Planetarion Forums - Planets being closed

Flip · 10 Jul 2003, 17:47

Quote:

Originally posted by Aryn
i think you're wrong parthos.
actually in fact i know you're wrong.
the multihunters have been working very hard the whole round. unfortunately it's only teh people who whine the most that get noticed. many planets ahve been closed, the owner admits to cheating, doesn't make a fuss, and disapears into the background. now then a top 50 planet gets closed and they kick up such a fuss that EVERYONE knows about it. well yes there's more fuss at the end of the round, they thought they were going to get away with it. think of it.. one week left and you're home-free. then BAM! account gets closed. must be frustrating :P

I wonder if cheaters get frustrated in the first place? :P
I mean.. it goes with the whole 'Win at whatever the cost' I have to wonder if cheaters feel good about their so called "win" Do they have any self gratification for 'winning' in that way? Fun things to speculate about when you're really really really bored. Thankfully this only happens to me when I'm at work..

Mit · 10 Jul 2003, 18:07

Yes they got closed, Yes I did have very valid reasons to close all of the accounts i closed lastnight. Strange, the logins were the same as the logs... and no, the accounts we'ren't hacked blah blah (even if they were, u can't see the password in your account). Only Game Admins (the 7 of us, 2 creators + 5 multihunters) can see login details. There is really no use lying to a hunter when we have evidence that is clear as crystal right in front of us. Why would someone 'know' ur login details if u've never given them out. Especially 10 letter long random strings(Nacho) or logs of other account details being pasted. Perhaps the source of info, was not the best, but in this job, any proof of a cheater, is proof of a cheater. PA does not support cheaters in any way shape of form. And no, being PA Team is NOT an excuse to cheat. If i should find Heartless or any others cheating, i will close him.

There is no use bringing lawyers etc into the matter, proof is proof, and what are you hoping to gain from a FREE game?

To put u all in perspective, we get a lot of multi reports, as Ayrn said, some ppl that are trying to report their attack and get it recalled, for no reason other than to save their planet... there are some which are obvious multies, and others that require a bit more investigation, this all takes time. Yes, there may be 5 of us, but we dont' hunt all day everyday.

Flip · 10 Jul 2003, 18:08

Quote:

Originally posted by Mit
Yes they got closed, Yes I did have very valid reasons to close all of the accounts i closed lastnight. Strange, the logins were the same as the logs... and no, the accounts we'ren't hacked blah blah (even if they were, u can't see the password in your account). Only Game Admins (the 7 of us, 2 creators + 5 multihunters) can see login details. There is really no use lying to a hunter when we have evidence that is clear as crystal right in front of us. Why would someone 'know' ur login details if u've never given them out. Especially 10 letter long random strings(Nacho) or logs of other account details being pasted. Perhaps the source of info, was not the best, but in this job, any proof of a cheater, is proof of a cheater. PA does not support cheaters in any way shape of form. And no, being PA Team is NOT an excuse to cheat. If i should find Heartless or any others cheating, i will close him.

There is no use bringing lawyers etc into the matter, proof is proof, and what are you hoping to gain from a FREE game?

To put u all in perspective, we get a lot of multi reports, as Ayrn said, some ppl that are trying to report their attack and get it recalled, for no reason other than to save their planet... there are some which are obvious multies, and others that require a bit more investigation, this all takes time. Yes, there may be 5 of us, but we dont' hunt all day everyday.

Thanks for the heavy clarification.

Hopefully it'll sink in.

Mit · 10 Jul 2003, 19:34

Quote:

Originally posted by Flip
Thanks for the heavy clarification.
Hopefully it'll sink in.

Quite alright, i just get a little sick of the "i'm innocent" from the people who are blatently not. i.e. written / textual proof. Even if it WAS faked logins. faked correctly is another story....

cypher · 10 Jul 2003, 19:52

i always thought irc logs didn't count tho?

that changed with ldk?:P

Mit · 10 Jul 2003, 20:18

Quote:

Originally posted by cyphie
i always thought irc logs didn't count tho? that changed with ldk?:P

depends on the context / info. for e.g. a log saying X is a multi of Y, is NOT enough. BUT, CORRECT username AND password... that is definately enough to say Z has given out their logins.

RaiDeN · 10 Jul 2003, 20:44

For me XtoTheZ log it's one good prove for the situatio, but.....
When we login into an acout there exists at least cookeis, ip's.
Sow for closing a planet, i thnk logs are not enouth, because creating a log it's too easy ( a log it's onli a .txt file), sow i think the creators shoud sheck that 1st and onli if they find diferent cookies or ip's in the same acout they can take a log as prove.

I can easly acpt a login and pass from someone, that doesn't kame that i login it his account ( will probably login

), but it's not my action that is in case, it's they'r action.

I will never understant XtoTheZ attitude or meddy or any of the othr's that possibly made account sharing, but i'll never understant the creators too, because if i whant to creat a log and find a way of geting someon's pass by is mail or by any other way (since the net it's not the safe place that exists), i'll make that someone get closed onli because i don't like or or because any other reason that i think enouth for geting im closed.

Since i've seen some of my friends geting into hotmail acounts by hacking then, i belive in anything and as evrione can see in the login page, it's easy to ask for user and pass to be sent for the mail.

I hope no one's think that i'm defending the cheaters or judjing XtoTheZ, but i don't like any of the cases (cheaters and privacy/friendship broken).

Lord_Olrik · 10 Jul 2003, 20:57

why is scorpio reopened ?

Scorpio · 10 Jul 2003, 21:33

Quote:

Originally posted by Lord_Olrik
why is scorpio reopened ?

coz Fury is no longer in control of the PA crew

KoeN · 10 Jul 2003, 21:35

Quote:

Originally posted by Lord_Olrik
why is scorpio reopened ?

"crocodile-tears"

Zh|l · 10 Jul 2003, 21:40

Quote:

Originally posted by Scorpio
coz Fury is no longer in control of the PA crew

But I like you.

Scorpio · 10 Jul 2003, 21:47

Quote:

Originally posted by Zh|l
But I like you.

Have you ever got to finishing your roleplaying stories about PA? They were nice to read, but I believe you still had some to write...

Leshy · 10 Jul 2003, 22:41

Quote:

Originally posted by RaiDeN
Since i've seen some of my friends geting into hotmail acounts by hacking then

Don't you mean by guessing the easy password? I sincerely doubt Hotmail gets constantly hacked. And if you do worry about the safety of your Hotmail account, then simply use your ISP's email address instead.

Passwords don't leak out because of actual 'hacking' in 99% of the cases. They leak out because they're stupidly simple (Lantador/lantador) or because you actually give it out to someone else.

Heartless · 11 Jul 2003, 00:40

Quote:

Originally posted by Edv
is PA-team members playing this round?

only 1, not me, though.

Heartless · 11 Jul 2003, 00:44

Quote:

Originally posted by Fruchtquake
i expect this post to be *edited* or *deleted* within a couple of hours as previous posts about PA "team" cheating/abusing the rules and the EULA have been "removed" before.
Too sad but in the same way too true.
Pa "team" is activing different every round , depending on the ppl involved.
U can flame my post but u cannot flame the facts which a lot of "known" and "respected" people will second.

Actually, Frucht, you are just bitter that I supported your closure.
You were multying, you cannot deny that fact, and yes, as I told all other gôsu members already, I was helping on your closure with veryfying that the sign up details were not yours. However, you would have been closed anyways, if I would have veryfied it or not. So now, shut the **** up little cheater, get a real life, or play honestly.

RaiDeN · 11 Jul 2003, 01:17

Don't you mean by guessing the easy password? I sincerely doubt Hotmail gets constantly hacked. And if you do worry about the safety of your Hotmail account, then simply use your ISP's email address instead.

Passwords don't leak out because of actual 'hacking' in 99% of the cases. They leak out because they're stupidly simple (Lantador/lantador) or because you actually give it out to someone else.
---------------------------------

I was not joking when i said that i've seen acouts from otmail beeing hacked.
And i don't use hotmail, i have a mail a bit more secure.
I don't even like the hotmail services.

Aryn · 11 Jul 2003, 01:28

Quote:

Originally posted by Heartless
only 1, not me, though.

there's more than one pateam member playing this round

NaQ · 11 Jul 2003, 02:32

Quote:

Originally posted by Flip
it's his server, he can do whatever the hell he bloody wants with it. There's absolutely no law against that.
Agreed it was a bit underhanded, but again, it's his server. :P

someone was paying for it i thought?

izverg · 11 Jul 2003, 08:17

Quote:

Originally posted by Al_zz
Allthough this was last round I do find it rather bad that PA -team gets involved in accountswapping and multying. Off course nothing can be done about the round 9 standings but I wouldn't let heartless get anywhere near multihunting mails or other such matters if this is true.

hAl

Agreed. Actually what i've seen in the past from other games (some muds and especially lamest on-line game ever - Emp1request), its never good when admin plays same game. Its just my personal opinion, but i would never allow an admin to play the game. First reason - he is still human. And humans hardly resist temptations. There is always temptation to use your position or once used, use it again in hope that u do not get caught next time. Second reason - playing admin will always become biased and especially if joins clans/aliances/. Cause that way he gets friends to love and enemies to hate. Than i guess i do not need to tell on whom such admin starts to focus on, and use his powers. Especially cause he than see, what he wants to see

p.s
Lo Zeus, i know deep in heart u love us :-)

Gerbie · 11 Jul 2003, 09:56

Quote:

Originally posted by Heartless
only 1, not me, though.

I know you have been playing. I know your planet has dropped enourmously in activity. I saw your planet logged in only to defend your alliance members. Starts to look a bit like a support planet. Did you quit before or after those defences?

Edv · 11 Jul 2003, 10:18

Quote:

Originally posted by Gerbie
I know you have been playing. I know your planet has dropped enourmously in activity. I saw your planet logged in only to defend your alliance members. Starts to look a bit like a support planet. Did you quit before or after those defences?

nice question

Gerbie · 11 Jul 2003, 11:42

Not really a nice question. Sorry to have to ask it, but I'm kinda curious.

hAl · 11 Jul 2003, 12:37

Quote:

Originally posted by Gerbie
Not really a nice question. Sorry to have to ask it, but I'm kinda curious.

Are you suggesting a PA-team member has given away a planet in PA ?

Gerbie · 11 Jul 2003, 12:49

Quote:

Originally posted by hAl
Are you suggesting a PA-team member has given away a planet in PA ?

I'm asking if he did or whether he just quit playing after his last defence mission. In which case I expect his planet to be deleted soon.

Flip · 11 Jul 2003, 14:34

I think it's sort of funny how people always try to find fault in admins for no real reason.

Gerbie · 11 Jul 2003, 15:27

It's the high tree that catches the wind.

Mit · 11 Jul 2003, 15:57

Yes, some of PA Team do play, u can't expect us, as voulenteers not to play the game we are helping out of own good will. BUT, however, since becoming a Multihunter, i have given up my alliance position (go ask any virus member to check the forums / the private channel - i idle in the public channel now, only so people can still contact me easily. i have nothing to do with virus, and don't let that affect the work). Also, i've stopped playing properly, i don't have the time really...

Should i, or any other hunter find out about a PA Team member cheating, it will be dealt with properly, just like any other case, and the fact he / she is a PA Team member will NOT bias the outcome.

More closures are being made at the moment, yes, a) more attacks are going out.... thus more people spotting multies etc for us and reporting them to [email protected] and b) theres more of us on the team now, thus we are getting through a lot more checks, a lot quicker (5 of us hunters now, plus 2 creators)

Imo, XtotheZ is honourable, using the ircd, to get lots, granted not the best way to go about it, but it proved a lot of cheaters. I know, i checked and closed all bar a few with different passwords.

People saying they can be faked... think about it for a second please, how can u suggest faking usernames and passwords CORRECTLY if u don't know them.... its more than a billion to one chance of guessing them correctly....

Hope i've been able to explain things, if anyone wants to ask Q's feel free, or find me on IRC later. (and no, i'm not gonna answer "what do we look for" "what is evidence" type of Q's.

Flip · 11 Jul 2003, 17:49

Quote:

Originally posted by Gerbie
It's the high tree that catches the wind.

Damn trees. :|

Edv · 11 Jul 2003, 22:45

Quote:

Originally posted by Gerbie
I'm asking if he did or whether he just quit playing after his last defence mission. In which case I expect his planet to be deleted soon.

Illegal · 12 Jul 2003, 04:18

Is it just me, or does it seem like 20 people in PA doesnt cheat at all (totally) while the rest do?

Every now and then one of the many gets closed, he(never a she) comes here to bitch about it and tell everyone why his case is special, while the 20 people legit people who ofcourse are forum trollers/bored people (plot thickens) all comes to the thread to gangbang the poor fellow. This while all the cheaters friends/fellow cheats come to his aid.

Am I the only one who feel Deja Vu when I read these threads?

I honestly dont care who cheats and who doesnt. Like any round aprox 8-9 out of top 10 cheats and 14-15 out of the top 20 cheats.

I also have no idea what this thread is about and who started it, but I feel dedicated after reading the last two pages quickly.

In my defence however, when people I like get closed I support them and blame PA-crew. When people I dont like get closed then I support PA-crew. Does this sound like anyone else?

Illegal · 12 Jul 2003, 04:29

Quote:

Originally posted by Nacho_OuZo
<Mit> yes u did
<Nacho_OuZo> heh
<Nacho_OuZo> where? atleas xxx the nick
<Nacho_OuZo> if u saying i did
<Mit> <Nacho_OuZo> xxxx / xxxx
<Nacho_OuZo> and pull my attack
<Nacho_OuZo> lool
<Nacho_OuZo> this aint my pw
<Nacho_OuZo> try it
<Nacho_OuZo> ffs
<Nacho_OuZo> blah
<Nacho_OuZo> im pissed
<Mit> heh, its close enough to be giving out ur details
<Nacho_OuZo> pff
<Nacho_OuZo> this was my old pw from r7
<Nacho_OuZo> how can some1 log in with that?
<Nacho_OuZo> wrong infos
<Mit> u've given out ur password, end of the story
<Nacho_OuZo> lool
<Nacho_OuZo> this aint my pw!!
<Nacho_OuZo> try to log in
<Nacho_OuZo> close enough is not equal sugar

omg is that true? That has got to be the most retarded closing I have ever seen and Ive seen my share of closings (If its true)

Toop · 12 Jul 2003, 07:32

There's probably more than that...

Aryn · 12 Jul 2003, 07:38

of course there's more.
they can't tell all the proof or it'd be too hard to catch the cheaters.

for example. you've been stealing cookies from the cookie jar. now i've found proof it was you because you've got chocolate chips smeared on your face.. you'll wash your face next time. then i get sneaky and find your fingerprints on the jar.. then next time you'll wear gloves.

you don't catch theives by telling them how you've caught them.

Edv · 12 Jul 2003, 08:30

Quote:

Originally posted by Aryn
of course there's more.
they can't tell all the proof or it'd be too hard to catch the cheaters.

especialy if they have no any proofs...

Aryn · 12 Jul 2003, 08:37

Quote:

Originally posted by Edv
especialy if they have no any proofs...

come again?
they can't close a planet with no proof.
that's been proven with planets that are still open while people 'know' they're cheaters but can't prove it.

Mit · 12 Jul 2003, 08:50

Quote:

Originally posted by Illegal
omg is that true? That has got to be the most retarded closing I have ever seen and Ive seen my share of closings (If its true)

That is not all there is too it, and yes, i have proof. i will NOT close someone just "cos i feel like it" or because "i have something against them". Come on, if i did that, i would be sacked immediately.

hAl · 12 Jul 2003, 08:54

Closing those planets is nice but could you please have creators run the cleanup job for planets again. For the last week people like to see their ranking without inactives and caught cheaters so they might actualy decide is they want to do something about that ranking !!!

hAl

Mit · 12 Jul 2003, 09:01

Quote:

Originally posted by hAl
Closing those planets is nice but could you please have creators run the cleanup job for planets again. For the last week people like to see their ranking without inactives and caught cheaters so they might actualy decide is they want to do something about that ranking !!!

hAl

Will ask...

Leshy · 12 Jul 2003, 09:52

Quote:

Originally posted by Illegal
omg is that true? That has got to be the most retarded closing I have ever seen and Ive seen my share of closings (If its true)

See page 1 of this thread, near the bottom of the page. It 's been discussed and explained.

Lord_Thunderball · 12 Jul 2003, 10:54

Quote:

Originally posted by Mit
Will ask...

If this is done, my gal is #1 again

Good plan, i've mailed spinner about it as well..

And ofc it's much nicer to see rankings at the end without cheaters etc...

Scouse · 12 Jul 2003, 11:14

It's a good idea from PA to always say "We can't tell you we have proof, because we can't tell you what we use to prove it, because it'd help cheaters get away with it".

In other words it's a fancy way of saying "You've cheated, but I don't need to show you any proof whatsoever, but you're going to get deleted."

Mit · 12 Jul 2003, 12:28

Quote:

Originally posted by Scouse
It's a good idea from PA to always say "We can't tell you we have proof, because we can't tell you what we use to prove it, because it'd help cheaters get away with it".

In other words it's a fancy way of saying "You've cheated, but I don't need to show you any proof whatsoever, but you're going to get deleted."

Yes, but sometimes, the proof is such that we can't say it without looking like it was made up (the case of all the logins the other day) or without giving away WHO gave us the info. In that case, XtoTheZ came out and owned up himself, which, i have to say, took a lot of courrage on his part.

Mit · 12 Jul 2003, 12:31

Quote:

Originally posted by Flip
I think it's sort of funny how people always try to find fault in admins for no real reason.

unfortunately, that is the way, when it effects them negatively, we're always to blame...

cypher · 12 Jul 2003, 14:21

Mit, is it true that naq was re-opened after farming and then you just took some roids away?

please tell me that isn't true, as that's so utterly ****ing pathetic. farming is against the rules... if he did he should be closed... if he didn't you shouldn't have locked his account in the first place... so who was the idiot who made this mistake?

if only thing that happens after farming STILL is some roids taken away why didn't someone tell me earlier... i could have had 20k by now then easily.....

Little Timmy · 12 Jul 2003, 14:29

Quote:

Originally posted by cyphie
Mit, is it true that naq was re-opened after farming and then you just took some roids away?

please tell me that isn't true, as that's so utterly ****ing pathetic. farming is against the rules... if he did he should be closed... if he didn't you shouldn't have locked his account in the first place... so who was the idiot who made this mistake?

if only thing that happens after farming STILL is some roids taken away why didn't someone tell me earlier... i could have had 20k by now then easily.....

At this rate you wont have much to do next round Multi hunting cause you will start to lose credibiltity and the numbers playing will reduce...he broke the rules. That should be end of story.

Mit · 12 Jul 2003, 17:27

Quote:

Originally posted by cyphie
Mit, is it true that naq was re-opened after farming and then you just took some roids away?

please tell me that isn't true, as that's so utterly ****ing pathetic. farming is against the rules... if he did he should be closed... if he didn't you shouldn't have locked his account in the first place... so who was the idiot who made this mistake?

if only thing that happens after farming STILL is some roids taken away why didn't someone tell me earlier... i could have had 20k by now then easily.....

I don't know what went on with that case, that wasn't me. All i know, is NaQ talked with some ppl about 'farming' his way to the top, but refused. (from the logs i used to do with account sharing etc) I didn't close NaQ cos i didn't have enough evidence against him.

Illegal · 12 Jul 2003, 20:33

Quote:

Originally posted by Leshy
See page 1 of this thread, near the bottom of the page. It 's been discussed and explained.

Read my first post.

Illegal · 12 Jul 2003, 20:34

Quote:

Originally posted by Mit
Yes, but sometimes, the proof is such that we can't say it without looking like it was made up

Perhaps that should ring a bell?

Illegal · 12 Jul 2003, 20:37

Quote:

Originally posted by cyphie
Mit, is it true that naq was re-opened after farming and then you just took some roids away?

Well like you know, farming wount get you deleted but signing up and not adding your phone number will. Due to the incredible advantages you get out of it.

Trust me, its makes sence.

no?

Doorsdown · 12 Jul 2003, 20:39

Quote:

Originally posted by Aryn
come again?
they can't close a planet with no proof.
that's been proven with planets that are still open while people 'know' they're cheaters but can't prove it.

how do they know there a cheater but still have NO proof?