MISTU storm into 3rd....

[Razorback]

Originally Posted by Kal

they didn't leave an alliance in game - at no time were they without an alliance - the entire alliances were merged, all ranks were kept the same etc.

that is wrong in this case, both mistu and phratkos kicked members to be able to merge.
Phratkos was not just 22 members who fully merged into an odd 50 member alliance.

[Kal]

the manual has been updated to relfect that mergers are now possible, we apologise for this information not being in the manual from the start of this round or indeed last round.

[Kal]

Originally Posted by Razorback

that is wrong in this case, both mistu and phratkos kicked members to be able to merge.
Phratkos was not just 22 members who fully merged into an odd 50 member alliance.

I would normlly agree with you, however a lot of Phraktos' memebers were inacitves and hence were not wanted in the new merged alliance. Also I know that some left becuase they did not want to be part of the new merged alliance. I expect that similarly mistu kicked its inactive members which is again a reasonable thing to do.

[Razorback]

how do you know all of these members personally and can judge each case ? On the otherhand the ones who left THEIR alliance because they didnt agree with a merger should have the same advantage as those who merged with mistu, or is that not correct ?

[Forest]

When mistu now attack the kicked mistu/phrak players, will that be farming?

[Forest]

Originally Posted by Kal

the manual has been updated to relfect that mergers are now possible, we apologise for this information not being in the manual from the start of this round or indeed last round.

Updated 5 mins ago, good job.

not

[Kal]

Originally Posted by Forest

When mistu now attack the kicked mistu/phrak players, will that be farming?

IF it is farming it will be treated as famring - if anyone suspects anything they are as allways free to report it.

[Forest]

Originally Posted by Kal

IF it is farming it will be treated as famring - if anyone suspects anything they are as allways free to report it.

That wasnt my question.

My question is, is mass-kicking in order to recruit (yes it was recruiting, NOT merging), a group of big players, which will enevitably give out a lot of defenceless targets for those same big players, gonna be classed as farming, or just a 'normal' attack.

[Crazeh]

Originally Posted by Wandows

tbh.... i don't really care about the fact they merged.... what i do mind however is the way PaTeam seems to be making the rules in the current game.

I landed in a shit gal, exiled 4 / 5 times ( i don't even know anymore) , wasting atleast 9 mil resources, losing almost any roids i had and most of my fleet, to only land in worse or equal bad gals. So i figured... Hey as a paying customer i might be able to expect some decent treatment, but ofcourse not. I immediatly get told that moving or any other compensation is out of the question since its just bad luck for me to have paid and get my round ruined for landing in crap gal(s). "I should have known before getting my planet paid that this was the risk of a random round".

And now we have 2 alliances, seemingly struggling to hold on. I would describe that as the same problems i (and many others i suppose) had (and still have) trying to find a gal ----> its just tough luck they landed in a crap alliance and they should pay the consequences (72 tick allianceless). But for some reason, this is completely different for the PaTeam then the problems i have to find a decent gal.


I really hope that PaTeam would learn to be fair or equal in judgement in these kind of matters. SO MERGE MY PLANET WITH ANOTHER GAL DAMNIT! SINCE MERGING SEEMS TO BE FINE!

Hail Wandows!

I think there were alot of us in this situation.

I mailed & talked to PA Team at start of the round.. At pt66 my galaxy had 3 planets with roids.. The last mail I sent to Phil complaining about the unfairness for paying costumers, he didnt even reply!
I don't see why PA Team couldn't have done something similar for the paying planets when asked early in round, when they themselves admittedly saw the flaws in their whole buddy/random galaxy set up system obviously didn't work.

This is just so typical PA, and as others have mentioned, this will only lead to loosing more players. We have heard little else from PA Team last 5 rounds other than 'we have to make the community bigger again, we need more players, YOU must get your friends to play' etc etc etc
Well woopde****indoo... why don't PA Team atleast start treating Paying customers with a tiny little bit of Respect!!!


MERGE MY PLANET WITH ANOTHER GAL DAMNIT! SINCE MERGING SEEMS TO BE FINE!

[Shev]

Originally Posted by Razorback

how do you know all of these members personally and can judge each case ? On the otherhand the ones who left THEIR alliance because they didnt agree with a merger should have the same advantage as those who merged with mistu, or is that not correct ?

An alliance can kick their member's whenever they like for whatever reason they want. Why should any of them be justfied induvidually to board trolls on AD?

[Razorback]

Originally Posted by Shev

An alliance can kick their member's whenever they like for whatever reason they want. Why should any of them be justfied induvidually to board trolls on AD?

indeed they can and each player has a 72h cooldown period to join another alliance. This should include merging. According to the last 2 cases it only needs 2 hc to complete such a merger. This includes members not agreeing with it are just kicked and it doesnt need an alliance majority like in tof-valhalla case where members realised they merged the day they saw other forums.

[Psi_K]

Originally Posted by Forest

When mistu now attack the kicked mistu/phrak players, will that be farming?

It's hard to attack planets which are 'too small'

[I am Idler]

Originally Posted by Kal

the manual has been updated to relfect that mergers are now possible, we apologise for this information not being in the manual from the start of this round or indeed last round.

how you are allowed to be in the PAteam is beyond me.

sorry, but that is just horrible

[Kjeldoran]

lol, hilarious how AGAIN 1up tries to make a big deal out of this ...

To colt etc, leaving cause someone else joined or leaving cause you're scared to lose roids and rank doesn't make the slightest difference. The result is the same, that's what matters.

And instead of whining at mistu, whine at PA crew. It's like scoring a goal with your hands, if the ref didn't see it or allowed it, then the goal counts. Becides, it's not like any of this even remotely affected 1up, aside from that fact that mistu is now 3th instead of 5th ...

yay, big disaster drama, bring out the big guns, nuclear war blablabla ....

[Razorback]

Originally Posted by Psi_K

It's hard to attack planets which are 'too small'

So all planets kicked from your alliance(s) are below 150k as thats the only "too small" possible.
Sadly this doesnt display in the amount of score - players lost by phratkos and what you mathematically recruited....

[Game']

Stop complaining, things will balance themselves out i am sure. Afterall what kind of alliance wants 22 members who decided they were so much better than the rest of their alliance and upped sticks? By the way how can it be a merger, the name is still the same, and id hazard a guess that mistu HC is still the same.

[Shev]

Originally Posted by Razorback

indeed they can and each player has a 72h cooldown period to join another alliance. This should include merging. According to the last 2 cases it only needs 2 hc to complete such a merger. This includes members not agreeing with it are just kicked and it doesnt need an alliance majority like in tof-valhalla case where members realised they merged the day they saw other forums.

I actually have to agree to a certain extent - it's not a particularly good system. 72 hours should also apply to mergers I think. However, the fuss over MISTU kicking the odd inactive is unjustified - it's MISTU HC's decision on their members.

[Forest]

Fine, ive said my piece, i will let jolt decide on the next course of action.

No more posts form me.

[furssie]

Why on earth this event suddenly becomes mistu's fault again?

[Spirit]

Originally Posted by Razorback

that is wrong in this case, both mistu and phratkos kicked members to be able to merge.
Phratkos was not just 22 members who fully merged into an odd 50 member alliance.

u think u know all, right? eh... stop with BS


erm per your post ppl can think Phrk had 50 top scoring ppl with ie 600 aver. score...
and MISTU had 80 members, so i doubt they kicked 50 ppl who r left in nowhere, same as Phrk....ffs what a lame propaganda...

[Phil^]

Can all ex-phraktos/mistu members who were KICKED please contact me in #support.
As a gesture of goodwill spinner will be waiving the 72h waiting period for them while we sort out this mess
have your user ids to hand

[Razorback]

Originally Posted by Spirit

u think u know all, right? eh... stop with BS

is that your hookup line ?

erm per your post ppl can think Phrk had 50 top scoring ppl with ie 600 aver. score...
and MISTU had 80 members, so i doubt they kicked 50 ppl who r left in nowhere, same as Phrk....ffs what a lame propaganda...

An average score of 600k isnt needed its more of 150k which is needed for 1up to attack anyone.
150k average score is the current #35 alliance so im quiet sure planets kicked from phratkos and mistu had roids to harvest or enough score to launch upon (the whole argument for this discussion since psi_k started by stating different)

[AkMaster]

Originally Posted by Psi_K

LCH/1up started the around at almost cap players, MISTU started at 70~
That was our own choosing to do, but when we even ourselves up with help from an alliance which lost a few mil score after kicking 20 odd members, I see no problems.

You better take a look again at alliance histories of this round b4 you start talking nonsense. LCH didn't have at lot of members at all when the round started. Rock & Vision were getting close to the player limit very quickly & so was 1up. LCH on the otherhand slowly grew, while MISTU was stagnating at a certain point. I'll save you the trouble to look it up:

(tick) LCH | MISTU | 1up

(12) 35 50 64
--------------------------------
(48) 66 73 85
--------------------------------
(84) 78 77 93

(150) 84 81 95

(200) 86 81 96
---------------------------------
(250) 92 80 95

(300) 91 81 97

(350) 93 81 97
---------------------------------
(400) 100 71 97

AkMaster
[]LCH[] since round 3

[Remy]

Can all the Ex-Phraktos/Mistu members who were kicked please contact Phil^ in #support asap please. have your user Ids to hand and the 72h waiting period before you can join another alliance will be waived. The list will be sent to spinner TONIGHT . ONLY those who were kicked from phraktos/mistu before the merge please.

Hilarious........ No further comment

[Synthetic_Sid]

Originally Posted by Phil^

Can all ex-phraktos/mistu members who were KICKED please contact me in #support.
As a gesture of goodwill spinner will be waiving the 72h waiting period for them while we sort out this mess
have your user ids to hand

As Kal was kind enough to clear up my previous hypothetical question, maybe you'd like to clear one up as well.

Are ALL kicked members from alliancesgoing to have the 72 hour waiting period waived - or do a certain number have to be kicked at once to qualify? Or is it only if your alliance subsequently merges?

[Phil^]

this one is only for those who were kicked and are subsequently being attacked by the alliance they would have been in normally.

Right now, i cant answer any hypothetical qus as we`re working out a way to do it which is less abusable by alliances
clearly the way we had it was flawed, and was abused. fair enough, hands up on that one. now it has to be sorted

[Kal]

as of now the current policy is in the manual - we will merge, but not in the last 4 weeks of the round. It has to however be a merger, not some people joining another alliance to avoid the 72 hours allianceless. We deemed that in this case mistu/phraktos abused the system which is why we are taking the actions of allowing thoose they kicked to waive the 72 hour alliancless if they so wish. Mistu has been spoken to and have agreed to make their internal structure for representative of a merger.

we welcome ideas on whether merging should be allowed or not full stop, and also on ways to control merging so this situation does not occur again. But it is helpful is such ideas are construcitve and well thought out rather than does flaming us for allowing this to happen.

We have admitted mistakes were made due to a lack of foresight, and no single PATeam member was to blame.

[Dark-Strider]

I think I am now allianceless :/

My comp has been fked for last 2 days and I come back and find I have no access in Mistu chans or server.
And that I have no alliance in game. :/

Oh well back to being allianceless again.

[Precursors]

I have a small planet, I am very abusable by the bigger players
can you make me bigger please, or give me back the 500 roids that I lost
thanks


note: I had to wait 72 ticks (which was during the entire weekend) just a few days ago to be able to join a different alliance

[Spirit]

Originally Posted by Razorback

is that your hookup line ?


An average score of 600k isnt needed its more of 150k which is needed for 1up to attack anyone.
150k average score is the current #35 alliance so im quiet sure planets kicked from phratkos and mistu had roids to harvest or enough score to launch upon (the whole argument for this discussion since psi_k started by stating different)

don't make fuss of nothing, u become noobish and anoying...
and anw 1up is uber super leet and will kill all universe, - kicked not kicked merged or not merged - u will kill us all...why wannking
this is not voting for president so who shout/wank most get the most votes!

u where not top wannker back in PA history
tho it seems 1up gather much wankkers sadly...
and it seems u become one of them...
and ofc beening personal bitch of Syd who teach rest to wank wank wank ...u all r very silly..

[The_Fish]

ND have a couple of people waiting to join, with the 72 tick bollocks happening, can you waive that please.

THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE TO THIS THAN TO 22 PHRAKTOS MEMBERS JOINING MISTU.

You ****ing lamers PA Crew, really, absolute ****ing lamers.

[Vasquez]

to be honest i can see the argument from the 1upers etc but in my opinion it is actually one of the problems caused when alliances were hardcoded into the game, im sure this sort of thing happened a lot in the past and it has happened again. however it has been addressed by pa team and i cant see where all this bug abuse is coming from.

I think it was an oversight on the team's part and an optimistic gamble on the part of mistu/phraktos to make the round more enjoyable and isnt that what every alliance's aim is?

as for the kicking out of members, afaik there were not a lot of members kicked out from either party and the majority were inactives or a burden on the alliance, just a bit of an alliance cull well overdue!

[Phil^]

the 72 tick period will ONLY be waived for those WHO WERE KICKED TO MAKE ROOM FOR THE MERGER

theres no need for senseless flaming

[MajorRS]

I want to join another alliance, but i really dont want to be allianceless for 72 ticks...

If i apply to an admin, can you 'merge' me into the new alliance so im not unprotected?

[Phil^]

Right :/
i`ll delete any more posts which are flames / trolls.

[Nadar]

hm.. So if two of my mates wanna stop playing PA, can I then ask PA Crew to merge their roids into mine?

[The_Fish]

last chance. After this, I never play Planetarion again, as it show the incompetence of the people running it.

Why do you let 22 people join an alliance, without the 72 tick delay, but not let others have it waived?

[Phil^]

Alliances can merge at the request of their HCs. This procedure involves 2 (unless there is only 1 HC) or more HCs from each alliance pamailing an admin and make the request. The request should include the names of the alliances to be merged and name of the new merged alliance. Note: All ingame ranks are maintained during a merge, but in game forums information, attacks and defence calls set up in game may be lost. A merge is also only possible if the total number of memebers for the new merged alliance will be less than the limit of 100. Mergers will also not be allowed in the last 4 weeks of the round.


i wish people would read the manual

[The_Fish]

So, its classed as a merger, if VisioN kicked its worst members, leaving them with 50, and ND did the same, so collectively, we were far superior to anyone else?

[Phil^]

as was explained further up this thread, that situation was ABUSE OF THE SYSTEM WE HAD IN PLACE BEFORE

the 72 hour wait for those who were kicked is being waived as a GOODWILL gesture

[The_Fish]

Originally Posted by Phil^

as was explained further up this thread, that situation was ABUSE OF THE SYSTEM WE HAD IN PLACE BEFORE

the 72 hour wait for those who were kicked is being waived as a GOODWILL gesture

Isn't abusing bugs classed as cheating?

What happens to those members who will be roided by MISTU now? nothing?

No need to get stressed with me, when you are the one who messed up. I am trying to figure out how to make the best out of your bad situation.

[Phil^]

thats exactly what this waiver of the wait to get into an alliance is for
( and yes im stressed )

[The_Fish]

lol, so you expect all these kicked people to have an alliance tonight? so, I guess, in total, 30 members, got kicked, and you expect them all to have homes, where people will trust and defend the tonight. Are you joking?

[Phil^]

no but its a start at least now , isnt it

[Leinad]

Originally Posted by The_Fish

So, its classed as a merger, if VisioN kicked its worst members, leaving them with 50, and ND did the same, so collectively, we were far superior to anyone else?

congratulations u understood the meaning of a merger.
What else would u do in a merger, keep the worse members?
Sometimes i really have to question the intelligence of ppl posting here. I dont even get ur point do u want to say us that MISTU or Phraktos arent allowed to kick their members whenever they want to for whatever reason?
There were 2 alliances, one struggling this round so they decided to merge (and this doesnt mean the name must be changed or even the command) and to make this possible (due to ingame 100 member rule) MISTU had to kick a few.
Now someone tell me what the problem is. The rules are about "joining" an alliance not about a merger and thats something different.
This whole thing here is just poor propaganda.

[Jester]

Originally Posted by Kal

as of now the current policy is in the manual - we will merge, but not in the last 4 weeks of the round. It has to however be a merger, not some people joining another alliance to avoid the 72 hours allianceless. We deemed that in this case mistu/phraktos abused the system which is why we are taking the actions of allowing thoose they kicked to waive the 72 hour alliancless if they so wish. Mistu has been spoken to and have agreed to make their internal structure for representative of a merger.

we welcome ideas on whether merging should be allowed or not full stop, and also on ways to control merging so this situation does not occur again. But it is helpful is such ideas are construcitve and well thought out rather than does flaming us for allowing this to happen.

We have admitted mistakes were made due to a lack of foresight, and no single PATeam member was to blame.

Since 72 is some sort of magic number, I think it should be involved in the merger. For example, both alliances are unable to reap benefits until 72 hours into the merger. In the mean time, the two seperate packs still operate as seperate alliances. There should be some sort of way of telling two alliances are being merged, for example the alliance rank page shows 'FAnG + phraktos' with their stats combined.

Doesn't that sound sensible?

Note that under this case just about any form of merge is possible without direct abuse of the system.

I also think you should be careful about cleaning up mistakes such as waiving the 72 hour grace period for kicked planets. It's clearly result of a series of posts by people who were not in this position, but stood at a disadvantage as a direct result of the merger. Yes, it's sad. Yes, it's problematic. But it's not anything new. I remember cries of evilness against Fury in round 3* because members they kicked were immediately roided. While they could've joined another alliance, that didn't really matter back then as no alliance could defend against Fury**.

* Often directed specifically at Sid, claiming he was farming them.

** And Legion probably wouldn't take in anyone with incoming from Fury.

[Phil^]

it does but would require a recode of the alliance handling system to accomodate that

[Treveler]

When this mistake has already happen, I think its fear deal that the pa team deal with those unfortunate members who was kicked, and the community deals with mistu as it sees fit.

[Jester]

Originally Posted by Phil^

it does but would require a recode of the alliance handling system to accomodate that

Honestly, shouldn't that have been a clue against doing the mergers in the first place?

Originally Posted by Treveler

When this mistake has already happen, I think its fear deal that the pa team deal with those unfortunate members who was kicked, and the community deals with mistu as it sees fit.

Yes. Definitely. Unfortunately the community's way of dealing with mistu seems to be whining to PAteam. Historically speaking mergers are rarely a success, especially not on the short term, and not when arrising from periods of difficulty. I don't expect mistu to end their rankings significantly higher than earlier based simply on taking in another failed alliance. Then again, I don't actually know if their failings were because of their military command or simply (as they claim) being hit by too many other alliances.

[Treveler]

I also suggest that the merging alliances have a combined number of 100 or less for one week before they are allowed merge.