[Football] Chelsea in another tapping-up row

[Phang]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/5238558.stm

now, correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought that actually there weren't tapping up rules with people under 17, rather that money had to be paid through settlement or tribunal (which presumably Chelsea are prepared to do).

Ken Bates is an arse.

[All Systems Go]

He's trying to get £24 million from his old club for two children who will probably never get close to sitting on the bench for the first-team at Chelsea.

I'd be disappointed with him if he did any less.

[wakey]

Originally Posted by Phang

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/5238558.stm

now, correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought that actually there weren't tapping up rules with people under 17, rather that money had to be paid through settlement or tribunal (which presumably Chelsea are prepared to do).

Ken Bates is an arse.

I may be wrong but at under 17 you cant sign a professional contract and until you have
signed a professional contract its your own free will if you walk out and the club isnt entitled to any money.

Now I would assume tapping up rules include approaching an u17 and encouraging them not to sign professional papers with the club they are at


As for Ken Bates being an arse, its more like Roman and Jose are the arses. They think that because they have all this money they are above the law and can do what they like. If its not tapping up players, its kidnapping players, having controlling shares in other clubs or simply just declaring their intrest in any player that any other club is after to screw them over

[Hicks]

Originally Posted by wakey

As for Ken Bates being an arse, its more like Roman and Jose are the arses. They think that because they have all this money they are above the law and can do what they like. If its not tapping up players, its kidnapping players, having controlling shares in other clubs or simply just declaring their intrest in any player that any other club is after to screw them over

You act like this kind of thing is specific to Chelsea and only they do it wakey, that would be the wrong assumption. Also when have Chelsea declared interest in a player to screw someone else up ? It's more like the other way around, every big player who has contact talks coming up has their agent mention that Chelsea are after them to lubricate negotiations (Hello Roberto Carlos who's done this two years in a row).

[wakey]

Originally Posted by Hicks

You act like tapping up is specific to Chelsea and only they do it wakey, that would be the wrong assumption.

I know they arent the only one but as a club chelsea just take the piss with it. They seemingly make no attempt to hide it and when they get caught they spout a load of excuses to explain it and then get away with a fine which is pocket money to Abramavich which then lets them go off and do it again.

Ashley Cole for example, Jose claims he want trying to sign him and has no intention of signing him and all he was doing was asking Cole to hand over information about how Arsenel operate (which even if true is just as bad). They got a measely 200k fine for the club and Jose got the same but now who is he trying to sign, the player he claimed he didnt want Ashley Cole. They will get the player and will pay over the odds just to stop any further action being taken

Obi Mikel is another. Was happy to sign for Man Utd and in prior interviews before Man Utd had gone for him stated he was a Man Utd fan. He then goes missing before declaring how he was forced to sign for Man Utd and always wanted to join Chelsea as he was a life long chelsea fan. Claims are made chelsea are behind it, chelsea deny it but at the same time jose keeps mentioning to the press about how talented Obi Mikel is and how he will make a big impact at chelsea next season. In the end Chelsea pay over the odds just to get Man Utd to drop any action they were taking.

On top of this we have what was clearly illegal approachs for Gerrard and the Meeting they had with Rio and now this. Your always going to have a seedy side to the dealings in football but when a club is caught doing it and so blatently the book should be thrown at them. As it is they are just giving off the message that if you have enough money you can buy yourself out of trouble

[Hicks]

Originally Posted by wakey

Ashley Cole for example, Jose claims he want trying to sign him and has no intention of signing him and all he was doing was asking Cole to hand over information about how Arsenel operate (which even if true is just as bad). They got a measely 200k fine for the club and Jose got the same but now who is he trying to sign, the player he claimed he didnt want Ashley Cole. They will get the player and will pay over the odds just to stop any further action being taken

Obi Mikel is another. Was happy to sign for Man Utd and in prior interviews before Man Utd had gone for him stated he was a Man Utd fan. He then goes missing before declaring how he was forced to sign for Man Utd and always wanted to join Chelsea as he was a life long chelsea fan. Claims are made chelsea are behind it, chelsea deny it but at the same time jose keeps mentioning to the press about how talented Obi Mikel is and how he will make a big impact at chelsea next season. In the end Chelsea pay over the odds just to get Man Utd to drop any action they were taking.

On top of this we have what was clearly illegal approachs for Gerrard and the Meeting they had with Rio and now this. Your always going to have a seedy side to the dealings in football but when a club is caught doing it and so blatently the book should be thrown at them. As it is they are just giving off the message that if you have enough money you can buy yourself out of trouble

I don't think Chelsea deliberately tapped Cole up in order to screw Arsenal up though, I genuinely think they want him, in fact I think he'll sign for them before the season starts. The same with Mikel they didn't just do that to screw United up they did it because they want the player.

Bates is saying he wants points docked from them, I think that would be a fair punnishment but it will never happen.

[Phang]

Originally Posted by wakey

I may be wrong but at under 17 you cant sign a professional contract and until you have
signed a professional contract its your own free will if you walk out and the club isnt entitled to any money.

Now I would assume tapping up rules include approaching an u17 and encouraging them not to sign professional papers with the club they are at

i think the exact ruling is that before signing a professional contract (ie at age 17), players and their agents can talk to whoever they like and sign for whoever they like. However, if their current club offers terms better than their current terms (ie, if kid is on £50 a week at Leeds and Leeds offer a contract of £51 a week) it has to be taken to tribunal.

[wakey]

Originally Posted by Phang

i think the exact ruling is that before signing a professional contract (ie at age 17), players and their agents can talk to whoever they like and sign for whoever they like. However, if their current club offers terms better than their current terms (ie, if kid is on £50 a week at Leeds and Leeds offer a contract of £51 a week) it has to be taken to tribunal.

Ive been looking through the rules to try and confirm this but I havent found it yet. Something intresting I did find mind you is the ability for a player to walk away from his contract freely if he hasnt been used in over 10% of the clubs competative games that he was eligable for over a full season (So basically if your not registered as officially injured or your not banned from playing in a game but are left out of the team for 90%+ of these games then you can walk away)

[isildurx]

Wow I did not know that. Kind of a unknown rule id suppose.

[furball]

Originally Posted by Wakey

Obi Mikel is another. Was happy to sign for Man Utd and in prior interviews before Man Utd had gone for him stated he was a Man Utd fan. He then goes missing before declaring how he was forced to sign for Man Utd and always wanted to join Chelsea as he was a life long chelsea fan. Claims are made chelsea are behind it, chelsea deny it but at the same time jose keeps mentioning to the press about how talented Obi Mikel is and how he will make a big impact at chelsea next season. In the end Chelsea pay over the odds just to get Man Utd to drop any action they were taking.

The incident was a total mess, but basically Obi Mikel had signed a contract with Man U by the time Chelsea came calling. That's why Chelsea had to pay so much money - because they couldn't just get him on compo.

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally Posted by Hicks

I think that would be a fair punnishment but it will never happen.

A fair punishment for operating totally within the rules in a manner which most football clubs operate

It's just Ken Bates being an arse. Again.

[ReligFree]

My limited experience of this comes from Football Manager and i dont think you can approach players over the age of 16 without going through the club first if they have signed a professional contract, which in this case they appear to have done.

The only way to stop Chelsea doing this would be docking points in the Prem, or maybe banning them from cups.

And with the Obi Mikel thing im not fussed by it (as a man utd supporter) we had a guy agree to join us, we didnt pay him a thing, and chelsea then payed us for a player that we havent payed a penny for yet. Works for me. Roll on Carrick.

[MrL_JaKiri]

Originally Posted by ReligFree

which in this case they appear to have done.

They hadn't. They rejected professional terms at Leeds to sign for Chelsea, and even then they were 16 when that happened.

Chelsea aren't exactly squaky clean, but to suggest that they should be strung up for doing something which is perfectly legitimate just makes you look rediculous.

[ReligFree]

ahh right my bad.