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Unread 8 May 2010, 18:24   #101
Hunterrrr
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Still we ended above you!
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Unread 8 May 2010, 18:25   #102
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

you sure did, and if it would only reflect activity i am sure it is well deserved!
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Unread 8 May 2010, 18:30   #103
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Yes we were lucky we were fenced to excessum cause wishmaster could have roided us all in 1 wave to death!
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Unread 8 May 2010, 18:31   #104
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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Originally Posted by Hunterrrr View Post
Yes we were lucky we were fenced to excessum cause wishmaster could have roided us all in 1 wave to death!
oh, ehm, sure!

Damn right he would have!
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Quote:
Originally posted by Newt
I would give me right testicle to be in a gal with you wishmaster!!! wonder if thatd be enough to bribe spinner with hmmmm
<JC`> i sent him a msg saying Wishmaster 0wns, so he recalled
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Unread 8 May 2010, 18:58   #105
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wishmaster View Post
You napped the mighty force of eXcessum. ****ing fencers!
Would surely have taken you all down if not

There are ALWAYS reasons why people break an agreement / backstab someone. Pointing it out over and over doesnt change the fact that alot of people lost trust with asc for comming rounds. You did get the top planet though, and dedin is a worthy winner.
You did ruin BA's chance of staying on top man I'm not saying people are wrong in hating us for the move we made, we would have been pissed off with vision if they did they same thing to dedin for sure. But at the same time this was not a move against Vision as an alliance (we had actually offered to defend Dmnts before, heck Henrik even asked me for asc def on 12:3 against some apprime wave on him), it was against a player who we felt had violated the rules. I know that Santa could do/say nothing about dmnts being treated different than all other players in vision, that's why I felt we had to.

It all came down to dedin being good friends with cardi anyway, even with cronix and tronick pushing for apprime to stay away from 12:3 cardi still decided what to do. You can be sure if it had been me up there instead of dedin, I would have gotten inc till I hit 1k roids
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Unread 8 May 2010, 21:54   #106
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

I'm getting fairly tired of constant flaming in this thread. Knock it off.
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Unread 8 May 2010, 22:06   #107
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

tbh people didn't trust/like asc to begin with, so who gives a smurf.
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Unread 9 May 2010, 02:01   #108
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

lol Dedin thanks for mentioning me on an EORC

GG all
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Unread 9 May 2010, 02:04   #109
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zotnam View Post
You did ruin BA's chance of staying on top man I'm not saying people are wrong in hating us for the move we made, we would have been pissed off with vision if they did they same thing to dedin for sure. But at the same time this was not a move against Vision as an alliance (we had actually offered to defend Dmnts before, heck Henrik even asked me for asc def on 12:3 against some apprime wave on him), it was against a player who we felt had violated the rules. I know that Santa could do/say nothing about dmnts being treated different than all other players in vision, that's why I felt we had to.

It all came down to dedin being good friends with cardi anyway, even with cronix and tronick pushing for apprime to stay away from 12:3 cardi still decided what to do. You can be sure if it had been me up there instead of dedin, I would have gotten inc till I hit 1k roids
tbh, the MAIN reason eXcessum played last reason was / is based on a conversation I had with JBG.

We both agreed Planetarion has been shit the last year ( s ) and that we should force the active part ( the skilled part ) into smaller groups.

However, unlike JBG told me, asc went ahead and played with a "full" tag.
I dont know why, I m sure JBG will tell me why.
I kinda felt a bit "****ed over" as I saw how the round would progress, but that ok! Since it was Pommehs last round I wnet ahead with it!!!

I am too drunk to actually make any sense in what I am typing atm, but what some thought would be a round with smal tags and a laid back round, eventually ended up in somethign shit. AKA the round you just played.

Next time I will just ignore JBG cause hes full of shit ? <3

NN!
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Quote:
Originally posted by Newt
I would give me right testicle to be in a gal with you wishmaster!!! wonder if thatd be enough to bribe spinner with hmmmm
<JC`> i sent him a msg saying Wishmaster 0wns, so he recalled
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Unread 9 May 2010, 02:08   #110
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Right, one more point.

Can someone drop their real life and sort a PA alliance for next round?

A proper alliance which will actually fight to win a round?

I tried, but I failed. So I am no competent to do it! Someone else ruin their summer!
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Quote:
Originally posted by Newt
I would give me right testicle to be in a gal with you wishmaster!!! wonder if thatd be enough to bribe spinner with hmmmm
<JC`> i sent him a msg saying Wishmaster 0wns, so he recalled
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Unread 9 May 2010, 02:29   #111
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wishmaster View Post
tbh, the MAIN reason eXcessum played last reason was / is based on a conversation I had with JBG.

We both agreed Planetarion has been shit the last year ( s ) and that we should force the active part ( the skilled part ) into smaller groups.

However, unlike JBG told me, asc went ahead and played with a "full" tag.
I dont know why, I m sure JBG will tell me why.
I kinda felt a bit "****ed over" as I saw how the round would progress, but that ok! Since it was Pommehs last round I wnet ahead with it!!!

I am too drunk to actually make any sense in what I am typing atm, but what some thought would be a round with smal tags and a laid back round, eventually ended up in somethign shit. AKA the round you just played.

Next time I will just ignore JBG cause hes full of shit ? <3

NN!
I told you ****ing nothing. http://pastebin.com/dxyvQwrd was our conversation. All I was talking about was that having a dominant alliance makes the game shit right now. Maybe you should stop making stuff up as you go along!
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Unread 9 May 2010, 02:45   #112
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

well jbg, u kinda "imply" that you will not be running asc full style.
I got the impression people would let a shit alliance ( like ND ) win a round.

You never DIRECTLY told me you would be asc again in a "full" tag. I am sorry.

I am quite drunk

Tbh though, that conversation was the main reason I didnt stay in apprime last round.

If I had, I spose apprime would have bashed the living shit out of any other alliance, like all other rounds they have while being at full strenght.

Being cocky is cool !
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Quote:
Originally posted by Newt
I would give me right testicle to be in a gal with you wishmaster!!! wonder if thatd be enough to bribe spinner with hmmmm
<JC`> i sent him a msg saying Wishmaster 0wns, so he recalled
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Unread 9 May 2010, 11:51   #113
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Have you actually looked at Asc last round? We were not exactly a 'war machine'.
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Unread 9 May 2010, 12:04   #114
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

I didn't think it was possible for an alliance to yawn into 3rd place before this round.
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Unread 9 May 2010, 13:41   #115
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wishmaster View Post
well jbg, u kinda "imply" that you will not be running asc full style.
Which I didn't do?

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After all you've certainly got the history to back it up!
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Unread 10 May 2010, 00:48   #116
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Seriously what was the big crime here ?
asc members left tag - hit 1 vsn member (whom broke some rules himself)
and VSN still won r36 - While asc could have done this same move without their members leaving two weeks ago - cause the VSN officer certainly didn't go against certain nap rules on the last day.

i only see one big issue here, that is members/officers playing for personal gain,
fencing gals, and not following the best interest of there alliance,
Im pretty sure if asc was playing active, dmnts wouldn't haven gotten to be top 50 even.

but i guess this is just drunk talk of me
Alcohol makes me see thing clear tho.
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Unread 10 May 2010, 01:01   #117
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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Originally Posted by HeimdallR View Post
Seriously what was the big crime here ?
Maybe the problem is the constant need to justify game political actions in a fashion where they'd somehow be morally right or wrong, which is just quite tiring by definition.
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Unread 10 May 2010, 01:02   #118
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

second thing i want to say, wich is probably related to this round and how things went on.

Private VS random gals.
tbfh i expected more "big players" to grow some balls and go fully random, (wich probably will happen next round). Private gals failed this round, the only thing that gave private gals some "breathing room" was the fact that all other "active" players took some time to get into same gals.

afterwards certain private gals took a beating cause:
1. Cause alliances couldn't compete with 26 members fenced gals anymore ( well they could have but people just didn't put the best interest of the alliance as a priority)
2. Some of those who went into private gals, prolly could have done better in random ones cause they weren't active enough.

Im not really looking forward to ROUND 2 of private vs random gals,
next round im expecting gal 1 - 5 to be completely random but with the most active players out there.

This all being said, im prolly don't have the most clear view on this seeing i started late.
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Unread 10 May 2010, 01:03   #119
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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Originally Posted by Tietäjä View Post
Maybe the problem is the constant need to justify game political actions in a fashion where they'd somehow be morally right or wrong, which is just quite tiring by definition.
agreed
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Unread 10 May 2010, 01:05   #120
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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Originally Posted by Zotnam View Post
How is this in any way close to how the reality was? In the end, there were 3 alliances who could not hit our gal, that's it.
Who where these 3 alliances? I didn't play this round, but i'd imagine it's 3 of of the top 5 alliances you napped, I could even loosen that up a bit and say 3 of the top 10. Now, since there are only 10 alliances playing. 3 of these you're napped to. 3 of these are to shit to hit you. 1 of these don't have the balls to hit you. That leaves 3 alliances, one of which, is yours?

You say there's only 3 alliances that couldn't hit you, others may say there's only 2 alliances that could hit you.
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Unread 10 May 2010, 01:32   #121
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

so you're saying that some alliances are too shit to hit them and this makes them fencesitters?
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Unread 10 May 2010, 01:51   #122
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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Originally Posted by VampiriA View Post
12:3 outplayed all the private gals in the uni.
HAHAHAHAHA

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Originally Posted by HeimdallR View Post
Private gals failed this round
What? Back this kind of statement up with some justification please.
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Originally Posted by HeimdallR View Post
the only thing that gave private gals some "breathing room" was the fact that all other "active" players took some time to get into same gals.
No idea what this means.

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afterwards certain private gals took a beating cause:
When? This quite simply isn't true.

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Originally Posted by HeimdallR View Post
1. Cause alliances couldn't compete with 26 members fenced gals anymore ( well they could have but people just didn't put the best interest of the alliance as a priority)
How is hitting 26 really small planets, quite a lot of which are below people's bash limits, in any alliance's best interest?

People need to understand and appreciate that galaxy ranks don't have as much meaning this last round as they have had in the past.


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Originally Posted by HeimdallR View Post
2. Some of those who went into private gals, prolly could have done better in random ones cause they weren't active enough.
Truth.
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Unread 10 May 2010, 04:21   #123
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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Originally Posted by HeimdallR View Post
Seriously what was the big crime here ?
asc members left tag - hit 1 vsn member (whom broke some rules himself)
and VSN still won r36 - While asc could have done this same move without their members leaving two weeks ago - cause the VSN officer certainly didn't go against certain nap rules on the last day.

i only see one big issue here, that is members/officers playing for personal gain,
fencing gals, and not following the best interest of there alliance,
Im pretty sure if asc was playing active, dmnts wouldn't haven gotten to be top 50 even.

but i guess this is just drunk talk of me
Alcohol makes me see thing clear tho.
how did Dmnts break some Asc nap rules? *hint* he didnt. He may of broke some Vision rules but thats within the alliance...

I dont blame Asc for doing what they did, it was the only way to get Dedin the win. However, it was a shit move to do and from an alliance which used to pride itself on never breaking agreements, it makes it even more shit.

If Asc was playing active and in full tag, the whole round would of been different, Dedin might not of even been top50. You cant use that argument for anything. If this or if that, those things different happen.

Asc decided to be shit to get Dedin the win. I dont think anyone disputes the fact, that it was there only choice (as why pass up the chance to get someone to #1 planet you want).. but that doesnt change the fact that it was a shit thing to do.
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Unread 10 May 2010, 05:01   #124
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Gotta love AD whores.

Didn't get top gal? - "We weren't ever trying for it."
Didn't get top ally? - "Never thought we could get it."
Got top planet! - "HOLY ****, THAT WAS THE PLAN ALL ALONG. HOW DID YOU NOT SEE IT HAPPENING, IT WAS CLEAR AS ****ING DAY".

Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

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Unread 10 May 2010, 06:43   #125
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

It was not the plan "all along", it became the plan once we noticed we could pull it off. If at any point during the round we'd thought we could get top gal or top alliance, we would've gone for that, too.
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Unread 10 May 2010, 08:40   #126
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Galaxy rank, in terms of random gals mean **** all, especially if you consider that from 12 3 or 10 4, we could hit I think a grand total of 20 planets in the top 5 random galaxies. That is about 16%. Hillarious if you ask me. And then the cute little random people say 'we pulled it off'

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Unread 10 May 2010, 09:21   #127
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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This is a war game. Playing the game in ways people don't expect is fun. It's more fun because I'm on the side having the fun. I'm sure everyone else is having a shit time because we've done something they don't like. I don't care about your enjoyment of the game. I care about mine.

I don't expect you to agree. I don't think you should agree. I think you should make your complaints, and meanwhile I'll gloat. That way, when you outplay us, you'll have all the more fun being an obnoxious prick about it.
Haha, still the same abnoxious prick you were 4 years ago

I like it though.
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Unread 10 May 2010, 09:38   #128
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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Asc decided to be shit to get Dedin the win. I dont think anyone disputes the fact, that it was there only choice (as why pass up the chance to get someone to #1 planet you want).. but that doesnt change the fact that it was a shit thing to do.
I think the overall oppinion is dedin would have won anyway (at least it has been stated several times), pretty much due to that last Apprime BS attack on Dimentus, landing on the last tick. The Asc FI/CO wave happened to launch on top of that, but after VsN shredded millions of bombers the day before without even touching Apps CR I doubt that you covered it. Got a calc somewhere? I´m really interested.

I still find it pretty hilaroius though we could just have cancelled the NAP ingame as we were totally mistaken about expiring time. That´s just SO awesome

Oh, and I totally agree (didn´t think it would come to this) about using "if this or that was different" as an argument is pretty useless. At least when trying to predict anything but really really short term differences (as in "if VsN would have hit dedin, Dmnts prolly would have won" - that´s short term enough to be actually likely).
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Unread 10 May 2010, 09:49   #129
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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how did Dmnts break some Asc nap rules? *hint* he didnt. He may of broke some Vision rules but thats within the alliance...
Maybe he didn't, but other members of VsN sure did defend Apprime against Ascendancy. From the top of my head I can mention tocx, booji could also name one. With that in mind, I can only say that there's quite a bit of hypocrisy in your (VsN's) posts.
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Unread 10 May 2010, 10:24   #130
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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Originally Posted by _Kila_ View Post
so you're saying that some alliances are too shit to hit them and this makes them fencesitters?
I'm not saying Asc are fence sitters, but there aren't many alliances that could hit them, and the ones that could, they napped them...
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Unread 10 May 2010, 10:36   #131
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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I'm not saying Asc are fence sitters, but there aren't many alliances that could hit them, and the ones that could, they napped them...
There have been many alliances that couldn´t hit us in the past, they usually just brought friends and did it anyway.
Noone is impossible to hit (except for really fenced faggots) - success however might be a different matter.

For the record, I think we were napped to VsN and eXcessum - while you can argue the first one "fenced" us a little, napping eXcessum wasn´t quite a major impact (considering overall activity and number of players - don´t get me wrong, I really like excessum, but I think there were more powerful allies around ).
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Unread 10 May 2010, 12:30   #132
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

We weren't hit a lot because we weren't actively competing for number 1, not because we were napped to everyone and their dog. There was just no point hitting us.
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Unread 10 May 2010, 12:36   #133
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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Originally Posted by Scott View Post
I'm not saying Asc are fence sitters, but there aren't many alliances that could hit them, and the ones that could, they napped them...
You can hit anyone if you team up.. I guess other alliances failed to sell the idea of attacking asc because we were pretty much doing nothing all round anyway. During the whole round the only alliances we really attacked were DLR and Apprime (and 1 night on ND before we agreed on avoidance). Apprime managed to piss off every alliance in the uni pretty much, which goes a long way to explaining why people wanted to attack them. Even so, p3n/CT/App/DLR were all without asc ties, surely that would be enough to hurt us

Also, after the first part of your sentence I was totally expecting a thinly veil threat
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Cat: 8th (r54), 9th(r48), 12th (r55), 20th(r32), 77th(r23), 103rd(r38), 150th(r34), 152nd(r24),
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Unread 10 May 2010, 13:48   #134
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Dedin would have won if no ships were launched on him or dimentus in the first place. Unless someone crashdonated on either of them, but history has shown that admins would have removed it.

The Apprime CR/BS wave was landing on dimentus. it was so clear that we were landing, that we didnt even bother to finish the calc. Mostly thanks to their suicidal def the day before.

It is pretty clear that dimentus was not cheated of a win.
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Unread 10 May 2010, 14:02   #135
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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Originally Posted by _Kila_ View Post
so you're saying that some alliances are too shit to hit them and this makes them fencesitters?
Im saying a gal with 26 players with 2 - 3 members of every top 10 alliance almost automatically became fenced.

my gal 4 5 was a good example of that, except for the random incomings i don't think we were hit by any alliance in the last 10 days.
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Unread 10 May 2010, 17:59   #136
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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Knowing us, we'll outlast your goldfish memories (again).

Remember when we were nothing but an XP alliance? Or just a bunch of planet rank whores? Or when we won every ****ing round we played?

Ascendancy is a lot of things, at different times. Right now, we're the guys who pulled the hilariously awesome dick move. Personally, I think it's pretty great.
Yo, I remember that son!
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Unread 11 May 2010, 00:32   #137
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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Originally Posted by ricoshay View Post
Maybe he didn't, but other members of VsN sure did defend Apprime against Ascendancy. From the top of my head I can mention tocx, booji could also name one. With that in mind, I can only say that there's quite a bit of hypocrisy in your (VsN's) posts.
Dmnts did defend apprime against ascendancy. In fairness that wasn't in the explicitly agreed NAP rules pre-NAP agreeing though. Not that us all leaving tag with 8 ticks to go to **** over dmnts was expressly prohibited either.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott
I'm not saying Asc are fence sitters, but there aren't many alliances that could hit them, and the ones that could, they napped them...
We were the last of the top 7 alliances to agree on an actual NAP with anyone. Sure we didn't get hit that much but that's because, once again, I outplayed you all. Cue my theme music.
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Unread 11 May 2010, 02:45   #138
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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Cue my theme music.
That songs kind of gay-camp. Really does fit you man.

Why didn't you go for this instead though?
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Unread 11 May 2010, 10:57   #139
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Right so.. after browsing through 3 pages of crap the best move asc managed to make was leaving tag and hitting 1 planet? And others making a big deal out of it? great, just great
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Unread 11 May 2010, 11:18   #140
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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And others making a big deal out of it? great, just great
Whiners need to whine just as ruiners need to ruin!
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Unread 11 May 2010, 11:24   #141
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Would dedin have won without asc hitting Dimentus?
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Unread 11 May 2010, 11:31   #142
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Most likely, yeah.
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Unread 11 May 2010, 12:29   #143
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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Would dedin have won without asc hitting Dimentus?
I suppose he could have let all vision anti cr/bs suicide on his place and have all the co home to leech salvage, since it was last tick I don't think it would be enough though.
If he had lost because of apprime waving him, there would be whine about apprime helping ascendancy instead so shrug
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Planets.
Zik: 3rd(r30), 4th(r52), 7th(r27), 9th(r26), 31st(r51)
Ter: 3rd(r50), 4th(r53), 4th(r37), 5th(r31) 7th (r58)
Xan: 3rd(r36), 40th(r57) 54th(r33), 104th(r29)
Cat: 8th (r54), 9th(r48), 12th (r55), 20th(r32), 77th(r23), 103rd(r38), 150th(r34), 152nd(r24),
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Unread 11 May 2010, 13:53   #144
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

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We were the last of the top 7 alliances to agree on an actual NAP with anyone. Sure we didn't get hit that much but that's because, once again, I outplayed you all. Cue my theme music.
Sometimes i get the feeling you forget people arent puppets you can control.
The people who let you grow, are the same people who can make you eat your words.
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Unread 11 May 2010, 15:28   #145
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Wow. Just wow.
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Unread 11 May 2010, 17:51   #146
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

I'm impressed that ****ing anyone actually thought I was serious.




Bar hanzi. These days I expect hanzi is frothing at the mouth any time I post on AD.
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Unread 11 May 2010, 21:04   #147
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Funny how some people of an alliance that contantly seeks new ways of playing the game and having fun can simply decide on the behalf of the community as a whole that fencing and napping is bad, evil and shit... Why do you feel the need to justify your actions by telling shit like that? You, of all, knows that the joy of pa comes from the diversity of the game mechanics. Be it fencing, fortressing, cov opping, donating or whatever.

As for VsN going for fence and a shitload of naps as a plan for the round, and for officers only playing for their own planet/gain, shut your trap(will elaborate if you're stupid enough to find this statement untrue/wrong/unrealistic)

With a slight fear of calling you stupid; STOP BEING STUPID AND STOP BELIEVING EVERYONE ELSE IS MORE STUPID THAN YOUR STUPID SELF!
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Unread 11 May 2010, 21:13   #148
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrunkenViking View Post
Funny how some people of an alliance that contantly seeks new ways of playing the game and having fun can simply decide on the behalf of the community as a whole that fencing and napping is bad, evil and shit... Why do you feel the need to justify your actions by telling shit like that? You, of all, knows that the joy of pa comes from the diversity of the game mechanics. Be it fencing, fortressing, cov opping, donating or whatever.

As for VsN going for fence and a shitload of naps as a plan for the round, and for officers only playing for their own planet/gain, shut your trap(will elaborate if you're stupid enough to find this statement untrue/wrong/unrealistic)
Were you stoned when you wrote this post? We didn't do anything on behalf of the community. We did it on behalf of us in order to have something to do. I don't feel the need to justify what we did to anyone. You can, of course, ask for my/our reasons for doing things. We did not accuse VsN of fencing (although, for the record, intentional or not, that's how it ended up). I can't believe anyone planned out the political course of this round so I severely doubt your HC went in with the intention of napping anyone in particular. As regards officers in general playing for their own gain I said one did, and that's why we hit him. There was nothing said about VsN as a whole, other people mentioned other vsn members who defended apprime ingal. If you feel this reflects badly on yourself that's your problem. In my opinion this had nothing to do with VsN. I think santa's a top man and he definitely deserved the round win for vsn. I think dmnts is a selfish planet/gal rank whore who deserved to end up with neither.
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Last edited by JonnyBGood; 11 May 2010 at 21:55.
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Unread 11 May 2010, 21:47   #149
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

Quote:
Originally Posted by HaNzI View Post
Sometimes i get the feeling you forget people arent puppets you can control.
Your mum is!
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Unread 11 May 2010, 22:05   #150
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Re: Asc/THINLYVEILEDTHREAT

I agree with everyone who has read this thread and not posted a response.
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