Combat Question

[MrLobster]

Ship Loss

Ships lost in combat are calculated lowest initiative to highest, with ships firing at each initiative, then the number of destroyed/frozen/stolen ships being applied before moving on to the next initiative.

The formula for losses (regular, EMP or steal) for each initiative is:

dead ships = (total damage on class/number of ships in class) * (number of ships/armour of ships)

Note that the total damage field is dependant on the TYPE of damage. There are a total of 6 damage fields in the combat engine. 3 for attackers and defenders. the three fields for each are : Normal Damage, EMP damage and Steal damage. They all use the above formula to work out the number of ships affected.


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My question, you have a frigate which targets corvette, and there are 3 diff types of Corvette in the fleet. How does it seperate the shots between each set of corvettes?

e.g.
Defenders:
1000 Tzen (FR)

Attackers:
Fireblade (Co) = 2500
Arrowhead (Co) = 5000
Thief (Co) = 10000

How do you seperate the 32000 damage, between each CO?

In the old pa it was a ratio of the target.

Fireblade (Co) = 14.28%*
Arrowhead (Co) = 28.57%*
Thief (Co) = 57.14%*

Damage Given
Fireblade (Co) = 4569.6*
Arrowhead (Co) = 9142.4*
Thief (Co) = 18284.8*

*Note: These are not the full decimal calculations.

Is this still the case?

[furball]

I'm fairly sure it's now done on number.

e.g. a fleet of 900 Vsharraks and 100 Daggers - 90% of the shots go to the vsh, 10% to the daggers.

[SpaceMonkey]

Originally Posted by MrLobster

Ship Loss
My question, you have a frigate which targets corvette, and there are 3 diff types of Corvette in the fleet. How does it seperate the shots between each set of corvettes?

e.g.
Defenders:
1000 Tzen (FR)

Attackers:
Fireblade (Co) = 2500
Arrowhead (Co) = 5000
Thief (Co) = 10000

How do you seperate the 32000 damage, between each CO?

In the old pa it was a ratio of the target.

Fireblade (Co) = 14.28%*
Arrowhead (Co) = 28.57%*
Thief (Co) = 57.14%*

Damage Given
Fireblade (Co) = 4569.6*
Arrowhead (Co) = 9142.4*
Thief (Co) = 18284.8*

*Note: These are not the full decimal calculations.

Is this still the case?

It is on number of ships 2500 + 5000 + 10000 = 17500

Fireblade = 32000 * 2500 / 17500 = 4571 damage
Arrowhead = 32000 * 5000 / 17500 = 9142 damage
Thief = 32000* 10000 / 17500 = 18285 damage

So yes, it is still the case.

[Ultimate Newbie]

Indeed, damage is assigned by the proportion of the number of ships of that class as others have said above .

[gormster]

dead ships = (total damage on class/number of ships in class) * (number of ships/armour of ships)
What does "number of ships" mean, as opposed to "number of ships in class"? They can't be the same, as then they would cancel out, making it a stupid formula

[Ultimate Newbie]

Originally Posted by gormster

dead ships = (total damage on class/number of ships in class) * (number of ships/armour of ships)
What does "number of ships" mean, as opposed to "number of ships in class"? They can't be the same, as then they would cancel out, making it a stupid formula

To answer this question it is prolly best explained with an example - note the Underlined values;

The Class is Frigates.
Three Types of frigates in this example; TBT, Sabres, Black Widows.
In a fleet of 10000 Frigates, there are 5000 TBT, 4000 BW and 1000 Sabres.
In a fictional battle, 50 000 units of damage are done to the Frigate class, thus;

5000/10000 (0.5) is the proportion of TBT
4000/10000 (0.4) is the proportion of BW
1000/10000 (0.1) is the proportion of Sabres.

Thus;
50 000 * 0.5 = Damage done to TBT (25 000)
50 000 * 0.4 = Damage done to BW (20 000)
50 000 * 0.1 = Damage done to Sabres (5 000)

Armour:
TBT = 26
BW = 70
Sabres = 34

Thus, to calculate losses;
25000/26 = 961.54 TBT killed (all numbers rounded down thus 961)
20000/70 = 285 BW
5000/34 = 147 Sabres

Now, that formula in the manual which you quoted works out the total losses for just one type of ship, in this case the TBT. So, using the same numbers as the fictional battle above, the formula would be:

Dead Ships = (50000/10000) * (5000/26) = 5 * 192.3 = 961.5 TBT destroyed (decimal errors are due to rounding)

So, to most briefly answer your question, the "Number of Ships" is how many ships of that Type are present in the battle (or rather, present at that initiative level).

[gormster]

good explanation.

[MrLobster]

Now explain how roid capture works!
What happens when two fleets from different races attack at the same tick, how do the roids get distrubuted?

[furball]

By fleet value. If one fleet doesn't have enough pods, the unstolen roids are NOT given to the other fleet, but are simply not stolen.

[MrLobster]

so they are left at the planet or just disappear?

[Banned]

Originally Posted by furball

By fleet value. If one fleet doesn't have enough pods, the unstolen roids are NOT given to the other fleet, but are simply not stolen.

This is incorrect.

If one fleet does not have enough pods, it receives its full share.

If one fleet does not have any (living) pods at the end of combat it receives no pods. The roids disappear.

[Gate]

Is this for round16 PAOL?

I'd like a beta by wednesday afternoon please. I have a journey then. <3

[SepH]

Originally Posted by Banned

This is incorrect.

If one fleet does not have enough pods, it receives its full share.

If one fleet does not have any (living) pods at the end of combat it receives no pods. The roids disappear.

to get a bit further on that seeing its a fun subject

say 2 ppl attack at the same time, player a having 90% of the fleet value but only 1 dagger (not enough to capture 1 roid) players B has 10% value but enough pods to easely make 25% cap
(i assume the 1 dagger isn't killed, emp-ed doens't matter in some cases)

player A would still take home 90% of the total cap, and player B only 10%

now lets asume the dagger dies, players A caps nothing, players B captures 10%, rest of the roids stay at the planet

now lets asume player B's pods are all killed

player A having 1 pods, which can capture 0 roids, both players take home nothing.

now the fun part, if players A pod is stunned, he still receives full cap if player B caps
but they can't capture more roids then they can have captured with the unstunned ships (ie if you can cap only 10%, and the rest of the pods is stunned, you capture 10% which gets divded 90-10% as long as player A keeps his 1 pod)

[KingAlan]

hmm, as for having many different ship types, damage is indeed divided by number of ships of each. But this means that a higher proportion of larger (better-armored) ships would survive.

Let's say we have a Zik attacking a Cat.

Attacker:
Gryphon 1000
Thief 1000

Defender:
Spider 1000
Recluse 300

In this example, you have CO (Gryphon and Thief) Even though there is an equal number of ships of each type, only 283 Gryphons are frozen, yet 980 of the Theives are. (Run this through a battlecalc!) This is because the Gryphon share of the damage is dvided by a much higher armor number [that is what finds out the # of ships killed].

[MrLobster]

one other question:

Do you get salvage for ships that are stolen?

[Ultimate Newbie]

Originally Posted by MrLobster

one other question:

Do you get salvage for ships that are stolen?

No. :\

[MrLobster]

Originally Posted by Ultimate Newbie

No. :\

That has to be a mistake, you still lose ships. Whats the point in defending a zik attack if you cant stop it all, and dont get any salvage...

[Banned]

Originally Posted by MrLobster

That has to be a mistake, you still lose ships. Whats the point in defending a zik attack if you cant stop it all, and dont get any salvage...

You get salvage for the zik ships you kill? You might force a recall?

The problem is that ships still exist, so giving salvage for them would basically create something from nothing.

[paolo]

Originally Posted by Banned

You get salvage for the zik ships you kill? You might force a recall?

The problem is that ships still exist, so giving salvage for them would basically create something from nothing.

and would make shipdonating 'worth it'

[Gate]

Originally Posted by paolo

and would make shipdonating 'worth it'

Not to mention ship trading. :/

[x-dANGEr]

Originally Posted by SepH

to get a bit further on that seeing its a fun subject

say 2 ppl attack at the same time, player a having 90% of the fleet value but only 1 dagger (not enough to capture 1 roid) players B has 10% value but enough pods to easely make 25% cap
(i assume the 1 dagger isn't killed, emp-ed doens't matter in some cases)

player A would still take home 90% of the total cap, and player B only 10%

now lets asume the dagger dies, players A caps nothing, players B captures 10%, rest of the roids stay at the planet

now lets asume player B's pods are all killed

player A having 1 pods, which can capture 0 roids, both players take home nothing.

now the fun part, if players A pod is stunned, he still receives full cap if player B caps
but they can't capture more roids then they can have captured with the unstunned ships (ie if you can cap only 10%, and the rest of the pods is stunned, you capture 10% which gets divded 90-10% as long as player A keeps his 1 pod)

Is this right?