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Unread 31 Mar 2008, 11:41   #101
_Kila_
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

it's pretty useless if you are serious about doing a law degree, especially since (apparently) most university lecturers seem to prefer having a clear slate to work on.
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Unread 31 Mar 2008, 11:54   #102
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

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Originally Posted by _Kila_
it's pretty useless if you are serious about doing a law degree, especially since (apparently) most university lecturers seem to prefer having a clear slate to work on.
Its the same with pretty much every degree, they would all prefer a group of students who have a clean slate BUT I do suspect part of that's due to it being easier that way. They have to tailor the lectures to suit those with clean slates anyway and it would just be alot easier to keep everyones intrest if everyone started with a clean slate rather than having differing levels of prior knowledge.

From my POV A-Level Computing was fairly useless when it came to my Degree in Computer Science but there were a fair number of people on my A-Level computing course who originaly intended to take Computer Science Degrees but ended up having a change of heart which they may not have had otherwise. As such there would have been alot more people without any real passion and interesting in computing taking up places that would have been better suited for others. And certainly going on my friends and aquentices that took A-Level law its a simerlar story there.

So I do think there's an underlying point for having many of he A-Levels in subjects that have a real acedemnic merit at degree level no matter how watered down the A-Level syllbuss may be and how much relevence it lacks
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Unread 31 Mar 2008, 12:16   #103
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

If it was fairly useless, then I assume your A-Level Computing had nothing or very little to do with your degree in it. If this is the case, then the people who changed their minds did so on the basis of incorrect or incomplete information.
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Unread 31 Mar 2008, 12:33   #104
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk
If it was fairly useless, then I assume your A-Level Computing had nothing or very little to do with your degree in it. If this is the case, then the people who changed their minds did so on the basis of incorrect or incomplete information.
Its not that it had nothing to do with anything on the degree, every module of the degree tied back into something on the A-Level course but the A-level course was dealing with things at the lowest level, something which you would basically cover and go beyond in the first lecture of each degree module. You could have got by without the A-Level computing, infact many did (a couple of the mature students barely knew how to turn a pc on and load word on day 1) but if you did take A-Level computing and got no enjoyment out of it you almost certainly wouldnt have got much out of the Degree as it was the fundementals of A-Level ramped up 10,000 times
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Unread 31 Mar 2008, 14:40   #105
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

So they based their decision on what would be covered in the first half of the first lecture of the courses (modules) students have in the first year. What exactly are you disagreeing with me on?
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Unread 31 Mar 2008, 17:53   #106
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk
So they based their decision on what would be covered in the first half of the first lecture of the courses (modules) students have in the first year. What exactly are you disagreeing with me on?
Its perfectly possible to get an idea if a subject is one you would enjoy investing alot of time and effort into. In this case if you don't enjoy the basic programming on the A-level course you are going to find the programming aspects of any Computer Science course somewhat boring as there will be a significant amount on most. The same goes for much of the other aspects such as computer architecture, databases ect ect that you may only touch the basics with but which your unlikely to have a sudden change in heart about when it gets more indepth and complicated at degree level
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Unread 31 Mar 2008, 19:43   #107
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

A-Level ICT is so very far removed from Computer Science as to be a horrible taster, and I would have been put off doing it had I not known it was a crock of shit. I wish I'd done a 'proper' subject instead of it.
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Unread 31 Mar 2008, 19:48   #108
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

I don't quite understand Wakey on this.

A level law is pointless because we are a common law system. Such systems build laws they don't start with them. The building blocks are cases (case law). In A level law students do not read cases. Thus there is no point because even if you summarise cases to a digestible level you inevitably leave out the thinking, the minute a new case comes out (which could be any day) what you have told the student is wrong and the student can not understand why everything has changed.

I have no idea whether or not computer science is like that.
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Unread 31 Mar 2008, 22:03   #109
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
I don't quite understand Wakey on this.

A level law is pointless because we are a common law system. Such systems build laws they don't start with them. The building blocks are cases (case law). In A level law students do not read cases. Thus there is no point because even if you summarise cases to a digestible level you inevitably leave out the thinking, the minute a new case comes out (which could be any day) what you have told the student is wrong and the student can not understand why everything has changed.

I have no idea whether or not computer science is like that.
Its all well and good wanting an A-Level Law system which has you spending hours discussing case law but its not viable or for that matter of any use to 99% of people who take it. You have 4-5 hours a week of lectures per subject at A-level which is not enough to even scratch the surface with so many area's of law and the complexity.

Surely the point of the course is to give the masses who take it a fundamental understanding of key elements, I myself on my Computer Science Degree had a law module who's aim was to do the very same thing and give us a grounding in the key laws that were connected with computing. It wasnt supposed to make us legal experts or even have us fully understand the big picture. TBH its probally the module that ive had the most RL use from atm even though those of you with law degrees would probally scoff at it. It was also enough of an introduction to see the top of our class have their intrest sparked enough to end up going on to take a law degree after completing the Computer Science one. I would assume its probally the same for alot of people who take A-Level law, its enough to decide if the interest is strong enough to continue and for those that don't gives them enough knowledge about the law to be useful in every day life.

I certainly don't believe one bit that A-Level Law is supposed to be that useful for your degree, just like most A-Levels aren't really supposed to be useful for you passing a Degree. Same goes for GCSE's which arent really useful for either A-Levels or Degrees (Infact I always remember GCSE science where the teachers would at times tell us that what they were teaching us wasn't strictly right but was a bastardised version as the fully correct version was beyond the scope of the syllbuss)
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Unread 31 Mar 2008, 22:29   #110
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

No, A level law makes it worse, because it gives you an entirely wrong impression of the subject, in terms of the way you think.
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Unread 1 Apr 2008, 07:56   #111
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

Quote:
Originally Posted by wakey
Its all well and good wanting an A-Level Law system which has you spending hours discussing case law
I don't recall saying I wanted such a thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wakey
but its not viable or for that matter of any use to 99% of people who take it.
You don't seem able to understand my point about use.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wakey
You have 4-5 hours a week of lectures per subject at A-level which is not enough to even scratch the surface with so many area's of law and the complexity.
Which is another good argument against a level law.

Why are you still waffling on about this when you can't grasp what I'm saying and clearly have no idea what you are talking about?
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Unread 1 Apr 2008, 12:48   #112
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

Quote:
Originally Posted by wakey
Its all well and good wanting an A-Level Law system which has you spending hours discussing case law but its not viable or for that matter of any use to 99% of people who take it. You have 4-5 hours a week of lectures per subject at A-level which is not enough to even scratch the surface with so many area's of law and the complexity.
I did it at night and went once a week for three hours (plus break).
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Unread 1 Apr 2008, 20:38   #113
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

Would you say it was less useless if it was given another name (such as Crime Studies or something) ?
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Unread 1 Apr 2008, 22:56   #114
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

Er.
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Unread 2 Apr 2008, 00:58   #115
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

Quote:
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Would you say it was less useless if it was given another name (such as Crime Studies or something) ?
Dont english children already have significant 'practical experience' with a unit like that already, given recent whinging in the Press?

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Unread 2 Apr 2008, 15:03   #116
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mzyxptlk
Er.
I was only being half-serious. The main gripe that Yahwe (and, I assume, furball?) have is that A-level Law does not prepare you for degree-level Law in any shape or form. So if it was given a different name, would they still say it was useless?

Religious Studies was recently "dressed up" at my school as Philosophy and Ethics. In turn, the number of pupils choosing it as GCSE increased as it sounds more interesting. It's pretty much the same syllabus and exam though. Ridiculous.
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Unread 2 Apr 2008, 19:35   #117
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

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Originally Posted by Tomkat
I was only being half-serious. The main gripe that Yahwe (and, I assume, furball?) have is that A-level Law does not prepare you for degree-level Law in any shape or form. So if it was given a different name, would they still say it was useless?

Religious Studies was recently "dressed up" at my school as Philosophy and Ethics. In turn, the number of pupils choosing it as GCSE increased as it sounds more interesting. It's pretty much the same syllabus and exam though. Ridiculous.
My main 'gripe' is written above. If you can not understand what I have written ask questions. Do not go off on a frolic of your own.
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Unread 2 Apr 2008, 20:20   #118
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

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there is no point or justification for a'level law

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Originally Posted by Yahwe
A level law is pointless because we are a common law system. Such systems build laws they don't start with them. The building blocks are cases (case law). In A level law students do not read cases.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TomKat
The main gripe that Yahwe (and, I assume, furball?) have is that A-level Law does not prepare you for degree-level Law in any shape or form. So if it was given a different name, would they still say it was useless?

In case you'd forgotten what you wrote, or you'd suddenly changed your stance halfway through the discussion... or whatever. I'm sure you'd never do anything like that though
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Unread 2 Apr 2008, 20:23   #119
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

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In case you'd forgotten what you wrote, or you'd suddenly changed your stance halfway through the discussion... or whatever. I'm sure you'd never do anything like that though
I remember what I write

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
I don't quite understand Wakey on this.

A level law is pointless because we are a common law system. Such systems build laws they don't start with them. The building blocks are cases (case law). In A level law students do not read cases. Thus there is no point because even if you summarise cases to a digestible level you inevitably leave out the thinking, the minute a new case comes out (which could be any day) what you have told the student is wrong and the student can not understand why everything has changed.

I have no idea whether or not computer science is like that.

I also remember idiocy.

Be careful little one.
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Unread 3 Apr 2008, 10:35   #120
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomkat
I was only being half-serious. The main gripe that Yahwe (and, I assume, furball?) have is that A-level Law does not prepare you for degree-level Law in any shape or form. So if it was given a different name, would they still say it was useless?

Religious Studies was recently "dressed up" at my school as Philosophy and Ethics. In turn, the number of pupils choosing it as GCSE increased as it sounds more interesting. It's pretty much the same syllabus and exam though. Ridiculous.
That is a somewhat appalling move. Do you teach in a religious school?
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Unread 3 Apr 2008, 11:12   #121
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Re: GIF Ad Banners

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That is a somewhat appalling move. Do you teach in a religious school?
No. Most of the topics are about ethics though (abortion, euthanasia, relationships, etc) and the views that people have on them, so the name is probably more suited anyway.
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