User Name
Password

Go Back   Planetarion Forums > Planetarion Related Forums > Planetarion Suggestions

Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
Unread 9 Nov 2009, 17:50   #1
carld
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 21
carld is on a distinguished road
Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Something that doesn't make a lot of sense to me is how an attacker's Dists are able to function so well on their fleet that is so far from home. I think the overall effectiveness of someone's dists should weaken the further their fleet is from home. So as the Attacker, for the first few ticks they will still get the big advantage of masking what was sent and the defender would still not be able to provide valuable information to their Alliance. But as each tick passes and the Attacker's fleet gets farther away from their Dists, the defender's Amps are able to have a higher probability of success.

Overall, if the Attacker still build 100+ dists and the defender only has like 10 amps, they'll never be able to get through, but if the defender has 90 amps, and the attacker has 100 dists, at some point the defender would be able to successfully do an Incoming scan.
carld is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Nov 2009, 01:44   #2
MrLobster
Commander in Briefs!
 
MrLobster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 783
MrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud of
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Yeah so if a fleet has a max eta of 12 and the fleet is 6 ticks away from the target dists have 50% actual strength, so the player with 20 dists has 10 effective at eta 6.

Not too bad an idea.
__________________
<Kila> WHAT HAVE YOU DONE WITH MY PRECIOUS FORUMS
<Zeyi> 24h forum closure
<Zeyi> all posts recalled

"he's got a proven track record when it comes to showy art composition" - Tommy

<Sigi> Light: can I ask u how many open internet-windows u always have?
<MrLobster|PM> i have 2, the pa page, and the website for naked light pictures
<Ave> both has bad gfx
MrLobster is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Nov 2009, 01:48   #3
carld
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 21
carld is on a distinguished road
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Yeah, pretty much something along those lines. Albeit the degradation wouldn't necessarily have to be linear or anything
carld is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Nov 2009, 02:36   #4
t3k
The Video Guy
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,279
t3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

What about somebody who has 37 distorters, at eta 3 (after starting with eta 11). How would the maths work there?
__________________
Writing lists and taking names.
t3k is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Nov 2009, 05:34   #5
MrLobster
Commander in Briefs!
 
MrLobster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 783
MrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud of
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Round up to 10 (from 9.99) or down depends on PA policy

EffectiveDists = Dists * (CurrentETA / MaxEta)

ED = 37 * (3/11)

ED = 37 * 0.27

ED = 9.99 > 10
__________________
<Kila> WHAT HAVE YOU DONE WITH MY PRECIOUS FORUMS
<Zeyi> 24h forum closure
<Zeyi> all posts recalled

"he's got a proven track record when it comes to showy art composition" - Tommy

<Sigi> Light: can I ask u how many open internet-windows u always have?
<MrLobster|PM> i have 2, the pa page, and the website for naked light pictures
<Ave> both has bad gfx

Last edited by MrLobster; 10 Nov 2009 at 05:40.
MrLobster is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Nov 2009, 05:37   #6
MrLobster
Commander in Briefs!
 
MrLobster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 783
MrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud ofMrLobster has much to be proud of
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Quote:
Originally Posted by carld View Post
Yeah, pretty much something along those lines. Albeit the degradation wouldn't necessarily have to be linear or anything
tbh I think my degradation is ok, as anyone at the home planet can look out a portal at eta 1 and see the ships outside. So dists are redundant then.
__________________
<Kila> WHAT HAVE YOU DONE WITH MY PRECIOUS FORUMS
<Zeyi> 24h forum closure
<Zeyi> all posts recalled

"he's got a proven track record when it comes to showy art composition" - Tommy

<Sigi> Light: can I ask u how many open internet-windows u always have?
<MrLobster|PM> i have 2, the pa page, and the website for naked light pictures
<Ave> both has bad gfx
MrLobster is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Nov 2009, 08:10   #7
Gabriel
Gabba gabba hey hey
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 212
Gabriel has a spectacular aura aboutGabriel has a spectacular aura aboutGabriel has a spectacular aura about
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrLobster View Post
tbh I think my degradation is ok, as anyone at the home planet can look out a portal at eta 1 and see the ships outside. So dists are redundant then.
I disagree, a linear degredation is not the way to go with this imo
Gabriel is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Nov 2009, 08:18   #8
Mzyxptlk
mz.
Alien Invasion Champion, Submarine Champion, Tiger Punch Champion, Barts Watersports Adventure Champion
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,587
Mzyxptlk has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Mzyxptlk has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Mzyxptlk has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Mzyxptlk has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Mzyxptlk has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Mzyxptlk has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Mzyxptlk has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Mzyxptlk has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Mzyxptlk has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Mzyxptlk has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.Mzyxptlk has ascended to a higher existance and no longer needs rep points to prove the size of his e-penis.
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Renders fake near useless. No.
__________________
The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
Mzyxptlk is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Nov 2009, 09:09   #9
rUl3r
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 296
rUl3r has a spectacular aura aboutrUl3r has a spectacular aura about
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrLobster View Post
tbh I think my degradation is ok, as anyone at the home planet can look out a portal at eta 1 and see the ships outside. So dists are redundant then.
Doesnīt adress a large concern I had in mind.
If itīs xan attacking, looking out of the window still shows you the pods only, since their combat ships have no need to decloak unless there are any hostile ships to engage.
As mz said, it renders fakes pretty useless. While this might be a "minor" disadvantage for most races (I think itīs a major disadvantage in general), itīs horrific for xans.

In the end, your suggestion would make building dists even more useless than it is now. They hold rather little strategic value anyway, since youīll almost always find a scanner who can scan even the biggest distwhores, you lack FCs/mines if you build mass distorters, leading to reduced income. One of the most funny examples about how useless dists are is Hardcore, the only guy I couldnīt scan last round (with 147 amps). I ended up higher in score and value. If you reduce the effect of distorters, thereīs no point in building them. Anyone half-decent gets like 20-30 amps during the round, which would make it completely impossible to block incoming scans.
rUl3r is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 10 Nov 2009, 10:30   #10
Linkie
fanboy
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Trondheim, Norway
Posts: 492
Linkie is a splendid one to beholdLinkie is a splendid one to beholdLinkie is a splendid one to beholdLinkie is a splendid one to beholdLinkie is a splendid one to beholdLinkie is a splendid one to behold
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Quote:
Originally Posted by carld View Post
Something that doesn't make a lot of sense to me is how an attacker's Dists are able to function so well on their fleet that is so far from home. I think the overall effectiveness of someone's dists should weaken the further their fleet is from home. So as the Attacker, for the first few ticks they will still get the big advantage of masking what was sent and the defender would still not be able to provide valuable information to their Alliance. But as each tick passes and the Attacker's fleet gets farther away from their Dists, the defender's Amps are able to have a higher probability of success.

Overall, if the Attacker still build 100+ dists and the defender only has like 10 amps, they'll never be able to get through, but if the defender has 90 amps, and the attacker has 100 dists, at some point the defender would be able to successfully do an Incoming scan.
Something that doesn't make a lot of sense to me is how there's MOTHER****ING SHIPS moving through MOTHER****ING SPACE.
__________________
Ascendancy, former [1UP] & Ministry.

FOUNDER OF THE OFFICIAL ASCENDANCY LADY GAGA FAN CLUB

ASCENDANCY DEMOLITION MAN
Linkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11 Nov 2009, 00:27   #11
M0RPH3US
idle
 
M0RPH3US's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Germany
Posts: 968
M0RPH3US is just really niceM0RPH3US is just really niceM0RPH3US is just really niceM0RPH3US is just really niceM0RPH3US is just really nice
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Quote:
Originally Posted by rUl3r View Post
Doesnīt adress a large concern I had in mind.
If itīs xan attacking, looking out of the window still shows you the pods only, since their combat ships have no need to decloak unless there are any hostile ships to engage.
As mz said, it renders fakes pretty useless. While this might be a "minor" disadvantage for most races (I think itīs a major disadvantage in general), itīs horrific for xans.

In the end, your suggestion would make building dists even more useless than it is now. They hold rather little strategic value anyway, since youīll almost always find a scanner who can scan even the biggest distwhores, you lack FCs/mines if you build mass distorters, leading to reduced income. One of the most funny examples about how useless dists are is Hardcore, the only guy I couldnīt scan last round (with 147 amps). I ended up higher in score and value. If you reduce the effect of distorters, thereīs no point in building them. Anyone half-decent gets like 20-30 amps during the round, which would make it completely impossible to block incoming scans.

well said
__________________
m0rph3us formerly known as Bugz

"Itīs not about how hard u hit, its about how hard u can get hit and still keep moving forward! How much u can take and still move forward!"
M0RPH3US is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 11 Nov 2009, 03:59   #12
Monroe
Planetarion Forum Moderator
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,289
Monroe has much to be proud ofMonroe has much to be proud ofMonroe has much to be proud ofMonroe has much to be proud ofMonroe has much to be proud ofMonroe has much to be proud ofMonroe has much to be proud ofMonroe has much to be proud ofMonroe has much to be proud of
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

In my opinion this is a solution without a problem.
__________________
Romans 10:9-10

#strategy
Monroe is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 12 Nov 2009, 23:35   #13
Machado
Seraphim
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 196
Machado is a jewel in the roughMachado is a jewel in the roughMachado is a jewel in the roughMachado is a jewel in the rough
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Seriously, look out of a window into space?

Do you have any idea how incredibly hard it is to spot objects in space with the eye, or even cameras? You probably wouldn't be able to see each other until you're 300m apart, and try getting intel then. Realism has very little to do with that :P
__________________
Seraphim
Machado is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 13 Nov 2009, 00:41   #14
Light
You've Seen The Light
Speed Cards Champion
 
Light's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,152
Light has a reputation beyond reputeLight has a reputation beyond reputeLight has a reputation beyond reputeLight has a reputation beyond reputeLight has a reputation beyond reputeLight has a reputation beyond reputeLight has a reputation beyond reputeLight has a reputation beyond reputeLight has a reputation beyond reputeLight has a reputation beyond reputeLight has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

In reality, spaceships wont have big lights on the front of them
__________________
First shalt thou take out the Holy Pin. Then shalt thou count to three, no more, no less. Three shall be the number thou shalt count, and the number of the counting shall be three. Four shalt thou not count, neither count thou two, excepting that thou then proceed to three. Five is right out. Once the number three, being the third number, be reached, then lobbest thou thy Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch towards thy foe, who, being naughty in my sight, shall snuff it.
Light is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 13 Nov 2009, 10:09   #15
t3k
The Video Guy
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,279
t3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond reputet3k has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Quote:
Originally Posted by Light View Post
In reality, spaceships wont have big lights on the front of them
What about brake lights?
__________________
Writing lists and taking names.
t3k is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 13 Nov 2009, 11:04   #16
rUl3r
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 296
rUl3r has a spectacular aura aboutrUl3r has a spectacular aura about
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny View Post
What about brake lights?
You wonīt see those until it is too late :P
rUl3r is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 13 Nov 2009, 13:01   #17
Gio2k
Bolivian Alpaca
 
Gio2k's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 912
Gio2k has a reputation beyond reputeGio2k has a reputation beyond reputeGio2k has a reputation beyond reputeGio2k has a reputation beyond reputeGio2k has a reputation beyond reputeGio2k has a reputation beyond reputeGio2k has a reputation beyond reputeGio2k has a reputation beyond reputeGio2k has a reputation beyond reputeGio2k has a reputation beyond reputeGio2k has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Going by the same logic, no scanner should get through on your planet given that you have over 150 * (1/7) distorters :P. Blind landing ftw!
__________________
"I throw myself into the sea, release the wave, let it wash over me ..."
MadCowS - Angels - eXilition - Destiny - Wolfpack - Jenova - p3nguins
Gio2k is offline   Reply With Quote
Unread 13 Nov 2009, 15:16   #18
rUl3r
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 296
rUl3r has a spectacular aura aboutrUl3r has a spectacular aura about
Re: Incoming Scans - Amps vs Dists

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gio2k View Post
Going by the same logic, no scanner should get through on your planet given that you have over 150 * (1/7) distorters :P. Blind landing ftw!
To quote Monroe: "In my opinion this is a solution without a problem."

After your post I start thinking this is a solution that only causes problems.
rUl3r is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 13:31.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright Đ2002 - 2018