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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 21:02   #1
Nodrog
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Britain

http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/st...575411,00.html
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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 21:08   #2
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodrog
are you looking for someone to defend this?

it would have been bad, but acceptable, if they'd stopped him and checked his bag. what they ACTUALLY did was insane and unforgiveable.
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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 21:15   #3
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Re: Britain

my first inclination was to moan about there being no synopsis so that i would know if i wanted to click or not,
but instead i shall say thanks for the link, i shall now throw out my black rucksack.

m
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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 21:33   #4
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Re: Britain

I've heard similar stories.
A friend of my mum was a mentor to a teenage refugee in Nottingham, he was given housing and employment on the condition that he met with his mentor once a week.
One day the police picked him up randomly and took him from Nottingham to somewhere like Doncaster and interviewed him for 48 hours. He wasn't able to contact anyone in that time and so lost his job, missed his mentor meeting so lost his home and when he was released without charge he wasn't taken back to Nottingham so he was on the street in an unfamiliar town without any money.

The terrorism act is not a good thing.
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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 21:37   #5
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Re: Britain

Crazy.
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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 21:38   #6
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Re: Britain

Well our terrorism act was passed in 2000 so we set the precedent.

Britan, leading the world once again.

Setting trends and harassing the French.
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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 21:44   #7
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Re: Britain

what

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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 21:56   #8
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Re: Britain

If he had have been carrying a bomb, the police would have done a marvellous job, though.
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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 22:41   #9
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Re: Britain

If he had run off they would have pulled him down to the ground, made sure he wasn't moving, and shot him in the head.
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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 22:50   #10
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Re: Britain

I think it was a BIT over the top. If he didn't have a bomb or any sor of explosive etc, how is he a threat? I think the laws are pretty shit if someone who's found innocent can't even get his stuff back and isn't supported by law. The public seem to have fewer and fewer rights, I guess. I thought the American Government was worse than ours, but it seems that that's pretty incorrect.
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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 23:14   #11
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Re: Britain

I don't think that it'll ever get as far as 3 months. The Government are trying to extend the length of time from 2 weeks, and are asking for an obviously overlong period so they get about what they want after "negotiating".

tbh, I think they should have some sort of evidence, and if they find the person innocent afterwards there should be some sort of refund + getting your stuff back. I know the Daily Mail in particular loves to point out how if the government kept anyone who was ever accused of anything in jail then they wouldn't commit some crime later in life, but really I think if the terrorists strike again they're probably going to try something different.
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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 23:23   #12
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Re: Britain

Thank god you Brits are down in Iraq, teaching those iraqis the basics of freedom, civil rights & democrazy.

Go Tony, you teach em!
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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 23:29   #13
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Re: Britain

Tony isn't actually our prime minster. We disowned him. He floats from country to country telling everyone how much the UK love them and want to help them (unless they're in the middle east, and then they're guilty of breaking all sorts of laws and need to be invaded with his friend Georgy so he can make a huge mess and steal some of that there oil).
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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 23:48   #14
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Re: Britain

The police should have arrested his girlfriend as well, she might have been the one carrying the bombs that day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boogster
If he had have been carrying a bomb, the police would have done a marvellous job, though.
Are you stark raving mad? If the police shot everyone in the face I'm pretty sure they'd get all the murderers and child rapists. I wouldn't exactly be too happy about that though, would you?
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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 23:51   #15
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Re: Britain

the police were paranoid at the time, not shocked that they made a fook up somewhere.

pretty shit tbh
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Unread 23 Sep 2005, 23:54   #16
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Re: Britain

Hopefully the situation will be slightly better. It's not like any future suicide bombers will look identically the same as before, as they're more likely to be caught then. Intelligent suicide bombers would do something different to before, unless/until the police stopped paying so much attention to "suspicious" people on public transport any more.

But if they arrest innocent people and screw up things like jobs and homes as in Ste's example I think the police must have to sort it out, tbh.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 04:17   #17
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Re: Britain

Id be interested to know what they based their 'suspicious' behaviour on, im sure they have psychological modeling of what they think suicide bombers would behave like, i wonder if it matched anything that happened in London. The 'not looking at the pigs' bit is a catch22 situation if ever i heard one, afaik the ****ers stop you if you make eye contact! which is why ive always followed the stare straight ahead school of passing a police man.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 05:57   #18
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Re: Britain

He was arrested for being French in public, obviously. A sensible law by any standard.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 12:54   #19
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Re: Britain

His complaint about them not letting him phone his girlfriend before they raided the flat was pretty stupid imo. "Hey honey, how are you? Good, good. Can you flush the crack stash down the toilet and throw the bomb making kit out the window? Ta." (in-code).
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 13:49   #20
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Exclamation Re: Britain

Mabye we should just herd all black and asian people into camps like what they did with the japs in America during WW2. It would save the police in London the effort of arresting/shooting all of them.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 14:08   #21
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marilyn Manson
Mabye we should just herd all black and asian people into camps like what they did with the japs in America during WW2. It would save the police in London the effort of arresting/shooting all of them.
They won't shoot/arrest all black and asian people. Just those with rucksacks or something electrical near them who are wearing "unseasonal clothing".
I believe they have orders to shoot to kill any asian wearing hawaiian t-shirts this winter.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 14:36   #22
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by G.K Zhukov
Thank god you Brits are down in Iraq, teaching those iraqis the basics of freedom, civil rights & democrazy.

Go Tony, you teach em!
Indeed.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/mid...st/4277532.stm
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 14:55   #23
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Re: Britain

I don't think the iraqis have an extradition treaty with the UK.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 15:00   #24
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Re: Britain

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Originally Posted by Nodrog
Oh well.

I would have more sympathy with the author if he wasn't a journalist though
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 17:11   #25
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Re: Britain

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Originally Posted by Vaio
Oh well.

I would have more sympathy with the author if he wasn't a journalist though
YEAH! I so agree, no civil rights for journalists!!!!!!
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 17:30   #26
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nantoz
You do? I would think that was sort of "suspicious" if it's obvious that you make a point of not staring.
I always look police officers in the eye, sometimes I might even smile.
That goes for bouncers aswell. If I'm trying to get into a club that I'm too young to be in, I always look the bouncers straight in the eye with an I-belong-here-and-you'd-better-know-it stare. It has not failed me yet.
I dislike police officers for joining a group which enforces laws I don't support so I generally don't bother looking at them in case I get violently ill all over myself and then I have to go and change my pants.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 17:36   #27
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by G.K Zhukov
YEAH! I so agree, no civil rights for journalists!!!!!!
heh,not quite.

Over here the journalists do silly things like plant fake bombs to 'test' security (It's sells papers) and it wouldn't surprise me that this idiot was all set to do an expose on how he managed to get onto an underground train with a rucksack and big jacket just to make the police look even sillier, right up to the point where he was arrested.

Plus he was french.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 17:41   #28
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaio
it wouldn't surprise me that this idiot was all set to do an expose on how he managed to get onto an underground train with a rucksack and big jacket just to make the police look even sillier, right up to the point where he was arrested..
Is this a joke? It doesn't sound like one but that's so stupid I think my head just imploded from the destruction of brain cells caused by reading it.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 17:42   #29
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaio
heh,not quite.

Over here the journalists do silly things like plant fake bombs to 'test' security (It's sells papers) and it wouldn't surprise me that this idiot was all set to do an expose on how he managed to get onto an underground train with a rucksack and big jacket just to make the police look even sillier, right up to the point where he was arrested.

Plus he was french.
British journalists are more adventerous than some from other countries, like America. For example, in the Iraq war, the British journalists are in the front line in their 4x4s, saying things like "behind me a few moments ago there were people shooting at each other", and most American journalists are like 30 miles away. Also, with all the hurricane stuff, they're again there, driving out at the last minute (apparently one group hijacked an ABC van or something to broadcast from). I assume there's more of an American presence in the danger zones near hurricanes, but our reporters seem to do a lot more to get their story. I'd say that was silly, but I spend all day online on forums and helping to run Planetarion without being paid, so ...
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 17:44   #30
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
Is this a joke? It doesn't sound like one but that's so stupid I think my head just imploded from the destruction of brain cells caused by reading it.
to be fair it is actually a good point and a real possibility given the depths of modern journalism.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 17:48   #31
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
to be fair it is actually a good point and a real possibility given the depths of modern journalism.
No it's not, it's not even vaguely close to a possibility. Also I don't think it's helpful when we classify journalists working for the guardian as equivalent to those working for the sun and other such diabolical wastes of valuable trees.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 17:50   #32
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
No it's not, it's not even vaguely close to a possibility. Also I don't think it's helpful when we classify journalists working for the guardian as equivalent to those working for the sun and other such diabolical wastes of valuable trees.
journalists write for whoever pays them the most.

journalists free lance articles.

journalists have a special interest in ensuring that 'exciting' things happen to them. so that they have exciting things to write about.

stop dismissing sensible ideas out of hand Irish!
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 17:53   #33
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Re: Britain

The proposed story of "oh look at me I got onto the subway with a rucksack and a big jacket" wouldn't sell a story to a half-mad compulsive-newspaper buying conspiracy theorist who believed that wearing a big jacket while carrying a rucksack makes you the overlord of the sixth circle of hell.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 17:55   #34
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
The proposed story of "oh look at me I got onto the subway with a rucksack and a big jacket" wouldn't sell a story to a half-mad compulsive-newspaper buying conspiracy theorist who believed that wearing a big jacket while carrying a rucksack makes you the overlord of the sixth circle of hell.
quite right.

best make sure you get arrested then.

that way you can sell it to the guardian
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 18:00   #35
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Re: Britain

Grave reservations remain as to the likelihood of such an event considering the incredibly common actions he was performing.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 18:01   #36
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Re: Britain

thank goodness we have independant evidence to corroborate his story
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 18:03   #37
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
The proposed story of "oh look at me I got onto the subway with a rucksack and a big jacket" wouldn't sell a story to a half-mad compulsive-newspaper buying conspiracy theorist who believed that wearing a big jacket while carrying a rucksack makes you the overlord of the sixth circle of hell.
Well, it got him arrested.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 18:05   #38
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
thank goodness we have independant evidence to corroborate his story
Is this sarcasm? Didn't ste point out something similar had happened to someone he knew?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaio
Well, it got him arrested.
Maybe every time in the history of mankind that a journalist has been arrested he's been looking to get arrested so he could write a story on it.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 18:09   #39
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
Is this sarcasm? Didn't ste point out something similar had happened to someone he knew?
I've met ste.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
Maybe every time in the history of mankind that a journalist has been arrested he's been looking to get arrested so he could write a story on it.
I bet the chap made money out of being arrested than if he hadn't been arrested.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 18:09   #40
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
Grave reservations remain as to the likelihood of such an event considering the incredibly common actions he was performing.
Actions very similar to a bunch of young tearaways in July. They were naughty lads.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 18:11   #41
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
I've met ste.
I'm not following.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yahwe
I bet the chap made money out of being arrested than if he hadn't been arrested.
I bet you'll make money if you get hit by a car but that doesn't mean that everyone who gets hit by a car was trying to do so. I tend to suppose innocent until proven guilty


Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaio
Actions very similar to a bunch of young tearaways in July. They were naughty lads.
They were wearing clothes and carrying bags on the tube? The rotters!
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 18:14   #42
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
Is this sarcasm? Didn't ste point out something similar had happened to someone he knew?

Maybe every time in the history of mankind that a journalist has been arrested he's been looking to get arrested so he could write a story on it.
Are you going to suggest it doesn't happen ?
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 18:15   #43
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
I bet you'll make money if you get hit by a car but that doesn't mean that everyone who gets hit by a car was trying to do so. I tend to suppose innocent until proven guilty
let's apply the same standard to the police shall we?
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 18:16   #44
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
I'm not following.

I bet you'll make money if you get hit by a car but that doesn't mean that everyone who gets hit by a car was trying to do so. I tend to suppose innocent until proven guilty


They were wearing clothes and carrying bags on the tube? The rotters!
The bags contained explosives ?

Do you remember that ?
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 18:18   #45
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaio
Are you going to suggest it doesn't happen ?
No. I'm suggesting it's not a safe assumption that it's happening every time.
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Unread 24 Sep 2005, 18:21   #46
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
let's apply the same standard to the police shall we?
I'm not calling for a public beheading here. I'd just like to find out if this is happening more often than the supposed "one-off event".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaio
The bags contained explosives ?

Do you remember that
I'm not opposed to the search. That's a valuable way to save lives and objecting to that would smack of insane libertarianism. What I do object to is the treatment he received afterwards and the idea that he dressed like he did and did all those minor things which must happen fairly often in order to write a story about it.
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Unread 25 Sep 2005, 00:00   #47
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Re: Britain

It's entirely irrelevant whether the story is being exagerrated, or even completely madeup. All thats important is whether the police have the power to do what was described in the article under current laws.
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Unread 25 Sep 2005, 00:09   #48
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodrog
It's entirely irrelevant whether the story is being exagerrated, or even completely madeup. All thats important is whether the police have the power to do what was described in the article under current laws.
oh is it Great All Powerful Lord of the Heavens.

Forgive us I beg of thee!!

Forgive those of us who could not see your divine plan when you just posted a ****ing link with no ****ing comment and a sensationalist thread title.

Forgive us Great God of the Troll
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Unread 25 Sep 2005, 01:54   #49
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Re: Britain

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodrog
It's entirely irrelevant whether the story is being exagerrated, or even completely madeup. All thats important is whether the police have the power to do what was described in the article under current laws.
Um, well they did it.
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Unread 25 Sep 2005, 14:02   #50
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Re: Britain

anyone done a search for David Mery ?

the results are um, startling.....
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