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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 15:39   #1
meglamaniac
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How convenient

Yesterday, John Reid was waffling on about how we might have to curb our freedoms in order to defeat terrorist (link).
Today we get a full blown terror takedown.

Now lets be sensible. Clearly I'm not saying it's an omgconspiracy and the government manufactured the whole thing. What I am suggesting is that Mr Reid was in the know about the status of this operation (he is, after all, home secratry) and chose yesterday to make his statement knowing full well what was going to go down today.

That way he gets to come back on TV and go "told you so" to millions.



Of course, I tend to be overly cynical, but I'm not putting this one down to coincidence.
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 15:48   #2
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Re: How convenient

"Short term"

Oh John Reid where did it all go wrong ? First ridiculous immigration quotas and now supporting curbing our freedom, I think the heat is getting to him
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 15:56   #3
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by meglamaniac
What I am suggesting is that Mr Reid was in the know about the status of this operation (he is, after all, home secratry) and chose yesterday to make his statement knowing full well what was going to go down today.
Given that it's been reported that Tony Blair and George Bush knew about this at the weekend, I think it's safe to assume that he would have known yesterday.
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 15:56   #4
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by meglamaniac
Yesterday, John Reid was waffling on about how we might have to curb our freedoms in order to defeat terrorist (link).
Today we get a full blown terror takedown.

Now lets be sensible. Clearly I'm not saying it's an omgconspiracy and the government manufactured the whole thing. What I am suggesting is that Mr Reid was in the know about the status of this operation (he is, after all, home secratry) and chose yesterday to make his statement knowing full well what was going to go down today.

That way he gets to come back on TV and go "told you so" to millions.



Of course, I tend to be overly cynical, but I'm not putting this one down to coincidence.

so ? whats wrong with that.
If he did indeed know about situation (i dont see how he did NOT know about it) everything went according to plan. If he would have known about the situation and terror plan would have succeeded that would have been a thing to discuss. I fail to see a point in your thread.
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 15:59   #5
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Re: How convenient

Well if I have to spell it out:
My point is he's using cheap psychological ploys to trick "the public" (the not-so-bright majority of the public anyway) into supporting his plans. That is not how politicians and the government is supposed to operate. They are supposed to work for the benefit of the people who elected them, not work against the people using scare tactics in an effort to futher a wildly unpopular agenda*. It's indicative of just how shit this country is becoming.

* Here's a handy hint. For "curb freedoms" read "ID cards".
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 16:01   #6
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Re: How convenient

Hasn't Brown said he'll be scrapping ID cards if/when he becomes Prime Minister ?
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 16:02   #7
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Re: How convenient

Not that I'm aware of (I could be wrong) but the Torys have. Cameron for President
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 16:02   #8
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighteh
so ? whats wrong with that.
Ignoring whether it's rather politically cynical or not, it seems a bit dangerous. If his speech was inspired by knowledge of arrests that were about to happen then you could say he was giving a rather big hint to potential suspects.
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 16:14   #9
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by meglamaniac
It's indicative of just how shit this country is becoming.
We saw this coming in 1776.
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 16:15   #10
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by dda
We saw this coming in 1776.
And decided to get there first?

Shazam!
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 18:00   #11
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Talking Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by meglamaniac
Well if I have to spell it out:
My point is he's using cheap psychological ploys to trick "the public" (the not-so-bright majority of the public anyway) into supporting his plans. That is not how politicians and the government is supposed to operate. They are supposed to work for the benefit of the people who elected them, not work against the people using scare tactics in an effort to futher a wildly unpopular agenda*. It's indicative of just how shit this country is becoming.

* Here's a handy hint. For "curb freedoms" read "ID cards".


duuuuuuddee....


what planet are you from !?

since when does those who have more power work for those who have less ? In entire history of this deam planet this has not been the case, it is not in our nature. That not what us, humans, do.
I dont htink that is ever going to change
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 18:24   #12
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dante Hicks
Ignoring whether it's rather politically cynical or not, it seems a bit dangerous. If his speech was inspired by knowledge of arrests that were about to happen then you could say he was giving a rather big hint to potential suspects.
my opinion was well summated* in this post.


*is a word.
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 19:03   #13
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by meglamaniac
And decided to get there first?

Shazam!
No. We still aren't socialists.
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 19:49   #14
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighteh
stuff
You may be happy to accept that. Personally I feel that most of the problem is created by the public blindly accepting or even ignoring what their politicians are doing without asking any real questions until it's already too late. "That's how it is so why should I challenge it" is not a healthy attitude.

It's all very well that public opinion is now firmly against the action in Iraq several years after the event. Maybe if people had actually put 5 minutes thought into it then there wouldn't be such surprise when it all falls down.
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 20:47   #15
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by meglamaniac
You may be happy to accept that. Personally I feel that most of the problem is created by the public blindly accepting or even ignoring what their politicians are doing without asking any real questions until it's already too late. "That's how it is so why should I challenge it" is not a healthy attitude.

It's all very well that public opinion is now firmly against the action in Iraq several years after the event. Maybe if people had actually put 5 minutes thought into it then there wouldn't be such surprise when it all falls down.
Yeh, its all good and jolly in cool pink lighting...
And yes, its ok to ramble about all the issues that are wrong with this world lately or forever, i had done my share of it.
But, atm, what can YOU do besides think for 5 minutes (and i suggest longer periods of time) about the problems we are facing ? what would YOUR solution be to them ? CAN YOU make this world better, and make it work at the same time ? So before calling me unintelligent and giving me shiload of negrep (which i dont really care about) think about what i erally said.

Unless youre plannign to be our next Che, and, quite frankly, as far as i can see, you lack charisma for that, you only spew out random faults of our society, political and other. Pointless, really. Spoken about thousands of times, and guess what ? nothing has changed.

I just care about my well being and well being of people around me. Terrorists got arested, New York sleeps safe (_er) once again. And it is good. And whatever conspiracies led to it, i can give a rats ass about, tbfh.

But you keep on fighting, you, rebel, you...
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 20:59   #16
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by dda
No. We still aren't socialists.
Oh please. Please spot your own country's political analysts' propganda, which has created a nation where people don't get treated in emergency rooms because they don't have the right insurance. The demonisation of nationalised healthcare as a socialist (therefore Communist am i rite) idea is up there with the treatment of the word 'liberal'.
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 21:16   #17
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by furball
which has created a nation where people don't get treated in emergency rooms because they don't have the right insurance...
which country is that?

cuba? mexico?

i guess it could be argued we created israel too, but i really have no idea about their health system.
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 21:27   #18
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by acropolis
which country is that?

cuba? mexico?

i guess it could be argued we created israel too, but i really have no idea about their health system.
The United States of America.
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 21:40   #19
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Re: How convenient

They'll usually treat you without insurance, You just don't always get the best attention, care, or treatment. They do enjoy making you pay out the ass for showing up without insurance though.
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 21:43   #20
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Re: How convenient

So far as I'm aware hospitals in the US are legally required to treat regardless of insurance/money if it's an emergency and/or a case of life or death. I'm not 100% sure i've got that totally correct but the gist is there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mighteh
more stuff
You're certainly living up to your user title.
I haven't called you unintelligent and I haven't given you negative rep.
However, I note that as soon as you feel threatened, which you're somehow implying is down to me, you don't hesitate to start attacking on a personal level. I'll leave you to decide what that says about the strength of your argument.

Defeatism is nothing to be shouting about. If everyone went around with that state of mind we'd still be under the feudal system. It's interesting that as Labour's term goes on and on I'm starting to see a lot more people with strong political views than before, which hopefully indicates the message is starting to get through that Labour in general and Blair in particular have made some staggeringly bad decisions.

What can I do? I can try to draw attention to the (admittedly, increasingly obvious) flaws in the current government. I've certainly made many of my friends stop and think - hopefully they will then pass that on to theirs and so on.
What would I do? It's fairly obvious I have left-wing views. This generally includes not invading various countries on the basis of, at best and taking the government at their word, seriously flawed intelligence.

I can certainly think of more useful things to be doing with my time than trying to disuade dissent.
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Last edited by meglamaniac; 10 Aug 2006 at 21:52.
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 21:50   #21
Mushroom
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hicks
Hasn't Brown said he'll be scrapping ID cards if/when he becomes Prime Minister ?
Far from it.
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Unread 10 Aug 2006, 22:22   #22
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by furball
Oh please. Please spot your own country's political analysts' propganda, which has created a nation where people don't get treated in emergency rooms because they don't have the right insurance. The demonisation of nationalised healthcare as a socialist (therefore Communist am i rite) idea is up there with the treatment of the word 'liberal'.
Actually, one of the crisis in health care in the US is that poor people are inundating emergency health care facilities who, by law, must treat them even if that is for free. People WITH insurance are starting to die because they can't be seen in time because of the glut of illegal aliens. As for our own poor folks, those on the dole or near to it, they are issued health care cards and the local, state and federal governments pick up the tab.

Apparently, spotting the propaganda put out by a country's political propagandists isn't high on you list of priorities if you are accepting what you are told about the world by your media.

No, you are not communists. If you were French THEN you would be a commiunist.

Liberals, at least in the US, are the least liberal people you can find. Most are so self-righteous that is makes my teeth ache.
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Unread 11 Aug 2006, 13:05   #23
Mighteh
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Re: How convenient

Quote:
Originally Posted by meglamaniac
So far as I'm aware hospitals in the US are legally required to treat regardless of insurance/money if it's an emergency and/or a case of life or death. I'm not 100% sure i've got that totally correct but the gist is there.


You're certainly living up to your user title.
I haven't called you unintelligent and I haven't given you negative rep.
However, I note that as soon as you feel threatened, which you're somehow implying is down to me, you don't hesitate to start attacking on a personal level. I'll leave you to decide what that says about the strength of your argument.

Defeatism is nothing to be shouting about. If everyone went around with that state of mind we'd still be under the feudal system. It's interesting that as Labour's term goes on and on I'm starting to see a lot more people with strong political views than before, which hopefully indicates the message is starting to get through that Labour in general and Blair in particular have made some staggeringly bad decisions.

What can I do? I can try to draw attention to the (admittedly, increasingly obvious) flaws in the current government. I've certainly made many of my friends stop and think - hopefully they will then pass that on to theirs and so on.
What would I do? It's fairly obvious I have left-wing views. This generally includes not invading various countries on the basis of, at best and taking the government at their word, seriously flawed intelligence.

I can certainly think of more useful things to be doing with my time than trying to disuade dissent.

A) invading various countries WAS supposed to make my gas cheaper. Hopefully it will in a long run.

B) never implied YOU called me unintelligent. that part of the thread was not targetting you.

C) To start changing this world for the better, you picked a helluva place to start, brotha.

D) By pointing to us some already oobvious flaws you are not really doing anything other then stating what in comparrison might aswell sound like "well, red, is, indeed, red"
I have heard so many political rambles over Bush's term in office, that yours is just one of those, clearly not the best ones, that just start to frustrate you like a bad joke told over and over.

About defeatism... U will find none here, we will find our freedom one possible way, one vote at a time. What do you plan to do ? a revolt ?

John Lennon could not change The Machine, as well as so many other great people... i doubt you are a better man.

I am just sick and tired of people screaming... "oh... boo... Bush... Blair... If i would have been in the office, i would... ideaot.... republican... boo..." and similar incoherent, politically, rants. As to the topic, WHAT THE HELL DID YOU EXPECT, really !

Them releasing all the information, that information hitting them "terrorists", and them reschedueling ? really now.
That yous, whoever it is, actually knew about it, is a GOOD thing.

here we hear that we KNEW about possibility of 9.11 but DIDNT do anything about it. THAT is a reason for concern, not smart, but not very politically right, "something" that your whoeveritis did.
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Unread 11 Aug 2006, 13:07   #24
Mighteh
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Re: How convenient

Oh, and...

Quote:
Originally Posted by meglamaniac
You're certainly living up to your user title.
Thank you, i was thinking of a one to pick for a very v ery long time. I am happy you like it.
__________________
[Destiny] awaits, ex-[Omen]
Nothing on the top
but the bucket and the mop
And an illustrated book about birds
See alot up there
But dont be scared
who needs action, when you got words....
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbg
reading this line is explicit acceptance of my superiority over you
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