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22 Oct 2007, 23:31
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#1
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 41
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Multi-Class Targetting
" Each ship now supports up to 3 targets. The ship will fire at their first target class first. After all the possible targets have been killed, any ships that have not fired will fire at their second target (if one is there) with 60% efficiency. If all of these ships are killed, then the remaining firing ships fire at their third target (if there is one) with 30% "
Please, DO NOT GO BACK TO THIS!! That is the one change that I have absolutely loved about the pax changes, was the single class targetting of ships. Someone has to agree with me on this, eh?
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It's a new day
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22 Oct 2007, 23:34
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#2
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 32
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Agreed. When I heard about this change it made me question if I even wanted to muck around with the game. I mean I understand that this was the way the game was when there were a huge amount of players, but everything is made so much easier and more fun with single ship targeting. Please refrain from going back to the old ways. I never did like the old targeting system anyways.
If you want more players, just let Killmark bring his bot armies back. Just kidding.
But seriously, I do not like this decision at all.
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Love,
Balor
New Dawn HC
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22 Oct 2007, 23:36
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#3
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h3ll's angels
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Chapel Hill, NC
Posts: 273
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Personally I'm looking forward to a change of pace, regardless of how this changes the game.
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[18:04] * h3ll has quit IRC (Ping timeout)
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22 Oct 2007, 23:39
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#4
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Jazz Man
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,494
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
I think it'll be fun.
As zebra said, it'll add a nice change of pace and add some variety, making attacking more dynamic and interesting to figure out exactly what to hit your target with.
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Marv
Ex ROCK HC & PA Team Head of Support.
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22 Oct 2007, 23:41
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#5
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 255
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
sounds like fun
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[F-Crew], Wolfpack, Destiny, Urwins, Ascendancy & Jenova
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22 Oct 2007, 23:46
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#6
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The brother of Spammer
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Paisley - Scotland
Posts: 2,352
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
got mixed views on this but I do eagerly await the stats
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Missing Subh (r15-r18)
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22 Oct 2007, 23:49
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#7
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 41
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
I suppose I should see stats before completely disagreeing with going back to multi-class targetting, but I have to say I can't picture a great outcome from this (imo).
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It's a [NEW DAWN]
It's a new day
It's a new life
For me
And I'm Feeling Good
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22 Oct 2007, 23:55
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#8
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Up The Hatters!
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Kenilworth Road
Posts: 3,012
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
How is this adding to the "pace" of the game?
Hilarious.
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Planetarion veteran
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22 Oct 2007, 23:55
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#9
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Registered Awesome Person
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 5,676
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
I'm not sure who decided this but they deserve a punch in the face.
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Finally free!
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23 Oct 2007, 00:04
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#10
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 32
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Just when I started to get a hang of the new style of PA they start going back, bwahahah. I guess I'll make the best of it, but I'd really like targeting to stay the way it is.
P.S. Wouldn't adding to the pace of the game be something like lowering ETAs? The game will still take as long etc. =D
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Love,
Balor
New Dawn HC
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23 Oct 2007, 00:12
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#11
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The BOFH
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 463
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Might make things a little more interesting. Instead of sending just a few ship types to attack a target, you might have to send more if the defender has secondary/tertiary ships targeting your attack fleet. We might actually see people losing some of their fleet whilst attacking instead of having minimal risk.
Things have become very stale recently, it might add something new back into the game.
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23 Oct 2007, 00:19
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#12
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 45
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Low init races (cath/xan) ftw! Unless secondary and tertiary shots will have a higher init to make up for the "advantage"
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23 Oct 2007, 00:19
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#13
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Fook Yu
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Looked pal
Posts: 383
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Sorry, but i'm for getting back multi-class targetting. Even class1|class2|ALL (like the Pegasus and Tarantula, etc, from good old days)
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HEROES - It's not cheating if you admit to it
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23 Oct 2007, 00:21
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#14
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 7
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
I love this change. IMO single class targetting makes things too easy and simple.
Thank god im not a DC
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23 Oct 2007, 00:29
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#15
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mz.
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 8,587
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
This is stupid beyonds words, so I won't bother wasting any more.
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The outraged poets threw sticks and rocks over the side of the bridge. They were all missing Mary and he felt a contented smug feeling wash over him. He would have given them a coy little wave if the roof hadn't collapsed just then. Mary then found himself in the middle of an understandably shocked family's kitchen table. So he gave them the coy little wave and realized it probably would have been more effective if he hadn't been lying on their turkey.
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23 Oct 2007, 00:59
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#16
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i also havent heard of me
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 41
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
This is indeed a horrible idea. Only 2 rounds in and I can see a major problem with it. Those who get on top early wont have the holes in there fleet that smaller people can punch through on. I heard they were changing the combat system to this, and I've been praying ever since that they don't. Can we get a vote on this? Seems to me to be the major problem, that not enough feedback from the community, why not have people who used a credit last round get to vote on whether or not to change this and then youll get community feedback from people who are active and playing(instead of people who are just active on forums :P).
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Former HA - TGV - ODDR - ND - CT - VGN
Currently purring
Former HA HC, CT DC
Still useless.
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23 Oct 2007, 01:49
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#17
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h3ll's angels
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Chapel Hill, NC
Posts: 273
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kargool
How is this adding to the "pace" of the game?
Hilarious.
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Who said anything about adding to the "pace"? You took a common phrase too literally while changing the part that was meant to be literal.
I'm glad you found hilarity in an unlikely place.
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[18:04] * h3ll has quit IRC (Ping timeout)
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23 Oct 2007, 03:17
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#18
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 32
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Zebra, I respect both your black and white stripes, and agree with what you say about pace. What does pace have to do with it?
Although PA is a marathon, not a sprint. I do think that multi-class targeting allows for people to get out front and stay out front much more easily. Maybe I am wrong, rnd 9 was so long ago. But I really do believe that single class targeting allows for strategies where one of a lower score can find ways to hit bigger planets more easily.
Maybe I'm wrong. I'm good at being wrong. But hey, just my opinion.
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Love,
Balor
New Dawn HC
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23 Oct 2007, 04:59
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#19
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 1,663
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Mixed feelings on this new system:
We will see more accidental fleet catch or fleet trapped in base... (and more people quitting the game -or losing interest- after a heavy loss).
The problem is not from the multi targetting itself, but from the fact that only ships which haven't fired in T1 can fire in T2. Meaning people will send more ships on smaller targets... welcome back bashing (not that it was gone...).
On the other hand, big planets attacking with their whole fleets will be more open to retals...
I'm surprised PA is going for a T3, it seems like players will be able to build less different ships... but i wish good luck to the people in charge of making stats.
Good or bad in the end, too early to say, but it surely will be interesting to work out the best race to pick.
big question (already asked): will the init be the same for a ship or will its T1-T2-T3 have different inits ?
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<smith> You're 15 and full of shit.
<Furious_George> no, im 22
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23 Oct 2007, 05:13
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#20
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speed demon
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: SX!!
Posts: 343
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
lame... a step in a backward direction.
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23 Oct 2007, 05:46
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#21
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Noruega
Posts: 2,999
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Ill wait for the stats to give a definite judgement, but I have to say im not convinced its the right way to go.
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"Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of War"
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23 Oct 2007, 06:34
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#22
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self-entitledly superior
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Finland
Posts: 341
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Wow, another decision done in the cabinets.
edit: **** you all, **** you
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23 Oct 2007, 06:50
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#23
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Up The Hatters!
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Kenilworth Road
Posts: 3,012
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
I don't really see why this change is gonna help the game, or make the game better in any way.
To be honest, this "move" has the smell of desperation hanging all over it. Bringing back a "dear old favourite" to attract more ex players.
To use an example from popular culture: Chef Ramsay of the tv show Kitchen Nightmares is always warning about making things to complex for customers, like having a big menu with over 20 different meals, which is exactly what I think the PA-Team is doing with this move.
I also think that it most likely wont attract any more "old" players back to the game. Most of the old people I know that came back to the game didnt start either crying or yelling where is my multi target ships. (They more complain about the cargo ship being gone)
It will also make the job of a dc AND a planet attacking a lot more difficult, and while that might be good for some of the bigger nerds who loves a very complex matrix to get everything, it will most likely not attract Joe Average.
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Planetarion veteran
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23 Oct 2007, 07:20
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#24
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Hired Thug
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Central Illinois USA
Posts: 894
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
how does it make the job of a DC more difficult, he now has more def options, and as long as the calcs are loaded with the proper engine, whats the problem
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Anatidaephobia is the fear that somewhere in the world, there is a duck watching you......
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23 Oct 2007, 07:25
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#25
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Up The Hatters!
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Kenilworth Road
Posts: 3,012
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
As i said, it makes the job more difficult for both parts. And most likely that more ships are needed to fully cover an attack because of the various targeting options a ship will have. I think it will become more apperant when the stats will be released.
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Planetarion veteran
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23 Oct 2007, 08:25
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#26
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Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: North
Posts: 227
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Im looking forward to it.
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VisioN Forever!
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23 Oct 2007, 08:28
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#27
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Dictator
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 634
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
you bunch of whiney bitches.. this in my eyes is a actual DECENT change for once. Theres a lot more to think about when attacking and defending and will bring back some old skool tactics. Im all for it.. i expect the people moaning are the ones who are used to putting sweet FA effort into playing nowerdays.
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23 Oct 2007, 08:35
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#28
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self-entitledly superior
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Finland
Posts: 341
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Good luck making a decent set of stats with the added complexity and five races, looking in the past few rounds I'm not too confident on the success.
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23 Oct 2007, 09:22
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#29
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Bad Girl
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: right here..right now
Posts: 1,055
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
well this is certainly a bombshell !
For once in pa history i can say with certainty that not one of us was expecting 3 ship targeting back ever .
For those who think it will make the stats harder to make up, remember this , there is more room to manouvere with extra firing, so deficiencies in the races can be made up for with T2 and 3.
I look forward to seeing the stats.
Wether it is a good idea or not i reserve judgement on.
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R11 -> NOW HR HC
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I'm not misunderstood ... I'm EVIL
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23 Oct 2007, 09:35
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#30
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[Vision]
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: The Netherlands
Posts: 897
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistwraith
For those who think it will make the stats harder to make up, remember this , there is more room to manouvere with extra firing, so deficiencies in the races can be made up for with T2 and 3.
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Given all targetting is in percentages of the fixed damage ships have, overpowered ships will have influence on alot more ships than they currently do. And given there will be more options to target certain classes, chances are more loopholes in the stats are introduced than fixed.
That said, i personally liked the multiple targetting in the past, but i'm not too sure on how it would cope with the fixed damage and armour ratings (weaponspeed, agility, guns, power, armour allowed for alot more tweaking options to try and balance out certain ships and targetting). One thing it will surely do is have a big impact on play styles. With the decreased player base i wonder how the extra defensive options will assist in keeping the game enjoyable. Never landing attacks ain't fun, but it might not be terrible in the sense that we might see more battles with losses on both sides rather than one. I'm a bit sceptic, but not completely negative towards to change.
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[Vision] in a lost dream, contributing to The 5th Element at present
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23 Oct 2007, 09:55
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#31
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For Crowly <3
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Luton, England
Posts: 1,391
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
if PA can't come up with decent ship stats for one vs one combat, how on EARTH will they come up with decent stats for one vs multi?
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23 Oct 2007, 14:36
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#32
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Bolivian Alpaca
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 912
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Mass xan fi/co ftw!
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"I throw myself into the sea, release the wave, let it wash over me ..."
MadCowS - Angels - eXilition - Destiny - Wolfpack - Jenova - p3nguins
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23 Oct 2007, 14:42
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#33
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Guest
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
I'd put money on the round being won by a pia boy.
Maybe Ministry (if they play) will have a better round? This should be familiar territory to them.
(NB: No I haven't been reading the forums and so have no earthly idea who's playing and who's not.)
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23 Oct 2007, 16:11
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#34
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 32
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
It's definitely going to take a while to get used to this again.
__________________
Love,
Balor
New Dawn HC
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23 Oct 2007, 16:14
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#35
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: Noruega
Posts: 2,999
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Lets bring back a FI with anti all 3rd targetting
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"Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of War"
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23 Oct 2007, 18:01
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#36
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NE
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: UK
Posts: 828
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Lose with single class, lose with multi targeting. its all good.
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PEACE.
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23 Oct 2007, 18:09
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#37
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Drink is Good
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 2,122
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
great decision
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Can we please have a moment of silence...........
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23 Oct 2007, 18:31
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#38
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Bolivian Alpaca
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 912
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alki
great decision
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Alki says it's great, do we really need any further proof that this is a bad idea?
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"I throw myself into the sea, release the wave, let it wash over me ..."
MadCowS - Angels - eXilition - Destiny - Wolfpack - Jenova - p3nguins
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23 Oct 2007, 20:21
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#39
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a pain
Join Date: May 2005
Location: .ro
Posts: 260
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
salvage ahoy
people need to start being prepared to lose ships in their attacks, there won't be a lot of "clean" breps anymore.
Also the terms flak and cannon-fooder will be widely used.
At this stage in the game, any change is good change. It can't get any worse can it?
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needles and pins
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23 Oct 2007, 21:01
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#40
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Fightin-irish for life
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: guinness brewery
Posts: 2,177
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
guess ill be xan or cat next rd , assuming they dont screw up the stats more than usual
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Ascendancy, now with added Irish
"In the absence of orders, find something and kill it."
-Rommel
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23 Oct 2007, 21:09
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#41
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a pain
Join Date: May 2005
Location: .ro
Posts: 260
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
zik FI/co pods maybe? that should also make the round nice
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needles and pins
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24 Oct 2007, 09:25
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#42
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LDK
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Norway
Posts: 2,220
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
AWESOME! just fking awesome. about time we get this back. missed it for years.
Finally I can play without worrying about nubs coming at me with MASSES of 1 class, and roid me, when I m 100 times bigger than them.
Thsi also makes more options, and u actually have to have a clue to attack someone. not just mass.
Before looking at stats, I love the idea. OLDSKOOL FTW! lets remove prelaunch, and add 3 ticks of roiding while we are at it?! plz?
__________________
[Omen]
Quote:
Originally posted by Newt
I would give me right testicle to be in a gal with you wishmaster!!! wonder if thatd be enough to bribe spinner with hmmmm
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<JC`> i sent him a msg saying Wishmaster 0wns, so he recalled
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24 Oct 2007, 13:45
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#43
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Wearer of The Hat
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Bedfordshire, UK
Posts: 252
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
gets my thumbs up, as long as ships dont have to have three target classes (IE only T1, or T1+T2) should make attacking/defending more interesting and a bit more random.
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24 Oct 2007, 15:36
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#44
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Crackhead
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 239
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Quote:
Originally Posted by voodoo
At this stage in the game, any change is good change. It can't get any worse can it?
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yes it can...just look at PIA
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wishmaster
Before looking at stats, I love the idea. OLDSKOOL FTW! lets remove prelaunch, and add 3 ticks of roiding while we are at it?! plz?
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Please do! as well as bring back scanning for roids
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[Ministry][Ascendancy][Retired]
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24 Oct 2007, 15:40
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#45
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Jazz Man
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,494
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wishmaster
Before looking at stats, I love the idea. OLDSKOOL FTW! lets remove prelaunch, and add 3 ticks of roiding while we are at it?! plz?
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^^
__________________
Marv
Ex ROCK HC & PA Team Head of Support.
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24 Oct 2007, 19:36
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#46
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Inactive peon
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,050
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
I've taken a step back from development recently, so I wasn;t invovled in the decisions on this, however I think its a good thing.
For a start its more realistic and as lame as it sounds I do like some semblence of realism. The other big benefit I see is that new players who don;t really know what they are doing will be better covered defensivly which is good. To counter that though attackers will feel as though they need to use more ships to avoid losses - this is bad and removes the benefits. However, we do have XP which rewards hitting bigger planets and taking losses - perhaps now is a good time to increase the importance of XP slightly to promote people's willingness to loose ships.
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24 Oct 2007, 19:39
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#47
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LDK
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Norway
Posts: 2,220
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
increasing the importance of xp can never, NEVER be a good thing.
__________________
[Omen]
Quote:
Originally posted by Newt
I would give me right testicle to be in a gal with you wishmaster!!! wonder if thatd be enough to bribe spinner with hmmmm
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<JC`> i sent him a msg saying Wishmaster 0wns, so he recalled
Last edited by Wishmaster; 24 Oct 2007 at 19:46.
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24 Oct 2007, 19:47
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#48
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zawze^asc
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Norway.
Posts: 87
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
You've got to be kidding me. Now I might have to use a bcalc :'(
And as for oldskool, let's remove the different races and bring back eonium as fuel and my battleships-who-I-could-not-afford-to-launch. Oh, and throw in some proper thieves aswell.
__________________
"Facts are just opinions, and opinons can be wrong, the only thing that's never wrong is confidence."
- Veronica Palmer, Better Off Ted
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24 Oct 2007, 20:57
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#49
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Registered Awesome Person
Join Date: Jul 2002
Posts: 5,676
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
As I said before, this is an absolutely shocking idea. Changing to single-class targetting was great because it made it possible for people with small value fleets to roid people with bigger fleets. This was much more difficult under muti-class targetting. You're removing skill by doing this - the only thing that's more complicated is combat itself, and any credible player will just use a battlecalc.
It'll all end in tears.
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Finally free!
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24 Oct 2007, 21:29
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#50
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Come Closer, I Have Candy
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Vast Regions of Space Without a Lifejacket
Posts: 213
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Re: Multi-Class Targetting
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal
For a start its more realistic and as lame as it sounds I do like some semblence of realism.
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Oh I agree that its more realistic than single class targetting, but Im not convinced that its fully needed at this point.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal
perhaps now is a good time to increase the importance of XP slightly to promote people's willingness to loose ships.
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As fun as r16 was, lets not repeat it in a pay round
This will likely hurt me more than help, I live on attacking above me, in many cases way above me, though there might be more of a sense of accomplishment if I actually cap from those planets with this system in place.
Only thing left to say is Ill be looking forward to beta
__________________
MetallicAnomaly
[ROCK] || Conspiracy Theory || Ascendancy
Rounds Played: 3-9 16-19 23-33
I became insane, with long intervals of horrible sanity.
- Edgar Allan Poe
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