2 Ideas

[Saphi]

1) can we ave a Gal ave score pls --- which we all can see

2) the exiling system is shocking atm im 7th in the sg atm and being trying to find a decent gal and keep ending up being added to the bottom of gals that are orange .... A beeter exiling system would be to self exile into a gal where ur score is within 50% of the average Gal score

this should advoid self exiling 10 times to find a gd gal and wasting over 5mill of res

[Chef!]

Originally Posted by Saphi

1) can we ave a Gal ave score pls --- which we all can see

Its on the universe page.

Originally Posted by Saphi

2) the exiling system is shocking atm im 7th in the sg atm and being trying to find a decent gal and keep ending up being added to the bottom of gals that are orange .... A beeter exiling system would be to self exile into a gal where ur score is within 50% of the average Gal score

No. Means there will be a load of decent gals and a load of shit gals. New players will have no chance.

[Saphi]

No. Means there will be a load of decent gals and a load of shit gals. New players will have no chance.

yes i understand this but it can also completely demorise someone as taking taking upward of 5 exiles ... the system is not fair ... to the experience player

and also from my experience

no eperienced gal wants n00bies in there gal ... im sorry but this is a fact

[Chef!]

Originally Posted by Saphi

yes i understand this but it can also completely demorise someone as taking taking upward of 5 exiles ... the system is not fair ... to the experience player

and also from my experience

no eperienced gal wants n00bies in there gal ... im sorry but this is a fact

Take the time training your n00bs. Prolly about half the players in this game are n00bs its gotta be said and they pay the bills. If they all start having shit rounds and leaving, jolt will loose money and the game will suffer. Dont forget it.

[Saphi]

Originally Posted by Chef!

Take the time training your n00bs. Prolly about half the players in this game are n00bs its gotta be said and they pay the bills. If they all start having shit rounds and leaving, jolt will loose money and the game will suffer. Dont forget it.

I like training n00bs but hen u get a gd start in a game and then 400 ticks in realy and truely u need a gd solid gal

and ending up in a bunch of oranges is gad damn annoying coz it leaves ur planet open ... and when the gal is inactive as well ur planet is doomed.

Smt needs to change here. coz this exiling thing is completely unfair to everyone as it stands atm

[SpookyVince]

I must agree with both of you, because in a way it is very frustrating & costly to exile a few times before landing where you'd like to be...

On the other hand, it should be indeed the responsibility of experienced players to train & help new ones, and make their experience of the game a pleasant one. I would probably have given up myself if I wasn't welcomed in the gal I landed in, first time ever I played.

I guess it's just that some people are too lazy? Or too pretentious to teach "n00bs", a word that I hate... Each and every player, even winners of rounds, has one day been a n00b... Remember that too please. And don't start with excuses like "I did it all myself, nobody has coached me".

If experience was shared and if newcomers were coached, the exile system wouldn't have to be criticized heavily in the first place.

[Chef!]

You've got to bear in mind in the situation you are in at the moment Saphi, is that its a speedgame. Its not a reflection on the real game cos numbers are MUCH lower.

[Saphi]

Chef i know its a SG atm but ive had this happen to me a couple of times when ive been T100 and also i know it happens to others as well

andits is incredibly fustrating and demorlising to wait upto a wk and also lose upto 5mill of reources

that in its self is a prob

[Chef!]

Originally Posted by Saphi

Chef i know its a SG atm but ive had this happen to me a couple of times when ive been T100 and also i know it happens to others as well

andits is incredibly fustrating and demorlising to wait upto a wk and also lose upto 5mill of reources

that in its self is a prob

other solution to your problem is to get in a decent bp at the round start.

[Saphi]

and generally i do but then agian this is problematic for the novices again bp of 5 experence player and 2-4 more exp'ed players aint gonna want (75%) of the time novices

so an Exile cap for the gal could be introduced


and its Self Exiling im getting at here more than exiling for the gal by the gal
getting put inton a gal 75% full of oranges is enough to destroy a round for a player Decent or not so

[jt25man]

Originally Posted by Saphi

I like training n00bs but hen u get a gd start in a game and then 400 ticks in realy and truely u need a gd solid gal

Maybe showing them respect and stop referring to them and thinking of them as n00bs but as new players that just need to be shown the right direction, they might be more apt to listen to you and take your advice. If you treat them as a n00b you'll come off as stuck up, or having a superiority complex because having played longer you think you're all that, they'll get fed up of being treated as such and either be less active, not take your advice, and sometimes they just stop playing altogether.

[Heartless]

Originally Posted by Chef!

Take the time training your n00bs. Prolly about half the players in this game are n00bs its gotta be said and they pay the bills. If they all start having shit rounds and leaving, jolt will loose money and the game will suffer. Dont forget it.

Sorry Chef, but why is it the players responsibility to create an enjoyable game for the newbs? Imho it is task of the game administration to create an enjoyable game.
It is certainly not the existing players fault when the ****ed up game mechanics require them to take advantage of those which are new and inexperienced. You can teach them what the game is about but you cannot magically make them run from incoming zik fleets you cannot cover (unless you account share) neither can you prevent them from totally wasting their planet with crashing into some heavy defense (yeah well, xp was fun while it wasn't crippled), and even if you manage to make them play another round they'll quit because it's another 3 months of doing exactly the same to achieve the same way (no value = no rank).

[wakey]

Originally Posted by Heartless

Sorry Chef, but why is it the players responsibility to create an enjoyable game for the newbs? Imho it is task of the game administration to create an enjoyable game.
It is certainly not the existing players fault when the ****ed up game mechanics require them to take advantage of those which are new and inexperienced. You can teach them what the game is about but you cannot magically make them run from incoming zik fleets you cannot cover (unless you account share) neither can you prevent them from totally wasting their planet with crashing into some heavy defense (yeah well, xp was fun while it wasn't crippled), and even if you manage to make them play another round they'll quit because it's another 3 months of doing exactly the same to achieve the same way (no value = no rank).

It is our duty as players to help create an enjoyable enviorment for all players of this game and especially those who are new to the game. We play a browser based game and its never going to be the most advanced game in the world because of that its down to the community side of the game to make it stand out from the crowd. However the majority of this community now decide to shirk their responsibility and would rather screw as many people in the community over as they can in an attempt to better their own acheivements.

We need to as a community start doing our part, we need to show Jolt that this is a game worth putting money into because its a vibrant and thriving place that's open and welcoming to new people coming into it and that its a place people want to spend time in. As long as we aren't doing that we make Jolts decision not to invest the time, effort and money that they indicated they would as lets be honest none of us here if we were running Jolt would invest in this community that drives new players away in droves when they can turn a nice profit on the current userbase.

We cant do anything about Jolt, none of us have any direct control on them but we can do something about ourselves and the community around us and rather than bury our heads in the sand and just attack Jolt we have to focus on what we can change

Also if we had a much more helpful and open community the game could probably afford to be more 'complicated' and indepth but as it is it has to appeal to the lowest common denominator just to keep the playerbase steady.

[Alki]

imo, get rid of exiling all together, it is an utterly shit system, rather not haev it then be forced to play with it

[Heartless]

Originally Posted by wakey

It is our duty as players to help create an enjoyable enviorment for all players of this game and especially those who are new to the game. We play a browser based game and its never going to be the most advanced game in the world because of that its down to the community side of the game to make it stand out from the crowd. However the majority of this community now decide to shirk their responsibility and would rather screw as many people in the community over as they can in an attempt to better their own acheivements.

We need to as a community start doing our part, we need to show Jolt that this is a game worth putting money into because its a vibrant and thriving place that's open and welcoming to new people coming into it and that its a place people want to spend time in. As long as we aren't doing that we make Jolts decision not to invest the time, effort and money that they indicated they would as lets be honest none of us here if we were running Jolt would invest in this community that drives new players away in droves when they can turn a nice profit on the current userbase.

We cant do anything about Jolt, none of us have any direct control on them but we can do something about ourselves and the community around us and rather than bury our heads in the sand and just attack Jolt we have to focus on what we can change

Also if we had a much more helpful and open community the game could probably afford to be more 'complicated' and indepth but as it is it has to appeal to the lowest common denominator just to keep the playerbase steady.

To be very honest wakey, I do see your points and I do wholeheartedly agree with a lot of them. But, and this is what annoys me most and drove a lot of old players away from the game lately, the game itself is too boring. It's always the same, there is only one way to succeed, fleets always look very similar for each race, the technology tree does not even remotely deserve such a name, the game is too calcuable.
Do you really expect people to keep on seriously playing and paying round after round because of you, me or playerX? In my opinion that is not the way things should be, it is more a nice machine to convert stupidity to money.

Yes it is a browser-game and as such can not offer the genious graphics modern 3d games supply, but graphics are not everything. You can make an interesting and enjoyable game without state-of-the-art visual effects - see Blizzard's games for instance: they are always one or two technology generations behind other games when it comes to graphics but since they invest the majority of their development time into an "easy-to-learn-but-difficult-to-master" gameplay they still create great products.

I also see that PA Team can by far not compete with Blizzard and apart from that being Jolt's mistake it's also the lack of an overall vision on how the game is supposed to be combined with unwillingness to actually completey revamp major parts of the game when these parts are boring or a cause of boredom.

On topic: Yes, removing the self-exile feature is definitely the way to go forward, in my humble opinion, but the final solution should fit into the new game design somehow.

[Timeline]

Originally Posted by Heartless

Sorry Chef, but why is it the players responsibility to create an enjoyable game for the newbs? Imho it is task of the game administration to create an enjoyable game.
It is certainly not the existing players fault when the ****ed up game mechanics require them to take advantage of those which are new and inexperienced. You can teach them what the game is about but you cannot magically make them run from incoming zik fleets you cannot cover (unless you account share) neither can you prevent them from totally wasting their planet with crashing into some heavy defense (yeah well, xp was fun while it wasn't crippled), and even if you manage to make them play another round they'll quit because it's another 3 months of doing exactly the same to achieve the same way (no value = no rank).

heartness please take 5 minutes to read your quote of chef's post again.
At no point in it did he say it was the gamers responsibility.
However as he pointed out, (although slightly exaggerated in my opinion) there is a large contingent of players in the so called 'n00b' bracket. This title is bandied around like hotcakes to anyone who isnt in a so called 'l337' alliance.
Everone moans that they arent in a top 10 galaxy as they keep getting n00b players in their galaxies. To those people i say one thing....it is the same for everyone..the shuffle and exiling is the luck of the draw.
If you get a galaxy where people are active in game and are in a gal channel on irc on a regular basis..you have the foundings of a decent galaxy right there. It may not be a top gal but it will be an active one, which is better than most imo. So instead of kicking these less seasoned players for the hope of getting a jerome or elviz take a while to see if you can help them improve as a player. If they ignore you fair enough, exile yourself or them. But if they listen and take heed of your advice it can only be good for you, your gal and the game.

[i][b]edit - just seen the post you made whilst i made this, a very reasoned and formulated answer

[Heartless]

Originally Posted by Timeline

heartness please take 5 minutes to read your quote of chef's post again.
At no point in it did he say it was the gamers responsibility.
However as he pointed out, (although slightly exaggerated in my opinion) there is a large contingent of players in the so called 'n00b' bracket. This title is bandied around like hotcakes to anyone who isnt in a so called 'l337' alliance.
Everone moans that they arent in a top 10 galaxy as they keep getting n00b players in their galaxies. To those people i say one thing....it is the same for everyone..the shuffle and exiling is the luck of the draw.
If you get a galaxy where people are active in game and are in a gal channel on irc on a regular basis..you have the foundings of a decent galaxy right there. It may not be a top gal but it will be an active one, which is better than most imo. So instead of kicking these less seasoned players for the hope of getting a jerome or elviz take a while to see if you can help them improve as a player. If they ignore you fair enough, exile yourself or them. But if they listen and take heed of your advice it can only be good for you, your gal and the game.

Timeline, please take 5 minutes and grow a brain. Then read my post quoting chef again and recognize that I started discussing the logical ramifications of what chef said with that sentence. Hint: it was not the currently popular "chef bashing" and neither "n00b bashing".

[Timeline]

i never said you was heartless and i personally wouldnt throw that accusation around and i dont want to start another flame arguement.

How you started the post came acrooss to me as to you were saying the community doesnt have to help its fellow players in any way...if i was mistaken and misunderstood the post then i apologise. You've stated it was the game admin and the mechanics fault we lose players, that is your opinion.
And if you notice i had made an edit to my initial post whilst you were responding as i saw the post you wrote at the same time i wrote mine. And as i say in it your reasoning on your point is sound in that the game does need an overhaul soon. However my comment still has validity as well...game mechanics only goes so far to make new players want to stay in an online community...fellow player assistance matters as well. Take WoW for example...how many times did any of us (when we first started playing) had to rely on a bigger player to help us through certain quests that were too difficult for us? That bigger player normally gave advice on how to play whilst doing so. it was our choice whether to listen or not admittedly but in the long run our gaming experience was improved because a fellow player took time out of his own gaming fun to help a new player. That is the kind of thing we are missing recently in my opinion

[Heartless]

Originally Posted by Timeline

i never said you was heartless and i personally wouldnt throw that accusation around and i dont want to start another flame arguement.

How you started the post came acrooss to me as to you were saying the community doesnt have to help its fellow players in any way...if i was mistaken and misunderstood the post then i apologise. You've stated it was the game admin and the mechanics fault we lose players, that is your opinion.
And if you notice i had made an edit to my initial post whilst you were responding as i saw the post you wrote at the same time i wrote mine. And as i say in it your reasoning on your point is sound in that the game does need an overhaul soon. However my comment still has validity as well...game mechanics only goes so far to make new players want to stay in an online community...fellow player assistance matters as well. Take WoW for example...how many times did any of us (when we first started playing) had to rely on a bigger player to help us through certain quests that were too difficult for us? That bigger player normally gave advice on how to play whilst doing so. it was our choice whether to listen or not admittedly but in the long run our gaming experience was improved because a fellow player took time out of his own gaming fun to help a new player. That is the kind of thing we are missing recently in my opinion

In WoW you mainly need the help of a bigger player when you into an instance, which in return rewards the bigger player as well as the smaller player due to loot. Planetarion offers the bigger player nothing to gain from a smaller player except a few more inbound fleets on his galaxy. Neither is there any real punishment for actually kicking around the smaller players. Humans tend to do the same unless they see something is more rewarding than what they are currently doing.

On a short- to mid-term base a new player simply does not pay off for a vast majority of the bigger guys as they are unable to protect them in a political way and militaristic way of playing. Long-term the game might get a new player, but seriously, who trains players in round 19 to win round 20 with them, especially when you have to win round 19 and round 20 to be as successfull as possible?

[ComradeRob]

The correct solution probably involves a complete overhaul of the galaxy system (I'd suggest abolishing galaxies and replacing them with some other means of community interaction).

The current solution is probably as good as it's possible to get; galaxies are bad because they are a source of inequality, but everyone has the opportunity to escape to a better galaxy. It's not a perfect system, but I can't see any way of improving it (short of radical change).

[furball]

Originally Posted by Heartless

Sorry Chef, but why is it the players responsibility to create an enjoyable game for the newbs? Imho it is task of the game administration to create an enjoyable game.

It's a chicken/egg scenario. One cannot exist without the other.

[Shyne]

Originally Posted by Saphi

ive had this happen to me a couple of times when ive been T100

Like you've ever been top 100 !

[Pilgrim]

I personally think we should abolish the exile system. And get accounts moved out to the c200 gal much sooner for being idol.
Theres nothing more fun than playing PA solo from a gal all orange.
Saphis point however comes a bit unstuck during the full game as alliances will defend you whatever gal you are in. Getting gal defence is also crap at the best of times due to ally politricks.

[Lοki]

A checkbox, default value false, if you want to join those who are about as active/have about the same score? 25% should do I think. 50% would only increase fortification of good gals.

[Veedeejem!]

Originally Posted by Chef!

Take the time training your n00bs. Prolly about half the players in this game are n00bs its gotta be said and they pay the bills. If they all start having shit rounds and leaving, jolt will loose money and the game will suffer. Dont forget it.

Keep in mind that alot of the people referred to as n00b don't want to be trained.
I've always tried to help other people, teach them the game, get them on irc,... but half of the "n00bs" don't listen to that. Ofcourse you can try mailing them 10 times "plz get on irc bla bla bla" but that's kinda pointless isn't it?

[Saphi]

w.e. happens is some ppl just cant be trained. due to them not wanting it or ppl being beligerent. but w.e. happens all we can do as vet is try... and when we get one that actually does wanna be trained we sure as hll dont let them outta our sight ... Ive trained one person who is a very solid T100 Cath player. but other than that theres been very few and far between that i can think of and most when trained give up after being slaughtered ro T100 to T750 i've seen this happen so often. And once they lose the will to compete you're stuck with a drone 7 times outta 10 ...which again becomes no fun.

[myk]

To alter the exile system which is currently random anyway and for you to not end up in a semi decent galaxy after 5 times is just hard luck, but it really is random.

The reason why you won't get in to a top 10 galaxy is because the stronger galaxies rarely have people leaving them and thus you can't get in. It is the way it works. The exile system is there as a convenience to players who want out of a particular galaxy and not a tool for players to promote their own position.

[Heartless]

Originally Posted by myk

To alter the exile system which is currently random anyway and for you to not end up in a semi decent galaxy after 5 times is just hard luck, but it really is random.

Originally Posted by John von Neumann

Anyone who considers arithmetical methods of producing random numbers is, of course, in a state of sin.

Enough said.

[Tomkat]

Originally Posted by Heartless

Enough said.

Can you come into my World of Warcraft game and tell that to this big nasty boss who just won't drop the damn axe I want because it's a random drop so each time I kill him there's a random chance he'll drop it and even though I've killed him a gabazillion times he just won't drop it PLEASE?

[Heartless]

Originally Posted by Tomkat

Can you come into my World of Warcraft game and tell that to this big nasty boss who just won't drop the damn axe I want because it's a random drop so each time I kill him there's a random chance he'll drop it and even though I've killed him a gabazillion times he just won't drop it PLEASE?

Just tell blizzard to increase the drop probability from 0.000001 to 1.

[Ramihyn]

Originally Posted by Heartless

Enough said.

Just replace "random" with "unpredictable* for observers outside the system**" and you should be fine.***




*: it should be "commonly unpredictable" as in fact some lazy/stupid people use build-in random functions which a smart dedicated person could actually predict with a lot of work

**: "system" meaning the software algorithm and its internal state

***: good quote though