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Unread 23 Jul 2004, 15:02   #1
Kal
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Communication

Recently it has become apparent that communication between jolt and PaTeam as well as with the community could be improved. Although any internal problems have now on the whole been rectified, there remains the issue of communication with the community.

So as a first step in bettering this communication Jolt and PaTeam invite you, the community, to submit ideas and discuss them.

Particular areas of interest are communications methods e.g. portal, forums, in-game, irc and what sort of information should be communicated.
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Unread 23 Jul 2004, 15:23   #2
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Re: Communication

Bring back CH - with Jolt attendance.
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Unread 23 Jul 2004, 15:24   #3
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Re: Communication

i think the whole idea i was trying to write was that if jolt/planetarion would act like big company act with their shareholder which mean write report and news in some place, where the mass can come and read to know what the exact situation of the company and therefore know if it worth putting money in.

i think jolt should open the highway of data and information about the game and the event, its better than some missinterpretation of events that later on will make the community act on something that could have been resolved in few seconds.

improvment of the communication dont need to be only between jolt and PATEAM, as few from PATEAM and biffy said, but should be focused between community and jolt and community and PATEAM, because lets face it the community is what make this game, without being informed there will be always problem, and by not hiding anything, the community will understand that nothing phishy is going on under the scene.

when mistakes are made, write them, give us info about it, so we can understand why and how, that wiill high your credibility by far more than you think.

ps: by giving the analogy to a company and their shareholder, i dont expect Planetarion to give any form of economical info or any other secret info ofc, but info that every users can claim.
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Unread 23 Jul 2004, 15:33   #4
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Re: Communication

"Creators" Hour would be a good idea. Especially now we have a working in-game com unit again. It's a nice easy way to get to at least one sub-section of the community; those that are on IRC.

What I would like to see in the idea of Creators Hour but expanded. A constant on-going thing. Questions can be asking via an in-game page. If you want communication either way, it has to be somewhere easy to access. Noone regularly visits the portal because of previous poor performance in keeping it up to date. Latest news 8th July.

So yeah, an in-game page where users can submit their questions. Then they are answered in this "Creators" Hour. Jolt's gorgeous Biffy would attend and if there were any questions that were directed towards Jolt he could answer them, or at worst go away for a week, research an answer and reply in the following Question Session.

Every week, you'd then have an edited copy of the Question Hour posted on the portal, and a link placed on this in-game page.

Also, I think in a system like this, the choice of questions that are asked is important. I think it would be a good idea to have someone unconnected to the team but who can be trusted in their choice. In fact, hoping not to come over big headed, I'd nominate myself for this, it's something I'd enjoy.

But at least things are heading in a nice direction. I hear lots of good things these days.
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Unread 23 Jul 2004, 15:39   #5
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Re: Communication

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal
So as a first step in bettering this communication Jolt and PaTeam invite you, the community, to submit ideas and discuss them.
Isn't that what the suggestions forum is already for?

Quote:
Particular areas of interest are communications methods e.g. portal, forums, in-game, irc and what sort of information should be communicated.
For the love of god, stop faffing around with useless portals that nobody ever uses. Make a decent manual and tutorial, something to help the new players get involved. Perhaps there could be some kind of dedicated newbie forum (moderated by the mentor team?) where new players can ask simple questions without fear of ridicule. This should be heavily linked from within the game, but is no substitute for proper ready-made tutorials.

Some kind of web-based IRC client (that means http-based, not a Java applet) would also be useful, though the bandwidth requirements may be a problem.

As was already suggested, bring back CH, even if it's not weekly.

I think many people have a stick up their arse about PA team/Jolt 'communication', and this vocal group of people are distracting Jolt/PA team from their real job, which is promoting Planetarion to as wide an audience as possible. There are definitely some things which could be communicated better - I'd like to see more information about exactly who is in PA team, what their role and and what rules govern their conduct, but these are minor problems when set against the bigger picture.

Planetarion isn't a democracy, and if you cater to the wishes of every whining forum poster then you'll never get anything done. Simply be honest, up-front and clear in what you say, then stick by it. No amount of 'communication' will prevent people from finding something to complain about, and so the best option is to make the game as good as possible for as many people as possible, and ignore those who don't like it.
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Unread 23 Jul 2004, 16:13   #6
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Re: Communication

Some of the stuff at start isnt related to this but the thread this one spawned off, i just cba to go through and reword some of the post to sort it out

Quote:
Originally Posted by alch
1. something out the forum on the portal with lot more detailed information posted both by biffy from the part of jolt, info on the game posted from the PATEAM and some community event and info posted by a rep of the community (an unofficial rep and not under jolt).

What Do we want to know? EVERYTHING?
Sorry but your idea is completly ridiculous. Why should only a rep get to put his point across, dont you think these people have their own issues and agendas which they are going to always push, will they actually even bother bringing up issues they dont agree with ect.

And will it take it away from the forums, of course not as soon as anything is posted from Jolt its going to move over to the forums. You cant change that .

And once it moves over to the forums you have the problem of events getting changed. You see people DONT use the portal that much, EVERY attempt to make them do so has failed. Alot of people will find out about whats going on when its discussed on the forums and may never actually see what was really said.

What should happen is there should be regular updates posted on the portal which obviously cross posts on the announcement forum.. A copy of this announcement should then be made on a forum like PD (or AD if its alliance related) and called <Subject> disscussion,. The first post would be a copy of the annoucement to start with and anyone would be able to comment on it. Preferable PATeam and maybe even the mods should be well versed in the issue at hand so they can keep the discussion on track and supply approiate replies. to questions that are raised. ANY reply to a question would have its responce edited into the first post so newcomers to the thread can see whats been answered before hand.

So it would end up something like

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ANNOUCEMENT SUBJECT

Announcement body

Additional 1
Additional info

Additional 2
Additional info
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

These threads would also be heaverly modded so replies like "this sucks", "this is great" would be removed as they can just hinder the discussion. However NO reply would be removed that gave some kind of constructive comment NO MATTER how negative. Jolt (well the bosses) seem to take Negative comments to heart atm and this is something they need to get over (or they need to quit and find jobs which doesnt require them to have to deal with customers because its simply something that comes with the territory and rather than getting defensive and offended it should actually be used to make things better)

PATeam and Jolt should should strive to answer as many questions as possible and do so in a suitable manner, not the heavy on the spin, very defensive responces that actually steer away from answering the question. if you cant go into details then explain WHY you cant as people arent going to be half as annoyed if you can give them a valid reason why you cant answer a question rather than when you post a standard peice of pr. (well as long as you dont end up using it as a reason to not say anything obviously you over use the excuses for not answering and people are going to start to wonder if your just being awkward). Obviously as you need people to answer questions you need to ensure theres PATeam members around at most times able to do so, if you cant acheive that as obviously PATeam are often very busy perhaps you can make use of the mods a bit more, i know when things arise on the forums and I try and get a responce from PATeam about it i'm 99.9% of the time fobbed off with the whole "we cant tell you" so perhaps when mods ask questions and PATeam cant go and answer it directly themselves they would be willing to give us the jist of it so we can pass it on and then later on PATeam can answer more indepth.


What info should be given. Well heres what i think

Development updates - Either weekly or fortnightly (weekly better imho bit fortnightly may be easier to). These dont have to be lists of features although some features being worked on being mentioned would be good, but rather details on what phase of development they were at, what area of the game they were focusing on at that time, what problems had arisen and if they were ahead or behind schedual and why this was the case. It should also detail minor aspects of the game that had changed their design spec or were remove completely (ie so if the planned galaxy structure goes form being 10 planets to 25 or an announced feature such as pds was removed then it would be mentioned)

Marketing updates - This would probally be from Jolt directly but maybe have aspects contributed by PATeam. Seeing as selling the game is really something you do only once a round this could probally get away with just one a round. In this Jolt would not only outline their plans and goals for PA that round and what they were going to do to try and make sure they are met BUT also analyse how well they acheived the previous rounds goals and what went wrong and what they learnt from the round that will help them. It doesnt have to be that in depth just enough so we can know what jolt are aiming for so we can see they are trying to take the game forward and if things dont go to plan so we know why and arent left to draw our own conclusions from the silence. if they make a mistake or were too over optimistic and they admit that people, will understand

General updates - Any peice of major info that affects the community would be announced before it can leak. Info like the BBW case, the scrapping of the PHP version, the sackings ect ect WILL leak no matter how much your try and prevent it (well unless you wish to lock PATeam up in a steal box and filter all their communications out of it) because it is soemthing that affects the community and rather than try and keep it secret ist simply better you make it public yourselves before the rumours start flying.


Outside the this we should also have some form of Creators hour back, although I think it needs refining so that it doesnt turn into a ' ask for the same flawed idea over and over again" hour that it sometimes became.

Also personally id like to see more input put into Suggestions from Spinner. I know he doesnt have too much time so cant go through all the threads so perhaps a return to the old system we had where every week id sumemrise all the suggestions threads which had reached a point where no further discussion and enhancements were taking place. This would be emailed to spinner and he would reply with his thoughts letting me know what I could say he said, what i was allowed to hint and what I could hint at and what he thougt but at this stage didnt want any official indication on his view being made (although i could often work aspects of it into my own ideas on the subject if the thread needed it). Also because the links to the threads were given in the email IF there was anything of real intrest to Spinner he could and would go and comment on it directly
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Unread 23 Jul 2004, 16:26   #7
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Re: Communication

Quote:
Originally Posted by Entium
Bring back CH - with Jolt attendance.
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Unread 23 Jul 2004, 16:48   #8
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Re: Communication

Quote:
Originally Posted by Entium
Bring back CH - with Jolt attendance.
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Unread 23 Jul 2004, 21:53   #9
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Re: Communication

way to go Wakey

I aint gonna quote ya none cuz I sorta like what you said and I aint gonna mess with it

CH with Jolt attendance YES

Information like the BBW affair should get into public view a lot sooner as its gonna help keep Jolt/PAteam believablity higher

Alch was correct when he said
Quote:
Originally Posted by alch
improvment of the communication dont need to be only between jolt and PATEAM, as few from PATEAM and biffy said, but should be focused between community and jolt and community and PATEAM, because lets face it the community is what make this game, without being informed there will be always problem, and by not hiding anything, the community will understand that nothing phishy is going on under the scene.

when mistakes are made, write them, give us info about it, so we can understand why and how, that wiill high your credibility by far more than you think.
Jolt are still new to PA, they didnt grow with it like 5th season did, so yes I figure they are going to screw up a few times, but ffs TELL US, its us the comunity of players that you need to keep playing, and the new players that come along and join in. If things go wrong and all we get is a "sorry it went wrong but we aint gonna tell you where or why" type excuse, then we are going to lose interest.

During the BBW fiasco, I know that many were saying they had been told BBW had applied to buy PA as well as having already paid out for new hardware for Jolt and thats why he wasnt deleted. I know, I know, thats old water underr the bridge now, but thats an example of how things get out of hand, because those who I spoke with were saying that this would be the last round of PA for them if thats how they were to be treated

Be open with us, tease us with new ideas, give us a reason to want to keep on putting our hands into our pockets and handing over money to you at Jolt
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Unread 23 Jul 2004, 23:46   #10
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Re: Communication

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal
Recently it has become apparent that communication between jolt and PaTeam as well as with the community could be improved. Although any internal problems have now on the whole been rectified, there remains the issue of communication with the community.

So as a first step in bettering this communication Jolt and PaTeam invite you, the community, to submit ideas and discuss them.

Particular areas of interest are communications methods e.g. portal, forums, in-game, irc and what sort of information should be communicated.
I've heard these sort of speeches before....

Best to reserve any judgement until we actually see action and not just words.

CH with jolt in attendance in more than just a listening / PR capacity would be a start.

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Unread 24 Jul 2004, 03:05   #11
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Re: Communication

The thing is if you really wanna turn this game to something more dynamic and worthy you will have to push the community and everyone of the players to have a personal link, while you give responsabilty to someone or give to someone a personal link, it will be hard for him to quit, the community should be involved and should do more than what they are doing now.

If you success by making the community addicted to this game, no matter how many people will say "i quit this game"., they will always come back, i have a very very very BIG feeling about PAX and PAX.5. and PA 11, i told the admin many times that we would beat the old numbers, i knew that on a personal basis, i for myself quitted around round7 and didnt play until late round10, which where i have done a comeback and became slowly HC of one of the alliance and had myself very involved into the game, i really liked the game and liked the community and that gave me a push to give more and be involved in it and loose some heart bit when i was reading that some players are quitting or that pilkara.com show you there is only 2k planets at signup, if you succeed with all the player to feel like i feel, then you will have a growing memberbase, no matter what....

invest, and work with the community, put aside your "im the boss" attitude, give communication, make the whole thing clear as crystal, give the community the advantage to interfere and be more than involved. you will see that the game will dynamically push itself toward a growing memberbase, ofc understand that not all what the community say is ok, but understant its better to tie us than let us go.
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Unread 24 Jul 2004, 04:49   #12
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Re: Communication

I don't like the multiple races, I liked one race with ships that could target multiple targets. I also miss defensive turrets.
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Unread 24 Jul 2004, 10:52   #13
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Re: Communication

Quote:
Firstly posted by the Alch master
i have done a comeback and became slowly HC of one of the alliance and had myself very involved into the game,
You were mentor team co-leader and you're HC of an alliance, yet on your webpage it stresses how important it was in your role to remain alliance-less. Tsk tsk.

But that's not what I wanted to say. What I wanted to say was that even the slightest of news pieces should be give to the userbase. The small decisions that you take for granted as a member of PATeam. I know what they're like, I've been there.

It's like at the moment, there is one gal in the unvierse with 11 planets. It's not a major issue because the 11th planet is in protection and has just signed up. But it would be interesting for people to hear about things such as this. On some level it makes them feel happy, proud even, to be informed of even the small things. If you let people know about all the little but interesting things that are going on, they'll feel like they're more in the loop because of the increased information flow.

[edit] I'm told that the 11th planet issue has been sorted. So the information we were told about this little issue would be updated accordingly. [/edit]

Anyway, so we don't want increased information on the really important game changing things, I for one want to hear about these interesting bits I can giggle at. Perhaps one day there is a multi of 30 planets closed, which is quite a lot so you say (without coords or accoutn info ofc) that there has been this massive multi closure.

*shrug*
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Unread 24 Jul 2004, 10:57   #14
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Re: Communication

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kloopy
It's like at the moment, there is one gal in the unvierse with 11 planets. It's not a major issue because the 11th planet is in protection and has just signed up
All fixed 15 minutes ago. Will be keeping an eye out for these as there was one earlier this round. It's probably a side effect of the universe being quite full, and if that is the case then we'll create some new gals at the end of the universe. However by my count, there should be about 490 empty spots out there somewhere, so I doubt it's because of that. Investigations continue but reported it to Spinner so he can look at the account creation code...
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Unread 24 Jul 2004, 11:05   #15
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Re: Communication

Quote:
Originally Posted by Entium
Bring back CH - with Jolt attendance.
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Unread 24 Jul 2004, 11:06   #16
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Re: Communication

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kloopy
Anyway, so we don't want increased information on the really important game changing things, I for one want to hear about these interesting bits I can giggle at. Perhaps one day there is a multi of 30 planets closed, which is quite a lot so you say (without coords or accoutn info ofc) that there has been this massive multi closure.
30 Planets is nothing. I was in a galaxy where I hadnt seen my GC, MoD, MoC or MoW online once even though I was checking the galaxy page every 3 mins or so. I raised this on galaxy forums and went back to checking the galaxy. Now for the next 30 mins I continued checking and not once did any of my galaxy come online, then 3 mins later I checked again and there was something differnt about my galaxy screen, id somehowe been exiled. The Gc and Minsisters whom I hadnt seen online for over 24 hours somehow all manged to login in the space of 3 mins, start an exile vote and all vote yes. I raised this with phil^ as it seemed strange and he came back and told me he had found atleast 46 accounts attached to this guy
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Unread 24 Jul 2004, 20:29   #17
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Re: Communication

Quote:
Originally Posted by Entium
Bring back CH - with Jolt attendance.

I say a CH... without the Creators-= just jolt, lets see how much they really care for the game
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Unread 24 Jul 2004, 22:58   #18
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Re: Communication

Quote:
Quote:
Firstly posted by the Alch master
i have done a comeback and became slowly HC of one of the alliance and had myself very involved into the game,

You were mentor team co-leader and you're HC of an alliance, yet on your webpage it stresses how important it was in your role to remain alliance-less. Tsk tsk.
Are you kidding? half a round before i became mentor co-leader, i quitted FAnG as HC and quitted FAnG as a player at end of the round, so no i was never involved in any alliance, you can also ask FAnG HCs and FAnG officer and especially kjeldoran, how fair i was when i asked them to go thru all my accesses and remove them, i could have retain my original accesses and yet continue to be mentor co-leader and no one would never know. tsk tsk.
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Unread 25 Jul 2004, 11:38   #19
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Re: Communication

  • Bring back CH, trying reasonably to get a Jolt point of view on questions that require it
  • Development diaries of some form for all of the dev team with 'regular' updates along the lines of every week or so, have it as a sub-forum if needs be where only PA Team can post but everyone can reply
  • More appearances from high-level PA Team members in Suggestions and PD threads that warrant it
  • Use Announcements more goddamned often
  • I'm tempted to say 'let people reply to certain announcements' although this seems impractical, so unless there's a reason otherwise, mirror threads in Announcements on PD with an [Announcement] tag or somesuch so that you can get feedback all located in the same place instead of trawling through PD/AD/Suggestions
  • Have a weekly/bi-weekly discussion point, questions submitted either by PA Team, or Jolt, or the players with the more pertinent responses on both sides being published in a shorter summary and linked to once the discussion's over. Specifically the questions shouldn't be inane crap like 'How do you like your coffee' but pertinent to PA. It's generally community members who start the biggest PD threads with the most intelligent discussion, how about we have PA Team/biffy-et-al starting some.

I think the last idea there is a bit 'flowery' but some people might like it, thought I'd put it out there.
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Unread 25 Jul 2004, 12:00   #20
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Re: Communication

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Originally Posted by pablissimo
Bring back CH, trying reasonably to get a Jolt point of view on questions that require it
Certainly possible. Instead of setting it as a regular thing though someone has come up with the suggestion that someone collects questions, and when there are a suitable number of decent ones then a CH is scheduled for 5-7 days later with PATeam and biffy in attendance in order to allow decent answers to be constructed, rather than the old style where the person answering the questions never knew what was coming next. It also means that there's no need to have any of the inane questions which used to crop up both as time fillers, and a way of giving a break / having a quick discussion about the next question.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pablissimo
More appearances from high-level PA Team members in Suggestions and PD threads that warrant it
Depends a little bit on what you class as "high-level", but we can certainly improve in this area and will be doing so.
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Unread 25 Jul 2004, 18:17   #21
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Re: Communication

If you're going to do Creators Hour like that then you might as well drop the concept of doing it on IRC and have it on the forums. Reading lengthy answers on IRC or flicking through logs is a pain in the arse, you could supplement a normal CH with a Q&A session that takes place over a longer period of time with more properly composed replies, all thrown into a forum thread for at-lesuire reading without crap line spacing and P splitting between sentences.
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Unread 25 Jul 2004, 23:05   #22
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Re: Communication

Just to add a note on whats been suggested by pab and wakey...

the portal can either be changed (1 field in a db) to post all announcements on PD instead.. OR.. they just open up the announcements forum for replies... (please note replies.. not new threads)
if there are particular threads they don't want discussing then they can just close the thread


CH logs/Q&A logging is also one of the things that was built into the new passport but never got implemented when the portal was launched

ho hum

*expects and email from kal to implement this*
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Unread 25 Jul 2004, 23:11   #23
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Re: Communication

Quote:
Originally Posted by Karmulian
CH logs/Q&A logging is also one of the things that was built into the new passport but never got implemented when the portal was launched

ho hum

*expects and email from kal to implement this*
You might get an e-mail from me instead, but I didn't know it had been done. Is there question submission/moderation there too?
Also isn't it one of those things that would require the passport to have users, or is there a way to do it with the current setup?
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