User Name
Password

Go Back   Planetarion Forums > Non Planetarion Discussions > General Discussions

Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 00:54   #151
s|k
Caveat Lector
 
s|k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Tucson, Arizona
Posts: 3,038
s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

I see things are going well while I have been gone (on GD and in the US). I still got a few more days hang on there! :O
__________________
Diomedes IRC
Blog
s|k is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 04:00   #152
dda
USS Oklahoma
 
dda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,500
dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by G.K Zhukov
Sorry, but your mostly wrong here.
The indigenous people are not growing in numbers, rather declining.

It's the poor brazilians, having no land of their own, who's the worst offenders. Driven by extreme poverty, they are moving into new areas.
Also there is also wealthier people who uses the Amazonas as a source for cheap wood or large plantations.

As USA have f***** up South America for decades*, the USA have a responsibility for the ammount of poor people and the lack of strong states. And therefore, a certain resposibility for the deforestation of Amazonas.

* Not only Chile, Guatemala, El Salvador, Argentina etc, but also Brazill.
Scapegoating. Brazil may be screwed up but I will not accept blame on the part of the US.
__________________
Ignorance is curable, stupidity is not.
dda is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 04:02   #153
Tactitus
Klaatu barada nikto
 
Tactitus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: St. Paul, Minnesota
Posts: 3,237
Tactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus would
Exclamation Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurashima
I dunno if theyre to blame for the hurricane , but theyre definetely to blame for building a city below sea level with two huge **** off sea-bearing lakes on their borders.
Blame the French!

The city was (slightly) above sea level originally when it was built on the natural levees of the Mississippi. The long term effects of the river raising it's bed through silt deposition coupled with the city itself sinking (due to pumping out ground water) has now left it below the river and sea level. By the time this was realized, it was easier to continue building up the levees than to move the city.
__________________
The Ottawa Citizen and Southam News wish to apologize for our apology to Mark Steyn, published Oct. 22. In correcting the incorrect statements about Mr. Steyn published Oct. 15, we incorrectly published the incorrect correction. We accept and regret that our original regrets were unacceptable and we apologize to Mr. Steyn for any distress caused by our previous apology.
Tactitus is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 04:25   #154
Leshy
Mr. Blobby
 
Leshy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Belgium
Posts: 8,271
Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

An interesting article that I came across. Probably not entirely objective, but if what he states is true, it does not reflect well on Bush' policy.
Quote:
"No One Can Say they Didn't See it Coming"
By Sidney Blumenthal

09/01/05 "Der Spiegel" -- -- In 2001, FEMA warned that a hurricane striking New Orleans was one of the three most likely disasters in the U.S. But the Bush administration cut New Orleans flood control funding by 44 percent to pay for the Iraq war.

Biblical in its uncontrolled rage and scope, Hurricane Katrina has left millions of Americans to scavenge for food and shelter and hundreds to thousands reportedly dead. With its main levee broken, the evacuated city of New Orleans has become part of the Gulf of Mexico. But the damage wrought by the hurricane may not entirely be the result of an act of nature.

A year ago the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers proposed to study how New Orleans could be protected from a catastrophic hurricane, but the Bush administration ordered that the research not be undertaken. After a flood killed six people in 1995, Congress created the Southeast Louisiana Urban Flood Control Project, in which the Corps of Engineers strengthened and renovated levees and pumping stations. In early 2001, the Federal Emergency Management Agency issued a report stating that a hurricane striking New Orleans was one of the three most likely disasters in the U.S., including a terrorist attack on New York City. But by 2003 the federal funding for the flood control project essentially dried up as it was drained into the Iraq war. In 2004, the Bush administration cut funding requested by the New Orleans district of the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers for holding back the waters of Lake Pontchartrain by more than 80 percent. Additional cuts at the beginning of this year (for a total reduction in funding of 44.2 percent since 2001) forced the New Orleans district of the Corps to impose a hiring freeze. The Senate had debated adding funds for fixing New Orleans' levees, but it was too late.

The New Orleans Times-Picayune, which before the hurricane published a series on the federal funding problem, and whose presses are now underwater, reported online: "No one can say they didn't see it coming ... Now in the wake of one of the worst storms ever, serious questions are being asked about the lack of preparation."

The Bush administration's policy of turning over wetlands to developers almost certainly also contributed to the heightened level of the storm surge. In 1990, a federal task force began restoring lost wetlands surrounding New Orleans. Every two miles of wetland between the Crescent City and the Gulf reduces a surge by half a foot. Bush had promised "no net loss" of wetlands, a policy launched by his father's administration and bolstered by President Clinton. But he reversed his approach in 2003, unleashing the developers. The Army Corps of Engineers and the Environmental Protection Agency then announced they could no longer protect wetlands unless they were somehow related to interstate commerce.

In response to this potential crisis, four leading environmental groups conducted a joint expert study, concluding in 2004 that without wetlands protection New Orleans could be devastated by an ordinary, much less a Category 4 or 5, hurricane. "There's no way to describe how mindless a policy that is when it comes to wetlands protection," said one of the report's authors. The chairman of the White House's Council on Environmental Quality dismissed the study as "highly questionable," and boasted, "Everybody loves what we're doing."

"My administration's climate change policy will be science based," President Bush declared in June 2001. But in 2002, when the Environmental Protection Agency submitted a study on global warming to the United Nations reflecting its expert research, Bush derided it as "a report put out by a bureaucracy," and excised the climate change assessment from the agency's annual report. The next year, when the EPA issued its first comprehensive "Report on the Environment," stating, "Climate change has global consequences for human health and the environment," the White House simply demanded removal of the line and all similar conclusions. At the G-8 meeting in Scotland this year, Bush successfully stymied any common action on global warming. Scientists, meanwhile, have continued to accumulate impressive data on the rising temperature of the oceans, which has produced more severe hurricanes.

In February 2004, 60 of the nation's leading scientists, including 20 Nobel laureates, warned in a statement, "Restoring Scientific Integrity in Policymaking": "Successful application of science has played a large part in the policies that have made the United States of America the world's most powerful nation and its citizens increasingly prosperous and healthy ... Indeed, this principle has long been adhered to by presidents and administrations of both parties in forming and implementing policies. The administration of George W. Bush has, however, disregarded this principle ... The distortion of scientific knowledge for partisan political ends must cease." Bush completely ignored this statement.

In the two weeks preceding the storm in the Gulf, the trumping of science by ideology and expertise by special interests accelerated. The Federal Drug Administration announced that it was postponing sale of the morning-after contraceptive pill, despite overwhelming scientific evidence of its safety and its approval by the FDA's scientific advisory board. The United Nations special envoy for HIV/AIDS in Africa accused the Bush administration of responsibility for a condom shortage in Uganda -- the result of the administration's evangelical Christian agenda of "abstinence." When the chief of the Bureau of Justice Statistics in the Justice Department was ordered by the White House to delete its study that African-Americans and other minorities are subject to racial profiling in police traffic stops and he refused to buckle under, he was forced out of his job. When the Army Corps of Engineers' chief contracting oversight analyst objected to a $7 billion no-bid contract awarded for work in Iraq to Halliburton (the firm at which Vice President Cheney was formerly CEO), she was demoted despite her superior professional ratings. At the National Park Service, a former Cheney aide, a political appointee lacking professional background, drew up a plan to overturn past environmental practices and prohibit any mention of evolution while allowing sale of religious materials through the Park Service.

On the day the levees burst in New Orleans, Bush delivered a speech in Colorado comparing the Iraq war to World War II and himself to Franklin D. Roosevelt: "And he knew that the best way to bring peace and stability to the region was by bringing freedom to Japan." Bush had boarded his very own "Streetcar Named Desire."

Sidney Blumenthal, a former assistant and senior advisor to President Clinton and the author of "The Clinton Wars," is writing a column for Salon and the Guardian of London.
__________________
http://www.leshy.net
Leshy is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 04:28   #155
dda
USS Oklahoma
 
dda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,500
dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tactitus
Blame the French!

The city was (slightly) above sea level originally when it was built on the natural levees of the Mississippi. The long term effects of the river raising it's bed through silt deposition coupled with the city itself sinking (due to pumping out ground water) has now left it below the river and sea level. By the time this was realized, it was easier to continue building up the levees than to move the city.
Finally, someone has begun with a cogent argument as to how mismanagement of the environment may have led to the level of devastation brought on by an uncontrollable force of nature.

To further this argument, I will point out that the levying of the Mississippi has resulted in the loss of hundreds of square miles of wetlands to the south of New Orleans. The river being channeled ceased to deposit silt over many of the low lying areas between New Orleans and the gulf coast. These wetlands would have formed a primary defense against the tidal surge which overwhelmed the levees.

Kyoto would not have helped this situation.
__________________
Ignorance is curable, stupidity is not.
dda is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 05:29   #156
CamelToe
You Know I'm Right
 
CamelToe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Under The Sea
Posts: 241
CamelToe is infamous around these partsCamelToe is infamous around these partsCamelToe is infamous around these partsCamelToe is infamous around these partsCamelToe is infamous around these parts
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
For some reason I don't believe you.
a "haha, i get it" would have been more appropriate.

or do you really take my comments that seriously?
__________________
Yeah bro, make that twat get the jelly.

Don't act like you weren't thinking the same thing...

you should stop posting on these forums as you're CRAP

Last edited by CamelToe; 2 Sep 2005 at 05:54.
CamelToe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 05:53   #157
CamelToe
You Know I'm Right
 
CamelToe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Under The Sea
Posts: 241
CamelToe is infamous around these partsCamelToe is infamous around these partsCamelToe is infamous around these partsCamelToe is infamous around these partsCamelToe is infamous around these parts
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sniborp
The USA can blame themselves for Katrina.

How much, we'll never know, but all the trees cut down in the Amazon rainforest to build their houses (which later get blown away haha.), and the levels of pollution they emit, arent exactly making this world a better place.
you sir, are an idiot.

The amount of timber grown and produced in America (& Canada) is much larger than the amount of timber actually used annually (do you know what a biome is?). Besides, how expensive do you think shipping large amounts of timber from the rainforest would be? Shipping standard sheets of plywood (the stuff you use to build homes) to Hawaii ends up costing about $80 or $90 per 8x10' sheet. You can buy the same sheet in the US for about $30 or $40. Seeing as how the shipping methods used to get mass amounts of wood from South America to North America are probably similiar to that of shipping from mainland US to Hawaii, I would say that it's probably not very economical.

But anyways, this still doesn't change the fact that you're basically trying to say that since we build our houses out of wood, we should be to blame for hurricanes. FFS, why am I even wasting my time replying to this idiotic notion?
__________________
Yeah bro, make that twat get the jelly.

Don't act like you weren't thinking the same thing...

you should stop posting on these forums as you're CRAP
CamelToe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 06:43   #158
Cuddley_Battleship
Luminous Flux
 
Cuddley_Battleship's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Fargo, ND
Posts: 215
Cuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these parts
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dda
Scapegoating. Brazil may be screwed up but I will not accept blame on the part of the US.
No shit. Whenever we do anything abroad we're labeled imperialists and such for ****ing around with other peoples affairs.
__________________
Cuddley_Battleship
Your neg rep destination.
Cuddley_Battleship is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 08:03   #159
Cuddley_Battleship
Luminous Flux
 
Cuddley_Battleship's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Fargo, ND
Posts: 215
Cuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these parts
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
by assuming, as americans seem to tend to do, the poise of the wounded or the unjustly attacked, they are claiming a right. they claim a position of power.

we none americans, we lesser mortals, are not allowed to speak freely to the great united states. we must cow tow. we must worry terribly about your oh so delicate feelings.

it smacks of an american self belief of superiority.

are you feelings greater than our own? Is your pain greater than ours?

It also smacks of disigenuity. your media is robbing the suirvivors of that poor city of their dignity as we speak. the latent and inherent racism has already been demonstrated in the other thread. has your army mobilised yet? have you sent aid? food? doctors? the mayor of new orleans can't even get enough buses for god sake. you knew this was coming and like spoilt children you have done nothing to prevent a crisis turning into a disaster. this is how you treat your own kind and you have the gall to tell me it is 'insensitive' to criticise now?

forgive me if i am not moved by such crocodile tears.
It is an unjust attack. You're associating environmental policy with a storm that hit by chance. Claiming that it is reeks of desperation and makes it seem like you're living your whole life seething with a frustration or anger, always on the verge of breaking into the OMG YOU FAT STUPID YANKS YOU MAKE ME SO MAD IM GOING TO FLY A PLANE INTO ONE OF YOUR BUILDINGS OMG OMG OMGBBQ!!!!!!111111111" The fact is that this thread was started on the basis that the hurricane was somehow "our fault". If the thing had hit Florida and fizzled out this thread wouldn't exist. If it killed 50,000 people in central america it wouldn't exist. When threads pop up claiming that this storm was something out of "The Day After Tomorrow" or whatever (which it wasn't) and that higher emissions than what could or should be coming from one part of the globe caused it to occur (which has no basis at all. can you show me a study by a neutral party that proves it? no. it might have made it a little worse by warming it by a few degrees, but that wouldn't have helped the situation much). Basically you're using the fact that levees holding back a lake and river were breached and killed some of the 50,000-100,000 or so people (out of 1,000,000+) that didn't have the time or means to leave an area the size of an average country with about a day of warning and no real certainty of what would really happen. You're saying environmental policy did that. Read the title of the thread. I don't have a problem with criticism, I could say some things about this more scathing than you could ever think of, that would make your hair fall out. I am just trying to get the point across that it is very base to try to associate this with envoronmental policy, to say we're 'to blame' when you have utterly circumstantial evidence that, say, the hurricane may have been a degree or two (fahrenheit mind you, otherwise it would be less than one) degree warmer from the total world output of greenhouse gasses, the US' 'excess share' adding perhaps .2 degrees. Yes, .2 degrees or so made the difference between cajun and cadaver, folks. Don't accuse me of acting superior. When events like this are hijacked in this manner you look like a child. Are you a child? Must you wait for events like this to hammer home an argument the relation to which is tertiary, at best? There's no amount of feelings to step around. I don't think I'm any superior than people from other countries. I sense a bit of a complex here. I argue against points in this thread, and you accuse me of acting superior, thinking myself and countrymen gods among mortals? What is wrong with you people? I can't even try to fend off the mk 1 flame without triggering this 'second Godwin's law' of people not arguing their point and saying "omg your so arrogant YOU FAT STUPID YANK OMG GRRRRR Get real. Perhaps there could be more intelligent discussion around here if things were presented more appropriately and didn't result in blatent stereotyping. Lets have a little more confidence, not troll stereotypes and post the arguments a little closer to reality. Something just discussing the effects of global warming on weather would have done better. More room to discuss, and no unfair accusations of causing an inevitable and superficially related event. Can you grasp my point, or did you not even try?
__________________
Cuddley_Battleship
Your neg rep destination.
Cuddley_Battleship is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 11:43   #160
JonnyBGood
Banned
 
JonnyBGood's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Further to the right
Posts: 19,441
JonnyBGood has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.JonnyBGood has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.JonnyBGood has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.JonnyBGood has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.JonnyBGood has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.JonnyBGood has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.JonnyBGood has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.JonnyBGood has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.JonnyBGood has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.JonnyBGood has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.JonnyBGood has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Did anyone else not exhale while reading cuddley battleship's post?
__________________
Some might ask what good is life without purpose but I'm anticipating a good lunch.
JonnyBGood is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 12:17   #161
All Systems Go
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: London
Posts: 3,347
All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuddley_Battleship
It is an unjust attack. You're associating environmental policy with a storm that hit by chance. Claiming that it is reeks of desperation and makes it seem like you're living your whole life seething with a frustration or anger, always on the verge of breaking into the OMG YOU FAT STUPID YANKS YOU MAKE ME SO MAD IM GOING TO FLY A PLANE INTO ONE OF YOUR BUILDINGS OMG OMG OMGBBQ!!!!!!111111111" The fact is that this thread was started on the basis that the hurricane was somehow "our fault". If the thing had hit Florida and fizzled out this thread wouldn't exist. If it killed 50,000 people in central america it wouldn't exist. When threads pop up claiming that this storm was something out of "The Day After Tomorrow" or whatever (which it wasn't) and that higher emissions than what could or should be coming from one part of the globe caused it to occur (which has no basis at all. can you show me a study by a neutral party that proves it? no. it might have made it a little worse by warming it by a few degrees, but that wouldn't have helped the situation much). Basically you're using the fact that levees holding back a lake and river were breached and killed some of the 50,000-100,000 or so people (out of 1,000,000+) that didn't have the time or means to leave an area the size of an average country with about a day of warning and no real certainty of what would really happen. You're saying environmental policy did that. Read the title of the thread. I don't have a problem with criticism, I could say some things about this more scathing than you could ever think of, that would make your hair fall out. I am just trying to get the point across that it is very base to try to associate this with envoronmental policy, to say we're 'to blame' when you have utterly circumstantial evidence that, say, the hurricane may have been a degree or two (fahrenheit mind you, otherwise it would be less than one) degree warmer from the total world output of greenhouse gasses, the US' 'excess share' adding perhaps .2 degrees. Yes, .2 degrees or so made the difference between cajun and cadaver, folks. Don't accuse me of acting superior. When events like this are hijacked in this manner you look like a child. Are you a child? Must you wait for events like this to hammer home an argument the relation to which is tertiary, at best? There's no amount of feelings to step around. I don't think I'm any superior than people from other countries. I sense a bit of a complex here. I argue against points in this thread, and you accuse me of acting superior, thinking myself and countrymen gods among mortals? What is wrong with you people? I can't even try to fend off the mk 1 flame without triggering this 'second Godwin's law' of people not arguing their point and saying "omg your so arrogant YOU FAT STUPID YANK OMG GRRRRR Get real. Perhaps there could be more intelligent discussion around here if things were presented more appropriately and didn't result in blatent stereotyping. Lets have a little more confidence, not troll stereotypes and post the arguments a little closer to reality. Something just discussing the effects of global warming on weather would have done better. More room to discuss, and no unfair accusations of causing an inevitable and superficially related event. Can you grasp my point, or did you not even try?
You really should learn how to paragraphs.

Rants are so much easierand more enojyable to read when they aren't just one big mess.

the day after tomorrow was the biggest piece of shit ever. Good graphics with a 'plot' pinned on for the sake of it.

the title is a question, not a statement. It is asking not saying.

Breath. Slowly.
__________________
The 20th century has been characterised by three developments of great political importance. The growth of democracy; the growth of corporate power; and the growth of corporate propaganda as a means of protecting corporate power against democracy.
All Systems Go is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 12:18   #162
Marilyn Manson
Gone
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 14,656
Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Exclamation Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
Did anyone else not exhale while reading cuddley battleship's post?
Bill Clinton.
Marilyn Manson is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 12:27   #163
G.K Zhukov
Evil inside
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,631
G.K Zhukov is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dda
Scapegoating. Brazil may be screwed up but I will not accept blame on the part of the US.
I didnt expect you too either.
I expect that you deny the results of Agent Orange in Vietnam.
I expect that you deny the results of US support for the genocide in Guatemala.

etc.
__________________
<Germania>but you called Fury a bully, and that is terribly unfair
<Hicks>Occassionally individuals do things without Executive consent
<Dreadnought>You cant whois on Eclipse server without a registered nic, which mr ****stirrer doesnt have.
<Almeida> well i like to grow fat myself too, and when i have enough ships then i can engage in big battles
<Nantoz> Zhukov for Lord Protector!
<Jakiri> (Windows)XP was fine on release
G.K Zhukov is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 12:54   #164
Yahwe
I am.
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,580
Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dda
To further this argument, I will point out that the levying of the Mississippi has resulted in the loss of hundreds of square miles of wetlands to the south of New Orleans. The river being channeled ceased to deposit silt over many of the low lying areas between New Orleans and the gulf coast. These wetlands would have formed a primary defense against the tidal surge which overwhelmed the levees.

Kyoto would not have helped this situation.
indeed kyoto wouldn't have helped that.

but given the thread title is USA can blame themselves for Katrina? one does have to ask:

"who was it who channeled the river?"
__________________
hi
Yahwe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 13:37   #165
MrL_JaKiri
The Twilight of the Gods
 
MrL_JaKiri's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 23,481
MrL_JaKiri has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.MrL_JaKiri has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.MrL_JaKiri has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.MrL_JaKiri has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.MrL_JaKiri has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.MrL_JaKiri has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.MrL_JaKiri has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.MrL_JaKiri has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.MrL_JaKiri has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.MrL_JaKiri has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.MrL_JaKiri has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuddley_Battleship
When threads pop up claiming that this storm was something out of "The Day After Tomorrow" or whatever (which it wasn't) and that higher emissions than what could or should be coming from one part of the globe caused it to occur (which has no basis at all. can you show me a study by a neutral party that proves it? no. it might have made it a little worse by warming it by a few degrees, but that wouldn't have helped the situation much).
"Weather" is a chaotic system.
MrL_JaKiri is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 15:33   #166
Leshy
Mr. Blobby
 
Leshy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Belgium
Posts: 8,271
Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuddley_Battleship
You're associating environmental policy with a storm that hit by chance.
Hurricanes do not hit by chance, especially in an area that is well known for it's hurricanes.

Especially when the FEMA has already assessed New Orleans being hit by a hurricane would be one of the biggest disasters that could strike the United States, you have to question why environmental policy over the past few years was not to minimize the risks of this happening, and doing as much as possible to ensure the safety of New Orleans, rather than cut funding to it.
Quote:
If the thing had hit Florida and fizzled out this thread wouldn't exist. If it killed 50,000 people in central america it wouldn't exist.
But it didn't. It hit a major city in the USA and likely caused thousands of casualties, apparently after environmental policy regarding New Orleans had been aimed at economical profit, rather than the prevention of the situation that has exactly unfolded now.

Environmental policy is not just limited to Kyoto, you know.
__________________
http://www.leshy.net
Leshy is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 15:53   #167
Texan
Prince of Amber
 
Texan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Heidelberg, Germany
Posts: 1,313
Texan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these parts
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Below are three messages some people posted anonymously.

Quote:
I cant believe how stupid and ignorant you Americans are some times. In moral and ethical values you are set back 500 years compared to the rest of the western world. Pld.
Hmm. That would put us around the time that Europe was attempting to conquer, enslave and murder everyone in the whole world. I'll keep that in mind next time.

Quote:
you have an alarming lack of grasp about what the rest of the world things about the festering hole which is america
And you have probably spent 95 percent of your whole life within 200 km of the village where you were born. Yet you do know how the rest of the world thinks. Wait, I know who sent this. Professor Charles Xavier

Quote:
world socialism? KYOTO? Christ. Get over your 'Oh, I've been to Europe so I paid any attention to their quaint politics before i dismissed altruism completely' little spiel. You're a prize twat, ever and always.
At least I am not afraid to state my opinions publicy. Coward.
__________________
"We sleep safe at night in our beds because rough men stand ready to visit violence upon those who wish to do us harm." -- George Orwell.

Last edited by Texan; 2 Sep 2005 at 16:11.
Texan is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 16:02   #168
NEWSBOT3
NEWSBOT
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: The enby cave!
Posts: 4,872
NEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriendNEWSBOT3 needs a job and a girlfriend
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

the lack of organised response to this to save lives is frankly ****ing disgusting.
It's like they never had a clue what to do, and even now, 3 days later, the only people actually trying to save lives are volunteers.

i'm lost for words, i really am.
__________________
[20:27:47] <nodrog-aawy> **** i think my housemate just caught me masturbating
[11:25:32] <idimmu> you are a little piggy arent you
[13:17:00] <KaneED> i'm so closet i'm like narnia
__________________
Pretty parks and funky scrap metal things here
NEWSBOT3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 16:07   #169
Yahwe
I am.
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,580
Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Someone good enough to neg rep you
I cant believe how stupid and ignorant you Americans are some times. In moral and ethical values you are set back 500 years compared to the rest of the western world. Pld.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Texan
Hmm. That would put us around the time that Europe was attempting to conquer, enslave and murder everyone in the whole world. I'll keep that in mind next time.
do you really read what you type?

because everyone else who reads his comment can see that

THAT

WAS

HIS

****ING

POINT
__________________
hi
Yahwe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 16:15   #170
Texan
Prince of Amber
 
Texan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Heidelberg, Germany
Posts: 1,313
Texan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these parts
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
do you really read what you type?

because everyone else who reads his comment can see that

THAT

WAS

HIS

****ING

POINT
Yes, retard, I saw that. And -- I -- will -- keep -- that -- in -- mind -- next -- time.
__________________
"We sleep safe at night in our beds because rough men stand ready to visit violence upon those who wish to do us harm." -- George Orwell.
Texan is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 16:17   #171
Yahwe
I am.
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,580
Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Bloody you are: bloody will be your end. Shame serves your life - and will your death attend!
__________________
hi
Yahwe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 16:30   #172
Tactitus
Klaatu barada nikto
 
Tactitus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: St. Paul, Minnesota
Posts: 3,237
Tactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus would
Exclamation Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leshy
Hurricanes do not hit by chance, especially in an area that is well known for it's hurricanes.

Especially when the FEMA has already assessed New Orleans being hit by a hurricane would be one of the biggest disasters that could strike the United States, you have to question why environmental policy over the past few years was not to minimize the risks of this happening, and doing as much as possible to ensure the safety of New Orleans, rather than cut funding to it.
It doesn't appear that funding would have made any difference, since the actual levee that gave way had already been upgraded under the program. The real problem was that the flood control system around New Orleans was designed to handle a Category 3 hurricane, not a Category 4 hurricane (like Katrina) or a Category 5 hurricane. This dates back to decisions made after Hurricane Betsy in 1965.

Southern Louisiana is an enormous sinkhole for flood control projects, both figuratively and literally (since most of the area is subsiding with New Orleans sinking faster than the rest of it). And with the current delta erosion rates, the city itself could be out in the gulf within a century.

If people are going to continue living there, it might make more sense for them to resign themselves to periodic losses of homes and businesses, and put their efforts into better evacuation plans. :/
__________________
The Ottawa Citizen and Southam News wish to apologize for our apology to Mark Steyn, published Oct. 22. In correcting the incorrect statements about Mr. Steyn published Oct. 15, we incorrectly published the incorrect correction. We accept and regret that our original regrets were unacceptable and we apologize to Mr. Steyn for any distress caused by our previous apology.
Tactitus is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 17:41   #173
Leshy
Mr. Blobby
 
Leshy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Belgium
Posts: 8,271
Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Leshy has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tactitus
It doesn't appear that funding would have made any difference, since the actual levee that gave way had already been upgraded under the program. The real problem was that the flood control system around New Orleans was designed to handle a Category 3 hurricane, not a Category 4 hurricane (like Katrina) or a Category 5 hurricane. This dates back to decisions made after Hurricane Betsy in 1965.
Thanks for the article. This does seem to suggest that at least funding wasn't a direct cause of this disaster, although the policy in regards to wetlands still remains somewhat questionable.
__________________
http://www.leshy.net
Leshy is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 18:05   #174
Tactitus
Klaatu barada nikto
 
Tactitus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: St. Paul, Minnesota
Posts: 3,237
Tactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus wouldTactitus spreads love and joy to the forum in the same way Jesus would
Exclamation Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leshy
Thanks for the article. This does seem to suggest that at least funding wasn't a direct cause of this disaster, although the policy in regards to wetlands still remains somewhat questionable.
I think it's more than somewhat questionable, but unfortunately there's rarely any sense of urgency for major policy changes. It usually takes a disaster to seize the public and political attention required to make it happen. :/
__________________
The Ottawa Citizen and Southam News wish to apologize for our apology to Mark Steyn, published Oct. 22. In correcting the incorrect statements about Mr. Steyn published Oct. 15, we incorrectly published the incorrect correction. We accept and regret that our original regrets were unacceptable and we apologize to Mr. Steyn for any distress caused by our previous apology.
Tactitus is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 18:53   #175
Ste
Bored
 
Ste's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Nottm ->Shef ->Croydon ->Manc ->Durham ->Sheffield
Posts: 6,506
Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Not sure if it's already been posted. But I read this and thought it might be important...
http://www.globalwarming.org/article.php?uid=116

Oh and I read this and thought it was hilarious:
http://www.repentamerica.com/pr_hurricanekatrina.html
SEE YOU ARE TO BLAME
__________________
Wise men write because they have something to write about; fools write because they have to write something. - Plato

yeh so Plastic Brilliance is now known as FOXYSTOAT - Come on by and check it out!
Ste is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 20:09   #176
furball
Registered Awesome Person
 
furball's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 5,676
furball has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.furball has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.furball has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.furball has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.furball has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.furball has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.furball has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.furball has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.furball has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.furball has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.furball has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

dda and Tactitus, you two are a breath of fresh air in comparison to the other American posters on this thread.
__________________
Finally free!
furball is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 21:00   #177
dda
USS Oklahoma
 
dda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,500
dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
indeed kyoto wouldn't have helped that.

but given the thread title is USA can blame themselves for Katrina? one does have to ask:

"who was it who channeled the river?"
Good on you. You got the point. This is a reasoned argument, even if I do say so myself. It is factual, non-emotional and not mean spirited. Some of the posts smack of "Hahaha. You got what you deserved. See how much better we are because we didn't have a hurrican."
__________________
Ignorance is curable, stupidity is not.
dda is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 2 Sep 2005, 22:37   #178
Texan
Prince of Amber
 
Texan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Heidelberg, Germany
Posts: 1,313
Texan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these partsTexan is infamous around these parts
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marilyn Manson
Bill Clinton.
He didn't inhale.
__________________
"We sleep safe at night in our beds because rough men stand ready to visit violence upon those who wish to do us harm." -- George Orwell.
Texan is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 00:01   #179
Treveler
Its time to roll the dice
 
Treveler's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: The barn
Posts: 876
Treveler has a brilliant futureTreveler has a brilliant futureTreveler has a brilliant futureTreveler has a brilliant futureTreveler has a brilliant futureTreveler has a brilliant futureTreveler has a brilliant futureTreveler has a brilliant futureTreveler has a brilliant futureTreveler has a brilliant futureTreveler has a brilliant future
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ste
Oh and I read this and thought it was hilarious:
http://www.repentamerica.com/pr_hurricanekatrina.html
SEE YOU ARE TO BLAME
I really liked that "Are you good enough to go to heaven" link at the left. Ohhh I`m so gonna burn!
__________________
Real life peon.
Treveler is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 00:13   #180
Boogster
I dunno...
 
Boogster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: manchester
Posts: 1,502
Boogster has much to be proud ofBoogster has much to be proud ofBoogster has much to be proud ofBoogster has much to be proud ofBoogster has much to be proud ofBoogster has much to be proud ofBoogster has much to be proud ofBoogster has much to be proud of
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

I just hope the mess gets sorted out.
__________________
He shall drink naught but brine, for I'll not show him / Where the quick freshes are.
Boogster is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 00:33   #181
dda
USS Oklahoma
 
dda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,500
dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Just for our foreign friends, the proper pronunciation of New Orleans, Louisiana is:

NAW-lins, loo-Zee-anna
__________________
Ignorance is curable, stupidity is not.
dda is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 00:43   #182
Yahwe
I am.
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,580
Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dda
Good on you. You got the point. This is a reasoned argument, even if I do say so myself. It is factual, non-emotional and not mean spirited. Some of the posts smack of "Hahaha. You got what you deserved. See how much better we are because we didn't have a hurrican."

IF, for goodness sake, IF you ever thought that about what i was saying, or what others were saying.

oh what must you have thought we were?

heartless tyrants wanting to destory democratic freedom?

let me say to you (and others will read this) but to you as a friend. when britain makes mistakes (and we do, and we will) tell us. that is what friends do.

friends are not yes men.

oh goodness how i see those pictures and weep. i do not want. i never ever want your citizens to die. this is a disgrace.

I'm a lawyer. i'm tough. it is just one disgrace. one in a million chance of it having happened at all. but please. please. i ask you.

not again.
__________________
hi
Yahwe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 00:43   #183
Yahwe
I am.
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,580
Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dda
Just for our foreign friends, the proper pronunciation of New Orleans, Louisiana is:

NAW-lins, loo-Zee-anna
yeeeees welll

'when in rome' i say
__________________
hi
Yahwe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 01:24   #184
vampire_lestat
Mathamagician
 
vampire_lestat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: At the very edge of existance
Posts: 1,803
vampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet society
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Yahwe, why don't you use capital letters at the start of a sentance?
__________________
I think I just had an evilgasm
vampire_lestat is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 01:56   #185
G.K Zhukov
Evil inside
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,631
G.K Zhukov is an unknown quantity at this point
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dda
Just for our foreign friends, the proper pronunciation of New Orleans, Louisiana is:

NAW-lins, loo-Zee-anna
I don't think you got that many foreign friends anymore.
__________________
<Germania>but you called Fury a bully, and that is terribly unfair
<Hicks>Occassionally individuals do things without Executive consent
<Dreadnought>You cant whois on Eclipse server without a registered nic, which mr ****stirrer doesnt have.
<Almeida> well i like to grow fat myself too, and when i have enough ships then i can engage in big battles
<Nantoz> Zhukov for Lord Protector!
<Jakiri> (Windows)XP was fine on release
G.K Zhukov is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 01:59   #186
Yahwe
I am.
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,580
Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

he's got more than you
__________________
hi
Yahwe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 02:01   #187
vampire_lestat
Mathamagician
 
vampire_lestat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: At the very edge of existance
Posts: 1,803
vampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet societyvampire_lestat is a pillar of this Internet society
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

To be fair I didn't know Zhukov had any friends, forign or otherwise.
__________________
I think I just had an evilgasm
vampire_lestat is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 10:46   #188
Ste
Bored
 
Ste's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Nottm ->Shef ->Croydon ->Manc ->Durham ->Sheffield
Posts: 6,506
Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Nice to see there is no favouritism in the aftermath
__________________
Wise men write because they have something to write about; fools write because they have to write something. - Plato

yeh so Plastic Brilliance is now known as FOXYSTOAT - Come on by and check it out!
Ste is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 10:51   #189
Phang
Aardvark is a funny word
 
Phang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: I'm No Nino Rota
Posts: 5,923
Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Phang has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

it's not actually so bad if you read it (competitive bidding, last year), although i know what you mean.
__________________
Efficiency, efficiency they say
Get to know the date and tell the time of day
As the crowds begin complaining
How the Beaujolais is raining
Down on darkened meetings on the Champs Élysées
Phang is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 11:17   #190
Ste
Bored
 
Ste's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Nottm ->Shef ->Croydon ->Manc ->Durham ->Sheffield
Posts: 6,506
Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Ste has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

and this article is quite interesting as well:

Quote:
Notes from Inside New Orleans
By JORDAN FLAHERTY

I just left New Orleans a couple hours ago. I traveled from the apartment I was staying in by boat to a helicopter to a refugee camp. If anyone wants to examine the attitude of federal and state officials towards the victims of hurricane Katrina, I advise you to visit one of the refugee camps.

In the refugee camp I just left, on the I-10 freeway near Causeway, thousands of people (at least 90% black and poor) stood and squatted in mud and trash behind metal barricades, under an unforgiving sun, with heavily armed soldiers standing guard over them. When a bus would come through, it would stop at a random spot, state police would open a gap in one of the barricades, and people would rush for the bus, with no information given about where the bus was going. Once inside (we were told) evacuees would be told where the bus was taking them - Baton Rouge, Houston, Arkansas, Dallas, or other locations. I was told that if you boarded a bus bound for Arkansas (for example), even people with family and a place to stay in Baton Rouge would not be allowed to get out of the bus as it passed through Baton Rouge. You had no choice but to go to the shelter in Arkansas. If you had people willing to come to New Orleans to pick you up, they could not come within 17 miles of the camp.

I traveled throughout the camp and spoke to Red Cross workers, Salvation Army workers, National Guard, and state police, and although they were friendly, no one could give me any details on when buses would arrive, how many, where they would go to, or any other information. I spoke to the several teams of journalists nearby, and asked if any of them had been able to get any information from any federal or state officials on any of these questions, and all of them, from Australian tv to local Fox affiliates complained of an unorganized, non-communicative, mess. One cameraman told me "as someone who's been here in this camp for two days, the only information I can give you is this: get out by nightfall. You don't want to be here at night."

There was also no visible attempt by any of those running the camp to set up any sort of transparent and consistent system, for instance a line to get on buses, a way to register contact information or find family members, special needs services for children and infirm, phone services, treatment for possible disease exposure, nor even a single trash can.

To understand the dimensions of this tragedy, its important to look at New Orleans itself.

For those who have not lived in New Orleans, you have missed a incredible, glorious, vital, city. A place with a culture and energy unlike anywhere else in the world. A 70% African-American city where resistance to white supremacy has supported a generous, subversive and unique culture of vivid beauty. From jazz, blues and hiphop, to secondlines, Mardi Gras Indians, Parades, Beads, Jazz Funerals, and red beans and rice on Monday nights, New Orleans is a place of art and music and dance and sexuality and liberation unlike anywhere else in the world.

It is a city of kindness and hospitality, where walking down the block can take two hours because you stop and talk to someone on every porch, and where a community pulls together when someone is in need. It is a city of extended families and social networks filling the gaps left by city, state and federal governments that have abdicated their responsibility for the public welfare. It is a city where someone you walk past on the street not only asks how you are, they wait for an answer.

It is also a city of exploitation and segregation and fear. The city of New Orleans has a population of just over 500,000 and was expecting 300 murders this year, most of them centered on just a few, overwhelmingly black, neighborhoods. Police have been quoted as saying that they don't need to search out the perpetrators, because usually a few days after a shooting, the attacker is shot in revenge.

There is an atmosphere of intense hostility and distrust between much of Black New Orleans and the N.O. Police Department. In recent months, officers have been accused of everything from drug running to corruption to theft. In separate incidents, two New Orleans police officers were recently charged with rape (while in uniform), and there have been several high profile police killings of unarmed youth, including the murder of Jenard Thomas, which has inspired ongoing weekly protests for several months.

The city has a 40% illiteracy rate, and over 50% of black ninth graders will not graduate in four years. Louisiana spends on average $4,724 per child's education and ranks 48th in the country for lowest teacher salaries. The equivalent of more than two classrooms of young people drop out of Louisiana schools every day and about 50,000 students are absent from school on any given day. Far too many young black men from New Orleans end up enslaved in Angola Prison, a former slave plantation where inmates still do manual farm labor, and over 90% of inmates eventually die in the prison. It is a city where industry has left, and most remaining jobs are are low-paying, transient, insecure jobs in the service economy.

Race has always been the undercurrent of Louisiana politics. This disaster is one that was constructed out of racism, neglect and incompetence. Hurricane Katrina was the inevitable spark igniting the gasoline of cruelty and corruption. From the neighborhoods left most at risk, to the treatment of the refugees to the the media portrayal of the victims, this disaster is shaped by race.

Louisiana politics is famously corrupt, but with the tragedies of this week our political leaders have defined a new level of incompetence. As hurricane Katrina approached, our Governor urged us to "Pray the hurricane down" to a level two. Trapped in a building two days after the hurricane, we tuned our battery-operated radio into local radio and tv stations, hoping for vital news, and were told that our governor had called for a day of prayer. As rumors and panic began to rule, they was no source of solid dependable information. Tuesday night, politicians and reporters said the water level would rise another 12 feet - instead it stabilized. Rumors spread like wildfire, and the politicians and media only made it worse.

While the rich escaped New Orleans, those with nowhere to go and no way to get there were left behind. Adding salt to the wound, the local and national media have spent the last week demonizing those left behind. As someone that loves New Orleans and the people in it, this is the part of this tragedy that hurts me the most, and it hurts me deeply.

No sane person should classify someone who takes food from indefinitely closed stores in a desperate, starving city as a "looter," but that's just what the media did over and over again. Sheriffs and politicians talked of having troops protect stores instead of perform rescue operations.

Images of New Orleans' hurricane-ravaged population were transformed into black, out-of-control, criminals. As if taking a stereo from a store that will clearly be insured against loss is a greater crime than the governmental neglect and incompetence that did billions of dollars of damage and destroyed a city. This media focus is a tactic, just as the eighties focus on "welfare queens" and "super-predators" obscured the simultaneous and much larger crimes of the Savings and Loan scams and mass layoffs, the hyper-exploited people of New Orleans are being used as a scapegoat to cover up much larger crimes.

City, state and national politicians are the real criminals here. Since at least the mid-1800s, its been widely known the danger faced by flooding to New Orleans. The flood of 1927, which, like this week's events, was more about politics and racism than any kind of natural disaster, illustrated exactly the danger faced. Yet government officials have consistently refused to spend the money to protect this poor, overwhelmingly black, city. While FEMA and others warned of the urgent impending danger to New Orleans and put forward proposals for funding to reinforce and protect the city, the Bush administration, in every year since 2001, has cut or refused to fund New Orleans flood control, and ignored scientists warnings of increased hurricanes as a result of global warming. And, as the dangers rose with the floodlines, the lack of coordinated response dramatized vividly the callous disregard of our elected leaders.

The aftermath from the 1927 flood helped shape the elections of both a US President and a Governor, and ushered in the southern populist politics of Huey Long.

In the coming months, billions of dollars will likely flood into New Orleans. This money can either be spent to usher in a "New Deal" for the city, with public investment, creation of stable union jobs, new schools, cultural programs and housing restoration, or the city can be "rebuilt and revitalized" to a shell of its former self, with newer hotels, more casinos, and with chain stores and theme parks replacing the former neighborhoods, cultural centers and corner jazz clubs.

Long before Katrina, New Orleans was hit by a hurricane of poverty, racism, disinvestment, deindustrialization and corruption. Simply the damage from this pre-Katrina hurricane will take billions to repair.

Now that the money is flowing in, and the world's eyes are focused on Katrina, its vital that progressive-minded people take this opportunity to fight for a rebuilding with justice. New Orleans is a special place, and we need to fight for its rebirth.
__________________
Wise men write because they have something to write about; fools write because they have to write something. - Plato

yeh so Plastic Brilliance is now known as FOXYSTOAT - Come on by and check it out!
Ste is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 13:32   #191
Dante Hicks
Clerk
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 13,940
Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Dante Hicks has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

One of the things this disaster brings home to me is that people take almost exactly what they wish from it. Over at Stormfront they're gleefully noting how the most black looters are showing their "true nature" (genetics, innit). Over on Znet they're blaming all of this on the Federal Government and the Free Market. A Marxist mailing list I'm on are saying this shows the contradictions of the capitalist system and the developing crisis at the end of Capitalism.

Given all this it's unsurprising that people concerned about global warming are "glad" this tragedy has shown they were correct in the first place. In this instance I don't think that's fully justified (as shown by the hurricane statistics linked somewhere in this thread).

Hurricanes happen. That's life, especially in this region and they can often be devestating. Sure, the preperation could have been better and at least on paper the recent budget cuts to the Engineer Corpos looks bad on the administration. Would it have made much difference? Possibly not, it's difficult to tell.

What I will say (again, drawing a conclusion that coincidentally agrees with my usual viewpoint ) is that the aftermath of this disaster has depressed me more than the initial damage. I am not sure if it's representative, but if this shows the health of the civil society in the United States then may your God help you all.

In various (premature and slightly unfair perhaps) comparisons with Cuba I have read, I am told that in previous severe hurricanes the Cuban government have done everything they can to evacuate up to a million people at a time (even going as far as some wild-life being moved). I'd wager that the higher level of collective identity, solidarity (and of course, much more oppressive/obtrusive government) serves the Cubans well in these times. I'd also doubt you'd see as much "crime" in the aftermath of disasters (although with others, I'm reluctant to condemn "looting" in a city with effectively no economy).

Now, in the US, to an extent you do not the have "the Cuban model". To an extent, you are on your own. If you fall down it is up to you (and your family) to get back up. For many years (and perhaps most today) people believed the state would look after them (cradle to grave perhaps). Well they are not. So if, to borrow Nietzsche's words "the state is dead", then what will replace it?
Dante Hicks is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 16:07   #192
meglamaniac
Born Sinful
 
meglamaniac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Loughborough, UK
Posts: 4,059
meglamaniac has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.meglamaniac has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.meglamaniac has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.meglamaniac has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.meglamaniac has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.meglamaniac has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.meglamaniac has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.meglamaniac has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.meglamaniac has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.meglamaniac has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.meglamaniac has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Just to clarify all this anti-american feeling:

We British, as a general guideline, don't have a problem with Americans* (plural).
The problem is with America (singular). As a nation, the USA has alienated so many countries that, as Yahwe already said, it's international image is having a severe crisis of confidence - although it seems most of America is yet to realise this.
America also has something of a record of having our grievances go straight over it's head. Case in point: Texan's earlier rantings about how the US pulled out of treaties but did so legally. America, you just don't get it. That's not the point. We don't care how you pulled out, what annoys us is that you pulled out at all. We care about the action, not the reasoning (or lack thereof) behind it.
And, much as it still dumbfounds me to see it, a good proportion of America (mainly the Christian extremist part that makes up Bush's home ground) really, honestly can't see why Iraq has irreparably damaged your international image, and again, trust.

One day, America will wake up to the fact that the rest of the world really doesn't have a very high opinion of it. When that will be who can say? Some would have thought that 9/11 might have been a hint, but apparently not.




* Except when they complain loudly about queues, usually to get into museums or other tourist attractions. It's the UK. You came here to experience it, so put up with it. Queuing is what we do.
__________________
Worth dying for. Worth killing for. Worth going to hell for. Amen.
meglamaniac is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 16:53   #193
dda
USS Oklahoma
 
dda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,500
dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

The problem with anti-(anything) sentiment is that it almost invariably drives opinion amongst the group singled out in the wrong direction.

Anti-arab sentiment certainly has driven many arabs to greater extremes.

Anti-black sentiment has certainly driven blacks to distrust whites even more.

If your daughter comes home with a new boyfriend that you don't approve of, expressing that sentiment just provokes her into an irrational defense of the very bastard you object to.

I am not saying this is a good thing. I am saying it is a human thing.

I am suggesting that people need to be more temperate in their expressions of disagreement if they truly care about convincing someone on the other side.

Now, I hate to do this, but, for the most part (note all of the qualifiers), I will use Yahwe as a good example. Yahwe mostly posts reasoned opinions and remarks in this area. He occasionally descends a tad when he feels himself provoked.

Sadly, I think, that if people followed the, what I consider good, advice I have just given, GD would be far less interesting. So, I only make these suggestions confident in the belief that they will be ignored and I will continue to be treated to various rants of enormous entertainment value and which are even sometimes instructive.
__________________
Ignorance is curable, stupidity is not.
dda is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 18:04   #194
Yahwe
I am.
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,580
Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dda
The problem with anti-(anything) sentiment is that it almost invariably drives opinion amongst the group singled out in the wrong direction.
we're only warning you.

at the end of the day it is america that will suffer if it doesn't realise, not us.

'you can lead a horse to water ...'
__________________
hi
Yahwe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 3 Sep 2005, 18:12   #195
Cuddley_Battleship
Luminous Flux
 
Cuddley_Battleship's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Fargo, ND
Posts: 215
Cuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these partsCuddley_Battleship is infamous around these parts
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by meglamaniac
One day, America will wake up to the fact that the rest of the world really doesn't have a very high opinion of it.
We know that.
__________________
Cuddley_Battleship
Your neg rep destination.
Cuddley_Battleship is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 5 Sep 2005, 15:26   #196
Marilyn Manson
Gone
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 14,656
Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Marilyn Manson has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Exclamation Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Texan
He didn't inhale.
He also lied to Congress, the nation, and the world.
Marilyn Manson is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 5 Sep 2005, 16:15   #197
s|k
Caveat Lector
 
s|k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Tucson, Arizona
Posts: 3,038
s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.s|k has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by meglamaniac
One day, America will wake up to the fact that the rest of the world really doesn't have a very high opinion of it.
That would be after the day that most Americans wake up and realise that there is a 'rest of the world.'

The kettle calling the pot black: A hundred years from now I'll be sporting an avatar like Yahwe's: after we've created our own commonwealth.*






*We already have one but it only includes the islands of the Marianas. :/
__________________
Diomedes IRC
Blog
s|k is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 5 Sep 2005, 17:31   #198
dda
USS Oklahoma
 
dda's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,500
dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.dda has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
we're only berating you.

at the end of the day it is all your fault.

'you can drive a horse to water, but you can't always get it to willingly let you push its head under water ...'
Fixed
__________________
Ignorance is curable, stupidity is not.
dda is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 5 Sep 2005, 17:39   #199
Yahwe
I am.
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 6,580
Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Yahwe has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

persecution complex? what?

America?

what? what?

paranoia? what?

little blonde haired Timmy?

flags on fire? what?

surely not!

"They're just plain evil Timmy!"
__________________
hi
Yahwe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 5 Sep 2005, 17:47   #200
All Systems Go
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: London
Posts: 3,347
All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.All Systems Go has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

According to American news reports 200 cops have left New Orleans during the clean-up and at least 2 have committed suicide due to working there.

that is not a good sign.
__________________
The 20th century has been characterised by three developments of great political importance. The growth of democracy; the growth of corporate power; and the growth of corporate propaganda as a means of protecting corporate power against democracy.
All Systems Go is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 19:50.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2002 - 2018