray tell, is the actual point in getting the entire game to destroy one alliance?
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:04   #238
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Originally Posted by Tommy View Post
There are better ways to play the game than to gangbang one alliance into the ground for 7 weeks. Hell, there are better ways to win than to do that. Any alliance that chooses to run as tight a ship as Asc does can take a win if Asc experiences even slightly heavier pressure than normal. Your plan assumes that none of ND/CT/xVx etc can actually step up and just play a solid, controlled round, even when presented with clear evidence that they need to. What, pray tell, is the actual point in getting the entire game to destroy one alliance?
Tommy once Ascendancy are completely destoryed, then by all means go fight each other. The trouble is, to get some things into the head of people who play this game, it needs to drummed in. If something is not done against Ascendancy by the masses the round will be dominated and Ascendancy will cruise through. ND/CT/xVx etc can still play a controlled round but by controlling they can firstly control to destory Ascendancy.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:04   #239
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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You gotta make use of the tools you got.
No, you don't.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:06   #240
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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I dont know what sort of relevence that is to planetarion. Besides, the wheel was designed from the tools available to the inventor at the time. When you cant do something one way, you have to do it another.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:06   #241
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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if you're tired of ascendancy winning too much, or being selfish, or saying "ignorant" things about other alliances giving us a challenge, why dont you stop crying and do something about it, rather than folding before tick start and starting some shitty little battle group instead
Its ironic because you are exactly the type of "opposition player" I was talking about earlier, that has "run scared" to Ascendancy in recent rounds because you would rather play with them for the sake of your planet than against them.

You're a proven coward, grow a backbone and then maybe you will have earnt the right to tell people to stop crying rather than thinking you own because you're hiding behind your Ascendancy badge. If you weren't in Ascendancy you'd be just as shit as everybody else.

This goes for more than just Posi so I apologise if it looked a bit personal.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:08   #242
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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I dont know what sort of relevence that is to planetarion.
I'm not sure if you caught my comment earlier implying you have genuine learning difficulties but in case you didn't.... well, you get the general idea. You didn't respond to my question as to what you'll be doing next round CBA!


Edit: Fine, as an actual response, why don't you use one of the tools you're using right now, that is the internet, and go find yourself 89 other people, there are a lot of both planetarion and internet users, and go make an alliance that can beat us.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:09   #243
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Long winded "solution" involving every alliance hitting one alliance
i find it a bit sad that you think the only way to take down ascendancy is for every single alliance to hit ascendancy every day all round (except those that arent going ftw or w/e you said)

if you really think your alliance is so awful that you need 5/6/7 other alliances just to take down Ascendancy from t72 then wow man i sure feel sorry for you

so yes, if you want next round to be the worst round in planetarion history, have your alliance nap every other alliance in the universe and attack asc all round. im sure that will be a satisfying effort.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:11   #244
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Because it's an ineffective strategy? This issue has been widely discussed before, during and after last round. Trying to band people together with a dual loss philosophy runs contrary to many of the vital ingredients needed to actually win. It's a short-sighted strategy that has no viable endgame and fails to consider human self-interest at all. If you could get an actual army of pure zealots then, sure, go for it. If not then perhaps trying something rational might be the better.

I honestly think this should be evident to anyone who's genuinely tried to deconstruct last round. This was the strategy that was tried. People did their best to execute it. It failed. Not for lack of effort but for lack of foresight. Proposing the exact same plan again is, as a better man than me has said, retarded.
I'm sorry Achilles, although your post is of outstanding quality, there are fundamental flaws which need to be addressed. A short-sighted strategy by deafting the best alliances in the game, I think not. human self-interest works in a number of ways and I feel with the common goal of defeating Ascenancy and with the propaganda we see from Ascendancy every round on these forums, I think all of those non- Asc peoples would have alot of interest in this strategy.

Last round what you are saying, did not happen. The effort was not really there, the foresight was not really there to the same extent of what I'm debating here.

Tell me at what stage in the round Ascendancy was without an alliance and targetted by 5 numerous alliances at one particular time. Did it happen? Did it last? I think we all know the answer, but I'll let you inform me.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:13   #245
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Re: R31 rumour thread

Do you have any idea why it didn't last? I actually don't know why I'm bothering to argue with you. Can someone not in Ascendancy who has actually competed against us in a meaningful sense over the past few rounds, anyone responsible in running Denial, CT, Omen, ND etc, please reply to CBA so I avoid reapplying for my mod position so I can erase him from my internet.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:13   #246
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Its ironic because you are exactly the type of "opposition player" I was talking about earlier, that has "run scared" to Ascendancy in recent rounds because you would rather play with them for the sake of your planet than against them.
so youre saying anyone that is ascendancy is ascendancy because they're too scared to play anywhere else? or was this a direct comment

i play in asc because i dont want to be an a alliance with defence points and a member/officer/HC architecture, which was the main reason i left where i was previously for where i am now. but yeah if you want to think im here because im a coward or w/e thats cool too i guess lol

Quote:
If you weren't in Ascendancy you'd be just as shit as everybody else.
who is everyone else? you?

Quote:
This goes for more than just Posi so I apologise if it looked a bit personal.
heh.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:15   #247
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Originally Posted by stay_posi
i play in asc because i dont want to be an a alliance with defence points and a member/officer/HC architecture, which was the main reason i left where i was previously for where i am now. but yeah if you want to think im here because im a coward or w/e thats cool too i guess lol
Oh really?? I thought if I wasn't playing in Vision, you already agreed to Androx you would play there where they have the defence points, member/officer/HC 'architecture' as you so nicely put it. Dont even try and bullshit your way out of this one.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:18   #248
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Do you have any idea why it didn't last? I actually don't know why I'm bothering to argue with you. Can someone not in Ascendancy who has actually competed against us in a meaningful sense over the past few rounds, anyone responsible in running Denial, CT, Omen, ND etc, please reply to CBA so I avoid reapplying for my mod position so I can erase him from my internet.
Thats touchy stuff JBG. Please elaborate, dont quite know why you need other people to help you out in your debating!
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:18   #249
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Originally Posted by JonnyBGood View Post
Do you have any idea why it didn't last? I actually don't know why I'm bothering to argue with you. Can someone not in Ascendancy who has actually competed against us in a meaningful sense over the past few rounds, anyone responsible in running Denial, CT, Omen, ND etc, please reply to CBA so I avoid reapplying for my mod position so I can erase him from my internet.
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Unread 17 Apr 2009, 19:19   #250
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Re: R31 rumour thread

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Oh really?? I thought if I wasn't playing in Vision, you already agreed to Androx you would play there where they have the defence points, member/officer/HC 'architecture' as you so nicely put it. Dont even try and bullshit your way out of this one.
i told Androx i'd go back to vision, which is where most of my friends are from; if DEFENCE POINTS WERE REMOVED AND EVERYONE WAS GIVEN OFFICER LEVEL ACCESS TO ALL TOOLS. but i guess you already knew that since you know everything huh CBA?

besides, why are you questioning my alliance standards? how many alliances have you played for in the past three rounds? and out of those three, how many were you kicked from?
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