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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 20:36   #1
Ace
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And now for something different.

Something thats been buggin me for a long time now.

And the Delos actions of this round made me decide to finally post about it.

There is a group of ppl in this game that have 1 motto and that is to be as negative as possible and whine, moan and bitch about everyone and every thing.

Yes a large part of this group are part of asc and yes they also are a group that like to XP whore (not all of em) and be as negative as possible about other players/alliances as they can to stirr up trouble.

This round I seen delos get escorts from our buddy elviz and co, getting heaps of dontations form the gal fund to grow in the end (56% value growth today) and imo thats against the spirit of the game.
How should it be rewarding to do as little as possible to gain the most ?

It should be the other way around imo.

I feel it's time for PA team to change the way XP works and get a better grip on the stats for next round cos I feel it will only scare more ppl away if they dont.

My 2 cents

(no personal attack btw just intended as a example)
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Last edited by Ace; 16 Mar 2007 at 20:43.
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 20:53   #2
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Re: And now for something different.

No, its to show the state the game is in at the moment, words wont cut it anymore, actions need to be taken. The game needs a change we all want it, pa team refuse to do it
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 20:55   #3
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Re: And now for something different.

The main reason why (some of us) we wanted Delos to win so badly was to prove a point like that. A free planet winning is a good thing, maybe it will make certain people open their eyes and give us a less one-dimensional game. Also, there are tons of threads about these issues, and I think most of Ascendancy agrees with a lot of what's written. At least insofar as what is a problem and what is not, though probably not to many of the proposed solutions.
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 21:02   #4
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Re: And now for something different.

I know the reasons to do it and I know its been suggested a lot but you also got to understand that a lot of ppl dont feel happy about getting attacked by a xp whore just so he can show the game stats and meganisme is wrong.

And you got hardly a way to def against it.


Like I said it's no attack on ppl (if you read it like that soz but its not intended that way)

It's just my way to try and show it needs to change.
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 21:07   #5
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace
I know the reasons to do it and I know its been suggested a lot but you also got to understand that a lot of ppl dont feel happy about getting attacked by a xp whore just so he can show the game stats and meganisme is wrong.
You yourself harbour these exact type of players, go figure.
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 21:13   #6
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alki
You yourself harbour these exact type of players, go figure.
And do you think I like it ?

but ppl get tired of getting hit that way so they do the same and thats something we need to try and change.
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 21:17   #7
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace
And do you think I like it ?

but ppl get tired of getting hit that way so they do the same and thats something we need to try and change.
yeah you're preeching to the choir here bud, but as i said actions speak louder than words.
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 21:18   #8
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by qebab
.... A free planet winning is a good thing....

He didnt win bec he was free, or despite being free. He got enough help from paying planets to be able to win (at least thats what ppl tell me)

Just to make sure you understand that. If he did it all himself, please correct me :P


Back to the topic: my personal opinion is that XP as an idea was perfect, but the way it has been abused since it was introduced, has made it foolish and stupid. Let's just kill XP and play for value again, like we shud ;-)

In the old days, you had to send just the right fleet to steal at maxcap. Sending too much value wud deminish your cap. SOmethin glike that could be reintroduced, like your cap% is bigger when attacking bigger planets. (Just an example)

THis wud make ppl attack bigeg rplanets more often, which was what XP was meant to do
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 21:25   #9
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Re: And now for something different.

Take a example from today.

Guy in my gal posts in forums 'bla bla bla gotta go to the hospital, ive sent away ships, if i get incs plz dont def'. Waddya know, delos is attacking him with a escort(he sends no pods) as first wave, coincidence? I think not, and i find it really really lame.
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 21:30   #10
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace
I know the reasons to do it and I know its been suggested a lot but you also got to understand that a lot of ppl dont feel happy about getting attacked by a xp whore just so he can show the game stats and meganisme is wrong.
You dont make any sense.
He won.
He won in a way you dont like?
He won in a way you dont think is right?
He used legal game mechanisms in a way that is crap in your eyes?
I dont see how you can blame him for winning a game by making best use of what the game allows him to do?
Doesnt that characterize a winner in all cases?
If you dont like it, then you should ask: why was that bullshit possible? So you actually agree with those "bitching and moaning".
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 21:34   #11
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Remy
He didnt win bec he was free, or despite being free. He got enough help from paying planets to be able to win (at least thats what ppl tell me)

Just to make sure you understand that. If he did it all himself, please correct me :P
I do understand that. What he showed is that it is possible to sign up 2 weeks late with a free account and win (admittedly he did have support), not entirely different from what Hude did. If you really think we all think XP is great, you're wrong. Doing things like this serves to highlight them, bring them to attention to people who might be able to do something about it. That was my point.
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 21:48   #12
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace
This round I seen delos get escorts from our buddy elviz and co, getting heaps of dontations form the gal fund to grow in the end (56% value growth today) and imo thats against the spirit of the game.
How should it be rewarding to do as little as possible to gain the most ?
Is this one of those "oh my he won I suck ass he's definately against the spirit of the game" -rants when you're bitter for someone winning? This reminds me so much of round 13.

How should it not be rewarding to play so that the way you play is both allowed by the rules of the game and also the best viable game plan shown by the rank of your planet, to elaborate, your victory?

It's not DeLos to blame for winning the round. DeLos, whatever he did, with or without escorts, with or without donations from galaxy fund, he played well, and won the round without cheating. What makes for the spirit of the game is something of a rant, and you can only say the game administrators and ship statistics designers have caused the spirit of the game (here I refer the to spirit of the game as the method of game play that brings success and is allowed by the rules) to be what it was past round.

This can be elaborated by the top quadrant DeLos-Game-Alki-goat as well as Hude's journey. They've all played well, and they've all played in the spirit of the game. The spirit of the game, however is for the administrators to forge, and the community to find. The fact that you cry here how you feel they did well was against the spirit of the game is just a bit pathetic.
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 21:50   #13
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coltaine
You dont make any sense.
He won.
He won in a way you dont like?
He won in a way you dont think is right?
He used legal game mechanisms in a way that is crap in your eyes?
I dont see how you can blame him for winning a game by making best use of what the game allows him to do?
Doesnt that characterize a winner in all cases?
If you dont like it, then you should ask: why was that bullshit possible? So you actually agree with those "bitching and moaning".

I agree with what they are trying to change but NOT with the way HOW they do it.
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 21:53   #14
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace
I agree with what they are trying to change but NOT with the way HOW they do it.
How else are we supposed to do it? The best way to show that something is broken is to actually exploit it. If you want to blame someone, then blame Jolt / PA Team. Blaming the players which suggest solutions to the problems they are proving is certainly not the way that things get changed.
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 22:13   #15
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Re: And now for something different.

For my part, (as I ahve made clear on numerous times), I dont care how ascendency got the top ranks, or how they choose to play the game.

What I cant stand is the continual whining from certain 'members', who are just heer to be negative and knock others. Its almost like a bunch of geeks trying to be the big bully by name calling jsut like they were bullied at school.
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 22:58   #16
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Re: And now for something different.

Ironically, its you who just sounded like a bitter boy pressing a hanky on his nose :\
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 23:03   #17
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coltaine
Ironically, its you who just sounded like a bitter boy pressing a hanky on his nose :\
My alliance won, why would I need a hanky?
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 23:25   #18
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by isildurx
Take a example from today.

Guy in my gal posts in forums 'bla bla bla gotta go to the hospital, ive sent away ships, if i get incs plz dont def'. Waddya know, delos is attacking him with a escort(he sends no pods) as first wave, coincidence? I think not, and i find it really really lame.
Same thing happened with my galmate and Ali. They've been hitting eachother non-stop whole round with the "dont please dont defend" reason.
They've gotten themselfs in the top10/top50 that way, untill they got reported/'closed' (2 weeks ago), ever since then they didnt do it ever again and dropped back to top50/200.
Unfortunatly there wasnt enough evidence to keep them closed, however in the end their 'tactic' didnt pay off as they didnt end up with toprankings. Its still sad how this happens though, failure in the system.

I cant comment on Delos and if he really did the same, just saying that IF he did - he wasnt the only one (by far)
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 23:43   #19
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Re: And now for something different.

Delos was the best winner to show that theres something going wrong with our game. I still dont know what rid the admins to establish something like xp. If you wanna know who was the most skilled planet this round, look at #1 value please. I wont play another xp-pa round. And I think im not the only one.
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 23:46   #20
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forest
For my part, (as I ahve made clear on numerous times), I dont care how ascendency got the top ranks, or how they choose to play the game.

What I cant stand is the continual whining from certain 'members', who are just heer to be negative and knock others. Its almost like a bunch of geeks trying to be the big bully by name calling jsut like they were bullied at school.
Be negative and knock others? For what? Did the object of their scorn deserve it?

All I will say, is that in terms of stats and game mechanics, I think Ascendancy is one of the most positive and progressive alliances there has ever been on that issue, because I think all of Ascendancy's members want to see a good game of planetarion.
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 23:52   #21
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lokken
Be negative and knock others? For what? Did the object of their scorn deserve it?

All I will say, is that in terms of stats and game mechanics, I think Ascendancy is one of the most positive and progressive alliances there has ever been on that issue, because I think all of Ascendancy's members want to see a good game of planetarion.
the people i see making intelligent suggestions generally are the likes of jer etc tbfh
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Unread 16 Mar 2007, 23:59   #22
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dedin
Delos was the best winner to show that theres something going wrong with our game. I still dont know what rid the admins to establish something like xp. If you wanna know who was the most skilled planet this round, look at #1 value please. I wont play another xp-pa round. And I think im not the only one.
All I'll say don't leave because we really need players who at the bottom line, actually enjoy a good round of planetarion (we could have done better this round, certainly). I do agree that DeLoS has shown that changes need to be made and I think we as a community can fix the problems with the game.

What I think the problem is that last round we had a good set of stats, a good balance, and all that was needed was changes in the way score was counted and minor tweaks to the stats. I have no idea why they change things a lot when we have a good setup that doesn't have one killer tactic, it seems to be change for change's sake. I'm not saying we should always keep the same stats, but we should give ourselves more time to properly revolutionise, develop and test future rounds of planetarion, instead of releasing what we had this round, when a refined version of last round's setup would have more than sufficed. I think we need to change the whole approach as to how we to develop the game, as well as to how the game should work. I'd rather have an improved version of something old to keep me entertained for a bit with different politics and storyline than something new which doesn't really work, much like this round did.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 00:12   #23
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Re: And now for something different.

I enjoyed playing this round, and i found the stats to be quite good except for etd, which were apparently designed to be an xp whoring race. I myself, was going to start as etd, but being a value player, found etd impractical when it came to holding roids.
I found politics a bit slacking, especially towards the end of the round. I thought the last week should have been as intense as the last 2-3 nights.
I however, have a problem with Ascendancy thinking _they_ have the solution for PAs problems. A 'better' game is a game as they would like to play, with the stats they want to make, with the score system they want to have. And it may well be that they have the most experience in the PA community. But that doesn't mean that the whole community as a whole will like the game as they want it.
I doubt any change in PA will make it soooo much better, that we will go back to 5k payed accounts. Those days are over. You play the game because you like it, and if you don't like it, don't play it, and it you play it nevertheless, cut the 'this round sucks' - 'stats suck' - 'I'm just playing to prove a point' - crap.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 00:29   #24
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Re: And now for something different.

Delos got as much help from his friends as say Caj or Agony did. He didnt ask for anyones help, from times i seen him, he came in channel he claimed targets, he teamed up where required. ridiculous.

WELL DONE DELOS \o/
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 01:21   #25
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace

There is a group of ppl in this game that have 1 motto and that is to be as negative as possible and whine, moan and bitch about everyone and every thing.

Yes a large part of this group are part of asc
I'm not so interested in the rest of your post, as I am about this. Would you care to elaborate on what you mean by 'whine, moan and bitch about everyone and everything'? Some specific examples would be nice. I'm not saying this as a rhetorical challenge, I'd honestly like to know what sort of behavior Ascendancy members exhibit to cause this sort of reaction.

I know we are often arrogant and condescending, and I can understand that jokes like this are taken a step or two too seriously. But my overall impression is that we mostly stay within the bounds of AD decency.

Personally, I see more negative attacks on Ascendancy than I see the other way around, but obviously I'm not in a position to call this the objective truth, so I'd like to see some examples of what sort of posts or IRC chatter we generate that fit into this category.

Quote:
and yes they also are a group that like to XP whore (not all of em) and be as negative as possible about other players/alliances as they can to stirr up trouble.
I don't understand what the connection between XP whoring and 'being negative' to 'stir up trouble' is. In fact, I don't understand that sentence at all.

Quote:
This round I seen delos get escorts from our buddy elviz and co, getting heaps of dontations form the gal fund to grow in the end (56% value growth today) and imo thats against the spirit of the game.
How should it be rewarding to do as little as possible to gain the most ?
While I agree with the sentiment of your post, that something in Planetarion is broken and needs to be fixed, I don't understand how 'escrorts, heaps of donations' are particularly rewarded by the game. And they're certainly not anything new. Do you mean to say that the top planets of rounds 2-6 were all 'against the spirit of the game'?

Quote:
I feel it's time for PA team to change the way XP works and get a better grip on the stats for next round cos I feel it will only scare more ppl away if they dont.
Yes, and there's already a healthy discussion going on about this on other forums. Why did you feel the need to post one on AD about it? Isn't this a bit off-topic?

Quote:
(no personal attack btw just intended as a example)
Oh but it is. You're singling out Ascendancy and DeLoS specifically as being awful people who whine, bitch and moan. Are against the spirit of the game and stir up trouble. All of these are hostile words. If you're so interested in changing the way the game works, shouldn't you be addressing the game and not the players?
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 02:20   #26
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Re: And now for something different.

you didnt have to crash fleets, get escorts, or donations to do well with xp. I did none of the above and still finished 3rd in xp. Some say xp made the game too easy. Im still undecided on that. It took more effort than I wanted to search for targets that didnt have waves of inc already or get piggied. Plus looking for targets who showed on sandmans they could be roided, and then actually landing without the targets getting def. It wasnt as simple as find the planet with the most value, launch on him, go to bed and dont worry about scanning. I never had that luxury once. Not to mention jgping yourself to look for fleetcatches.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 03:54   #27
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Re: And now for something different.

You gotta ask yourself this question: They are actually using 6 weeks of their lives to prove that it is possible to win with a free planet, and trying to bend the rules as much as possible to do so.

Gotta give them credit for that time consuming effort.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 09:08   #28
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kargool
You gotta ask yourself this question: They are actually using 6 weeks of their lives to prove that it is possible to win with a free planet, and trying to bend the rules as much as possible to do so.

Gotta give them credit for that time consuming effort.
To be honest, I don't think DeLos' effort was at all as consuming as an average Ct value member's effort. The thing is, they spent their time to win or succeed in a round of Planetarion, for which a lot of people have spent time to achieve. Way more time, too. I can just look at myself for the amounts I spent round 13.

What's the bottom line? DeLos can be proud winning the round. You can whine about bending the rules, but you've probably played too little (yes, I know how much you've played, but then it has to be somewhere else, doesn't it?) still whining about bending rules. Round after round, the winners often bend rules more or less. This can be seen in succesful planets from the beginnings of Planetarion (as jesterina mentioned) all the way to modern day top alliances. There are rounds 1up or eXilition have won where we can say "oh they spent a lot of time bending the rules", but they've still made it on the top.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 10:20   #29
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Re: And now for something different.

Some food for thought:

Yes the stats and xp this round were a mess,

BUT - surely everyone knew all the formulae and stats at the start of the round - if one particular person, group, alliance adapts to this best and wins surely it shows they are using the correct tactics etc for a given round - people can complain about the balence issues etc., but in the end the winners still did a better job than anyone else - if it was a play for XP round, why didn't everyone adapt and play like that?

In general you don't complain about how a particualr game doesn't play the way you want to play it, you learn how to play a particular game - sure you can lobby for feature changes - but not on the grounds that the current game doesn't suit your style, but on the grounds that you think another way of doing things will be more fun.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 11:09   #30
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Re: And now for something different.

That is correct Kal.

However, surely as we all knew at the start of the round the stats and xp were a mess, surely it should of been fixed before tick start?

Then Ascenency wouldnt of been doing this 'to prove a point'.

Again though, I dont think people are complaining about the way the top planets adapted to the stats, more the attitude of a select few vocal members who all the way through kept on with the 'you all suck, u dont deserve to win etc etc' attitude.

Its like, they of all people want to be able to do there thing, but are the first to complain when others do it differently.

They spend 30 minutes saying how many skilled players they have, and how those players are all ex-hc of this that and the other, then the next 2 hours complaining about how the skill level has dropped elsewhere.

Its that attitude I believe this thread is about.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 11:28   #31
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal
Some food for thought:

Yes the stats and xp this round were a mess,

BUT - surely everyone knew all the formulae and stats at the start of the round - if one particular person, group, alliance adapts to this best and wins surely it shows they are using the correct tactics etc for a given round - people can complain about the balence issues etc., but in the end the winners still did a better job than anyone else - if it was a play for XP round, why didn't everyone adapt and play like that?

In general you don't complain about how a particualr game doesn't play the way you want to play it, you learn how to play a particular game - sure you can lobby for feature changes - but not on the grounds that the current game doesn't suit your style, but on the grounds that you think another way of doing things will be more fun.
yes but who the hell wants to play a xp game?
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 11:32   #32
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Re: And now for something different.

xp the way it is is certainly more fun to play then for value.

I guess some people simply cant play for xp properly cause they are used to hit downwards, and are angry cause others are more talented playing that way.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 11:42   #33
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Re: And now for something different.

All these value players are just crying into their pillows at night because instead of bashing on people 1/3 their size and stealing their roids, the people 1/3 their size are now bashing on them and outscoring them.

'I've played since rd 2 and xp has ruined my life!'

Adapt, boys and girls, stop moaning that you can't actually play the game as it's set out and see if you can learn to.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 11:44   #34
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Re: And now for something different.

i have one thing to say


PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE

remove zik steal ships dieing - was a bad idea - was a bugged idea - ziks dont need to be nerfed.. been what... 7 rounds or more since a zik won ?
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 11:45   #35
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Re: And now for something different.

Are you not seeing that people that have played (and won) with xp, are also calling for it to change? It is not just the value players.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 11:55   #36
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caj
i have one thing to say


PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE

remove zik steal ships dieing - was a bad idea - was a bugged idea - ziks dont need to be nerfed.. been what... 7 rounds or more since a zik won ?
I am very glad they changed the zik-race, cause a lot of abuse was going on with the stealing ability. Actually for the first time I played zik myself this round, and its a good race to play as it is now.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 12:06   #37
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Re: And now for something different.

This is my last round, because i can't combine RL and work (i'm a stocktrader) with PA anymore. I played this round with a minum of activity. I decided to sign in two weeks after tickstart (Thnx Marinho for the credit )
I chose Zik and wanted to go for value, because i didnt had much time to login and check my planet. I thought when i have incomings and wasn't online to send away my fleet, at least i capped some ships back. I logged in twice a day, in the evening to claim targets and in the afternoon to build ships. Most of the time i didnt had a jgp, i almost landed blind always. Ive lost a shitload of ships that way. Since it was my last round, i couldnt be bothered much. I changend from going for value for XP-whoring and went for almost only DE. With The ships i capped along the way, i had three attackfleets available. Almost half the round i went 3-fleeting. I did not send defence to allie and ingal, simply cuz i could not be around to login, not cuz i didnt want too. All in all, i have send 10 defence in total (allie + ingal). Sorry for that guyz...But i didnt expect defence in return, so it was all good.

Bottom line: With a minimum of activity, i ended top 100 and #1 XP for ziks. Im convincend with a little bit more activity, i could make top 10.
So yes, the formula needs imo to be changend. I can imagine for those who spended waay more time than me and still not being able to end top 100, are kinda pissed and it kills their fun for this game.

I understand why sum people want to prove the system fails, but whats the price for that? When this game almost dont have any players left, was it worth at the end? It's a fact that more and more people have lost interest in the game since a few rounds. Proving your point by killing the fun for others and in the long way the game itselff, isn't worth it imo. I know it's hard, but always aim (in this case) for a win-win situation and not just to prove your own point...think further...
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 12:10   #38
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Caj
been what... 7 rounds or more since a zik won ?
I'm fairly convinced nobody has won as a zikonian player since round 13, and I might add I might well be the only zikonian player to have won a round in PAX enviroments. Caths have been taking the wins! Irregardless, this might just be a sign of a characteristic lack of balance that relates to the current combat engine.


edit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forest
Then Ascenency wouldnt of been doing this 'to prove a point'.
I'm quite convinced Ascendancy didn't do it "just to prove a point". Rather, I think they did it because of no particular reason but the dramatic score gains related to it and the ability to succeed in a round through those scoregains. Can you blame them?
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 13:03   #39
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Re: And now for something different.

Indeed. But thats the 'reason they have always given'.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 13:45   #40
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Forest
Then Ascenency wouldnt of been doing this 'to prove a point'.
The 'proving a point' stuff is mostly BS and any Ascendancy member who said this was wrong. There's no need to justify playing for XP with some kind of higher moral purpose; the objective of a game is to win, and if XP is the most effective route to victory then that provides all of the reasons a person or alliance needs to follow an XP-based strategy. We do not, and have never, given a shit about what 'the community' thinks of our playing style.

Quote:
They spend 30 minutes saying how many skilled players they have, and how those players are all ex-hc of this that and the other, then the next 2 hours complaining about how the skill level has dropped elsewhere.

Its that attitude I believe this thread is about.
It's true though, isn't it? Most old-timers would agree that present alliances wouldn't stand a chance against, say, LDK or Legion, if these were still around (even correcting for the difference in alliance sizes). The 1up/eXilition hegemony proved that. Of course, you can only beat the enemy in front of you, so that's no reflection on the effort put in by those who do play in the current 'top' alliances, merely a reflection on the game as a whole.

This definitely is a problem with the game rather than a problem with people. The game lacks tactical and strategic depth, and this means that most of the complexity is shifted to the meta-game (alliances). Ascendancy have managed to exploit the few tactical options that remain (XP, the exile system, Zik stealing) and the response of PA team has generally been to nerf or remove these options. So we see a game that is getting simpler, and also an alliance system that is getting simpler too - most alliances are very much alike and show little variation or innovation in their approach to the game. The days when there was an identifiable Fury, Legion or Xanadu 'way' are gone; the old differences in command structure, attack planning or basic game tactics have largely disappeared. Only the 'slow play' was used effectively by eXilition and 1up, and the last alliance strategic innovation - hiding members out of the tag - was used by Ascendancy and subsequently joined the list of 'too good to allow' strategies, being nerfed by the restrictions on alliance recruitment, score and merging.

In Ascendancy, we try to innovate. It seems like nobody else does, and is simply making ever-poorer clones of some long-gone alliance (CT being basically the fourth generation Fury knock-off). Fun, if you still enjoy that kind of thing I guess, but speaking personally I had enough of that after r9.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 21:05   #41
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Re: And now for something different.

Rob could not have put it better. The quality of the players has dropped to an all-time low, and its a bit comical to an extent. The pa team has really jacked up the game to the extent that they made it too easy for people with an inkling of brain power to do well. I was on the outside looking in at ascendancy until I joined in round 19 I think. They all enjoy the game. They all play(most) the beta and give very realistic feedback. PA team never responds to this feedback, and when they do, its in the form of taking another aspect of gameplay completely out.

I can't speak for everyone, but generally I give the community shit no matter what. When something serious comes baout to improve the game I am all for it.
I am sure many other ascendancy feel the same way.
We want to win in the easiest and most effective way possible. Sadly this has bene narrowed down due to the lack of PA team response to the requests for a broader game.

As for members talking shit about the communities skill level, when you have people that have ended top 10/20/30 with no alliance defence, ended a round with the top 4 planets and you had no organized attacks or defence, after a while it gets a bit comical. Its also fun to rub it in to people that really "try", as the game is not that hard and every single planet that signs up can do the exact same thing that ascendancy does. Instead they make thread after thread after thread complaining about it.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 21:11   #42
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal
Some food for thought:

Yes the stats and xp this round were a mess,

BUT - surely everyone knew all the formulae and stats at the start of the round - if one particular person, group, alliance adapts to this best and wins surely it shows they are using the correct tactics etc for a given round - people can complain about the balence issues etc., but in the end the winners still did a better job than anyone else - if it was a play for XP round, why didn't everyone adapt and play like that?

In general you don't complain about how a particualr game doesn't play the way you want to play it, you learn how to play a particular game - sure you can lobby for feature changes - but not on the grounds that the current game doesn't suit your style, but on the grounds that you think another way of doing things will be more fun.
I so hate it when you comment on the stats post round. Why not LISTEN, and fix issues PRE-round.
Slap yourself for having a 7 week lag on your brain functionality.
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 21:36   #43
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Re: And now for something different.

Amen you guys, amen.
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R60 - ND -> Ultores (Finished rank 48)
R61 - Rogues

14:05 <Swing> I wear a cape and a burger king paper crown when i play pa
14:10 <Zwanstic> u also talk alot of shit
14:14 <Blue_Esper> you're a weird unit
12:33 <hone> oddr is where we send all the semi retarded and gay bashing ult has beens LOL
12:34 <hone> thats where u should be swing lol
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Unread 17 Mar 2007, 22:43   #44
TheGoaT
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Re: And now for something different.

even from a business aspect it makes so little sense how PA doesnt listen to the paying members and makes stupid choices that makes them quit the game. You do realize youre supposed to MAKE money with your business right? And ffs ever heard of ADVERTISING? Increasing your source of revenue? Does anyone out there have a fking clue?
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Unread 18 Mar 2007, 11:23   #45
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Re: And now for something different.

Engineering a win isnt illegal .. a bit immoral and very disheartening for those who made real attempts without that sort of help to make it into the top 5 planets.

to those stripped of a place because of what happened, you dont have to drown your sorrows too much, those of us with an ounce of intelligence know where you should have been.

Effort doesnt allways make you come 1st, but it is allways recognised.
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Unread 18 Mar 2007, 11:29   #46
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistwraith
Engineering a win isnt illegal .. a bit immoral and very disheartening for those who made real attempts without that sort of help to make it into the top 5 planets.

to those stripped of a place because of what happened, you dont have to drown your sorrows too much, those of us with an ounce of intelligence know where you should have been.

Effort doesnt allways make you come 1st, but it is allways recognised.
Of course it's not illegal. /Sarcasm.

But whom would you "blame" for it? The person who cleverly ploys his win, and wins the game? Or the people who set the game mechanics so that this is the viable and best way to play the game (the top100 setup should elaborate why it is the best way to play the game). Nobody was stripped of a place. They just did not play the most effective way. It's their fall, for not seeing through the game mechanics regarding a profitable way of play.

I'd like to underpin and press that it was not DeLos who designed the statistics and the formulaes the round was played with.
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Unread 18 Mar 2007, 11:55   #47
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Re: And now for something different.

XP killed my mother and raped my sister.

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Unread 18 Mar 2007, 12:13   #48
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistwraith
Engineering a win isnt illegal .. a bit immoral and very disheartening for those who made real attempts without that sort of help to make it into the top 5 planets.

to those stripped of a place because of what happened, you dont have to drown your sorrows too much, those of us with an ounce of intelligence know where you should have been.

Effort doesnt allways make you come 1st, but it is allways recognised.
this sort of thinking is infuriating. there is NO SUCH THING as 'where you should have been' in terms of moral grounds: planetarion is score, and score no less. apart from perhaps JBG, i can't think of a SINGLE planetarion planet winner who won by thoroughly solo means, everyone has been helped by political means. do you have any idea how retarded you sound when you say this sort of stuff? it's like someone said the other day on irc to me "delos needed you to kill off a couple of other top planets to win" - IS THAT NOT THE POINT OF A ****ING WAR GAME?

similarly, we had delos do what was needed to win, no more no less. the free planet thing was a great novelty we didn't want missed.

with all of this in mind, this has nothing to do with xp, i doubt you will find a single person in ascendancy who doesn't want a war game.
edit: to clarify, xp sux and i'd personally much prefer a score system such as what heartless suggested. now that somewhat rewards 'effort'
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Unread 18 Mar 2007, 13:47   #49
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Re: And now for something different.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistwraith
Engineering a win isnt illegal .. a bit immoral and very disheartening for those who made real attempts without that sort of help to make it into the top 5 planets.

to those stripped of a place because of what happened, you dont have to drown your sorrows too much, those of us with an ounce of intelligence know where you should have been.

Effort doesnt allways make you come 1st, but it is allways recognised.
The nailing of Caj the first time round and the fallout from it was his alliance's doing as we saw Caj's mistake as a massive opportunity to take him down. The result of Caj breaking his VGN NAP (and probably the only thing he could have done if he really wanted to win) was a succession of top planets killing each other.

Considering Ascendancy set up this attack (and very well executed it was) and made it worthwhile for all of our attack partners on this raid and caused this mayhem, DeLoS has his alliance to thank. Just like Caj and agony and the like have their alliances to thank to defend them and take the hits for them constantly.

DeLoS won because he roided more efficiently and effectively than anyone for the whole round to make him a contender, stepped up his efforts once the chance opened up to win and capitalised while his alliance triggered a chain of events where all his rivals more or less killed each other (which is their fault, not his).

What you may not understand is that this wasn't just profitable for DeLoS; it caused several asc planets (and quite a few ND, too I suspect) to fly up the rankings and is part of the reason why we secured so many top 100 planets.
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Last edited by lokken; 18 Mar 2007 at 16:44.
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Unread 18 Mar 2007, 13:52   #50
Chika
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Re: And now for something different.

haha.
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