Powah blocking

[logbat]

Originally posted by Zh|l
So the formation of VoM was to do what exactly? It was a block formation - there was no other blocks around at the time, not even in negotiation. The closest was Ely/WP that everyone believed would remain together.

Regardless, are you really surprised NaR are hitting VoM when VoM kept on calling them hostile preround and generally giving NaR no option but to fight VoM?

VoM has hardly seen any real big joint military campaign against them from WEET and NaR forces.

aint ely and wp considerd an block?
just those together have the membersize that VoM had for starters.

We said 3 blocks all along zhil.

when two blocks fight together to fight 1 block its joined,and you guys have shared arbiter info aswell as intel!

[Treveler]

Originally posted by Zh|l
So the formation of VoM was to do what exactly? It was a block formation - there was no other blocks around at the time, not even in negotiation.

hehe, yeah I believe that

VoM was made without any discussion with any other alliances right ?

[KeyStroke]

Originally posted by K-W
How you play is important. You must play within the rules and within the spirit of the game. But wanting to win is the basic reason that a game exists. Without fair play(as in rules and spirit, not making sure everyone is equally strong), you have a bad game. Without competition between people you have no game.

Lol, empathy eh? I agree fully. If people could realize that we are all normal human beings this good vs evil garbage would stop.

Erm. The big problem with your golden rule is this. PA is a war game. you have to take roids from other people and try not to have roids taken from you. I cant imagine the game would benefit if everyone tried to get roided as much as they roid. I know this isnt exactly what you mean, but recognize that competition demands that you best your opponants.

You should think that competition between the alliances should be enough to have a fun game. Of course its a war game where everyone want to win their battles. Every alliance want theirs to be a good one and evolve, improve. However blocking up so the over half the universe end up being exlcluded as targets and the rest get bashed to dust over and over again doesnt make much sense imho. Sheer brute force by numbers doesnt give any recognization for skillfull playing. It doesnt make members of your alliance stand out being experienced or skillfull either. Its not skillfull to overpower someone so totaly that there is no chance or will of fighting back.

I think we'we all been through this before. Eventually (this round faster than previous ones) one side get the majority of the roids in the game. Then leer smug at the rest telling them to team up to make the game fun again etc. So they get some competition.

[Psi_K]

It simply breaks down to this.
WEENAR HC's are cowards, they were too afraid to lose a round fairly, so they blocked and caused this.
Now, I know a few of their HC's are silently opposed to what's currently happening, but they know if they try any actions alone, they'll be dropped from both Nar and Weet and distroyed in turn.
You must realize however, that there are HC's that would be willing to turn this into a fair(er) fight (certainly not Eclipse HC, they're only in this to win; (annoyance++; )).
Any alliance, or group of alliances that break from WEENAR would be highly respected from the whole community, but does this mean anything to them? That's yet to be seen.

If you're opposed to me calling you cowards, PROVE ME WRONG. (Eclipse HC need not reply, we know what you're gonna say)

[ginjas]

1 [TeamPies] Slaves 2 [SeX] 48:4 12.545.000 NaR/SweeT

2 [C19] Optical Illusion[se7en] 19:7 10.687.000 NaR/SweeT

3The Phoenix Legion [!] 21:1 10.274.000 NaR/SweeT

4 TheUnderTakers [C30] 30:9 9.257.000 NaR/SweeT

5Roids R(nt) Us 26:4 9.007.000 NaR/SweeT

6[se7en] The Plagues 13:7 8.974.000 NaR/SweeT

7 Wings of Destiny 2:9 8.908.000 NaR/SweeT

8 come on, we are bored .... 47:5 8.769.000 NaR/SweeT

9 Egyptian Gods & Goddesses 40:9 8.767.000 NaR/SweeT

10Hakunamatata [TWO] 9:2 8.724.000 NaR/SweeT

By NaR/SweeT i mean the block side...some ministry and others around....

is this elucidative enough ?
and dont ask me about top 20/50...it get scary...like hummm...3 maybe 6 gals from VoM in entire top 50/100.-.....NICE!!!

"whos talking of overpower ?"

[K-W]

Originally posted by ginjas
1 [TeamPies] Slaves 2 [SeX] 48:4 12.545.000 NaR/SweeT

2 [C19] Optical Illusion[se7en] 19:7 10.687.000 NaR/SweeT

3The Phoenix Legion [!] 21:1 10.274.000 NaR/SweeT

4 TheUnderTakers [C30] 30:9 9.257.000 NaR/SweeT

5Roids R(nt) Us 26:4 9.007.000 NaR/SweeT

6[se7en] The Plagues 13:7 8.974.000 NaR/SweeT

7 Wings of Destiny 2:9 8.908.000 NaR/SweeT

8 come on, we are bored .... 47:5 8.769.000 NaR/SweeT

9 Egyptian Gods & Goddesses 40:9 8.767.000 NaR/SweeT

10Hakunamatata [TWO] 9:2 8.724.000 NaR/SweeT

By NaR/SweeT i mean the block side...some ministry and others around....

is this elucidative enough ?
and dont ask me about top 20/50...it get scary...like hummm...3 maybe 6 gals from VoM in entire top 50/100.-.....NICE!!!

"whos talking of overpower ?"

Just for the sake of argument, in the first week of rd 6, FLTV dominated the top 10.

[K-W]

Originally posted by Psi_K
It simply breaks down to this.
WEENAR HC's are cowards, they were too afraid to lose a round fairly, so they blocked and caused this.
Now, I know a few of their HC's are silently opposed to what's currently happening, but they know if they try any actions alone, they'll be dropped from both Nar and Weet and distroyed in turn.
You must realize however, that there are HC's that would be willing to turn this into a fair(er) fight (certainly not Eclipse HC, they're only in this to win; (annoyance++; )).
Any alliance, or group of alliances that break from WEENAR would be highly respected from the whole community, but does this mean anything to them? That's yet to be seen.

If you're opposed to me calling you cowards, PROVE ME WRONG. (Eclipse HC need not reply, we know what you're gonna say)

It simply breaks down to this. Despite pretty much everyone explaining to you very clearly how this happened, you persist in believing a fantasy that not only isnt true, but really doesnt make sense.

You calling anyone a coward means jack squat. Youve yet to post a single thing that makes any sense. Or explain exactly how anyone is a coward. You can call names like a 5 yr old. It doesnt change the fact that anyone with half a brain knows better.

If you would find some sense in your ramblings, maybe we could discuss things. I think that the nar weet nap was excessive. But its hardly Weet's fault that Nar felt the need to also attack vom, nor is it weets fault that they saw vom as their main competitors. Things dont work the way you think they work. There is not some evil conspiricy. Weet/Nar is 7+ alliances, all acting on their own. Your odd concept that all thier actions are dictated by one alliance is just plain silly. Weet aimed at vom, Nar aimed at vom, wala, vom is getting ganged up on. It really isnt any more complicated than that.

And we are just past week 1 of this game, so any argument that things should have been changed are stupid. Its been a week. Anyone arguing stagnation or cowardice because of that has done so prematurely and shown thier hand as either a propagandist or overemotional. We are now closer to, but not yet at the point many people were claiming we past a week ago ago.

[KeyStroke]

Originally posted by K-W
Just for the sake of argument, in the first week of rd 6, FLTV dominated the top 10.

Just for the sake of argument, how many players in R6 compared to this round?

rest my case ;-)

[K-W]

Originally posted by KeyStroke
Just for the sake of argument, how many players in R6 compared to this round?

rest my case ;-)

My point was simply that the top ten gals dont indicate anything in particular regarding the universe as a whole. Ginjas implied that because there are no vom in the top ten, that is an indication of the nature of the universe. If that were true, than FLTV should have kicked ass in the beginning of rd 6. Just disproving his point, not drawing anymore parralllels.

[Hardin]

Originally posted by K-W

Since I never said it wasnt excessive, im not sure what progress you think is being made.

The reason to not end the nap with Nar now, is because it makes no difference. The nap means nothing really.

What you should be doing is trying to convince weet or nar that whatever thier motivation for targetting vom is satisfied and they should move on. THe nap is really nothing at this point and making it your focus doesnt help your cause.

Okay NaR HC - ur nap with WEET means nothing now.

They acknowledge that NARSWEET is excessive for killing VOM!

They have said that they will hit u as soon as VOM is dead!

Do you really wanna wait until then or do you want to fight the war on your terms?

If you do then you don't have much time b4 WEET will be turning its fleets on you!

[Hardin]

Originally posted by K-W
It simply breaks down to this. Despite pretty much everyone explaining to you very clearly how this happened, you persist in believing a fantasy that not only isnt true, but really doesnt make sense.

Okay the fantasy that NARSWEET is simply excessive? The fact that as soon as NARSWEET has killed VOM then WEET will try and kill NaR? You and your colleague have already admitted as much on these boards!

You calling anyone a coward means jack squat. Youve yet to post a single thing that makes any sense. Or explain exactly how anyone is a coward. You can call names like a 5 yr old. It doesnt change the fact that anyone with half a brain knows better. If you would find some sense in your ramblings, maybe we could discuss things.

Oh my...PSI's post made perfect sense to many people on these boards. The longer NARSWEET coalition exists the more you and NaR HC will be seen as cowards! Your leeter than thou attitude is really sad particularly as u persist in calling anyone who disagrees with u or has a different view of PA history than ur biased one a 'liar'

I think that the nar weet nap was excessive. But its hardly Weet's fault that Nar felt the need to also attack vom, nor is it weets fault that they saw vom as their main competitors. Things dont work the way you think they work. There is not some evil conspiricy. Weet/Nar is 7+ alliances, all acting on their own. Your odd concept that all thier actions are dictated by one alliance is just plain silly. Weet aimed at vom, Nar aimed at vom, wala, vom is getting ganged up on. It really isnt any more complicated than that.

All acting on their own? Are u r sure ur board propoganda about 'evhul' VOM and whatever you said in your private negotiations with NaR had no influence?

And we are just past week 1 of this game, so any argument that things should have been changed are stupid. Its been a week. Anyone arguing stagnation or cowardice because of that has done so prematurely and shown thier hand as either a propagandist or overemotional. We are now closer to, but not yet at the point many people were claiming we past a week ago ago.

And also closer to the point when you can dispense with NaR's (and the other alliances making up excessive NARSWEET) services!

Get the hint NaR! You're gonna be next.

Unless you make the jump soon this is gonna be the most stagnated and one sided round in history!

[K-W]

Originally posted by Hardin
Okay the fantasy that NARSWEET is simply excessive? The fact that as soon as NARSWEET has killed VOM then WEET will try and kill NaR? You and your colleague have already admitted as much on these boards!

No the fantasy that this is all the actions of a few HC, and not simply the actions of many many people in response to a round. I think you stilll need to brush up on your reading skill Hardin, either that or stop jumping to conclusions that the facts dont warrant.

Originally posted by Hardin


Oh my...PSI's post made perfect sense to many people on these boards. The longer NARSWEET coalition exists the more you and NaR HC will be seen as cowards! Your leeter than thou attitude is really sad particularly as u persist in calling anyone who disagrees with u or has a different view of PA history than ur biased one a 'liar'

Well, im sorry if non-sensical things make sense to you. I dont care if stupid people see me as a coward, I never had. That is the problem of the morons who see things horribly wrong. Cowerdice and bravery have fck all to do with an online browser based game. And certainly nothing to do with this situation. As I asked psi, pls explain to us poor people who actually think about things how cowardice is involved instead of parading the word around like so many propagandists of PA past.

Its not a view or history. Its simple facts. Fury never dropped ally after ally and roided them. YOu made that claim and have not at any point explained when it happened. Ive tried to explain to you what really happened in the few cases that I think might be spawning your silly claim.

You getting facts wrong does not mean I have a leeter than thout attitude. The fact that you say things that arent true does make what you say a lie.

You have had more than enough chances to justify your claimse and you have failed to do so. Put up or shut up, and dont criticise me because I point out that your facts are wrong as if that makes me a bad guy.

Originally posted by Hardin


All acting on their own? Are u r sure ur board propoganda about 'evhul' VOM and whatever you said in your private negotiations with NaR had no influence?

Last time I checked no one in Eclipse HC had mental control over anyone else in PA. Now I can check again if you like. Im not sure why you think influence means they werent acting on thier own.

As I said before if you think Petru and Dingo are too niave and stupid to run alliances, and are just being led around by others, take it up with them. They were free to make thier own decisions. Nar has some of the most exeperienced alliance leaders in planetarion.

Originally posted by Hardin


And also closer to the point when you can dispense with NaR's (and the other alliances making up excessive NARSWEET) services!

Services? What in the heck are you talking about. Why do you insist on being delusional. Nar is in full control of thier actions. They are not being used by anyone. I think you owe NAr leaders a huge apology, you have done nothing but imply that they are stupid, spineless puppets. I think both they and thier alliances might take issue with that.

Originally posted by Hardin

Get the hint NaR! You're gonna be next.

Unless you make the jump soon this is gonna be the most stagnated and one sided round in history!

News scans arent even out yet, and youve already seen a majority of the round. Will the vom pyschics ever cease to amaze.

We could make the jump in 2 months and the round would still be less one sided and stagnated than rd 3. Its been a little over a week Hardin. Im amazed that so few people playing this game seem to know how long a day is.

[Cothaniel]

K-W, how would you like to be defeated? By skill or by sheer numbers?

If you want to be defeated by skill rather than sheer numbers, you should strive todefeat your enemy with skill rather than sheer numbers. This is mature and good sportsmanship.

I for one would prefer to be defeated by a clever oponent, not just anyone and his 10 friends. In analogy, I would like to win because of my skill, any other victory would feel hollow.

[Psi_K]

Originally posted by Cothaniel
K-W, how would you like to be defeated? By skill or by sheer numbers?

If you want to be defeated by skill rather than sheer numbers, you should strive todefeat your enemy with skill rather than sheer numbers. This is mature and good sportsmanship.

I for one would prefer to be defeated by a clever oponent, not just anyone and his 10 friends. In analogy, I would like to win because of my skill, any other victory would feel hollow.

He doesn't care how he wins, he's already made that perfectly clear.
His (and his alliance's) only goal is to win, at all costs.

[RexDrax]

Originally posted by K-W
No the fantasy that this is all the actions of a few HC, and not simply the actions of many many people in response to a round. I think you stilll need to brush up on your reading skill Hardin, either that or stop jumping to conclusions that the facts dont warrant.

I am not sure whether I should be happy or not. On the one side eclipse is trying very hard to shed its Fury-past and look honourable. On the other side in doing so for the next 2-3 months they are literally going to be seeing the deletion of about 500 planets, ie VVOMM might just leave since no point in being bashed for the next few weeks especially once news scans come out and you guys hunt down our fleets.

Not sure which way to go... ? Its in intresting dilemma.

[Hardin]

Originally posted by K-W

Its not a view or history. Its simple facts. Fury never dropped ally after ally and roided them. YOu made that claim and have not at any point explained when it happened. Ive tried to explain to you what really happened in the few cases that I think might be spawning your silly claim.

I had actually prepared a long reply to this but my computer crashed just as I was posting it and I cba to do it all again...

I see you are playing with words again. It is probably my own fault for describing the members of WTFVE and FFLVTT as your allies......but I hadn't counted on you being that pedantic!

I should have said 'coalition partners' as you have decided to be pedantic about who was actually an ally and who was just NAP'd.

I think the members of NARSWEET who are not actually 'allied' to Eclipse shud take careful note of that pedanticism as it will come back and bite them in the ass.

===========================================

A few quick points...

1) Was Fury part of 'coalitions' that unnecessarily overkilled their enemies in R5 & R7 leading to stagnation?

YES...WTFVE & FFLVTT

2) Did Fury end up fighting the former 'members' of these coalitions in one-sided wars once the original enemy was dead?

YES...please note...I already know all your crappy justifications for this (i.e. ending stagnation, Titans plots etc.) so don't trot them all out again! Both these situations were manipulated in your favour to make sure there was no real threat to your own dominance! Just as you will try and manipulate the situation with NARSWEET

3) Was R5 and R7 the most stagnated and boring rounds in PA history?

YES...

4) Will Eclipse and WEET end up fighting its former partners in the excessive NARSWEET coalition (on WEET's terms and timing) once they are satisfied VOM is dead?

PROBABLY...unless NaR and co. have the guts to take that decision out of WEET's hands!

5) Is R9 heading down the same crappy route as R7 & R9?

YES...unless someone in NARSWEET does something about it before VOM is dead!

[Zh|l]

Originally posted by logbat
aint ely and wp considerd an block?
just those together have the membersize that VoM had for starters.

We said 3 blocks all along zhil.

when two blocks fight together to fight 1 block its joined,and you guys have shared arbiter info aswell as intel!

Oh dear god, we do?

The closest round this one can be compared to is round 6 - the WEET/NAR cooperation is nothing like the WTF/VE cooperation and there is no previous history that links the alliances to eachother.

When your block pushed NaR further and further away they had no choice but to hit you. Its not us that wanted to hit NaR, they know very well we want to hit VoM. Since VoM wanted to hit NaR isn't it a logical political conclusion to help eliminate that immediate threat?

I sometimes wonder if there is any decent politics in this game left or rather people that can actually understand them.

[Hardin]

Zh|l,

I think many people in VOM knew (then and now) that the private gal tactic probably didn't make us the most likely friends of NaR.

However I am sure as a HC of WEET you more than welcomed this and certainly did nothing to discourage NaR falling into your arms (To be fair u had no reason not to!)

However you should have realised by now that NARSWEET is massively excessive to the task of destroying VOM...so why dont you do something about it?

Have NaR gals got protection in your arbiters? Then cancel it!

Are you sharing targetting information with NaR and dividing up targets? Then stop it!

Are you sharing HC channels and defence? Then end it!

As you and KW have pointed out NaR may still go on hitting VOM targets and WEET may go on hitting us too...but it would provide a little breathing space the coordination ended!

And who knows what else might result?

I know u want VOM dead but do you really want to do it at the expense of stagnating the game within a matter of weeks? Is that all you are really focused on? Surely your own members want at least a bit of a fight!

[K-W]

Cothaniel
Of course id like to fight a close fun war and win that. THat has always been the goal of every alliance ive been in. *GASP* Then why didnt it happen???? Because this isnt a scripted movie Cothaniel, this isnt an ideal world. Events arent a result of some omnipotent conciousness. They are a result of many small decisions made by many people sometimes it comes out how youd like it, sometimes it doesnt. Its no ones concious decision which is the case.

Psi_k
Seek help. One can only hope you are more rational and less paranoid/dillusional in real life.

RexDrax
Eclipse isnt trying to shed anything. Eclipse isnt Fury, its simply not. And the thing is, its Fury past is not something it actually has. Its a stupid public perception by people who have no clue what they are talking about and either chose to be spiteful towards those who roided them/did better than them, or bought into rounds of silly garbage posted on these forums. Fury was a normal alliance that acted the same way as other alliances. It just did so with a great command and a great membership. Eclipse is an entirely different alliance that is making its own way through the round as a normal alliance.

Any mystical connotations you attach to either alliance are your own mental constructs. I suggest you see Psi_k's psychologist if you are unable to come to terms with that.

As far as 500 planets deleting. If you really are that much a bunch of sore losers than I pity you. Take a beating like so many have done before you. We are just over a week into the round, we arent stagnated yet. Im sorry that you all have WAY overactive imaginations and already think the round has gone 2 months of stagnation.

[K-W]

Originally posted by Hardin
snip [/i]

Hardin

Your quick points:
1&2) No. I asked you to do this in PM, why you are making me give a history lesson in the thread I do not understand.

R5 Fury was part of a block that won with too much ease because its competitor didnt perform anywhere near what was to be expected based on past performance. Nos, Cell, Xan were all superstars of rd 4. No one in our block had any clue that they would fall apart so dramatically. We created a block to battle the superstars, and found ourselves in a position that we liked no more than anyone else. We did not try to overkill. We did not like overkilling.

After much stagnation, the universe and our members were dying of boredom. Elysium was, of the block an alliance we were not closely allied to. They were the #3 alliance in the universe, so we thought we could stop stagnation. (remember if we stagnate we are evil, but if we backstab we are evil, catch-22's are fun) We turned on one ally. We did it with VERY clear motives.

Rd7 Overkill? Are you silly? Wenx and FLTV were actuallly well matched blocks. Wenx butchered thier side on the tactical end, choosing to ignore attacks on thier smaller members and protect thier top gals at all costs. That said the war still lasted for a long time and had its share of backs and forths at the start. But ALL wars in PA end with one side taking control, its the nature of asteriods. FLTV was certainly not excessive. Where do you come up with these things?

Fury never backstabbed any of our allies. We made proposals to the block to have a mutually agreed upon war to end stagnation. Those proposals were rejected by multiple members of the block who wanted to just sit in stagnation and finish the round, or wanted to drop off members of the block and roid them. We STOPPED this. We almost ended up at war in the consortium incident in no small part because we didnt want to allow allies to be selectively cut from the block to be roided. We had a dispute with Titans, that according to all HC in the block was a very valid one. They refused to treat us in a way that we saw as proper for an ally. I might add that no one ive talked to since, including some titans disagree that our greivence was justified. Facing a non-friendly reaction from our allies, who threatned to use force against us if we tried to enforce our own rules, we concluded that they had broken our alliance and thus we went to war with them. Thier size had nothing to do with it. IT was completely about the situation. Before the incident we counted Titans among our closest allies and were aiming to stick with them for the longer run. Once again, this was the only alliance we touched.

So your basing your opinion that it was Fury tactics to purposely stagnate and then roid small allies based on only 2 incidents where it niether purposely stagnated nor attacked allies for roids.

YES...please note...I already know all your crappy justifications for this (i.e. ending stagnation, Titans plots etc.) so don't trot them all out again! Both these situations were manipulated in your favour to make sure there was no real threat to your own dominance! Just as you will try and manipulate the situation with NARSWEET

Why am I not allowed to "trot" the truth out? You are allowed to trot your lies out. That doesnt seem very sporting, does it? We didnt manipulate anything. We didnt comitt suicide if that is your complaint. At no point did we try to lose. IS that what we were supposed to have done? God forbid we should play a competitive war game by competing in war. The truth about these situations is readily available to you and makes alot more sense, than an entity that doesnt actually exist "Fury" is just evil. Those 2 rounds werent even the result of the same peoples decisions. One of them was based on my decisions, and if you think I played the round to try and stagnate and cut allies you have no idea what you are talking about.

3) No. Rd 3 was more stagnated than both of them.

4) Erm, first off, how exactly is NAr turning on us, any different than us turning on nar. Wouldnt that create the EXACT same results. YEt you encourage them to turn on us, but say that us turning on them would be evil? You are making ever so much sense.

Thanks for painting us into a corner again. I never get tired of board ethicists telling us that we are evil no matter what we do. NAR ARE NOT OUR ALLIES. We are not using them. We made no promises to them. We are simply avoiding attacking each other becuase we are both at war with vom. It is just that simple. Thefore there is no coalition to turn on. There is no alliance to break. There is no one to kick out and roid. We arent allied. We are two independent blocks made up of indepependant alliances. Maybe after we decide the vom war is ended, we wont turn on anyone, just be nuetral for a time. Maybe Nar and weet will go to war. Maybe one of the blocks will split. Youd have to be a psychic to know. Yet somehow you claim to.

5) Huh? How does vom dying have anything to do with rd5 and rd7. There are no parrallels. IN rd5 and 7 you had a 2 block war. So when it ended, there was only one block. Thus the problems that arose. Stagnation occured because of block loyalty and massive block galaxy sharing.

There are 3 blocks in this round. This is much more like rd 6. Where an alliance was crushed in a first war, there was some stagnation and everyone worried that it might kill the round, but then things changed because, 2 independent blocks, not one closely tied block was on top. Because it was 2 blocks, not one, it was quite natural for them to then fight. And the block that was defeated then played a pivotal role in the end of the round.

So, how can you possibly justify saying that killing vom = killing the round when in the round that most closely mimicked this one politically, killing a block did not mean stagnation at all, and led to one of the more interesting rounds weve had.

On an interesting rd 6 side note. Xeta with xanadu was a higher quality block than Fos, just as one could argue that Weet is higher quality than nar(im not so terribly sure of that). Yet in the end fos won, partly because of the help of a defeated block, who didnt quit but kept on fighting.

[Zh|l]

Originally posted by Hardin
Zh|l,

I think many people in VOM knew (then and now) that the private gal tactic probably didn't make us the most likely friends of NaR.

However I am sure as a HC of WEET you more than welcomed this and certainly did nothing to discourage NaR falling into your arms (To be fair u had no reason not to!)

I already posted reams of my opinion regarding this. I don't think it helped matters at all, since it only means if VoM had won there would be total stagnation since nothing political could ever happen for them.

Originally posted by Hardin

However you should have realised by now that NARSWEET is massively excessive to the task of destroying VOM...so why dont you do something about it?

Have NaR gals got protection in your arbiters? Then cancel it!

Why do that when we are going to focus totally on VoM?

Originally posted by Hardin

Are you sharing targetting information with NaR and dividing up targets? Then stop it!

Actually, we aren't really doing this very well. There is no coordination room. Best is "We want to hit here, try and avoid hitting there also".

Originally posted by Hardin

Are you sharing HC channels and defence? Then end it!

Shared defense? Where on earth do you get that? We don't have shared defense within WEET, why would we have it with NAR?

Originally posted by Hardin

As you and KW have pointed out NaR may still go on hitting VOM targets and WEET may go on hitting us too...but it would provide a little breathing space the coordination ended!

And who knows what else might result?

I know u want VOM dead but do you really want to do it at the expense of stagnating the game within a matter of weeks? Is that all you are really focused on? Surely your own members want at least a bit of a fight!

You are pleeding to the wrong HC, I see VoM still very much active and alive and able to capture my asteroids along with my members. I'm heavily biased in wanting VoM dead

[Psi_K]

Originally posted by K-W
Psi_k
Seek help. One can only hope you are more rational and less paranoid/dillusional in real life.

Yay, the next cryptic ...
Did they breed them like this in Fury?

[Zh|l]

Originally posted by Psi_K
Yay, the next cryptic ...
Did they breed them like this in Fury?

Germ isn't like Cryptic...

He is more like.. hmm... hmm... I don't know.

Ive been compared with Sid/Cayl before.

[§pa¢e¢ook¦e]

Originally posted by K-W

Actually its a very good comparison. Lets think of this community as a local football(adjusted my terms for the rest of the world) league. Your comparison of a top class and ametuer team does not apply, or at least it shouldnt. Nor does your changing the players around. That is simply a constraint of the game. Just as PA has constraints soccor doesnt. The simantics of the game dont matter. The idea that it is a competitive game is the point.
Pls put down your attitude and think about why a football league works. There are parts of PA that should change to fit the model better, but it gives an important understanding of the nature of a competitive game, something alot of people seem to forget this is.

heh get real, and read again what i wrote i said you CANNOT compare this as a football league, IF if you would compare it to football match then you would be playing with your subs as you have more players on the field . lol i certainly do not have an attitude and im well aware how a league works if you want something competitive then you search 3 good allies and fight them which in the case you had, member count where pretty much the same the quality of players, well i think all the alliance have better and less players. im not saying those are the bad guys and those are the good guys, but i sincerely hope you read some of your own posts and compare them with what you post again '' i see alot of contradictions and denials, ofc theres no rules that say your not allowed to team up with a bigger % of the universe but if you claim you want a competitve game that lasts a while it isnt certainly this way but everyone has his own views and opinions 1 is from a struggling side that fights hard and the other hand is a side that sits comfy for now and doesnt have to much to worry about which i wouldnt blame you to try and convince ppl that the game runs perfectly like this and leads you to a more easier victory as how more ppl fighting eachother 1 or more alliances benefit from that situation .

[§pa¢e¢ook¦e]

Originally posted by Zh|l
IWhy do that when we are going to focus totally on VoM?

So basicaly your saying that 1st objective is to eliminate every threat of VoM with all means even when it could mean stagnation

Actually, we aren't really doing this very well. There is no coordination room. Best is "We want to hit here, try and avoid hitting there also".

ehm distributing entire p's isnt what you call coordination ?

You are pleeding to the wrong HC, I see VoM still very much active and alive and able to capture my asteroids along with my members. I'm heavily biased in wanting VoM dead

ofc VoM isnt dead and well keep fighting coz we will win in the end we won on 1 part allready anyway


i really think you and germania's view is a bit blurred noticeing from what you post, you say you are against stagnation you want a nice fight (still like 2 1/2 month to go) yet you do not see why you should break up the nap/allied status with nar altho i hardly see that possible as you have many shared gals and like i said before if your galm8s have some respect to the alliance your in they wont attack it.

[Cochese]

Originally posted by Zh|l

Regardless, are you really surprised NaR are hitting VoM when VoM kept on calling them hostile preround and generally giving NaR no option but to fight VoM?

Now hold on a second Zhilybilly, I know for a fact no one on my side ever called NaR hostile preround. There was some speculation about RaH wanting to twat ViruS, but that aside, no one considered NaR hostile...and why should we, they were officially neutral, or supposed to be?

I suppose what was expected was for them to make NaR/neutral galaxies and raid both sides equally, not mingle in with WEET galaxies and essentially give themselves no option BUT to hit VVOMM, and join the war against us. Though if they are "neutral", I suppose they've hit some of your galaxies too then?

Anyways, yes the galaxy policy was a foolish risk, and perhaps if we'd had a joint discussion between VVOMM and WEET before things were set in stone, we could have come to a join agreement to make allied-only galaxies. Would have been interesting, that.

I can see how someone from NaR could interperet our galaxy policy as being "hostile" to them, by dissalowing them in our galaxies...however, that wasn't the intention whatsoever and I think we all know it.

We're a rookie alliance, and we made rookie mistakes, it's pretty obvious. I alone cannot steer my alliance into what I "know" to be the best course, and certainly not a coalition of alliances of which I was against from the get-go. All we can do is learn from these mistakes, and avoid them next time around.

I'm pretty sure almost everyone agrees this round didn't turn out like it could, and should, have

[Jester]

Originally posted by Cochese
Now hold on a second Zhilybilly, I know for a fact no one on my side ever called NaR hostile preround. There was some speculation about RaH wanting to twat ViruS, but that aside, no one considered NaR hostile...and why should we, they were officially neutral, or supposed to be?

Hostile, no. However there were campaigns telling us how it was a 'bad thing to do'. This attitude no doubt polarized the situation. NAR weren't said to be allied with, but they were lumped together with WEET.

Jester

[K-W]

Originally posted by §pa¢e¢ook¦e
heh get real, and read again what i wrote i said you CANNOT compare this as a football league, IF if you would compare it to football match then you would be playing with your subs as you have more players on the field . lol i certainly do not have an attitude and im well aware how a league works if you want something competitive then you search 3 good allies and fight them which in the case you had, member count where pretty much the same the quality of players, well i think all the alliance have better and less players. im not saying those are the bad guys and those are the good guys, but i sincerely hope you read some of your own posts and compare them with what you post again '' i see alot of contradictions and denials, ofc theres no rules that say your not allowed to team up with a bigger % of the universe but if you claim you want a competitve game that lasts a while it isnt certainly this way but everyone has his own views and opinions 1 is from a struggling side that fights hard and the other hand is a side that sits comfy for now and doesnt have to much to worry about which i wouldnt blame you to try and convince ppl that the game runs perfectly like this and leads you to a more easier victory as how more ppl fighting eachother 1 or more alliances benefit from that situation .

The differences between the game of football and the game of planetarion have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with what I am talking about. I am talking about the nature of a game as a competition. The number of people on a team is just one of many differences between the games. You could just as validly complain that planetarion doesnt use a ball and somehow think youve made some clever retort.

Please point out some contradictions and denials and I will be more than happy to explain where youve misread and misunderstood.

Im not trying to convince people that the game should stay like this. If you bothered to extend me the curtesy that I generously extend to you and read my posts. You would see that Im not having any more fun than you are in a one sided war. I dont think its as one sided as you say, I still feel a threat that the doomssayers on the forums imply i shouldnt, but regardless. I like a good fight as much as you. I look forward to the rest of this round, I think there is plenty more fighting to come. The day I dont think that I will quit.

The point is that all fights arent neccessarily good fights. So when a bad fight comes, you fight it, you move on. You dont bitch and moan and try to argue that the winners are some kind of subhuman jerks.

The football comparison has nothing to do with number of players on a team and everything to do with jsut recognizing that playing to win, within the rules, does not ruin a game. Its vital to having a game. WIthout it football is just a picnic and planetarion is just a chat network.

[§pa¢e¢ook¦e]

the way i see it Jester is nar couldve twatted weet and vom while they where busy with eachother and take advantage of that situation

edit : ok germania ill look up some of the things you posted later on when i come back from the bar and ill show you where you contradict youself just a lil bit

[Jester]

Originally posted by §pa¢e¢ook¦e
the way i see it Jester is nar couldve twatted weet and vom while they where busy with eachother and take advantage of that situation

edit : ok germania ill look up some of the things you posted later on when i come back from the bar and ill show you where you contradict youself just a lil bit

No, at some point someone would've taken offense and started hitting NAR, at which point we'd have reverted to a 2-v-1 situation.

Jester

[K-W]

Originally posted by §pa¢e¢ook¦e
the way i see it Jester is nar couldve twatted weet and vom while they where busy with eachother and take advantage of that situation

edit : ok germania ill look up some of the things you posted later on when i come back from the bar and ill show you where you contradict youself just a lil bit

I think maybe at some point either weet or vom might have noticed nar twatting them.

gl finding those contradictions. Im not being overly arrogant here. My stance is very simple, so there arent exactly many opportunities for contradiction.

[Cothaniel]

Originally posted by K-W
Of course id like to fight a close fun war and win that. THat has always been the goal of every alliance ive been in. *GASP* Then why didnt it happen???? Because this isnt a scripted movie Cothaniel, this isnt an ideal world. Events arent a result of some omnipotent conciousness. They are a result of many small decisions made by many people sometimes it comes out how youd like it, sometimes it doesnt. Its no ones concious decision which is the case.

Ah, but if everyone goes "well, no one else does anything so why should I?" then nothing EVER happens.

The world is not scripted. The world is not fair.

It's broken so lets NOT fix it? Is that your message?

I am beginning to see why planetarion is, indeed, doomed.

[JonnyBGood]

It would have made more sense for NAR to ally with VOM as then the relative advantage over WEE (these block names redefine homosexuality) would have been less and the level of entertainment for both sides would probably have been higher. Of course from a purely strategic point of view it made most sense to ally with the strongest group so you can use their strength to batter down the others leading to two substantially weakened groups who you could take with a fair degree of dedication and skill.

[ParraCida]

Originally posted by JonnyBGood
It would have made more sense for NAR to ally with VOM as then the relative advantage over WEE (these block names redefine homosexuality) would have been less and the level of entertainment for both sides would probably have been higher. Of course from a purely strategic point of view it made most sense to ally with the strongest group so you can use their strength to batter down the others leading to two substantially weakened groups who you could take with a fair degree of dedication and skill.

The main problem was ofcourse the brilliant PR VOM managed to put out.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally posted by ParraCida
The main problem was ofcourse the brilliant PR VOM managed to put out.

They shouldn't have bothered telling even their own members until about a week before tick start. And I do not mean they should have not organised until then, I just mean they should have kept it quiet. Of course maybe that was just plain impossible.

[Cochese]

Originally posted by JonnyBGood
They shouldn't have bothered telling even their own members until about a week before tick start. And I do not mean they should have not organised until then, I just mean they should have kept it quiet. Of course maybe that was just plain impossible.

I don't know how we couldn't have told them, when they were forming galaxies (or trying to) a month before tickstart.

I'd say "plain impossible"...of course, the 'pure' galaxy idea was foolish to begin with.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally posted by Cochese
I don't know how we couldn't have told them, when they were forming galaxies (or trying to) a month before tickstart.

I'd say "plain impossible"...of course, the 'pure' galaxy idea was foolish to begin with.

Should have told them to shut up and do what their alliance leaders told them. Of course I'd say that your situation would be an inevitable result of how your alliance formed, ie from a community. Strengths and weaknesses to everything.

[K-W]

Originally posted by Cothaniel
Ah, but if everyone goes "well, no one else does anything so why should I?" then nothing EVER happens.

The world is not scripted. The world is not fair.

It's broken so lets NOT fix it? Is that your message?

I am beginning to see why planetarion is, indeed, doomed.

Wow, you would have such a good point... except that I didnt say that. I said you cant expect perfection. You cant blaim people when things arent ideal The politics of this game are a result of many many factors. YOu cant just change things at will.

[K-W]

Originally posted by JonnyBGood
It would have made more sense for NAR to ally with VOM as then the relative advantage over WEE (these block names redefine homosexuality) would have been less and the level of entertainment for both sides would probably have been higher. Of course from a purely strategic point of view it made most sense to ally with the strongest group so you can use their strength to batter down the others leading to two substantially weakened groups who you could take with a fair degree of dedication and skill.

If we have to have blocks, the best situation would have been nar going in neutral, and then letting the events of the round decide how things happen. That would be the most exciting.

[G.K Zhukov]

Originally posted by K-W
Wow, you would have such a good point... except that I didnt say that. I said you cant expect perfection. You cant blaim people when things arent ideal The politics of this game are a result of many many factors. You cant just change things at will.

Creating the biggest powerblock ever, in comparision with total universe size, is as far from percection as you can get it. Now dont say either WEET or NAR didnt know what they were doing.
Dont try telling me or anyone else, the NAP+ betweet WEET and NAR isnt due to the people playing this game, and so can be gotten rid of.

This round must be the lamest ever, but hurrah! WEETNAR managed to create a new word: superpowerblock..

[Scouse]

Originally posted by K-W
We had a dispute with Titans, that according to all HC in the block was a very valid one. They refused to treat us in a way that we saw as proper for an ally. I might add that no one ive talked to since, including some titans disagree that our greivence was justified.

Would you please stop? I've got logs of every single one of your allies, bar FAnG, agreeing that you were the bullies and that you were in the wrong. Not us.

Originally posted by Zhil
There is no coordination room

I find that tremendously hard to believe. You and I both know how these things work. I'm sure there's no joint defence, there very rarely is, but that there's no target booking room is a little hard for me to believe.

[Hardin]

Watch out Scouse....

He'll call u a liar next!

[Cothaniel]

Originally posted by K-W
You cant blaim people when things arent ideal The politics of this game are a result of many many factors. YOu cant just change things at will.

No, but WE can change things. But if people won't even try, wont even begin the hard work, then we are at the end of the road. Shortsighted greed will ruin what is in my opinon a great game.

Can't you agree on that something needs done, and that it is up to each and one of us to do it, however in what small way we do it?


Oh, and..

Originally posted by K-W
Wow, you would have such a good point... except that I didnt say that.

I never claimed that you said that, I merely asked a question based on my impression of your post. Asked because I wanted a clear answer, instead of putting words in your mouth. Attacking that in the way you do is a commonly used, and in my opinion cheap, stunt to discredit a poster. If we are to have a serious discussion, kindly leave it out.

[Cochese]

Originally posted by JonnyBGood
Should have told them to shut up and do what their alliance leaders told them. Of course I'd say that your situation would be an inevitable result of how your alliance formed, ie from a community. Strengths and weaknesses to everything.

Well, I would have told them that anyways but you're partially right. The differences between running a community alliance and a military organization have become quite obvious in the last few weeks.

Anyways, the problem wasn't Cows alone...most of the other participant alliances' HC were being pressured by their members for some news of who their allies were, and what the galaxy policy was going to be.

It was all set up far too soon, no thanks to the Creators' faulty timetable, and our faith in their announcements :/

[Zh|l]

Originally posted by Scouse
Would you please stop? I've got logs of every single one of your allies, bar FAnG, agreeing that you were the bullies and that you were in the wrong. Not us.

Of course. ViruS wanted the opportunity to do something away from Fury after we stopped their war with RaH. Legion at the time was run by a man wanting to win - and Titans at that time werent a threat like Fury was to his chances (No offense to Titans here, just saying from the round perspective).

By the rules and agreements themselves we did have grounds. Unfortunately we got to the point where we needed lawyers to comb over it and with pressure on both sides (Fury's and Titans) there was no chance anyone would back down. With no other solution in sight, the breakup was really inevitable.

Originally posted by Scouse

I find that tremendously hard to believe. You and I both know how these things work. I'm sure there's no joint defence, there very rarely is, but that there's no target booking room is a little hard for me to believe.

There is no joint booking room. The closest is a channel where WEET representatives can talk to NAR representatives (Not a room with bookings), but nothing to the scale of the WTFVE original booking room (that was two blocks that joined together). Each has their own bookings with the occassional "try and avoid this please".
If you don't believe me then I can't change your mind, but I dont post outright lies and you know that.

[ginjas]

im geting tired of this...sweet nar Hc hasnt said a decent word,.,,,,
ok so people once and for all know...
distribuition of universe:
300 +- (give or take 10 smal ones) and new ins and outs of aliances...are from Sweet/NaR
50 +- (give or take 10 smal ones) are from VoM side..
The rest is neutral...
so acording to PA crew there are Galaxies: 509 :
150 neutral smal ones...50 VoM and the rest ....300 gals are powerblock..they outnumber entire game..just for you people to know....


this is average number of course...the 9 spare are for the give or take....


Wana TAG so whe can see it ?
i bet if all tag REAL TAGS.....its gona be fun..to see..how much did you exagerate....

by the way..i been geting info around...
5 to 10 gals in entire top 100 are VoM....

[K-W]

Originally posted by G.K Zhukov
Creating the biggest powerblock ever, in comparision with total universe size, is as far from percection as you can get it. Now dont say either WEET or NAR didnt know what they were doing.
Dont try telling me or anyone else, the NAP+ betweet WEET and NAR isnt due to the people playing this game, and so can be gotten rid of.

This round must be the lamest ever, but hurrah! WEETNAR managed to create a new word: superpowerblock..

No one has created the biggest powerblock ever.

This round is just over a week into its ~3 month run. I certainly would give it to at least the half way point before I tried to judge how good a round it was overall. News scans arent even out yet, and you think the round is over. What are you thinking?

Originally posted by Cothaniel

snip

You basically agree with me then. The current situation isnt any one person or groups fault, but it is everyones responsibility to make sure that the round progresses in a way that does not lead to stagnation. I and everyone I know in weet agree with that. So, im just not sure why these threads are neccessary.

[K-W]

Originally posted by Scouse
Would you please stop? I've got logs of every single one of your allies, bar FAnG, agreeing that you were the bullies and that you were in the wrong. Not us.

Scouse, you hurt your credibility. Titans took in a top player and protected her from a completely valid retalliation from Fury. You put a member of your recruitment section as a higher priority than your alliance with Fury. A player who, as soon as the war started went into vacation mode, contributing nothing to Titans at all.

You can have logs with everyone you want. Your still wrong. And I talked to who I talked to. Hell, Titan command members from rd 7 agree that Fury had a perfectly valid complaint. They dont regret thier actions, but they dont think Fury was being a bully. It was an unfortunate situation. Once titans took her in they felt they had an obligation. Once she acted in as a traitor to Fury we felt that we had an obligation.

How were we bullies? Pls explain that to me. We originally assumed that Titans would have no problem letting us enforce our rules. Its not exactly too much to ask of a close ally. But when we were informed that Titans would not, we immediately ceased any military action and went directly to Titans to talk as allies. We went to Titans and explained our case. Said that under regular cicumstances we would take no hesitation and destroy any traitors to Fury, BUT because we valued titans so much as an ally, we would be willing to negotiate. We made many offers, basically all we wanted was some kind of hit, even a small one, just so that we could say that we enforced our rules. Just so that Fury rules still meant something. We couldnt allow the entire legitimacy of our rules fall apart because Titans recruited a member out from under us. Titans hard lined us, said they would not compromise and that any action we took would be met with military action. Titans wouldnt even enter into negotiations. We were told that we would get nothing and that anything we did would result in titans military action.

Now pls explain to me where we were bullies? We asked for negotiation and were told that we couldnt even negotiate.

I realize that around consortium ALOT of false rumors were being spread about Fury and alot of things were being misinterpreted. Alot of people saw us as bullies. Luckily some alliance leaders saw through the bull**** and we avoided a war based on one giant lie after another. Your choice to still believe these lies is unfortunate.

I would be happy to discuss this further with you on irc if you want. But I refuse to sit by while you portray me as some kind of mean, greedy, bully. When I bent over backwards to accomidate all our allies in rd 7. I treated every single one of our allies with full faith and credit and tried as hard as possible to do right by each and every one in situations where it was impossible to not do some wrong.

So, how about you please stop. Stop slandering Fury, stop slandering my decisions, and get a clue. It upsets me that an alliance I had so much respect for, with a command that I had so much respect for still has people spreading such lies about my actions and fury's actions.

[Hardin]

Told you Scouse!

[Confraria]

Originally posted by [7]Gunn3r
I honestly would love to see the so called '40 gals' being picked up, considering FoS and XeTa combined had difficulty reaching 25 gals at this stage in round 6.

round 6 u had 15 planets per gal... that makes "37,5" gals with 10 planets each