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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 10:49   #1
lrytas
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Not tired weet ?

What are you trying to show ? That you are the best ? Cant you split ? I am really tired now of covering 2 waves every day on my planet. Making more people quit this game is not good. Try to kill bigger nar galaxies maybe. vom are already dead, so whats ur point now ? Make us quit or ? Or you are affraid that we will be a threat when/if weet splits up ? At least make ur incomings honorous, because when u are getting attacked by 3x bigger planet with 2 fodders, it SUX.

HC take care of that ?

Have a f**** nice day
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Last edited by lrytas; 26 Feb 2011 at 19:23.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 10:56   #2
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yes so agree, need more tgts, impossibel to find a good tgt.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 10:56   #3
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Quote:
Originally posted by lrytas
What are you trying to show ? That you are the best ? Cant you split ? I am really tired now of covering 2 waves every day on my planet. Making more people quit this game is not good. Try to kill bigger nar galaxies maybe. vom are already dead, so whats ur point now ? Make us quit or ? Or you are affraid that we will be a threat when/if weet splits up ? At least make ur incomings honorous, because when u are getting attacked by 3x bigger planet with 2 fodders, it SUX.

HC take care of that ?

Have a f**** nice day
^^
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 11:02   #4
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if you still have roids, we'll still take them, havent you ever done anything this revolutionary before?
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 11:04   #5
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never
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 11:06   #6
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i'm not tired..bit hungover maybe but not tired
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 11:09   #7
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Re: Not tired weet ?

Quote:
Originally posted by lrytas
What are you trying to show ? That you are the best ? Cant you split ? I am really tired now of covering 2 waves every day on my planet. Making more people quit this game is not good. Try to kill bigger nar galaxies maybe. vom are already dead, so whats ur point now ? Make us quit or ? Or you are affraid that we will be a threat when/if weet splits up ? At least make ur incomings honorous, because when u are getting attacked by 3x bigger planet with 2 fodders, it SUX.

HC take care of that ?

Have a f**** nice day
rofl, funny, I don't think you'd have minded doin that last round if the round didn't end 1 month earlier. Don't act like the holy one plz

rgds Kj
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 11:13   #8
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Re: Re: Not tired weet ?

Quote:
Originally posted by Kjeldoran
rofl, funny, I don't think you'd have minded doin that last round if the round didn't end 1 month earlier. Don't act like the holy one plz

rgds Kj
always attacked top planets, never attacked 3x smaller planets with fodders
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 11:16   #9
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Re: Not tired weet ?

Quote:
Originally posted by lrytas
What are you trying to show ? That you are the best ? Cant you split ? I am really tired now of covering 2 waves every day on my planet. Making more people quit this game is not good. Try to kill bigger nar galaxies maybe. vom are already dead, so whats ur point now ? Make us quit or ? Or you are affraid that we will be a threat when/if weet splits up ? At least make ur incomings honorous, because when u are getting attacked by 3x bigger planet with 2 fodders, it SUX.

HC take care of that ?

Have a f**** nice day
I wonder if I will ever cease to be amused by Lyrtas making posts like this.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 11:19   #10
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bah humbug... had enough and royally pi**ed too. I dont want weet to split .. well I do but think we should just all target wolfpack now as they are much more arrogant than eclipse by far
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 11:22   #11
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Re: Re: Not tired weet ?

Quote:
Originally posted by K-W
I wonder if I will ever cease to be amused by Lyrtas making posts like this.

/me is always posting truth
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 11:31   #12
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one side this makes me really wanna quit the game.. cuz this is blatent wank, have had 2 nites all round wivout incs, yippity yay.. on the other side it makes me wanna play r10 just to get back at fudgepack and crew.. I dont like the last thought cuz im sick & tired of this game..
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 11:35   #13
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naww, they'll just align with 2/3 of the universe again and we'll be in the same position. good job nar. I will NEVER help u guys, cuz u f£$ked up this round for everyone.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 11:40   #14
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Re: Not tired weet ?

Quote:
Originally posted by lrytas
What are you trying to show ? That you are the best ? Cant you split ? I am really tired now of covering 2 waves every day on my planet. Making more people quit this game is not good. Try to kill bigger nar galaxies maybe. vom are already dead, so whats ur point now ? Make us quit or ? Or you are affraid that we will be a threat when/if weet splits up ? At least make ur incomings honorous, because when u are getting attacked by 3x bigger planet with 2 fodders, it SUX.

HC take care of that ?

Have a f**** nice day
Lack of choice innit? They have to hit you cos a) they have no other targets and b) you have more than 100 roids.

Besides don't think a split is too far off, unless Eclipse just dismiss Wolfpack hitting them tonight and continue to try and stay buddy buddy with everyone.

Altho I think they are bastards and dislike them with a passion, well done to Wolfpack for having the, erm, I would say arrogance but Eclipse have plenty of that too, maybe balls (bravery) to actually strike out on their own and have a go at being "the one and only" winner of a round.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 11:43   #15
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 13:15   #16
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its funny seeing wp actualy doing something.
Its not often you see wellknown flak with a attitude
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 13:20   #17
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With the amount of spineless cowards among weet hc (some excluded) i'm sure there'll be some sort of a lame (as in useless) breakup very soon.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 13:21   #18
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well written lrytas
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 13:23   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by Fred of Bedrock
bah humbug... had enough and royally pi**ed too. I dont want weet to split .. well I do but think we should just all target wolfpack now as they are much more arrogant than eclipse by far
:e_bunny: :e_chick:
clearly the other way around...

eclipse is the same scum fury was
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 13:23   #20
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A split cant be far away. Eclipse/ToT ppl are bored again.
WP isnt bored yet becouse they like all the roids they get, (atleast if vvomm planets have more then 100 roids)
Elysium have said about 100times that they wont split up becouse loyalty towards their allies is everything(doesnt matter how stagnated the round is)

So if they split up it would be Eclipse/ToT that has the honor.
then we got the 24hour notice (the time when all weet gals will attack vvomm for some last easy roids)
and then we will have some peace for a couple of weeks

atleast this is what i think will happen
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 14:06   #21
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Quote:
Originally posted by BOB_LOST
its funny seeing wp actualy doing something.
Its not often you see wellknown flak with a attitude
:e_chick: :e_chick: :e_chick: :e_chick: :e_chick:
heh, check the top 250 planets, great flak to get that high.

and we retalled, big deal, its what happens when your members get hit is it not?
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 14:10   #22
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Re: Re: Re: Not tired weet ?

Quote:
Originally posted by lrytas
/me is always posting truth
If thats the truth from you point of view, fair enough. But id think youd have a better understanding of how things work here.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 14:11   #23
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Quote:
Originally posted by genosse27
clearly the other way around...

eclipse is the same scum fury was
Why dont we just start a thread called:

I think Eclipse are Fury, and I think Fury are Evil

And all you morons can indulge your delusions without annoying the rest of us.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 14:26   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by The_Fish
heh, check the top 250 planets, great flak to get that high.

and we retalled, big deal, its what happens when your members get hit is it not?
funny how we get 2-waved daily and yet still outrank some of your gals who have prolly yet to recieve incoming. there's skill for ya
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 14:48   #25
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WP has lots of casual players as well as those wanting to end top 10, 50, 100, 250, not every player has those aims, and WP lets them stay, is that such a bad thing?
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 15:05   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by The_Fish
WP has lots of casual players as well as those wanting to end top 10, 50, 100, 250, not every player has those aims, and WP lets them stay, is that such a bad thing?
people's biggest misconception is that 'casual' players can't have high aspirations. It's an excuse for being a crap player. Anytime you play a game more than 'casually' it's not a game anymore.

I don't have a problem with casual gamers. I have a problem with people being arrogant and retarded and then playing the whole 'we're a community' card when someone calls them on their lack of skill.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 15:13   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by Tesla
one side this makes me really wanna quit the game.. cuz this is blatent wank, have had 2 nites all round wivout incs, yippity yay.. on the other side it makes me wanna play r10 just to get back at fudgepack and crew.. I dont like the last thought cuz im sick & tired of this game..

I actually understand you all very well, cause God knows I have had rounds with daily incs.. it sucks, and I have considered to quit so many times.. I sympathize, I really do.. Hopefully the round still has some fun left, cause if it continues like this, the ones being bashed will not be the only ones bored out of their minds..
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 15:22   #28
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VOM declared the 1st Powerblock... then is whining because the other 2 allied against them and began the "powerblocking kills the game" stance...

VVOMM attack a 28m WEET gal. Among the attackers, 3 VVOMM gals of about 13m targeted each a single 1,5m player... They got retailed, waved, roided, crushed... and then whine about being waved...

What's next ? VVOMM trying to accuse gals of cheating and when some of their multies get spotted and deleted whining about it ?

From the beginning of the round, (V)VOM(M) has called the attention on them then whined because it backfired... So, I can only say one thing : if you can't behave, make everyone a favor and self-delete !!!
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 15:32   #29
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Re: Not tired weet ?

Quote:
Originally posted by lrytas
At least make ur incomings honorous
It's a good thing I don't drink coffee in the morning or it woulda been spurting out my nose.

A Lithuanian player lecturing on honor...

Right up there with "Peacekeeper missile" in the oxymoron dictionary.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 15:35   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by Vapula
VOM declared the 1st Powerblock... then is whining because the other 2 allied against them and began the "powerblocking kills the game" stance...

VVOMM attack a 28m WEET gal. Among the attackers, 3 VVOMM gals of about 13m targeted each a single 1,5m player... They got retailed, waved, roided, crushed... and then whine about being waved...

What's next ? VVOMM trying to accuse gals of cheating and when some of their multies get spotted and deleted whining about it ?

From the beginning of the round, (V)VOM(M) has called the attention on them then whined because it backfired... So, I can only say one thing : if you can't behave, make everyone a favor and self-delete !!!

----------------------------------
Vapula,
R3,4,6,7,8 : random
R9 : private gal
some people should get a clue

but pld dragons for actually standing up for your members while eclipse tries everything to get 'authed' retals... ( if i'm not mistaking someone said earlier on in this round that was farming btw (someone in eclipse)) but nm that..
everyone knows the meaning of a fury retal

jurgen good to see you're back and someone actually having some balls
as for the rest of weet happy roiding i'm sure i'll see about 20 different gals on my planet within 3 days:P i'll serve cookies for whoever wants it
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 15:37   #31
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Quote:
Originally posted by Vapula
VOM declared the 1st Powerblock... then is whining because the other 2 allied against them and began the "powerblocking kills the game" stance...

VVOMM attack a 28m WEET gal. Among the attackers, 3 VVOMM gals of about 13m targeted each a single 1,5m player... They got retailed, waved, roided, crushed... and then whine about being waved...

What's next ? VVOMM trying to accuse gals of cheating and when some of their multies get spotted and deleted whining about it ?

From the beginning of the round, (V)VOM(M) has called the attention on them then whined because it backfired... So, I can only say one thing : if you can't behave, make everyone a favor and self-delete !!!

----------------------------------
Vapula,
R3,4,6,7,8 : random
R9 : private gal
some people should get a clue

but pld dragons for actually standing up for your members while eclipse tries everything to get 'authed' retals... ( if i'm not mistaking someone said earlier on in this round that was farming btw (someone in eclipse)) but nm that..
everyone knows the meaning of a fury retal

jurgen good to see you're back and someone actually having some balls
as for the rest of weet happy roiding i'm sure i'll see about 20 different gals on my planet within 3 days:P i'll serve cookies for whoever wants it
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 15:37   #32
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Quote:
Originally posted by Vapula
VOM declared the 1st Powerblock... then is whining because the other 2 allied against them and began the "powerblocking kills the game" stance...

VVOMM attack a 28m WEET gal. Among the attackers, 3 VVOMM gals of about 13m targeted each a single 1,5m player... They got retailed, waved, roided, crushed... and then whine about being waved...

What's next ? VVOMM trying to accuse gals of cheating and when some of their multies get spotted and deleted whining about it ?

From the beginning of the round, (V)VOM(M) has called the attention on them then whined because it backfired... So, I can only say one thing : if you can't behave, make everyone a favor and self-delete !!!

----------------------------------
Vapula,
R3,4,6,7,8 : random
R9 : private gal
some people should get a clue

but pld dragons for actually standing up for your members while eclipse tries everything to get 'authed' retals... ( if i'm not mistaking someone said earlier on in this round that was farming btw (someone in eclipse)) but nm that..
everyone knows the meaning of a fury retal

jurgen good to see you're back and someone actually having some balls
as for the rest of weet happy roiding i'm sure i'll see about 20 different gals on my planet within 3 days:P i'll serve cookies for whoever wants it
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 15:37   #33
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Quote:
Originally posted by Vapula
VOM declared the 1st Powerblock... then is whining because the other 2 allied against them and began the "powerblocking kills the game" stance...

VVOMM attack a 28m WEET gal. Among the attackers, 3 VVOMM gals of about 13m targeted each a single 1,5m player... They got retailed, waved, roided, crushed... and then whine about being waved...

What's next ? VVOMM trying to accuse gals of cheating and when some of their multies get spotted and deleted whining about it ?

From the beginning of the round, (V)VOM(M) has called the attention on them then whined because it backfired... So, I can only say one thing : if you can't behave, make everyone a favor and self-delete !!!

----------------------------------
Vapula,
R3,4,6,7,8 : random
R9 : private gal
some people should get a clue

but pld dragons for actually standing up for your members while eclipse tries everything to get 'authed' retals... ( if i'm not mistaking someone said earlier on in this round that was farming btw (someone in eclipse)) but nm that..
everyone knows the meaning of a fury retal

jurgen good to see you're back and someone actually having some balls
as for the rest of weet happy roiding i'm sure i'll see about 20 different gals on my planet
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 16:00   #34
SpazMonster
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Quote:
Originally posted by Vapula
VOM declared the 1st Powerblock... then is whining because the other 2 allied against them and began the "powerblocking kills the game" stance...

VVOMM attack a 28m WEET gal. Among the attackers, 3 VVOMM gals of about 13m targeted each a single 1,5m player... They got retailed, waved, roided, crushed... and then whine about being waved...

What's next ? VVOMM trying to accuse gals of cheating and when some of their multies get spotted and deleted whining about it ?

From the beginning of the round, (V)VOM(M) has called the attention on them then whined because it backfired... So, I can only say one thing : if you can't behave, make everyone a favor and self-delete !!!

----------------------------------
Vapula,
R3,4,6,7,8 : random
R9 : private gal
I can take being 2 wave attacked every day for a month or two.
I can understand why things happened politically how they did.
I can respect certain WEET HC's decisions to do or not do things as the case my be.

What I can't stand is the attitude some of the people from WEET show on here, gloating, belittling and downright being dickheads to the very people they are playing this game with; the same people that they will have to work with down the road in rounds to come, or perhaps even later this round. Add to that, their position has largely been gained because 2/3rds of the universe teamed up (fault on both sides yes I know and understand, but mostly due to a few people's insecurity) and you might be able to understand the propensity of people to come here and make comments about it.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 16:10   #35
lrytas
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Quote:
Originally posted by The_Fish
WP has lots of casual players as well as those wanting to end top 10, 50, 100, 250, not every player has those aims, and WP lets them stay, is that such a bad thing?
u forgot to add that wp do not kick their members for farming/roid donations.
________
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Last edited by lrytas; 26 Feb 2011 at 19:24.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 16:11   #36
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Quote:
Originally posted by The_Fish
WP has lots of casual players as well as those wanting to end top 10, 50, 100, 250, not every player has those aims, and WP lets them stay, is that such a bad thing?
u forgot to add that wp do not kick their members for farming/roid donations.
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Last edited by lrytas; 26 Feb 2011 at 19:25.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 16:14   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by Vapula
VOM declared the 1st Powerblock... then is whining because the other 2 allied against them and began the "powerblocking kills the game" stance...

VVOMM attack a 28m WEET gal. Among the attackers, 3 VVOMM gals of about 13m targeted each a single 1,5m player... They got retailed, waved, roided, crushed... and then whine about being waved...

What's next ? VVOMM trying to accuse gals of cheating and when some of their multies get spotted and deleted whining about it ?

From the beginning of the round, (V)VOM(M) has called the attention on them then whined because it backfired... So, I can only say one thing : if you can't behave, make everyone a favor and self-delete !!!

----------------------------------
Vapula,
R3,4,6,7,8 : random
R9 : private gal

In my point of view this was discussed million of times. And there was VOM created, later there was WEET created, then a bit later NAR and then NARWEET appeared with shared gals. 1:4 is kinda a bit too big, 1:2 would be possible to fight, but not 1:4.
________
Fj40

Last edited by lrytas; 26 Feb 2011 at 19:25.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 16:16   #38
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Re: Not tired weet ?

Quote:
Originally posted by lrytas
What are you trying to show ? That you are the best ? Cant you split ? I am really tired now of covering 2 waves every day on my planet. Making more people quit this game is not good. Try to kill bigger nar galaxies maybe. vom are already dead, so whats ur point now ? Make us quit or ? Or you are affraid that we will be a threat when/if weet splits up ? At least make ur incomings honorous, because when u are getting attacked by 3x bigger planet with 2 fodders, it SUX.

HC take care of that ?

Have a f**** nice day
sometimes we win, sometimes we lose, u lose now, u won´t be always in the wining side ;D. If u are tired, quit playing, but don´t whine to us...is more tired hear bull****s .

Have a nice day
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 16:17   #39
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Re: Not tired weet ?

Quote:
Originally posted by lrytas
What are you trying to show ? That you are the best ? Cant you split ? I am really tired now of covering 2 waves every day on my planet. Making more people quit this game is not good. Try to kill bigger nar galaxies maybe. vom are already dead, so whats ur point now ? Make us quit or ? Or you are affraid that we will be a threat when/if weet splits up ? At least make ur incomings honorous, because when u are getting attacked by 3x bigger planet with 2 fodders, it SUX.

HC take care of that ?

Have a f**** nice day
sometimes we win, sometimes we lose, u lose now, u won´t be always in the wining side ;D. If u are tired, quit playing, but don´t whine to us...is more tired hear bull****s .

Have a nice day
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 16:21   #40
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Re: Not tired weet ?

Quote:
Originally posted by lrytas
What are you trying to show ? That you are the best ? Cant you split ? I am really tired now of covering 2 waves every day on my planet. Making more people quit this game is not good. Try to kill bigger nar galaxies maybe. vom are already dead, so whats ur point now ? Make us quit or ? Or you are affraid that we will be a threat when/if weet splits up ? At least make ur incomings honorous, because when u are getting attacked by 3x bigger planet with 2 fodders, it SUX.

HC take care of that ?

Have a f**** nice day

Then end of Pa has we know it , Weet had to win at all costs , gathering all smaller alliances to get rid of evil VVOM , has they were to be the possible winners.
Acting like Weet resulted in this nice stagnation and bashing waves 24/7.

What compensates me is that me in r7 roided some evil foes...those who remember Cimmeria remembers the nice rapes they had...the ones saying now they are great players...with their back covered by 400 players....like some nice Fury members...i wont tell names , but if u think some important fury ppl , u can guess....\o/

I just like to say that was nice to play PA with all my friends and that r10 will result in a failure...

and to quote Lrytas again....."have a nice ****ing day"

TuGaS Will HunT YoU DoWn
[Cimmeria]
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 16:42   #41
SpazMonster
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Re: Re: Not tired weet ?

Quote:
Originally posted by Sauron
Then end of Pa has we know it , Weet had to win at all costs , gathering all smaller alliances to get rid of evil VVOM , has they were to be the possible winners.
Acting like Weet resulted in this nice stagnation and bashing waves 24/7.

What compensates me is that me in r7 roided some evil foes...those who remember Cimmeria remembers the nice rapes they had...the ones saying now they are great players...with their back covered by 400 players....like some nice Fury members...i wont tell names , but if u think some important fury ppl , u can guess....\o/

I just like to say that was nice to play PA with all my friends and that r10 will result in a failure...

and to quote Lrytas again....."have a nice ****ing day"

TuGaS Will HunT YoU DoWn
[Cimmeria]
we also remember your nice account sharing and closures. Please refrain from speaking on behalf of someone you don't represent.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 16:44   #42
cypher
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Re: Re: Not tired weet ?

Quote:
Originally posted by Sauron
Then end of Pa has we know it , Weet had to win at all costs , gathering all smaller alliances to get rid of evil VVOM , has they were to be the possible winners.
Acting like Weet resulted in this nice stagnation and bashing waves 24/7.

What compensates me is that me in r7 roided some evil foes...those who remember Cimmeria remembers the nice rapes they had...the ones saying now they are great players...with their back covered by 400 players....like some nice Fury members...i wont tell names , but if u think some important fury ppl , u can guess....\o/

I just like to say that was nice to play PA with all my friends and that r10 will result in a failure...

and to quote Lrytas again....."have a nice ****ing day"

TuGaS Will HunT YoU DoWn
[Cimmeria]
very true... too bad cimmeria was full of cheating aswell:/ further nice post :e_bunny: :e_bunny: :e_bunny: those bunnies are addictive
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 16:52   #43
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Not all vom is dead, they are just beaten bloody and pulling @ straws. Clearly the odd weet attacker underestimates the mighty def whoring straw puller~

:e_bunny: :e_bunny: :e_bunny: :e_bunny:

Oh and those bunnies are just too weird not to use...
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 17:00   #44
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Re: Re: Re: Not tired weet ?

Quote:
Originally posted by SpazMonster
we also remember your nice account sharing and closures. Please refrain from speaking on behalf of someone you don't represent.
...we did not share accounts or cheat. Spinner had to close us because we were hitting his friends and a group of ppl had to get rid of us...they didnt prove the cheating , all was based on a well planned trick to close us.

Quote:
Originally posted by cyphie
very true... too bad cimmeria was full of cheating aswell:/ further nice post
same has above.

Its too bad ppl justify their losses with the argument of cheating.

What is also funny is that many proofs have been delivered to creators about some farming gals and still nothing have been done , and they continue to farm...why are not they closed?

many questions are still to be answered , and its sad that this continues without punishment.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 21:36   #45
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Quote:
Originally posted by SpazMonster
funny how we get 2-waved daily and yet still outrank some of your gals who have prolly yet to recieve incoming. there's skill for ya
Or possibly total lack of, depending on which way you want to look at it. There was certainly no skill used in the attempted roiding of me and my galaxy last night.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 21:41   #46
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Quote:
A Lithuanian player lecturing on honor?
I will stand up for ldk as a lliance as they have proved to pa bout bot usage in the past when the anti-bot system was introduced so stop flaming ppl from where they come from.
I myself count this to being racist & am offended that some1 can b classed from where they come from in the world.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 21:51   #47
SpazMonster
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Quote:
Originally posted by Maddix
Or possibly total lack of, depending on which way you want to look at it. There was certainly no skill used in the attempted roiding of me and my galaxy last night.
well they don't exactly have to worry about skilled or planned attacks with their score advantage where it's at right now.
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 22:06   #48
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Quote:
Originally posted by lrytas
u forgot to add that wp do not kick their members for farming/roid donations.


roid donations? who and when?

farming, well thats been and gone over, PA Crew have changed the rules now, what more can be said?
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 22:09   #49
SpazMonster
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Quote:
Originally posted by The_Fish


roid donations? who and when?

farming, well thats been and gone over, PA Crew have changed the rules now, what more can be said?
More like clarified for the mentally retarded
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Unread 8 Apr 2003, 22:12   #50
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there's plenty of threads for that, cant we leave it out of this thread?
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