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Unread 13 Jul 2007, 11:18   #1
All Systems Go
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Philosophical Question

Here we really have a question for the ages:

Is it better to read the 'greatest' works of a philosopher first or do you acquire a better understanding reading the earlierst works to the latest?

To read the best means even if you get bored and move to another topic then you've got the 'best' from the philosopher but then again it can only go downhill from there and the timeline of views can be disjointed.

I found for example, when I did a Woody Allen marathon I watched them in highest rated order (according to IMDB) and they got gradually worse. Also, it didn't really take into account the reinventions he went through from comedy to drama and the such so it may be said that whilst each work by itself can be appreciated, this order makes the whole more difficult to assimilate.

Thoughts?

In this case I think I'm going to be reading Nietzsche.
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Unread 13 Jul 2007, 12:16   #2
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Re: Philosophical Question

Nietzsche's work definitely evolves, but you'd be able to start with Thus Spoke Zarathustra and still see how things developed, as that came slap bang in the middle.

If you wanted to go in the other direction, read Human, All Too Human and The Gay Science before TSZ. The Birth of Tragedy is barely worth reading if you're a Literature student, and Untimely Meditations and Daybreak don't really get much done.
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Unread 13 Jul 2007, 12:26   #3
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Re: Philosophical Question

Acquire a better understanding of what? Philsophy in general? His development as a philosopher? His biography and how it impacted his intellectual outlook? For example no matter what order you read hegel's works in if you didn't come out thinking "woha that guy was a faggot" there's something wrong with you.
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Unread 13 Jul 2007, 14:24   #4
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Re: Philosophical Question

Surely if only for your personal enjoyment, it would be better to not start with the greatest works. Well, in the case of Woody Allen anyway where his career displays not necessarily progression in terms of achievement but changes in his directorial approach and influence - I mean finally he's not just filming in NYC! So you don't end up watching gradually weaker films and wondering why the hell you started in the first place. Why not just watch Gargoyle's Revenge? (classic)

I don't know about this with regard to philosophers though, I generally just study what I'm told and then take it from there. In the case of some, ie Husserl, I think I read the best and was sufficiently baffled and angered to not follow it up. With Nietzsche I worked in no particular order and despite the lack of cohesion it didn't really devalue the material. Plato though, I'd say read the dialogues before the Republic. That springs to mind and sounds sensible.
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Unread 13 Jul 2007, 15:07   #5
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Re: Philosophical Question

Depends on the person and how independent/systematic their works are. Often you arent going to understand the 'best' works if you dont have a good idea about their context and general ideas (in the specific case of Nietzsche, you may struggle to get parts of TSZ if you havent read anything else by/about him, although Nietzsches works are more standalone than a lot of other people's so who knows).

I'd start with TSZ anyway though but if it annoys you then consider going Beyond Good And Evil -> Geneology of Morals -> TSZ

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Unread 13 Jul 2007, 19:31   #6
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Re: Philosophical Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by All Systems Go
I found for example, when I did a Woody Allen marathon I watched them in highest rated order (according to IMDB) and they got gradually worse.
Did you not condition yourself a little bit to expect this?

Reading or recipes or anything you want to classify specifically such as philosophy is found is by a mixture of personal endeavour, recommendation, and chance. That's maybe a generalisation but usually I'd say 2 out of the 3 would influence me to try something new.

A list is too clinical, personally. What was your motivation for your marathon?
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Unread 13 Jul 2007, 20:12   #7
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Re: Philosophical Question

I started Nietzsche with The Antichrist, and liked it. Moved on to Thus Spoke Zarathustra then. I'm very limited to Plato, Hobbes, Nietzsche, and Kant though (started with Critique of Practical reason, which probably was upside down too). Well, I guess if I'm interested in reading something I'll usually start with the book that interests me, and which I get my hands on, without too much thinking.

Quote:
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For example no matter what order you read hegel's works in if you didn't come out thinking "woha that guy was a faggot" there's something wrong with you.
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Unread 13 Jul 2007, 20:31   #8
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Re: Philosophical Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodrog
I'd start with TSZ anyway though but if it annoys you then consider going Beyond Good And Evil -> Geneology of Morals -> TSZ
I'd read BG&E after TSZ, because it's chronologically after and because it's both different and an evolution of the thought of TSZ.
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Unread 13 Jul 2007, 22:23   #9
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Re: Philosophical Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by All Systems Go
Is it better to read the 'greatest' works of a philosopher first or do you acquire a better understanding reading the earlierst works to the latest?
The only sensible answer I can think of is that it depends. On you, the subject matter, why you're doing this, the philosopher in question, etc.

Firstly, I would never try to read all of author x's works without some pressing need unless I had read some of his works and found them to be particularly interesting. Although no-one writes that neatly, I would gravitate towards the book (or series of essays) which discussed that theme in the most detail.

The "spirit" (or image) of what the author is trying to say will develop all the time in your mind because of your own personal development, and later authors you read, etc. And that's sort of the point, I'm not reading Marx because I want to know more about what he thinks (per se) but because some of what he says aids my understanding / thoughts about the world.

Each author is different though so there's no set answer. I can't remember the first Woody Allen movie I ever saw (and it was probably when I too young to appreciate it anyway) but it doesn't matter - I adore some of his other movies and think others are poor.

As for Nietzsche, I'm not a fan so I have no recommendations on which order to read it in but I'd start by asking myself the question - what am I hoping to learn? Why am I doing this?
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Unread 14 Jul 2007, 08:39   #10
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Re: Philosophical Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maladoni
Did you not condition yourself a little bit to expect this?

Reading or recipes or anything you want to classify specifically such as philosophy is found is by a mixture of personal endeavour, recommendation, and chance. That's maybe a generalisation but usually I'd say 2 out of the 3 would influence me to try something new.

A list is too clinical, personally. What was your motivation for your marathon?
To be honest, no. I caught a bit of Manhattan on some channel 4 clip show and having only seen Annie Hall (a year or so ago) I decided to check it out. Ienjoyed it a lot and decided to get the next best film, then the next best and before you know it I was burning down the list at a tremendous speed.And towards the end I thought I might have gotten more out of it seeing them in a chronological order.

There is no marathon with Nietzsche and I probably won't read them all in a row. I'll probably read one of his, then a book by some one else then one of his, then a bookby someone else etc... but this question has got me thinking about experiancing things in a certain way.

Seeing as I was unable to check this thread before I bought a book, I bought Beyond Good and Evil.
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Unread 14 Jul 2007, 18:40   #11
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Re: Philosophical Question

I think it depends on what you're trying to accomplish for yourself by reading. If you're looking to broaden your scopes, read it all, if you're looking for an answer or opinion to a question, then well you get the idea.

Bottom line: Do what's best for you.
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