Planetarion Forums - Dragons, the one to fear?

Sun_Tzu · 3 Aug 2003, 10:38

Quote:

Originally posted by Scouse
Maybe. But I know exactly what I mean. It's not that hard to figure out.

'It' is having two or more board accounts. 'Nathan' thought it meant something else. There, explained.

well enough, I wasn't really following the argument(rather boring really

), just that one comment at the end of the page that looked like it demanded a reply

Maddix · 3 Aug 2003, 10:49

Quote:

Originally posted by Sun_Tzu
well enough, I wasn't really following the argument(rather boring really ), just that one comment at the end of the page that looked like it demanded a reply

Or you trying to be a smart ass and failing miserabley, I mean come on....out-done by a Scouser?

/me snuggles Scouse

Sun_Tzu · 3 Aug 2003, 11:05

Quote:

Originally posted by Maddix
Or you trying to be a smart ass and failing miserabley, I mean come on....out-done by a Scouser?

/me snuggles Scouse

no, just me being me, I generally speak my mind just for the **** of it, I could care less what you think Maddix, or anyone else for that mather. Stupidity just needs to be combated, where ever, when ever.

Master · 3 Aug 2003, 16:01

I think Dragons might be a strong force, we will have to wait and see

reseacher · 8 Aug 2003, 15:59

seems like everyone is forgetting that the dragons only got their reputation by being selfish

and now when they got nowhere to hide behind (wolfpack elysium and others) i seriously wonder how they are gonna continue being the force everyone think they are.

one thing for sure the alliance that now finally got rid of the dragons only get stronger by it. maybe now they will have less "top" planets but atleast they dont need to waste resources on those that dont even play for the alliance but for the battlegroup

and yes as everyone says only time will tell.

The_Fish · 8 Aug 2003, 16:04

Quote:

Originally posted by reseacher
seems like everyone is forgetting that the dragons only got their reputation by being selfish

depends on who you speak to, I would say Dragons got their reputation by fighting harder than other people alongside them (especially R9, when I had most dealings with them) but their original repuation was one of fencesitting. We'll see in R10 how they stand up though, and I believe they'll be one of the top 3 alliances.

mens · 8 Aug 2003, 16:19

Quote:

Originally posted by reseacher
one thing for sure the alliance that now finally got rid of the dragons only get stronger by it. maybe now they will have less "top" planets but atleast they dont need to waste resources on those that dont even play for the alliance but for the battlegroup

get someone to check wolfpacks "wp-score" (ranking for best defenders) history of round 8 and 9 and check how the dragon planets were ranked there. I seem to remember gothic, gorgoroth and alot of others (including myself) were present at the top 5 list for most of those rounds.

xtothez · 8 Aug 2003, 16:20

It really depends on who stays with them now that single-membership is enforced. Personally I don't care, I got to keep my cheerios and isotee, so Dragons can do what they like : )

SpazMonster · 8 Aug 2003, 16:42

No one alliace is worth fearing in round 10, especially a bunch of arbiter monkeys (/me hides). It's pretty much a clean slate and test of adaptation, organization and foresight.

G.K Zhukov · 8 Aug 2003, 16:50

Quote:

Originally posted by The_Fish
depends on who you speak to, I would say Dragons got their reputation by fighting harder than other people alongside them (especially R9, when I had most dealings with them) but their original repuation was one of fencesitting. We'll see in R10 how they stand up though, and I believe they'll be one of the top 3 alliances.

Jurgens r6 gal defined fencesitting.

mens · 8 Aug 2003, 17:00

Quote:

Originally posted by G.K Zhukov
Jurgens r6 gal defined fencesitting.

it's called politics

they won.
everybody remember 5:24, who the fk remembers 2nd and 3rd place?

xtothez · 8 Aug 2003, 17:00

Quote:

Originally posted by The_Fish
depends on who you speak to, I would say Dragons got their reputation by fighting harder than other people alongside them (especially R9, when I had most dealings with them) but their original repuation was one of fencesitting. We'll see in R10 how they stand up though, and I believe they'll be one of the top 3 alliances.

The Dragons core are undoubtedly skilled attacking players, and have been fun to work with on raids in the past. However up till now they have always relied on political support to avoid incoming rather than cover it (be it fencesitting gals, NAPing the leading alliances, or simply using the dual-alliance benefits of being a BG rather than official alliance). The random round should keep directed firepower away from them, but it'll be interesting to see how they cope should too many people find their roids attractive.

xtothez · 8 Aug 2003, 17:01

Quote:

Originally posted by mens
who the fk remembers 2nd place?

Hicks? : )

LordNieminen · 9 Aug 2003, 10:28

Quote:

Originally posted by mens
it's called politics
they won.
everybody remember 5:24, who the fk remembers 2nd and 3rd place?

--------
hehe my gal was 3th or 2nd.. so yes I remember it.

ComradeRob · 9 Aug 2003, 10:44

Quote:

Originally posted by mens
it's called politics
they won.
everybody remember 5:24, who the fk remembers 2nd and 3rd place?

26:7 finished second in r6.

This information is taking up valuable space in my brain

mens · 9 Aug 2003, 13:17

isildurx · 9 Aug 2003, 13:40

Quote:

Originally posted by LordNieminen
--------
hehe my gal was 3th or 2nd.. so yes I remember it.

u dont rmbr if u were 2nd or 3rd though :P

isildurx · 9 Aug 2003, 13:41

Quote:

Originally posted by xtothez
Hicks? : )

Razorback · 9 Aug 2003, 15:41

or you could use this:

http://www.caeneus.org/planetarion/

thx to scouse

Nitros · 9 Aug 2003, 21:11

Quote:

Originally posted by K-W
Round 10 is wide open alliance wise. Especially since we dont exactly know what the new round will do to allainces and what allainces will handle the new game in what ways.

I think there are several alliances who can reasonably aim to win round 10, and no clear favorite among them.

Sun_Tzu · 10 Aug 2003, 11:34

LordN; you should remember you Dwarves came in at 3rd, Silvercity at 4th, the #2 gal...can't remember whos gal that was :/

Zukov, fish, everyone else speking out of their arse about Dragonlands rnd6; You might wanna get a clue before claiming Jurgens gal fencesat, there's really more to it than you think(I'll let Jurgen fill in something if he cba but I doubt he will, I was told the story in a drunken haze while walking from one bar to another so my attention to detail might be a "tad" lacking)

The_Fish · 10 Aug 2003, 18:02

Quote:

Originally posted by Sun_Tzu
Zukov, fish, everyone else speking out of their arse about Dragonlands rnd6; You might wanna get a clue before claiming Jurgens gal fencesat

and you might wanna stop talking out of your arse and point me to where I said they fencesat, I dont know the whole story, so I wouldnt say that. I said they got a reputation for being fencesitters, not that they fencesat, as I dont know if they were

G.K Zhukov · 11 Aug 2003, 00:43

Quote:

Originally posted by The_Fish
and you might wanna stop talking out of your arse and point me to where I said they fencesat, I dont know the whole story, so I wouldnt say that. I said they got a reputation for being fencesitters, not that they fencesat, as I dont know if they were

Want me to tell you about their massive account-swapping too?

xtothez · 11 Aug 2003, 02:43

Quote:

Originally posted by The_Fish
and you might wanna stop talking out of your arse and point me to where I said they fencesat, I dont know the whole story, so I wouldnt say that. I said they got a reputation for being fencesitters, not that they fencesat, as I dont know if they were

I'm still trying to get to the actual point of this post, as you seem to contradict yourself after each comma. But in the event you were serious in believing they didn't fencesit, I'd like to ask you what your definition of the following is:

Being under FoS and Xeta arbiters (while FLVT where co-operating with FoS, protecting the gal by default).
Targeting low-priority enemy gals (under t100) and avoiding high-profile individuals likely to bring retals to them
Getting gal mates to jump to 'more friendly' alliances once their old protection wasn't needed

Oh, and if we want to start with the cheating accustions, I'll give Zhukov a heads up with Pies' login:

Quote:

[19:23] (Calibretto) I talked to Jurgen this morning and he didnt do anything
[19:23] (Calibretto) even tho he owed me one
[19:26] (Calibretto) ive got the pass now
[19:27] (XtoTheZ)

[19:27] (Calibretto) lets all retal that ****in rank one gal
[19:28] (XtoTheZ) can i see the overview of your planet there?
[19:28] (XtoTheZ) copy it to a webby or summit
[19:28] (Calibretto) just log in to it
[19:28] (Calibretto) Ashraf/amber
[19:29] (Calibretto) dont change anything tho
[19:29] (Calibretto) just look around
[19:29] (Calibretto) we will take revenge

Of course he didn't start in that gal, his account was a multi owned by Mr. Calibretto in my gal. However I wasn't in my 'grass on a mate' phase so it went unreported and they got off with it.

Oh well, thats my inflammatory post for the day...

The_Fish · 11 Aug 2003, 10:04

Quote:

Originally posted by xtothez
I'm still trying to get to the actual point of this post, as you seem to contradict yourself after each comma. But in the event you were serious in believing they didn't fencesit, I'd like to ask you what your definition of the following is:

I dont know if they fencesat, I never said they did, I never said they didn't, I was inactive as **** back then, didnt follow the situation, they did get a reputation for fencesitting, which is what I said. I never said they deserved it or never deserved it.

No contradiction there?

Sun_Tzu · 11 Aug 2003, 10:31

X; there's more to it than you let on.
Fish; sry, I also aimed my post at the rest so the tone might have been a tad harsh, but no point in talking of things you don't know about for sure is there?
And nice Calling Jurgens team cheaters for having a multi-account of one of your gals players in it which had joined as free-random \o/

Besides, Dragonlands was only the original 15 players, not the randoms :P

The_Fish · 11 Aug 2003, 11:22

Sun Tzu, thats why I stayed on the fence, 5:24 had a reputation of being fencesitters, no-one can deny that, I dont know if it was deserved or not, like I said all along.

xtothez · 11 Aug 2003, 13:56

Quote:

Originally posted by Sun_Tzu
X; there's more to it than you let on.

I'd love to hear an explanation of this.

Quote:

Originally posted by Sun_Tzu
And nice Calling Jurgens team cheaters for having a multi-account of one of your gals players in it which had joined as free-random \o/

I don't see the relevance of this statement. I could understand if I had posted "lol jurgen is cheating scum lol", as thats entirely hypocritical when me and my gal were cheating. I didn't however. I simply posted my evidence that some players in Dragonlands had cheated. A person who admits to cheating and provides evidence that someone else did isn't a hypocrite, they are merely posting facts (unless you want to claim an Englishman calling someone else English qualifies).

I'm not going to claim any moral superiority here. I had plenty of logins for my gal in that round. I logged into Pies account just to see if worked. I let gal mates get away with login sharing and multi planets. The main reason I didnt report the multi in 5:24 was to protect my friend.
I stopped cheating the same round mainly because I was scared of being caught and kicked from Silver/Ely. I also wanted to protect the reputation of my alliance (spending the next round in an Ely HC gal without daring to cheat).

I'm just a messenger here providing the information I have. I'm not in a position to judge anyone.

Parthos · 11 Aug 2003, 15:00

I swear, 90% of this board's space is taken up with pointless debates over things that are facts rather than speculation. Someone posts a fact, and all it takes to derail the entire thread and send it into microscopic nitpicking is someone saying "uh uh, that fact isn't true at all, but I can't be arsed to explain why as I was drunk at the time and I'll let the person involved explain, but oh btw, I doubt they will."

Granted, it is fun seeing the facts then backed up and the lone voice against logic and reason owned.

But it's sad that it has to be done. Someday people will learn that owning up to things brings a lot less attention to those peccadilloes. 3+ rounds after the fact, who cares that they fencesat? We all knew they were doing it at the time. At this point it's not good, or bad, it's just a fact of history that folks will take into account as one of the small things they keep in mind when they consider what kinds of relations they will have with them r10. And the account swapping and login sharing was also common knowledge to all of PA at the time, there's no point in trying to rewrite history.

Not to mention, all the people who post vehement denials of known facts are the ones who push the button sending threads into endless debate. By posting denials of known facts, they distract the thread from its original intent and send it into a long spiral of needless debate that in the end winds up casting an even more negative light on the subject.

Umm.. </end morning rant>

LordNieminen · 11 Aug 2003, 19:11

u might aswell start new topic dragonlands.. in r6.. da fencer.. anyways it's been discussed in another topic long time ago, but generally those 3 points fit dragonlands, they didn't do gal attacks on top enemy gal/planets.. who did? no one i think.. atleast none of those who survived.. prolly they had few players now and then joining on att's to big enemy gals etc.. cba to talk more.. i don't care.. *ignores this topic from now on*

Jurgen · 11 Aug 2003, 19:50

actually I do know it's only stupid to post a reply to here... I'll only get flamed and stuff.
About our random planet that was sum1's farm planet... heh
How am I supposed to control my random planets? I didn't choose those... I can't help if they r multi.

It was nice ofc. that pies hooked 1 of those heh. In the end it didn't make no difference we would have won even if pies wouldn't have been 1 of our randoms... only by 0.4billion thoz or summit.
And about the fence sitting... I set up every single attack Ðragonlands did I made sure target is not friendly and ok to be attacked and that most of planets get covered... I did that for 3 months or summit like that every bloody night...
I was in the setsuation where my gal had over 2 times more roids than rank2 galaxy... I was tired of setting up those attacks and ofc. there always is a change of retal so when spinner suddenly announced that there is 2 or 3 weeks left I thought wtf I'll start to sleep at night we'll win anyway.
Like we did... I think we won more than any other galaxy ever before has won in pa if roidcounts and score is compared to second ranked galaxy.
Still u ppl whine that we should have tried to get more roids.
And about not helping our alliance... I told to Caliban and other wp hc that if wp ever get incoming that can't be covered get sum1 to call me and I'll cover it. (I recall us being also flamed about not defending any1 ;-))
Try to decide... should we defend or attack? or neither?
heh

do whatever getting flamed anyway
mwahahahaha r6 is still teh best round ever.
r9.5 was fun also a bit 2 easy thoz.

Actually didn't do this cause of I felt like I should explain something... did this cause I saw sum1 claiming that we wouldn't post anyway.

lrytas · 11 Aug 2003, 19:52

u sleep too much jurgen

(hope to see you soon

)
________
CYCLONE

Jurgen · 11 Aug 2003, 19:56

LOL eat my shorts lrytas

u old fart... heh heh heh

I'm not the 1 quitting and sleeping ;-)

and yeah... I'm looking forward to c ya 2.
Hope u remember Ðragons ghey reputation and set urself ready for it.

xtothez · 12 Aug 2003, 04:12

Quote:

Originally posted by Jurgen
About our random planet that was sum1's farm planet... heh
How am I supposed to control my random planets?

Try not taking them from somone in my gal for a minute...

Sun_Tzu · 12 Aug 2003, 12:41

lrytas coming to finland? ooh, this I gotta see

Jurgen · 12 Aug 2003, 13:43

xtothex: well that doesn't mean I wouldn't try to control my randoms...

Sun_Tzu: no we going to holland

Sun_Tzu · 12 Aug 2003, 14:21

Quote:

Originally posted by Jurgen
Sun_Tzu: no we going to holland

bummer :/ why is everyone going to holland? :/
hmm, we should hold a meeting in tallin next summer, a couple of meetings infact, what with the new import laws and all

cheaper for all of us etc.

Knight Theamion · 12 Aug 2003, 14:28

holland aight?

Scorpio · 12 Aug 2003, 15:31

Quote:

Originally posted by Knight Theamion
holland aight?

guess it provides us with a nice opportunity to put those dragons back in their place

Argilus · 12 Aug 2003, 16:53

Quote:

Originally posted by Scorpio
guess it provides us with a nice opportunity to put those dragons back in their place

they are entering the danger zone =)

The_Fish · 12 Aug 2003, 21:51

I thought it was in Belgium?!

Rabbagast · 12 Aug 2003, 23:04

There's no doubt about Ðragons skills and dedication.
Most observant players shouldn't have much problems with acknowledging this.

I believe they can do well in Round 10,
if they keep up their dedication and are blessed with a decent political landscape..
( and an active Jurgen ! :P )

I have been abscent for awhile now and haven't really been keeping uptodate with politics and alliance relations lately like I used to.
Real life takes up to much time for me now.

When I'm online now from time to time I must admit I miss seeing Ðragons on our Wolfpack server.
I'm sorry about having to fade out of Wolfpack Command during round 9, which I know was a significant reason for the gap that was created between WP and Ðragons. Which later resulted in a more or less complete breakup.

I won't go into the full story about what happened here, but gorgo and biusa knows this very well.

As I'm writing this I realise that this is perhaps not the best thread to put this part of the story into..
Gorgoroth knows alot about how I felt about this..
We talked alot on the phone, and I always made myself available for a chat be it day or night, even when I was no longer playing PA.
Perhaps things would've been different with me there, and maybe I could've presented you with a good solution. Then again maybe not.. who knows..
We had started something already when I was there, and you know I would've gone along way with you guys..

Ðragons fought hard all the way towards the end against ET in r9, even when the WE military weren't really working..and most of WE top100 had left and joined Eclipse and ToT to save their roids(!:/)

Ðragons as a unit and team is truly hardcore from what I've seen, and we all saw them do great in r9.5.. allthough still not as a proper mono-alliance.

However it's no denying that they did well under the wings of Wolfpack and Elysium. The cooperation and community of WE seemed to suit Ðragons nicely, it was a great place for them to grow and prosper.
I very much think that Ðragons helped tighten the bonds of WE.

The leaders of Ðragons and their older members should know well to always remember and respect their old friends and allies.

I wish you all the best for the future =)

OWAGE !

I remember Jurgens 5:24-Ðragonsland aswell.. and that I spent quite a few hours a day 'protecting' it from FLTVTTTTT (lo sid,zhil,biggdogg,biggie and the rest of you..)

not many remember 2nd and 3rd, but I do remember them having Wolfpack atleast

aswell as 4-10 if I recall correctly. To this day I wonder why we didn't spell Wolfpack on the top10 list downwards.. or for that sake Brotherhood
[/Wolfpack__ad]
[/old_memories]

'Rabba
Putting up Wallpaper since 1847
-
You better watch out where those wolves go, so you don't eat that yellow snow !

Biusa · 13 Aug 2003, 21:14

Quote:

Originally posted by Scorpio
guess it provides us with a nice opportunity to put those dragons back in their place

Amusement level = High

Biusa · 13 Aug 2003, 21:16

Quote:

Originally posted by Rabbagast

... The leaders of Ðragons and their older members should know well to always remember and respect their old friends and allies...

You know I lubbleh you

SoulS · 14 Aug 2003, 23:14

I don`t think Dragons will be as dangerous as they were when they were a "BG". Because back then, there were ppl from numerous alliances which provided def from all angles. Now they are on their own.

Zo0f · 15 Aug 2003, 11:31

Quote:

Originally posted by Sun_Tzu

Besides, Dragonlands was only the original 15 players, not the randoms :P

TheACE · 15 Aug 2003, 12:48

I (u here, not WolfPack, but me TheACE) would rather have Dragons as a winner of the round then a Eclips or ViruS.

I know the Dragons r good players and nice ppl. I wish then the best luck and hope we stay friends Jurgen, Lizardking, burmel and all the others.

GL in real live (u'll need it when we meat: the hospital is far away and i bet no1 wil be allowed to drive u there)

TehVader · 15 Aug 2003, 14:06

Quote:

Originally posted by Zo0f

Awww

berten · 15 Aug 2003, 14:30

Quote:

Originally posted by Jurgen

Hope u remember Ðragons ghey reputation and set urself ready for it.

I know i am

Sun_Tzu · 15 Aug 2003, 14:39

oh yes, robs, bertens and neverls finland trip was a true testament to the gheyness of then alliance ^^ Samistock r0ked though

Glad to have met you guys

And probably a big reason for Dragons becoming an own entity is also found in the split between WP and Ely during rnd9 as Rabba hinted, but then again I'm a strong beliver in that everything effects everything, if not directly then indirectly, no-one goes untouched.