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Unread 25 Jul 2006, 17:52   #1
Gate
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An attempt at making shipstats

This is not intended to be used in PA (although perhaps a speedgame would be nice? ), it's just an attempt by me to try and create a set of stats that isn't very boring. Mainly, by being far too confusing to make sense to anyone and therefore being full of the thrill of the unknown.

You can take a look at the .txt or the .xls version of them.

The basic idea is that there are 2 races, with slight branching. Each race has 6 basic ships and a pod, but can do further research for the last 3 ships and a pod.

Science comes with 3 EMP and 3 normal ships, and can research either stealth (gets 3 cloaked ships) or 'advanced science' (gets 2 more powerful EMP ships and a more powerful killship).

War come with reasonably tough armour and can research 'advanced war' (a battleship pod and some very well armoured shiznit) or 'nanotechnology (1 drone and 2 stealships).

I just wanted people's opinions on these stats and of the basic idea behind them; would they prove interesting?
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Unread 25 Jul 2006, 17:55   #2
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Re: An attempt at making shipstats

I don't get how having less races and which branch off each other leads to more creativity and fun. Just see the recent competitions with the old war/science stats to see how boring it was.

Edit: having looked at your stats it's not quite as bad as I thought, but its still 4 'half' races rather than 4 full races.

Or something like that, I just got home from work and my head is hot and tired.
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Unread 26 Jul 2006, 05:10   #3
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Re: An attempt at making shipstats

I like the idea. Fun also to have Fi pods coming in later in the game. Changing is fun anyway. I think we've come to the limit of what races can bring. Every round is just about guessing which race as better stats.
We could even go farther by having a single race at the start with a common pod, then 4 branches to choose from.
Steal ships is more limited this way, good, coz for me zik have always been suspect, far too easy to ship farm without being caught.
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Unread 26 Jul 2006, 22:11   #4
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Re: An attempt at making shipstats

To be honest, I have to say that having looked a *bit*, ships and trees are a bit more flexible than I thought. It took me about a day to sort out the limitations for the world cup setup. Branches would require a bigger recode, but I guess it's not completely out of the question.
Adding more ships per race and more classes etc is a lot easier as it's handled by arrays in most (all?) places. The only issue is that the ships have to be added manually (at the moment) to the database if we go over 48.

Multiple targetting and so on are part of the combat engine itself, and would probably require more of a combat engine recode.
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Unread 26 Jul 2006, 22:37   #5
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Re: An attempt at making shipstats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Appocomaster
To be honest, I have to say that having looked a *bit*, ships and trees are a bit more flexible than I thought. It took me about a day to sort out the limitations for the world cup setup. Branches would require a bigger recode, but I guess it's not completely out of the question.
Adding more ships per race and more classes etc is a lot easier as it's handled by arrays in most (all?) places. The only issue is that the ships have to be added manually (at the moment) to the database if we go over 48.

Multiple targetting and so on are part of the combat engine itself, and would probably require more of a combat engine recode.
I suppose the most simple option within the current confines is to have you pick your race and branch at the beginning rather than picking one of two races then branching... and have 4 tech levels for ships, just have each individual research take less time?

Apologies, if I've misunderstood the way the game works. I'm a technonoob tbh.
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Unread 26 Jul 2006, 23:24   #6
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Re: An attempt at making shipstats

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Originally Posted by Cannon_Fodder
Just see the recent competitions with the old war/science stats to see how boring it was.
what?
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Unread 27 Jul 2006, 01:04   #7
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Re: An attempt at making shipstats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Appocomaster
To be honest, I have to say that having looked a *bit*, ships and trees are a bit more flexible than I thought. It took me about a day to sort out the limitations for the world cup setup. Branches would require a bigger recode, but I guess it's not completely out of the question.
Adding more ships per race and more classes etc is a lot easier as it's handled by arrays in most (all?) places. The only issue is that the ships have to be added manually (at the moment) to the database if we go over 48.

Multiple targetting and so on are part of the combat engine itself, and would probably require more of a combat engine recode.

Just an idea, would/have you considered having a research and development team for developing new stats on a continuous basis, rather than the 2 week get together in #beta inbetween rounds

An example would be continous testing of a 5 maybe a 6 race stat system
or alternative tech trees/features etc.
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Unread 27 Jul 2006, 03:22   #8
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Re: An attempt at making shipstats

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Originally Posted by Paisley
Just an idea, would/have you considered having a research and development team for developing new stats on a continuous basis, rather than the 2 week get together in #beta inbetween rounds

AHHAHAhhHAHhhaa!


Oh, sorry. please forgive my bitterness, but i've asked the exact same question for 3 or 4 years now. Hmm, its 2006 right? perhaps even longer .

/me waves
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Unread 27 Jul 2006, 18:58   #9
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Re: An attempt at making shipstats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ultimate Newbie
AHHAHAhhHAHhhaa!


Oh, sorry. please forgive my bitterness, but i've asked the exact same question for 3 or 4 years now. Hmm, its 2006 right? perhaps even longer .

/me waves
It is only a suggestion worse the worse that can happen....

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Unread 28 Jul 2006, 17:14   #10
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Re: An attempt at making shipstats

I had another mess about, adding more ships. Can be found here, you will need excel to view it.

The funny coloured ships are the ones that would need the 4th tech level in order to build.

This spreadsheet has a page showing how the 4 'semi races' would look. Ignore the names, it was just a theme I had in mind: Terran vs Cathaar, but after achieving certain levels of development they each have a philosophical split. If it wants to be put into a PA 'storyline', cathaar developed stealth tech could have been stolen by the xands, whilst pacifist cathaars eventually won over their race, and 'integrationist' terrans were defeated by the 'humanists', forced out, they did a whole cylon thing of evolving into pure machines and coming back with a vengeance as the Zikonian.

EDIT; for the extra ships, we could always take out structure killers if the technical whatsimathingy won't handle over 48.
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Last edited by Gate; 28 Jul 2006 at 17:21.
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Unread 28 Jul 2006, 19:47   #11
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Re: An attempt at making shipstats

I would either recommend...

3 races with 2 variants. Would be murder to put together but could be interesting.
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Unread 28 Jul 2006, 23:10   #12
Gate
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Re: An attempt at making shipstats

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paisley
I would either recommend...

3 races with 2 variants. Would be murder to put together but could be interesting.
I've tried both, but couldn't really get my head around them...

But that's kind of a problem with my own paradigm; when I make stats I attempt to make it so that every race or variant can hit every other variant if required, depending on choice of attack fleet. I also try, as far as I can, to make every attack fleet a viable one... so I work my stats around a basic targetting matrix before I add in the rest of a race's ships...

Which I think I kind of succeeded with in r17, despite any other problems.

Unfortunately, 3 races with 2 variants each is a matrix with 36 potential variations, as opposed to the 16 for 4 variants. Personally, I cbad to even try this, so it's up to someone else if this idea appeals :/
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