go go go Exilition

[Kargool]

*Note: The following message is personal view only, and is not to be looked upon as a offical alliance statement, nor does anyone in the alliance know I am writing this*

It seems like the PA crew is overeager to close down Exilition's accounts based on accusations about them cheating in the past.

How many times havent we heard of this kind of predjudice in the real world. People get sentenced to jail because they have done a crime in the past so it is easy to assume that they have done it again, without proper investigation this will never be a true and fair way of dealing with cheaters.. If someone on AD was starting to flame an alliance , and the pa crew responding with extremly short leash for thoose involved we wouldnt have a fair game for anyone anymore. Then it would be the whiners and bad players who will get another excuse for yelling at an alliance doing good.

What I want to ask is, is this really how we want PA? Do we really want to judge people just based on that? Now, I've been told about Exilition players getting closed due to them logging in from work, public libraries etc etc etc, I want to inform the PA crew that I have done excactly the same. And there is alot of others who has been doing the same. Does this qualify as cheating?
Now I have been quite clear towards the PA crew about cheating, having galmates checked out.
Now, I dont like cheaters, I dispise them. But if you plan to close down a planet, you should have better proof of it than logging into two IP's from the same city.

In the end, i'd like to voice my word of support to thoose guys from Exilition who has gotten unfairly closed or punished for things they havent done. This whole situation just leaves me with a foul taste in my mouth and the feeling of someone elses game being ruined because of them doing to good for someone.


Good luck for the rest of the round Exilition.

[jerome]

Did you know that Jolt's hesitance to lose income is the reason PATeam have not deleted many exil planets? Ruins your whole ill-knowledged thread doesn't it?

[Squidly]

err....

Can you blame PA-team here? I mean fk... for example, I played about 1/4 a round of another tick-based game with 6 LDK-types(2HC) in my gal ... The entire gal got closed for bug abuse and account sharing. Myself, and a WP'er... Taraka included despite no sharing/bug abuse on our parts.

No offence my old random-trout-slappaging companion, but you're kind of advocating a PA equivelant of: "Let's not keep a police eyeball on the convicted pedophile who now lives across the street from a school"....

One question here... say Exi was doing badly this round... Would the amount of 'MH attention' on them be the same? I think to some degree it would be similar...

[I am Idler]

Originally Posted by Kargool

The following message is personal view only, and is not to be looked upon as a offical alliance statement, nor does anyone in the alliance know I am writing this*

Great, as I am sure most of them disagree entirely with you[/quote]

It seems like the PA crew is overeager to close down Exilition's accounts based on accusations about them cheating in the past.

Not accusations, but facts. FACTS, not accusations, learn the difference.

How many times havent we heard of this kind of predjudice in the real world.

Prejudice against people such as ? Nazi's ? Catholics ? The Virgin Mary ? Please be a bit more spesiefic before making claims on behalf of humanity.

This is a game on the internet People get sentenced to jail because they have done a crime in the past so it is easy to assume that they have done it again, without proper nvestigation this will never be a true and fair way of dealing with cheaters..

People who have commited crimes in the past are easily suspected when there is reason to suspect them, they dont get thrown into prison for being scum.

If someone on AD was starting to flame an alliance , and the pa crew responding with extremly short leash for thoose involved we wouldnt have a fair game for anyone anymore. Then it would be the whiners and bad players who will get another excuse for yelling at an alliance doing good.

Im not quite sure I understand this one.. ?

What I want to ask is, is this really how we want PA? Do we really want to judge people just based on that? Now, I've been told about Exilition players getting closed due to them logging in from work, public libraries etc etc etc, I want to inform the PA crew that I have done excactly the same. And there is alot of others who has been doing the same. Does this qualify as cheating?

I suggest you read up on the roles where it is required that people inform the multihunters if its likely the planet will be logged into from different locations so they wont have to suspect you.
While we are at it, is it only Exil players this have happened to ? Or are the PACrew on a huge bias quest against the cuddly toys of Exil ? (Who have been cought cheating before. Proven, Not accused).

Logging into a bunch of different locations doesnt really warrant as cheating in itself, but it sure does warrant a closer look if its done from the same locations over and over.

Now I have been quite clear towards the PA crew about cheating, having galmates checked out.
Now, I dont like cheaters, I dispise them. But if you plan to close down a planet, you should have better proof of it than logging into two IP's from the same city.

And if you had paid attention you would actually know that closed accounts is NOT based on simply having the same one or two ip's logging in over and over.

[QuteoIn the end, i'd like to voice my word of support to thoose guys from Exilition who has gotten unfairly closed or punished for things they havent done. This whole situation just leaves me with a foul taste in my mouth and the feeling of someone elses game being ruined because of them doing to good for someone.[/quote]

That fould taste in your mouth might be over Exil's shit being shoved down your neck. And the someone elses game part.... well, I am sure you have heard of VNC.

(oh no, as you are completely clueless and have obviously just decided to make a nice post dedicated to Exil simply because your alliance happens to be NAP'ed to them.)

Good luck for the rest of the round Exilition.

Yes, good luck Exil, thanks for bringing cheating en massè to another game on the internet

[Bashar]

Go ask PA Team which alliance 'appears' to be cheating the most. Go and ask PA-Team to port-scan every single PA player when they login, and see if the VNC ports are open, they will tell you that on Exilition, a surprisingly high number of these ports are open. Trouble is, when paying, this can't be used to close them as there are other things that can use those ports. The evidence is therefore circumstantial, and not enough to warrant cheating.

Ask PA team about the activity patterns of Exilition. You will get the same answers: "Very suspiscious but not sufficient to close them".

That is the sum of it, PA-Team KNOW exilition are cheating, they just can't gather sufficient evidence to close them under the user agreement. Add to this also the blatent incompetence of multi-hunters this round (this is not just referring to not closing exilition planets for reasons above, or for saying that use of VNC is not evidence for closing a planet, but also for a lot of the closings they have made on all sides which have been very questionable) and it brings up a rather shitty round from a cheating perspective (thankfully multi-hunters seem to have improved as the round nearly descended into a farce early on).

Simple fact is everybody 'knows' exilition are cheating (take 'knows' however you want, I know but can't prove it, same for everyone else that has spoken to me about it), only people denying it are exilition and their allies. I don't know who they are hoping to convince, or why we bother keeping bringing this up as we know they cheat as does PA-Team, they deny it and nothing can be done because they found an undetectable way of doing it.

[MacTAnzu]

Did you know that Jolt's hesitance to lose income is the reason PATeam have not deleted many exil planets? Ruins your whole ill-knowledged thread doesn't it?

Quoted that from jerome or some1 ?

Well so far for my knowledge there has been only 2 deletes in whole in Exilition they've been 2 romanian guys who works in same place etc. They were deleted for interaction.
So what is the most funniest thing 1up etc. accuses us that we use VNC & some other stuff ? Well haven't seen any proves yet what so ever and I won't be seing them in future either cause there is noone.

And it's COMMONLY known that there is cheaters in 1up too Who've been caught and closed in earlier PA rounds etc.
From my personal view I haven't been closed in any PA round before so far same is all members in exilition i play with when i think fast don't come up with any nick that i've heard to be deleted before.
I have to think 2 secs about 1up and i got already few nicks in my mind

So would you leave investigation etc to MHs and learn to play and not to whine in boards like sore loosers ? =) Stated this once before if 1up would have as much energy/skill to put into the game than they put in forum flaming there would be no one to stop them
And when we got 2 planets deleted in whole round of ~68 members with fast calc that is ~1,36%
and they were with exception just they did brake the rule of interraction too many times and you tell rest +98% are cheaters without any evidence just becouse we are active? Still waiting some proves about "our VNC use" etc. false sh*t.

Sorry my bad english etc. And I really don't usually even bother to read forums but a bit tired of this "exilition uses vnc" sh*t if you would even have that much intel that you would have spy in us then you would know how excactly we do def/att and how active it works and how good we are. Maybe I should invite some of u to play few days in exil so u would understand ? =)

MacTAnzu
Exilition HC

P.S All contest in this reply is my own opinions feel free to flame etc I won't be reading ur replies anyway. So i'm not doing any post "behalf of exilition" etc. That one is yet to come

[Bashar]

Originally Posted by MacTAnzu

So what is the most funniest thing 1up etc. accuses us that we use VNC & some other stuff ? Well haven't seen any proves yet what so ever and I won't be seing them in future either cause there is none.

I fixed the typo (I assume it was a typo anyway - and I am not being picky, it is what I am replying to - correct me if it wasn't a typo).

The reason there is no proof (which is something I agree, there isn't any prrof sufficient enough for closing, especially after multihunters said use of VNC is not proof of cheating) is because you've found a way that can't be proved to the extent necessary.

[Nadar]

Originally Posted by Kargool

*Now, I've been told about Exilition players getting closed due to them logging in from work, public libraries etc etc etc, I want to inform the PA crew that I have done excactly the same.

You should know by now that what you've been told often differs from the truth in PA Cheaters will ofc give you a version that makes them innocent, but what actually happened wasn't too innocent at all. And when peoples who's been closed in past rounds gets closed again, I wouldn't really believe their "innocent" version. I'm not accusing them of cheating and I'm not saying they didn't. Point is that "I've been told..." doesn't count in PA

[Bashar]

MacTAnzu, explain the particularly high proportion of exilition planets that have VNC ports open when port scanned to me.

[MacTAnzu]

Bashar only evidence u got is our activity & skill. Nothing else what reason we would ever have to use any vnc etc if we have 68 hardcore players who are active & tries their best ? and an EXCELLENT DC/BC team to do their job? Why should we cheat? Or is being better than some1 cheating ? Imo some of you should look mirror you ain't no gods or anything there is always someone better than you.

But Bashar gd reply though you don't at least flame like jerome etc.

[jerome]

Like I said then. The reason for not as many deletions are there should be. I have no idea how many there should be, but from the words of a MH, it's been conclusively stated that the reason for the lack of deletions is Jolt's interference, not the lack of evidence and such.

The rest of your post is of no interest as it simply formulates a defence of your alliance based upon the number of deletions occurred so far, which has been rather invalidated I hope by the first paragraph of this post.

[jerome]

Pfft, I haven't flamed, I've only stated what's been said.

[Squidly]

I agree. Exilition does have an incredible amount of activity. Their officers have an extreme amount of talent being able to manage all those windows at once.


In all seriousness however... The degree of skill you claim to have doesn't even enter into it. Whether rank 20+ alliance cheats or rank 1 cheats. Makes no difference =/

[Kal]

I use VNC a lot, am I cheating?

[jerome]

Not all alliances use the simple 'pm def to bc/dc' system so that's hardly a reason tbh.


Also, if their client is like mine, all /msg's go straight to one window and you can open each into a new window if required so that's hardly a valid argument.


Yes I know, I'm supposed to be anti-exil etc, but I've given myself a new role

"jerome` - pioneering forum truth since 2005"


(Pioneering mightn't be exactly the right word though)

[Barrow|Pony]

What the hell does that mean Kal?

[Guran]

1up propaganda machine in it's finest form..

You seriously believe an alliance could pull off the use of vnc with 68 members? I'm assuming here it's some sort of random desktop alike program.

[Buddah]

tsk tsk.

most ppl say: EX cheats so much nobody there is playing by the book etc.
ive never cheated i will never cheat. and i dont think EX has more cheating than other alliance.
i actually think we have less cheating than f.ex 1up. now you will prolly say, dont throw back at us what we throw at you etc, but i wont post nicks at boards, feel free to pm me at irc and discuss it.

I say(known ldk saying)(ps i was never ldk): if you cant beat them delete them

[Barrow|Pony]

Didn't your planet get closed Buddah?

[jerome]

I'm not claiming anything like that Guran.

Frankly, I don't care* whether Exil are cheating or not. I'm much more inclined to be pissed off/worried at Jolt's stance in this.


*as much comparatively

[Gate]

I have to say, I'm impressed with eXilition this round.

If you aren't cheating, your level of activity and commitment is absolutely amazing. To throw out 53 deffleets at a single alliance's attacks, and having galmates that never sleep for more than 2 hours at a time shows huge commitment, enough to deserve a win.

If you are cheating, FOAD ta.

[Kal]

Originally Posted by Barrow|Pony

What the hell does that mean Kal?

that just becuase someone happens to use VNC it does not automatically mean they are cheating, so the MH's can't just go aroudn closing people if they happen to use VNC

[MacTAnzu]

Gate: Yes we are We got active ppl we use loads sms/phone. And i think many ppl still sleeps often more than 2h per time.

[Guran]

Originally Posted by Gate

I have to say, I'm impressed with eXilition this round.

If you aren't cheating, your level of activity and commitment is absolutely amazing. To throw out 53 deffleets at a single alliance's attacks, and having galmates that never sleep for more than 2 hours at a time shows huge commitment, enough to deserve a win.

If you are cheating, FOAD ta.

Our dc's are crazy. They have all our phone numbers and are not afraid to use them several times a night. It's not at all uncommon that I wake up 2-3 times a night to send defence. We actually have specific ppl who does nothing but call people online as silly as that may sound.

[jerome]

Btw, when we say "Exil cheating", we're ofcourse referring to a number of members in the alliance not ALL, I'm 100% certain that I know at least 5 people who don't cheat and play in Exilition, some who are too retarded to understand the concept of VNC-ing, others who are morally strong enough not to. IF they are cheating in PA this round, and let's be frank here, we all KNOW they(ldk and dragons core) have cheated in the past using tools such as Jonni/MrJ's for accountsharing/multi-ing, it'd be limited to the "core" members of the community which had already existed for quite a while.

Please do note that I'm not claiming Exil core are cheating because of their past, I'm actually defending some of your members.

[alch]

Originally Posted by Guran

Our dc's are crazy. They have all our phone numbers and are not afraid to use them several times a night. It's not at all uncommon that I wake up 2-3 times a night to send defence. We actually have specific ppl who does nothing but call people online as silly as that may sound.

Now it sounds like we done in Angels :/

[Alki]

Originally Posted by Guran

Our dc's are crazy. They have all our phone numbers and are not afraid to use them several times a night. It's not at all uncommon that I wake up 2-3 times a night to send defence. We actually have specific ppl who does nothing but call people online as silly as that may sound.

just how we do it tbh

[Guran]

Originally Posted by alch

Now it sounds like we done in Angels :/

I know Irvine is master of calling people but I didn't want Angels to steal the spotlight from Exilition.

[Hude]

http://www2.lut.fi/~huttunen/log.txt

[Alki]

funny log, doesnt show anything though, and logs aint allowed?

Logs are allowed if linked - Lok

[Hude]

Originally Posted by Alki

funny log, doesnt show anything though, and logs aint allowed?

It wasn't meant to show anything, I only find it amusing.

[jerome]

Originally Posted by Yahwe

IRC quotes and logs are never as funny for others as they are to the one who finds them funny. like conversation they are part of a living entity. cut them out of their context and they lose that certain "i don't know what"

[Alki]

yahwe likes men though

[Buddah]

Originally Posted by Barrow|Pony

Didn't your planet get closed Buddah?

nope, never.

ive been in vac mode 2 times thats the closest, wich of 1 i regret, the other time i was really at vac

[xontas]

OK lets make one thing clear at the start
Jolt doesnt control the MH proces
they dont tell us to reopen accounts because they dont want to lose money
(if jolt alowed cheats for money i will leave)
so any reopening in any case (yes i cant talk about specific cases) is done by the MH team
also any overruling is done by me or ph8

if we reopen its because the case is not strong enough or we get a good explination.

some things on why we look at sertain alliances more closely
thats because we always look at the top 10 alliances before the end of round (regardless of if we have suspects)
and when we look at a alliance like that we run every planet in them!

so if you are in the top 10 alliances, you can be sure we look at you!

now on the subject of VNC
VNC alone is no reson to close someone, but it is suspect and will be considered in investigations
on the other hand we cant proof that people use VNC for PA so we do need supporting evidence to prove that.
if we have suspects for VNC usage we watch the planet involved on a daily basis!

now if you get closed and you want to apeal the closure you can always contact me on [email protected]
i will run my own investigation on compair it agains the investigation done by the MH involved
then i will go true all the evidence with the planet involved!
if i think the MH was wrong i will reopen, if he is right the closure will become permanent
and if I was the MH who closed you PH8 (who also replaces me when i am not around) will look at your case.

hopes this makes it more clear for you guys

[_Kila_]

Originally Posted by Kargool

How many times havent we heard of this kind of predjudice in the real world. People get sentenced to jail because they have done a crime in the past so it is easy to assume that they have done it again, without proper investigation this will never be a true and fair way of dealing with cheaters.

Well they cheated in the first place. If you cheat and get caught you become a prime suspect for next time.

Im not going to start moaning/bitching but Ive had a lot of farms in my gal and funnily enough we kept getting raided by EX. Maybe it is because we have a lot of SiN and ND players but it seems like nobody else was hitting the farms.

I know they were farms cos they logged in once a week or so and inited roids and didnt come abck on again for a week or so. I also Mailed them numerous times asking for IRC activity or even a reply but they didnt reply.

/me prepares to be neg repped

[Almeida]

um kila... why didn't u exile those planets?

[Alki]

sounds like concrete evidence

[Forest]

<exil member> Its only cheating if we get caught.

3 people in exilition have now told me that.

Shame pateam wont use logs, cheating twats.

[_Kila_]

we did... we kept exiling them and mroe kept coming. We were unsure about their activity at first but then when we noticed them only initing we exiled them and we kept getting farms. We had around 10 farms we had to exile in total

[Phil^]

forest, you know they cant use logs because they can be forged too easily.
That said - I cannot personally believe that exilition are entirely innocent.
If you dont like them - and multihunters are still gathering evidence on them rather then having closed already - then why not go attack them.
Push their defences to the limit and if they`re cheating they'll eventually slip up and give the mh the evidence they're looking for.
And if they dont slip up - at least youve given them a rather good hammering.

[Almeida]

man Phil^ now u participate in the witchhunting too?

[-=Yggdra=-]

<1up member> with every multihunter beein busy monitoring exil we can cheat as much as we want

34 ppl in 1up have told me that.

[xontas]

and they would be dead wrong :-)
so let them

[Phil^]

I am perfectly entitled to give my opinion

Also - if it is a witchhunt, its not entirely undeserved.

-=yggdra=-, you demonstrated my point about why irc logs arent used as direct evidence perfectly

[Rocko]

If the rest of Excil are as active as the couple of them that I know, then i'm not surprised their doing so well.
Oh and i've got logs of every player in the top 10 addmitting cheeting, and a dozen ot so concerning explicit things i really can't go into in this family fun environment
Now what the MH need, is a number of spies to infiltrate the top 10 alliances to find out from the inside who is cheeting and who isnt,.. or are they doing that already
/me looks around shiflty
not that i have to worry

[xontas]

.........

[JonnyBGood]

That's not exactly a valuable contribution to the thread xontas.

[Forest]

Originally Posted by Phil^

forest, you know they cant use logs because they can be forged too easily.
That said - I cannot personally believe that exilition are entirely innocent.
If you dont like them - and multihunters are still gathering evidence on them rather then having closed already - then why not go attack them.
Push their defences to the limit and if they`re cheating they'll eventually slip up and give the mh the evidence they're looking for.
And if they dont slip up - at least youve given them a rather good hammering.

We sent over 100 fleets at exil planets, and magically, they all started defending when a couple of certain dragon core players woke up. And they gained roids.

[Alki]

dude please explain what this proof entails, u cant say u have proof and nothing more thats just idiotic. I know 5 players in the top10 all of whom i know wouldnt cheat, but i still am interested. If your talkin about top10 alliances then maybe, but top 10 players come on u gotta be joking. Oh and btw who are you?