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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 10:18   #1
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Drunken Sex

Could get you a caution

(I know we've talked about this before)
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4780992.stm

Pig and Tomkat will need a big pad of specially prepared contracts...

Does this worry anyone else?
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 10:26   #2
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Re: Drunken Sex

Sounds to me like all a woman needs to do is have a drink and cry rape and there is a good chance the man could get prosecuted without sufficient evidence from that story which could be pretty dangerous.

I wonder if a similar law will be passed for women who take advantage of beer goggles.


Edit: Reminds me of this old classic.

Police are warning all men who frequent clubs, parties and local pubs to be alert and stay cautious when offered a drink from any woman. Many females use a date rape drug on the market called "Beer."

The drug is found in liquid form and is available anywhere. It comes in bottles, cans, or from taps and in large "kegs". Beer is used by female sexual predators at parties and bars to persuade their male victims to go home and sleep with them. A woman needs only to get a guy to consume a few units of Beer and then simply ask him home for no strings attached sex.

Men are rendered helpless against this approach. After several beers, men will often succumb to the desires to sleep with horrific looking women whom they would never normally be attracted. After drinking beer, men often awaken with only hazy memories of exactly what happened to them the night before, often with just a vague feeling that "some thing bad" occurred.

At other times these unfortunate men are swindled out of their life's savings, in a familiar scam known as "a relationship." In extreme cases, the female may even be shrewd enough to entrap the unsuspecting male into a longer term form of servitude and punishment referred to as "marriage." Men are much more susceptible to this scam after beer is administered and sex is offered by the predatory females.

Last edited by PSH; 7 Mar 2006 at 11:22.
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 12:30   #3
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Re: Drunken Sex

So before taking advantage of them while they're drunk we need to get them to sign an affadavit or something saying that they want to have sex?

Presumably we ask them to sign this before they pass out?
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 14:54   #4
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Re: Drunken Sex

isn't this the topic Yahwe brought up a while ago that would amount to men having to prove they are innocent?
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 15:21   #5
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Re: Drunken Sex

Quote:
Originally Posted by BBC
One in five reported rapes in London leads to a caution or charge
A caution?

For rape?
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 15:23   #6
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Re: Drunken Sex

Quote:
Originally Posted by All Systems Go
A caution?

For rape?
A caution for alleged rape ...
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 15:28   #7
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Re: Drunken Sex

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
A caution for alleged rape ...
Noone cares about your obscure politically correct legal distinctions, rapists are evil monsters who deserve to be castrated and raped in prison.
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 15:41   #8
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Re: Drunken Sex

Quote:
Originally Posted by All Systems Go
A caution?

For rape?
the police consider the revalation that one has slept with a minger punishment enough.
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 16:01   #9
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Re: Drunken Sex

If a girl was ever more drunk than me, thus I knew what was going on id never sleep with them, what happens if they are stone cold sobre, and im wasted....which has happened and I end up in bed with them. Why is it not rape then...because I can then run to GD and tell you the story!
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 17:04   #10
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Re: Drunken Sex

Quote:
Originally Posted by pig
If a girl was ever more drunk than me, thus I knew what was going on id never sleep with them,
What if they were really fit?
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 17:12   #11
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Re: Drunken Sex

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ste
What if they were really fit?
no ;/
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 17:37   #12
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Re: Drunken Sex

waiting for the "I was too drunk to pronounce consent, in order to ask for it" defence. or variant thereof.
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 18:01   #13
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Re: Drunken Sex

I suppose it all depends on what the law says about consent.

If a woman who is very, very drunk is not legally able to consent, then I think that men who can't stop themselves from committing a crime while they are drunk should stop drinking.

If a woman who is very very drunk is legally able to consent, then the men aren't doing anything wrong (from the point of view of the law) by having sex with very drunk women, and therefore women who can't say no when they are drunk should stop drinking.

What does the law say about drunken consent? I can't actually remember, it's not really relevant to me, cos I don't drink. (Anyone who says 'you don't have sex either, hurrrrrrrrrrrrrr' gets a slap.)
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 18:31   #14
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Re: Drunken Sex

"No, I just wanted sex because I was drunk!
They abused me in my fragile state!! Rape!!
I didn't know alcohol could do such a thing!!"
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 19:04   #15
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Re: Drunken Sex

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nantoz
No one would think about sayng that as long as Noddy is around. He's a safe bet, isn't he?
That's so several years ago.
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 19:12   #16
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Re: Drunken Sex

I had drunken sex on friday night. Are the less harsh penalities if you don't get specific oral or written consent...but don't enjoy it? (that's more a joke than anything)

And another question, if things are leaning towards a situation where a woman is drunk, has sex, didn't give specific consent because she was drunk, then can cry foul the next day...does that mean a man can too?
If you get really really drunk, end up having sex with a woman but don't give your direct consent. Can you then claim rape?
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 19:42   #17
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Re: Drunken Sex

Quote:
Originally Posted by IncubusGod
And another question, if things are leaning towards a situation where a woman is drunk, has sex, didn't give specific consent because she was drunk, then can cry foul the next day...does that mean a man can too?
If you get really really drunk, end up having sex with a woman but don't give your direct consent. Can you then claim rape?
In the UK, a man cannot be raped by a woman: it requires penile penetration.

In Ireland, the offence of rape is governed by the Criminal Law (Rape) Act 1981. There is no provision in the statute for a woman to rape a man.
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 19:53   #18
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Re: Drunken Sex

So if a women had aids, got you drunk, and had sex with you, there's nothing you can do?
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 19:54   #19
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Re: Drunken Sex

Quote:
Originally Posted by furball
In the UK, a man cannot be raped by a woman: it requires penile penetration.
Well, yes, technically you're right in that she can't be charged with "rape" as such, but a woman who forces a man to have sex with her can be charged with "causing a person to engage in sexual activity without consent", under Section 4 of the Sexual Offences Act 2003, which if it involves penetration carries the same sentence as rape (maximum life imprisonment).
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 19:54   #20
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Re: Drunken Sex

Quote:
Originally Posted by IncubusGod
I had drunken sex on friday night. Are the less harsh penalities if you don't get specific oral or written consent...but don't enjoy it? (that's more a joke than anything)

And another question, if things are leaning towards a situation where a woman is drunk, has sex, didn't give specific consent because she was drunk, then can cry foul the next day...does that mean a man can too?
If you get really really drunk, end up having sex with a woman but don't give your direct consent. Can you then claim rape?
Surely if a woman says yes but didn't mean it or her judgement was impaired whatever, then that's still consent, because she still says yes? If that still counts as rape, then you're right, if a woman has sex with you while you're drunk it should be rape. But if it's only when a woman is too drunk to articulate either 'yes' or 'no' that it's rape, I'm not sure you have such a strong case, because surely for a man to have sex with a woman requires an action of actually doing the sex thing, whereas a woman can just lie there going 'Where am I? What's happening?' while some guy has sex with her. If a guy lies there going 'wtf where am i?' then no sex gets done.

NB I'm sure the law has things to say about what happens in these cases, I'm merely expressing an opinion on what I personally think the law should say.
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 20:01   #21
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Re: Drunken Sex

If a woman is too drunk to even pronounce the word 'yes' or 'no' then drunk is a misleading term to use; unconscious (or semi-conscious) would probably be better. Although that should definitely count as rape, I dont think this is the sort of extreme case which is being debated.
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 20:14   #22
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Re: Drunken Sex

While this is all well and good, there still doesn't seem to be any kind of legal clarification about what happens if you club her over the head with a baseball bat before having consensual sex with her?
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 20:47   #23
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Re: Drunken Sex

Quote:
Originally Posted by Proteus
Well, yes, technically you're right in that she can't be charged with "rape" as such, but a woman who forces a man to have sex with her can be charged with "causing a person to engage in sexual activity without consent", under Section 4 of the Sexual Offences Act 2003, which if it involves penetration carries the same sentence as rape (maximum life imprisonment).
Correct, I even had a few mental bets on as to who would point this out first


The problem is that before a jury, all a defence lawyer has to do is to say that a man who does not consent to sex is not going to get aroused. Since it's then impossible for the man to penetrate the woman, there must have been consent (or at least, that would be the argument used). It's simplistic enough to put serious doubt in the minds of the jury, which is enough.
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 20:48   #24
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Re: Drunken Sex

Well the point I was making was tin relation to that recent case in the UK which sparked all this, where a woman claimed she was raped while drunk, but couldn't remember giving consent or not and couldn't remember the actual sex.
Link

This sparked a massive outcry from womens groups and rape centres, saying that it was a travesty and a horrible 'loop hole' in the law.
So in their eyes he was guilty of rape because she was drunk and couldn't remember if she gave consent or not.

I've woken up, in the past, with a girl in the bed next to me who remembered the previous night when I didn't. We'd had sex, but I couldn't remember much of it.
That's pretty much the same situation but she would never be accused of innapropriate behavior with me. So why can a man be accused in the very same situation?

Now we'll never know if the guy in this case raped her or not, but it's a shadow over him for ever.


Quote:
Originally Posted by furball
Correct, I even had a few mental bets on as to who would point this out first


The problem is that before a jury, all a defence lawyer has to do is to say that a man who does not consent to sex is not going to get aroused. Since it's then impossible for the man to penetrate the woman, there must have been consent (or at least, that would be the argument used). It's simplistic enough to put serious doubt in the minds of the jury, which is enough.
There are many child sex abuse cases where male victims feel shame and somewhat responsible because they had gotten involuntary errections before or during the abuse. This is not seen as an issue in such cases.
I don't have to remind you or anyone else her that mister winky can have a mind of his own.
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 22:20   #25
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Re: Drunken Sex

Quote:
Originally Posted by IncubusGod
There are many child sex abuse cases where male victims feel shame and somewhat responsible because they had gotten involuntary errections before or during the abuse. This is not seen as an issue in such cases.
I don't have to remind you or anyone else her that mister winky can have a mind of his own.
And of course she could have slipped him some viagra without him noticing.
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Unread 7 Mar 2006, 23:59   #26
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Re: Drunken Sex

IncubusGod, Proteus, both good points. I don't mean to dismiss child sex abuse as being the child's fault, I'm sure you realise that that wasn't my intention.

However, when it comes to bog-standard occasions where a woman wants to have sex and a man doesn't, it's unlikely that the man will be aroused and able to have sex. That was my point. The factors of age (children) and drugs (viagra) are additional factors which would obviously change the outcome of the cases.
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Unread 8 Mar 2006, 00:46   #27
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Re: Drunken Sex

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/mid/4464402.stm

I know the woman talked about in there.
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Unread 8 Mar 2006, 01:27   #28
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Re: Drunken Sex

Women have been tried and convicted of having sex with people that don't want to in Norway. At least one case I can think of, the man was drunk.
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Unread 8 Mar 2006, 01:56   #29
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Re: Drunken Sex

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snurx
Women have been tried and convicted of having sex with people that don't want to in Norway. At least one case I can think of, the man was drunk.
Do they have fat ugly goth women in Norway ?
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Unread 8 Mar 2006, 01:56   #30
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Re: Drunken Sex

you looking for another wife?
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Unread 8 Mar 2006, 02:33   #31
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Re: Drunken Sex

it's why camera phones were invented
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