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Unread 9 Apr 2008, 11:55   #1
midge5
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The Australian Incestuous Couple

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A South Australian woman has given birth to her father's son after the couple had intercourse

John and Jenny Deaves reunited 30 years after Mr Deaves separated from Jenny's mother.

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Jenny was 31 and just two weeks after meeting, father and daughter had -.

"John and I are in this relationship as consenting adults," Mrs Deaves told the Nine Network.

"We are just asking for a little bit of respect and understanding."

Their nine month old daughter Celeste, shown on TV, appears fit and healthy.

Mrs Deaves said soon after reuniting with her father she began to see him as a man first and her father second.

"I was looking at him, sort of going, oh, he's not too bad.

"Like you might look at a man across the bar at a nightclub."

Mrs Deaves brought two children, Samantha and Alex, into the relationship after splitting from her former partner.

Mr Deaves admitted that he "initially" thought having - with his daughter was wrong.

"Emotions take over, as people no doubt realise, there are times during your life where emotions do rule the heart, it rules the head," he said.

"I knew it was illegal, of course I knew it was illegal but you know, so what."

Mrs Deaves said the physical relationship with her father was like "a sexual relationship with any other man".

For Mr Deaves the sexual relationship was "absolutely fantastic".

A South Australian police media spokesman told AAP "the couple is being monitored".

Personally I don't really have much problem with what they have done. They were both consenting adults so who cares.

I don't agree with them having children though, it is quite screwed up due to the increased risk of genetic disorder. However, one problem is at what point do we say, no that potential deformity isn't bad enough for the government to legislate on? Are two haemophiliacs okay, but then not two MS sufferers? What about two mentally retarded people? If the government is going to legislate on that basis are you going to stop two blind people dating due to the increased risk of their child being blind? Stop anyone with aids ever having children? You could even stretch it to two people who both have family history of cancer not being allowed to have children due to the increased risk in the future.


The worst thing they did for me though is go public with their relationship. They should have buggered off to a new town where no one knew them and that way they could have raised their children in a normal life which is probably going to be .
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Unread 9 Apr 2008, 13:05   #2
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Re: The Australian Incestuous Couple

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Originally Posted by midge5
They should have buggered off to a new town where no one knew them
Why? You just said you had no problem with it, why do you care if they go public with it?

As for your main argument, it's a gray area. Assuming one is at all willing to let the government manage which couples are allowed to have children, I think what you'll end up looking at is
1) onset of disease (at birth? at 20? at 60?)
2) quality of life after the onset of disease (itchy feet or wheelchair bound?)
3) (increase of) chance of disease being transmitted to child
4) possibility of determining the presence of the disease in an embryo or fetus (allowing for abortion)

I however do not believe governments should be involved in any way in a couple's choice to get children or not.
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Unread 9 Apr 2008, 14:06   #3
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Re: The Australian Incestuous Couple

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Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk
Why? You just said you had no problem with it, why do you care if they go public with it?
Because their children's lives will probably be a nightmare now. It seems unlikely they will get through school with no bullying.

The reason I said move is, as far as I am aware their old area knew what had happened so again it was just to make their children's lives easier (Won't someone think of the children!). Obviously giving in to the mob discrimination isn't the best thing to do but I can't help feeling that going on national tv hasn't helped them.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk
I however do not believe governments should be involved in any way in a couple's choice to get children or not.
Yeah I'd like to agree with this as it is a dangerous precedent, but I have trouble getting over certain things (like the blind parents and the IVF treatment I mentioned a few weeks ago).
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Unread 9 Apr 2008, 14:30   #4
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Re: The Australian Incestuous Couple

Here's a link on the story.
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Unread 9 Apr 2008, 15:03   #5
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Re: The Australian Incestuous Couple

Quote:
Originally Posted by midge5
Because their children's lives will probably be a nightmare now. It seems unlikely they will get through school with no bullying.

The reason I said move is, as far as I am aware their old area knew what had happened so again it was just to make their children's lives easier (Won't someone think of the children!). Obviously giving in to the mob discrimination isn't the best thing to do but I can't help feeling that going on national tv hasn't helped them.
Point taken.

Quote:
Originally Posted by midge5
Yeah I'd like to agree with this as it is a dangerous precedent, but I have trouble getting over certain things (like the blind parents and the IVF treatment I mentioned a few weeks ago).
I'm not sure what you're saying here, do you think blind couples should not have children? If so, what makes blind people inherently incapable of fostering children? If not, explain please.
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The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
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Unread 9 Apr 2008, 17:16   #6
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Re: The Australian Incestuous Couple

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Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk
Point taken.


I'm not sure what you're saying here, do you think blind couples should not have children? If so, what makes blind people inherently incapable of fostering children? If not, explain please.

I have no problem with blind couples having children. In the other case they were purposefully selecting eggs which had an increased chance of also being blind. Personally I just felt that was wrong due to the fact they were essentially purposefully handicapping another human.
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Unread 9 Apr 2008, 17:51   #7
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Re: The Australian Incestuous Couple

I'd guess that falls under child abuse, indeed.
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The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
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Unread 9 Apr 2008, 18:15   #8
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Re: The Australian Incestuous Couple

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Oh well, I've no problem with this now. Look at them, who else are they going to ****?
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Unread 9 Apr 2008, 22:53   #9
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Re: The Australian Incestuous Couple

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Originally Posted by midge5
Personally I don't really have much problem with what they have done. They were both consenting adults so who cares..
I tend to agree and yet the term moterf***er still tends to be seen as an insult.
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Unread 10 Apr 2008, 02:51   #10
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Re: The Australian Incestuous Couple

This is bad for the state of West Virginia. We are going to lose our only claim to fame if people around the world start having incestuous relationships. I think the couple should be forced to live out their lives in West Virginia. That would protect the sanctity of incest.
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Unread 12 Apr 2008, 17:24   #11
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Re: The Australian Incestuous Couple

I've never been clear on what genetic deformities occur with incest. Anyone care to explain?
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Unread 14 Apr 2008, 16:01   #12
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Re: The Australian Incestuous Couple

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Originally Posted by QazokRouge5
I've never been clear on what genetic deformities occur with incest. Anyone care to explain?
That is because there is no clear answer. It is probably more accurate to say that a child born out of incest is at greater risk of losing some of their genetic diversity.

Most people would be familier with the concept of dominant & recessive genes (allele), though once again genetics are not nearly as simple as those two distinct categories.

Just in case here is a brief run-down on the difference:

A dominant trait (phenotype) occurs when there is either two dominant genes of the same type or one dominent gene and one recessive gene. (DD or Dr)

A recessive trait only occurs when there are two of the same recessive gene. (rr)

Since we inherit both types from our parents what traits make up a person depends very much on their culteral background and genetic history.

By having parents who are close relatives you increase the chances that the child will inherit identical recessive genes and therefore inherit more recessive traits than would normally occur.

That does not mean all recessive genes are bad, some are perfectly normal things like eye colour, others may determine whether a person has a certain genetic disorder. Dominant genes can also carry genetic disorders, but the process of natural selection means people with undesirable dominant traits are usually removed from the gene pool.

In short, a child born out of incest does not have any gaurentee of being born with genetic deformities, this for the most part is urban myth. If the parents have recessive genes that lead to genetic deformities then the child is more likely to inherit those deformities.
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