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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 03:37   #201
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Re: a political summary of r24

It's true, he is.
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 04:04   #202
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElAlan
No i dont need to particularly look through it, mz said if you disagree with his post then neg rep, but you decided to indirectly insinuate that maybe he dont get neg repped due to asc types being clever on this forum, i decided to display a way that this may not be the case, maybe you were wrong by getting so het up in your reply to such "neg rep me then" post, maybe jumping to call others on the forum retards after a simple reply aint so perfect either, but if you want another technical, exact wording, a la JBG argument like earlier find someone else, cheers....
oh my god, you really are a ****ing retard. Here you go. Go think to yourself why neg/pos reps don't reflect popularity (or quality of posts) on the alliance discussions forums. Or any of the planetarion-related forums. Even if you failed to think of that particular line of reasoning, there's a few others flying about you could have opted for. Jesus Christ.
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 04:20   #203
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Re: a political summary of r24

My point still stands, and no reason for the abuse nor the blasphemy here kthxbye
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 04:31   #204
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElAlan
My point still stands, and no reason for the abuse nor the blasphemy here kthxbye
I must confess I didn't even bother reading your post, guessed what was in it - I have now though. How does your point stand?

I say people dislike mz, he points out the neg-rep feature (as in - "if people don't like me, neg-rep me. Oh, how come I have so many green blobs?"). I call him a retard for making that argument. You join in, I call you a retard. You continue to be retarded. Ok?

Also, despite me thinking you're making dire posts at the moment, and its mutual, are we neg-repping ourselves? no! Why not? To get more green blobs I know all I have to do is go "asc are shit" then wait for the standard neg rep, then point out I got a neg rep, then asc will pos rep me. Admittedly its fun, but does get dull if you do it more than twice a year.
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 04:32   #205
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by Newt
Another retard. Start engaging some of those brain cells that you have. What I mean by that: read what you posted, lean back in your chair, then lean forwards again, and look for logical fallacies in your argument. Granted they aren't painstakingly obvious, but if you have an IQ over 70 it should be doable.
Newt, being arrogant like this only works if you're right, and unfortunately this time you're not. You're getting awfully worked up over the fact that mz corrected some information you put forth, are you not?

Tbh you're letting the whole 'ascendancy' thing get in your eyes a little there - mz is one of the most intelligent guys to play PA. Would you rather he behave like another adolescent muppet who argued over everything and started namecalling? I think the game has enough of those already.

I like mz, and I'm not Ascendancy.

In fact I like him a lot.

I wish we could be closer.

Very close.

mz, will you marry me?
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 04:34   #206
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Re: a political summary of r24

Newt: Actually only a few high ranked planets were HC's/Officers, most were regular pe0ns like me.

Mzyxptlk: Not paranoia to assume your channel is getting relayed with the knowledge that it is 1) A common practice and 2) especially hard to stop when no one cares. Why else would the rules have been made about not posting coord related stuff in .priv channel, and setting +ix? It's just common knowledge/good practice.
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 04:44   #207
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny
Newt, being arrogant like this only works if you're right, and unfortunately this time you're not. You're getting awfully worked up over the fact that mz corrected some information you put forth, are you not?
I am right. I'm not worked up at all about mz correcting me, its good that he did. I'm not even worked up about his very slight dig at me - I' wound up at him and his like in general. Not that thats any better.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny again
Tbh you're letting the whole 'ascendancy' thing get in your eyes a little there - mz is one of the most intelligent guys to play PA.
Yeh, its a tricky issue. Did I hate people like mz on the internet before or after ascendancy. GLADLY, my posting record will tend to confirm that yes, I hated people like him pre-r15. Phew eh? As to teh second part of your post.. thanks, I needed a good laugh to cheer myself up before bed.
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 04:55   #208
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by Recluse
Newt: Actually only a few high ranked planets were HC's/Officers, most were regular pe0ns like me.
Yeh, I admitted I was only talking about pre tick 800 or so (I know nothing about last 200 ticks which I've said frequently). Even had a chat with yogibear and some other urwins officer about the top urwins players all being hcs/officers at the time. Since the round didn't finish that way for urwins, and I didn't say this before, yeh I'm sorry and I was wrong (though I think the point I was making is still validated a little bit by the state at t800 before urwins went shit).
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 05:05   #209
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Re: a political summary of r24

erm, even pre-tick 800 that is not true. Eksero, Isildurx, and I were all top planets most the round, and none of use were anything but pe0ns. I know Callan, Rinoa, and a few others were as well, and again, not but pe0ns there. if you were to say only t10 planets, than yes, as Yogi and Logbat were the only Urwins t10 for a length of time. However I believe both admit to having decent galaxies to thank for that, and not sucking ally def. As most know I sucked the most ally def of all Urwins planets. Again, not but a pe0n
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 05:13   #210
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by Newt
I must confess I didn't even bother reading your post, guessed what was in it - I have now though. How does your point stand?
Why would you guess what was in my post, you seem ascendancy obsessed yet i am not known as asc.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Newt
I say people dislike mz, he points out the neg-rep feature (as in - "if people don't like me, neg-rep me. Oh, how come I have so many green blobs?"). I call him a retard for making that argument. You join in, I call you a retard. You continue to be retarded. Ok?
Actually it was me who pointed out the green blobs argument, you asked in your post if "Is there where I can say I've noticed how you are a generally patronising egotistic **** in your posts" about mz, to which he says you can neg rep, how that is retarded i have no idea and will let others decided, seems a logical reply to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Newt
Also, despite me thinking you're making dire posts at the moment, and its mutual, are we neg-repping ourselves? no! Why not? To get more green blobs I know all I have to do is go "asc are shit" then wait for the standard neg rep, then point out I got a neg rep, then asc will pos rep me. Admittedly its fun, but does get dull if you do it more than twice a year.
Cant say i was personally thinking about my own rep here, honestly, i just replied to the use of neg rep getting used, you worry about your rep i'll worry about mine, and perhaps yes we are mutually bad posters
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 05:21   #211
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Re: a political summary of r24

you both have horrible rep, mine is clearleh better I think the comments I have recieved from my neg reps are the funniest things ever lol. Some people shouldn't be allowed to have a computer
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 06:03   #212
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElAlan
to which he says you can neg rep, how that is retarded i have no idea and will let others decided, seems a logical reply to me.
A-ha! mz answered my rhetorical question. Silly me, since it was rhetorical I'd completely forgotten I'd even phrased my statement as a question, and assumed mz was making a point about it. My bad for assuming mz's been brought up in an educational system where you're taught not to answer such questions.

Thankfully: a). he answered a rhetorical question - retard; b). he was patronising by doing so - epitomising my statement about him (doubt he was mocking it by playing up to my expectations of him); c). his reply did also address my statement about him, so my ensueing posts are relevant.

That said he did encapsulate all those 3 things into a one-line post. Do 3 wrongs make a right? hmmm nah, answering a rhetorical question is still retarded no matter how many "hidden messages" you put inside it.

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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 06:29   #213
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Re: a political summary of r24

You may as well get a final word in before this thread is closed in the morning recluse! Were you happy with the way urwins played out the politics last round? What do you think of your hcs? you agree yogibear is the best yeh? you better had
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 07:22   #214
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Re: a political summary of r24

heh I hounded dreamz and yogi all round about not being happy with the politics, and you can ask them Yogi clearleh pwned dreamz.
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 11:03   #215
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by Newt
A-ha! mz answered my rhetorical question. Silly me, since it was rhetorical I'd completely forgotten I'd even phrased my statement as a question, and assumed mz was making a point about it. My bad for assuming mz's been brought up in an educational system where you're taught not to answer such questions.
You know I like you newt, but this is an idiotic thing to say for a number of reasons.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Newt
Is there where I can say I've noticed how you are a generally patronising egotistic **** in your posts, a sentiment agreed upon by most non-ascendancy readers I know? Or?
At least if this is the rhetorical question you're talking about. If someone throws dirt at me I reserve the right to react, rhetorical question or not. Does that make me a retard, or does it make the educational system of Norway bad?

Frankly I'm getting a bit tired of you throwing shit about "ascendancy" and "non-ascendancy" people, what we're talking about here is generally opinions, and there's no good reason to assume that every non-ascendancy person has a different opinion from every ascendancy person, or even that every ascendancy person has the same opinion. I know for a fact that I often disagree with the things my fellow ascendancy members post here, and there's no reason to assume that none of the others who bother reading the forums (In fact it's just a minority of us who bother reading the forum at all) feel the same way occasionally.

I'm not of the opinion that we're Gods gift to PA, that having .tv channels is the very essence of fun, or that ****ing up other peoples round is the best way to play PA (Unless of course I have a particular reason to do it). In fact, I don't particularly care about these things and I imagine that most of the players in Ascendancy and in the community in general don't. We're not so different that you have to spend every single keystroke of yours slagging us off because you dislike the minority of us that bother with being public figures around here.

And please, stop spending energy on mz, you've made it known that you dislike him and think he's an idiot, I think most of the readers here have had enough of that by now. It's not really that interesting.
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 11:24   #216
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Re: a political summary of r24

I personally think that MZ is just bitter because he was left out of the original seven gummi bears.
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 11:43   #217
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Re: a political summary of r24

the real important question isn't if mz is a dick or not (he is, as are you newt):

but is he a dick under the discipline of JBG or mine?!
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 12:12   #218
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Re: a political summary of r24

Yes, its true and ND and TGV were friendly to one another for the round since day 1, but it was never really a NAP, just what we agreed upon to be neutral to one another. TGV only took the step to help ND when they came asking for help in taking down urwins, with them being among our top-hostiles we had no objection and began targeting urwins for the last 2 weeks of the round. With the exception of a 2-day ceasefire we granted to urwins when they came begging for us to cease and desist. ND deserved to win this round in full right, it put in hard effort and constant work the entire round, with good political thinking. The time we acted to take down urwins proved correct and ND broke the rank 3 slowly moving its way into #1. Ct's stockpiling of ships was eventually what drew the round to so close and end between the top 2 alliances.

Although i was amongst the most received defense fleets in TGV, i was not the one who took the majority of TGV def fleets, My race (cath) was obviously one of the primary reasons i was targeted so much, especially CT and ToF/Orbit, which ill admit cath had a big disadvantage this round with the multi-targeting. But lets face it there are worse ppl then me for stealing def.

And who really puts a spy in the rank 9 alliance lol, thats jsut sad, TGV had all intentions to remain neutral (until ND came askign for assistance) and we made this publicly clear on numerous occasions.

Angels/Exc did infact side with urwins/CT for the early days, until their nap was broken by urwins, who continuously pounded into CT with little or no fighting back on CT's behalf. Orbit and ToF merged together mid-round to make themselves a larger more solid alliance, and did reasonably well then they would have seperately. ND did target CT during the last few days to lower their chance of overtaking them with productions hidden, and it worked, although it was very slim between the two.

Despite what people think of me as a player, the time and effort i put into TGV can't be denied, as Kargool has said himself here a few times. I've DC'd and scanned for them ever sicne my return at the end of R19, and being made a HC in r22. I do admittedly have a few good friends ive made inside TGV, but i dont consider myself special at all.
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 12:42   #219
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by Recluse
Newt: Actually only a few high ranked planets were HC's/Officers, most were regular pe0ns like me.

Mzyxptlk: Not paranoia to assume your channel is getting relayed with the knowledge that it is 1) A common practice and 2) especially hard to stop when no one cares. Why else would the rules have been made about not posting coord related stuff in .priv channel, and setting +ix? It's just common knowledge/good practice.
Actually, I noticed that in the CT priv channel as well, and never understood it. How is forcing your members to set mode +ix going to make your alliance more secure? (That's a genuine question, someone enlighten me)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Newt
doubt he was mocking it by playing up to my expectations of him
You know, I actually was.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Macaroth
And who really puts a spy in the rank 9 alliance lol, thats jsut sad, TGV had all intentions to remain neutral (until ND came askign for assistance) and we made this publicly clear on numerous occasions.
Entertainment was our only motivator. No political reasons, no particular dislike for TGV. We're just dirty voyeurs.



P.S.
Can you guys stop fighting over me, thanks. I can stand up for myself you know.

P.P.S.
Answer jer's question though!
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 12:49   #220
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk
How is forcing your members to set mode +ix going to make your alliance more secure? (That's a genuine question, someone enlighten me)
I guess it only matters if you use fake nicks, which are old news. Hence it doesn't. (Matching hostnames of fake nicks to real nicks)
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 12:59   #221
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Re: a political summary of r24

I always used to set mode +x for my fakenick, so there's nothing to match. Though I guess redundancy is a good thing in this respect. Then again, starting to enforce it halfway through the round is probably pointless indeed.

</mindless ramble>
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 13:24   #222
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk
I always used to set mode +x for my fakenick, so there's nothing to match. Though I guess redundancy is a good thing in this respect. Then again, starting to enforce it halfway through the round is probably pointless indeed.

</mindless ramble>
For us we really just set the +x because its easier for our bots to recognize our members when they login to the bot.
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 13:33   #223
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Re: a political summary of r24

Entertainment was our only motive xD hahahah

Seriously, if u can idle with a bunch of people in like 4-5 or more channels of certain alliances listening to their dribble (assuming much is of the sort CT ppl talk about) and lolling over their defensenotices. You're an idiot.

Had you done it to free ride your planet to a decent ranking, because you knew how and when and from whom you got inc, i'd say, well done, its gay but well done.

Entertainment hahah, I can totally see it now. 4-5 irc windows open, going red when someone in TGV, Urwins or CT says something and the lot of you going 'Omg omg they speak, gogogo alfa team report'
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 17:29   #224
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kargool
For us we really just set the +x because its easier for our bots to recognize our members when they login to the bot.
Yeah, that is a good reason, but again, it's not really valid if you managed without for half a round. :P
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Unread 31 Dec 2007, 20:38   #225
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Re: a political summary of r24

Well, it was supposed to be enforced from day 1, but most gave up on it after a week or so, because by than most coords were known anyway and it's pointless after that. Does it matter if my nick is known if I'm already known as an Urwins planet? Hardly.
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Unread 1 Jan 2008, 04:59   #226
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Re: a political summary of r24

All i have to say on this subject unless u want details (pm me in irc)

Is Resecpt to the ND troops WOOT WOOT......

And Respect to Exe,TGV and to Jupp in particular.

Jupp was the most honest a person in Pa i have worked with in 26 rnds....

There was an honest open working relationship between Exe and ND..

TGV respect also we always been close through out the years.

I would alos like to wish every one a happy new year.
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Unread 1 Jan 2008, 18:27   #227
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Re: a political summary of r24

mz, you didn't answer my question
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Unread 1 Jan 2008, 20:19   #228
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Re: a political summary of r24

jupp
As difficult as you guys made our round, I too respect your efforts to create war and competition. That said I cannot for the life of me understand why you are taking digs at CT for not being friendly with you when you obviously had no interest in friendship with us (quite the contrary in fact). You offered us a rather unfriendly nap after your first war against us and even that was only a ploy to get Urwins to attack us. At which stage of this process would CT have opened doors with friendship? If I had pmd you and stroked your ego would you have abandoned your goals for the round and become CT partisans? I gave you guys more credit than that and treated you like gamers.


elalan
CT was a battle group last round and we haven't won a round since round 20, I don't know what on earth possessed you to expect us to be some uber-alliance that knows everything. We are just a bunch of better than average players trying to keep an alliance going and contending as PA dies out. That is all weve ever claimed to be.


JBG
Perhaps one of the reasons people arent eager to step up and HC alliances is because they know that unless they manage to perform amazingly people like you will desmiss all thier work and call them retards.

You seem to want to play a game that isn't Planetarion. This is a very simple and poorly designed browser game hemmoraging players and dedication. If you are looking for complex plans and excited playerbases... I don't know what to tell you. Some of us are trying to keep the game going while others sit back and snipe at the few people still crazy enough to put themselves out there.

CT is a very flawed alliance. Nobody is more aware of that or more vocal about that than our core players almost all of whom have played in great alliances in the past. We formed in round 20 not because we have time and energy, but because there were no better options for us. We have struggled since then to keep CT alive and relatively good as the player base continues to dwindle and as all of us, members and command, struggle with staying motivated and balancing our real lives with Planetarion.

CT bashing is fun, I do it as much as anyone else, but at least when we do it in CT we also know that no small amount of effort goes into keeping an alliance going these days. Just keeping the basic functions of the alliance running for multiple rounds, while certainly unimpressive in the grand scheme of PA is more than most alliances have been able to do recently. I'm certainly not asking for a trophy here, but if you actually want Planetarion to get better perhaps you should sympathize with those of us trying to make things happen even if we fail to achieve the kind of exciting play that everyone wants to see.


logbat
Before you approached CT we had made no deals with any other alliances, not even ToF. This is exactly why we napped you, we had no block and we knew you were out looking for naps and allies so rather than face an urwins lead block against us when we knew the other top ally ND was historically anti-CT we napped you as a stalling tactic if nothing else; we actually expected you guys to break the nap and come at us with a block as soon as we pulled ahead.


Kargool
There are no planetarion rules about how many people you are allowed to have in an irc channel, we actually did have a fair amount of non-players in channel. I also think its funny that after a thread full of people going on and on about how shit ct is you are still trying to pretend CT is some kind of evil super alliance. We were recruiting people up until the last day of the round to fill our tag spots, anyone who thought that every nick that passed through #ct at the beginning of this round was playing actively with us is an idiot.


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The simple fact of the matter is that for round 24 CT was not mediocre. Contrary to self-serving alliance discussion myths CT is not full of noobs who think we are amazing. The core of CT is mostly made of extremely experienced players who are painfully aware of how rough it is in CT. We are also well aware that our bad alliance has been the most successful new alliance in this dark era of PA. It isn't much but it isn't nothing either.
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Unread 1 Jan 2008, 21:00   #229
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by K-W
Perhaps one of the reasons people arent eager to step up and HC alliances is because they know that unless they manage to perform amazingly people like you will desmiss all thier work and call them retards.
If that's a genuine reason then I'm surprised they manage to get out of bed without hurting themselves.

Quote:
You seem to want to play a game that isn't Planetarion. This is a very simple and poorly designed browser game hemmoraging players and dedication. If you are looking for complex plans and excited playerbases... I don't know what to tell you. Some of us are trying to keep the game going while others sit back and snipe at the few people still crazy enough to put themselves out there.
I've probably done as much as you have for this game. Personally I try to do new and/or interesting things when I play any sort of game. You're just on autopilot.

Quote:
CT bashing is fun, I do it as much as anyone else, but at least when we do it in CT we also know that no small amount of effort goes into keeping an alliance going these days. Just keeping the basic functions of the alliance running for multiple rounds, while certainly unimpressive in the grand scheme of PA is more than most alliances have been able to do recently. I'm certainly not asking for a trophy here, but if you actually want Planetarion to get better perhaps you should sympathize with those of us trying to make things happen even if we fail to achieve the kind of exciting play that everyone wants to see.
If you want Planetarion to get better you should put more effort into playing it. It's not even that difficult. People just don't respond well to being led by alternatively apathetic has-beens or complete idiots.
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Unread 1 Jan 2008, 21:06   #230
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by K-W
j
Kargool
There are no planetarion rules about how many people you are allowed to have in an irc channel, we actually did have a fair amount of non-players in channel. I also think its funny that after a thread full of people going on and on about how shit ct is you are still trying to pretend CT is some kind of evil super alliance. We were recruiting people up until the last day of the round to fill our tag spots, anyone who thought that every nick that passed through #ct at the beginning of this round was playing actively with us is an idiot.


Yeah. I stand corrected on that one.

But say, when do you guys plan on stop letting elviz the cheater into your alliance as its obviously hempering your alliance when he's more likely to get closed each round instead of doing anything constructive. You guys get a bad reputation when you take in people that have proven that their only quality in this game is cheating.
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Unread 1 Jan 2008, 21:18   #231
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Re: a political summary of r24

Even if elviz is ultimately found guilty and closed on a round by round basis, I suppose one could find a small amount of logic in getting the most out of him prior to any 'revelations' of cheating. The attacks he's helped made a success, the times (if any) he's defended. If he gets closed after that, it's too little; too late. Any alliance that houses him shouldn't rely on his score, but the contribution he can make.

Personally I think he's a pretty sound guy too, but you're right when you say that anyone taking him on expects him to cheat; are happy with that; and should be ashamed because of that.

Doesn't make them bad people though, it just means they should house a little guilt now and then!
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Unread 1 Jan 2008, 21:57   #232
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny
Personally I think he's a pretty sound guy too, but you're right when you say that anyone taking him on expects him to cheat; are happy with that; and should be ashamed because of that.

Doesn't make them bad people though, it just means they should house a little guilt now and then!
Sound guys don't cheat.
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Unread 1 Jan 2008, 22:14   #233
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Re: a political summary of r24

guys i got a friend to crash his cr into me in 18
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Unread 1 Jan 2008, 22:46   #234
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
If that's a genuine reason then I'm surprised they manage to get out of bed without hurting themselves.
Why don't you spare me the formulaic 'witty' comebacks JBG.

You are here calling for people to work hard to make the game more entertaining for you, while at the same time calling the people who are currently working retards.

Quote:
I've probably done as much as you have for this game.
This isn't a pissing contest. My point is that without people running alliances every round, even if they don't excite JBG, there would be no game.

Quote:
Personally I try to do new and/or interesting things when I play any sort of game. You're just on autopilot.
No, we both try and do new and/or interesting things when we play any sort of game. If no such opportunity is available you sit back and make fun of everyone else, I work to keep my alliance going anyway so people have a place to play.

Quote:
If you want Planetarion to get better you should put more effort into playing it. It's not even that difficult. People just don't respond well to being led by alternatively apathetic has-beens or complete idiots.
So instead of putting more effort into Planetarion yourself, or calling on people who put no effort to put in some, you insult people who are putting effort in?

Why should the two of us, some of the few people who actually give a shit about this game anymore, talk constructively when you can insult me and insist on your intellectual superiority. Obviously that is the important thing here.
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Unread 1 Jan 2008, 23:04   #235
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Re: a political summary of r24

I have seen way too many cheaters in my time in PA to buy into the idea that elviz is some all-time-bad cheater. The details of his closing this round were more humorous than anything else and if the accusations were true they describe a rather inexperienced cheater.

Elviz should be known for putting his planet/gal before his alliance. That is his big baggage. And the reason why he still gets into alliances is because for the most part he is a very professional and helpful player who gets along well with people.
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Unread 1 Jan 2008, 23:24   #236
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Re: a political summary of r24

I don't think HC have to perform amazingly to avoid criticism; they have to be competent and that's all. They can do the best for their alliance and dictate who wins (themselves included) politically and run a reasonably organised unit.

But trying out different ideas and ways of playing can be the difference between success and failure and at least, makes the game more interesting. From my own experience, the best rounds to play in Ascendancy weren't the ones where we did what we are famous for; i.e. sat on our arse not doing very much and occasionally did something brilliant/hilarious.

When we went out to achieve a set goal and thought up of every single way possible to help us achieve those goals, be it by winning through XP, creating a winning super galaxy or achieving the top 3 ranks be it planet or galaxy. These situations have made Ascendancy better as a unit and better to play in because they're interesting and have demanded us to be exceptionally creative. And contrary to popular belief, we are all human (even Stoom and Alki) and need motivation to actually do something worthwhile in the game.

The scenarios above have been as exciting as the old rounds when we had all action epic contests. People need to set themselves targets, put thought into how they play. It doesn't require activity but it does require some kind of effort. The rounds where someone in Asc gets off their arse and gets us to achieve something end up being the better ones.

The reason we made the rounds I've hinted towards above interesting was because we put effort and thought into achieving something and making them interesting. I'm not saying every alliance should play like Ascendancy; I'm saying that every alliance has a responsibility to itself to make its own round fun and rewarding.

As JBG said, this requires effort.
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Unread 2 Jan 2008, 00:05   #237
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by K-W
Why don't you spare me the formulaic 'witty' comebacks JBG.

You are here calling for people to work hard to make the game more entertaining for you, while at the same time calling the people who are currently working retards.
I'm not asking people to do anything. I'm just calling it like I see it.


Quote:
This isn't a pissing contest. My point is that without people running alliances every round, even if they don't excite JBG, there would be no game.
No, it isn't, my point was I'm not being hypocritical. My point was that there won't be a game shortly if we all continue to play like this.


Quote:
No, we both try and do new and/or interesting things when we play any sort of game. If no such opportunity is available you sit back and make fun of everyone else, I work to keep my alliance going anyway so people have a place to play.
I make fun of everyone else regardless, it's pretty amusing. As I said above I've done plenty of work in PA and for PA so your implication is just way off.


Quote:
So instead of putting more effort into Planetarion yourself, or calling on people who put no effort to put in some, you insult people who are putting effort in?

Why should the two of us, some of the few people who actually give a shit about this game anymore, talk constructively when you can insult me and insist on your intellectual superiority. Obviously that is the important thing here.
I'll criticise anyone I feel deserves to be criticised. Otherwise I'd worry about them never improving. And I wasn't insisting on my intellectual superiority with respect to you. To an extent I was pointing out why CT failed. The utter lack of any genuine leadership to look up to.

To be honest I'm genuinely confused why some people play PA, and this isn't really aimed at you germania. They just set themselves up for the most predictable bland round they can think of and complain when they get bored. It's just bizzare.
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Unread 2 Jan 2008, 00:15   #238
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Re: a political summary of r24

lokken,
So almost winning the round after facing the toughest wars of any alliance doesn't qualify us even for competency?

Quote:
I'm not saying every alliance should play like Ascendancy; I'm saying that every alliance has a responsibility to itself to make its own round fun and rewarding.

As JBG said, this requires effort.
And I appreciate the effort asc put in, why can't you appreciate the effort we put in?

I think what you guys did was great. There was a pool of casual but experienced players and you organized them in a way that gave you tremendous freedom. Your members didn't demand constant defense or constant organized attacks, they were pros who could take care of thier own planets if they wanted to. You were free to focus your effort into interesting projects when you felt like it and this served your members.

Great.

Now what my members want is a little different. To serve our members we need to provide near constant defense organization, we need to provide daily attacks, we need to make political agreements and we need to be around and available to members for all sorts of little things all the time.

That takes effort too. It isn't glamorous effort but it is effort just the same and it serves portions of the playing population who wouldn't be happy in ascendancy.

And yes, of course, CT could be better. If everyone from the command to the scanners would dedicate themselves more we could have a really amazing alliance. We could run away with rounds and do whatever we wanted to do, though I imagine you wouldn't approve of that either. But its round 25, that kind of dedication is hard to come by, so we do what we can and we try to improve. I'm not saying we deserve accolades, I'm just not sure why we deserve the scorn and derision.
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Unread 2 Jan 2008, 00:34   #239
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Re: a political summary of r24

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Yeah, and white men can't jump.
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Unread 2 Jan 2008, 00:48   #240
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Re: a political summary of r24

I haven't criticised CT in this thread because I don't know how CT have played recently as I can't really play any more.

All I was giving you was my general thoughts on how I think the game should be played and how I think people can get the most out of it.

As JBG said - it requires effort. I simply used Ascendancy to justify my point. I haven't thrown rocks at anyone, so a grand defence of how CT play is not necessary. Players need inspiration, even the best ones which is particularly true in Ascendancy because if we aren't given a challenge, we're absolutely rubbish as a group regardless of our ability.

JBG suggested leadership is needed to inspire in CT. And in my opinion, this is what more conventional alliances generally need to succeed - I will not comment on the state of CT.

What I will say is that the game has suffered greatly for HC willing to 'accomodate' people for the sake of having extra score - because they often disrupt their own team. If you win, you get people in that group plotting how to get the best planets above their so-called alliance mates, if you lose, they jump ship and you've all wasted your time. What you can guarantee is that they are taking the people who are the core people of that alliance for a ride. This does not inspire, this makes you come across as someone who has favourites based on score rather than their contribution and that in my opinion is ultimately counterproductive. It's this kind of leadership that drives me up the wall.
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Unread 2 Jan 2008, 01:37   #241
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny
Yeah, and white men can't jump.
If you cheat you're not a sound guy. Accept it.
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Unread 2 Jan 2008, 01:51   #242
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Re: a political summary of r24

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Originally Posted by furball
If you cheat you're not a sound guy. Accept it.
My point was not that 'all white men cant jump', so that 'all cheaters must be sound guys'... but I was highlighting the fact that dealing in absolutes is futile, as there are always exceptions to every rule. I assume you're not disputing that there are exceptions to every rule, are you?
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Unread 2 Jan 2008, 01:52   #243
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Re: a political summary of r24

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Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
No, it isn't, my point was I'm not being hypocritical. My point was that there won't be a game shortly if we all continue to play like this.
There won't be a game next round if everyone who just plays in normal alliances stops playing because it isn't exciting enough.

Quote:
I've done plenty of work in PA and for PA so your implication is just way off.
What is way off is your reading if you think I have implied anything at all about your overall work in Planetarion. I am talking about the specific issue of organizing alliances right now in PA as the game continues to die.

As unexciting as it may be, boring alliances like CT and others continue to provide most of the members of this game with a place to play, without which they probably wouldn't.

Quote:
I'll criticize anyone I feel deserves to be criticized. Otherwise I'd worry about them never improving. And I wasn't insisting on my intellectual superiority with respect to you. To an extent I was pointing out why CT failed. The utter lack of any genuine leadership to look up to.
CT barely failed for a variety of reasons. Yes CT HC is not marked by inspirational personalities. I disagree that this is the only genuine type of leadership. Regardless, perhaps if we had more of that type of leadership we would have won... how does that make us idiots? It wasn't a choice we made, we are playing the hand we are dealt and that hand includes a fairly humble and shy group of people. Is this something we deserve to be insulted for?

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To be honest I'm genuinely confused why some people play PA, and this isn't really aimed at you germania. They just set themselves up for the most predictable bland round they can think of and complain when they get bored. It's just bizzare.
I completely agree. Few things have frustrated me as much in the last few rounds.
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Unread 2 Jan 2008, 02:01   #244
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenny
My point was not that 'all white men cant jump', so that 'all cheaters must be sound guys'... but I was highlighting the fact that dealing in absolutes is futile, as there are always exceptions to every rule. I assume you're not disputing that there are exceptions to every rule, are you?
If you cheat then you're not a sound guy. Even if you once were. No exceptions.









(is this really that hard to understand?)
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Unread 2 Jan 2008, 02:05   #245
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Re: a political summary of r24

lokken,
I will never agree with the primacy you and many others place in inspirational leaders. I believe in teams and I believe that in strong teams the leaders inspire the members and the members inspire the leaders and the members inspire each other. I think Fury made Sid as much as Sid made Fury. I do not think that apathetic command produces apathetic players in PA I think that the members and command all got apathetic together as the game has declined. I think a strong leader or strong leaders could produce some level of excitement in PA today but I think in the long term they would find it impossible to fight the general apathy caused by PA's decline.

Anyway having more inspiring leaders like any number of improvements would have made CT better and made up the tiny difference with ND. I certainly won't argue with that, I guess im just making the always silly mistake of taking issue with JBG's rhetoric. It was a frustrating round and I want to call people retards too.
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Unread 2 Jan 2008, 02:29   #246
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Re: a political summary of r24

Quote:
Originally Posted by K-W
There won't be a game next round if everyone who just plays in normal alliances stops playing because it isn't exciting enough.
Maybe you should, I dunno, try and make your own round more exciting.



Quote:
What is way off is your reading if you think I have implied anything at all about your overall work in Planetarion. I am talking about the specific issue of organizing alliances right now in PA as the game continues to die.

As unexciting as it may be, boring alliances like CT and others continue to provide most of the members of this game with a place to play, without which they probably wouldn't.
With which they steadily aren't.


Quote:
CT barely failed for a variety of reasons. Yes CT HC is not marked by inspirational personalities. I disagree that this is the only genuine type of leadership. Regardless, perhaps if we had more of that type of leadership we would have won... how does that make us idiots? It wasn't a choice we made, we are playing the hand we are dealt and that hand includes a fairly humble and shy group of people. Is this something we deserve to be insulted for?
It's not a personality issue. It's a competency issue. Last round ct had things like ronin pnapping urwins and nothing was done about it. The fact nothing was done makes people lose faith in their leadership. Sure kicking him would have probably lost you the round (which you lost anyways in the end) but you're going to face the same sorts of situations if you play again because people just won't respect you.

For any alliance to succeed and survive long term you need to establish institutional loyalty. Better to do that with 20 people than 70 sometimes.
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Unread 2 Jan 2008, 02:54   #247
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Re: a political summary of r24

We worked to resolve the pnap issues with ronin and dauthi, ronin we resolved and dauthi we removed all access and any method of getting defence from the alliance untill he dropped the pnap, which he did when his exams finnished.

maybe we would of done better if people like you stepped up to help out but i guess complaining is easyer to do.
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Unread 2 Jan 2008, 03:08   #248
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Re: a political summary of r24

Ronin you resolved by doing nothing. It takes precisely one night at most to resolve anything like that. What you did could perhaps best be characterised as "bending over" not "genuine leadership".

To be honest I had no inclination to step up and help ct beyond what I did, I was only really able to commit at the level of an active member. Which I did.
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Unread 2 Jan 2008, 03:16   #249
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Re: a political summary of r24

without kicking someone it is neer impossable to resolve in one night, you need proof he has a nap, then you need proof that the nap is over when he agreed to drop it. im sorry but pa doesnt tick fast enough. anyway you were not hc so why they hell should we tell you every single thing we do?? maybe we should just put an hourly log of our hc channel onto AD.
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Unread 2 Jan 2008, 03:18   #250
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Re: a political summary of r24

Proof is easy. "Hi, launch on this planet please." You don't have to tell me anything. You don't have to win either. Accomplished both didn't we!
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