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Unread 18 May 2010, 09:02   #1
isildurx
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Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

Yo!

Seems there are some preliminary stats up at the beta server, so I guess it is time to start discussing!

http://beta.planetarion.com/manual.p...n=165438108831




My first comment, what the **** is up with zik, is there a typo or what?
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Unread 18 May 2010, 09:29   #2
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

And Xan is definitively looking too strong(just FYI!)!
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Unread 18 May 2010, 09:46   #3
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

Isil, you never do fail to bring the fail.
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Unread 18 May 2010, 10:22   #4
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

it is a waste of time commenting on a set that is clearly not even in its beta version.
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Unread 18 May 2010, 10:27   #5
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

Of course it is!
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Unread 18 May 2010, 15:15   #6
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

According to Appoco it's a "prealpha" version. I wouldn't waste much time on them!
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Unread 18 May 2010, 19:15   #7
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

heh ziks seem to be missing anti fr ,hardly using that for beta
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Unread 18 May 2010, 23:53   #8
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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heh ziks seem to be missing anti fr ,hardly using that for beta
you gotta steal it yo
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Unread 19 May 2010, 01:33   #9
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

yeah thatd be another good way to fuk zik,like rouges not stealing last round,wouldnt be suprised
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Unread 19 May 2010, 10:07   #10
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

pls don't start discussing stats that are far from being completed
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Unread 19 May 2010, 15:39   #11
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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pls don't start discussing stats that are far from being completed
Sign up is in two days.
It's pretty much a pathetic joke that they don't start working on stats until days before.
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Unread 19 May 2010, 19:08   #12
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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Sign up is in two days.
It's pretty much a pathetic joke that they don't start working on stats until days before.
Are you volunteering to do it? Never mind, you're not competent, but I doubt you'd be willing to do more than run your mouth regardless.
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Unread 19 May 2010, 20:35   #13
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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Are you volunteering to do it? Never mind, you're not competent, but I doubt you'd be willing to do more than run your mouth regardless.
Competent or not, volunteering has proven to have little to no effect.

Still, signups haven't even opened and people are already whining.
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Unread 19 May 2010, 21:53   #14
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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Competent or not, volunteering has proven to have little to no effect.

Still, signups haven't even opened and people are already whining.
Mjeh, volunteering to do something you're not qualified for isn't really worth much, and there's very few of us qualified for this crap.

Anyway, I do agree that people should just take a fcking chill pill and enjoy the break between rounds.
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Unread 19 May 2010, 23:07   #15
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

FR steal ship targeting BS would be win for ETD, their BS fleet is pretty much useless for solo attacking at current stats
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Unread 20 May 2010, 01:49   #16
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

omg i cant believe you guys take these stats into consideration. They are really bad
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Unread 20 May 2010, 02:45   #17
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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FR steal ship targeting BS would be win for ETD, their BS fleet is pretty much useless for solo attacking at current stats
Please explain why it is useless solo attacking with Etd Bs, without using an argument that can be used for every other fleet. (bar Cath Fi/Co )
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Unread 20 May 2010, 10:02   #18
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

hmm just let people know when stats are final.. aka no more tweaking.. the current ones look pretty.. oh well let's say I'd prefer a max tag limit alliance over anything small.. but then again single targetting round.. that's what you get, numbers definately over quality in that short round.

if there's some decent compo there might be playing next round, but we'll see when stats are final.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 10:32   #19
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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Please explain why it is useless solo attacking with Etd Bs, without using an argument that can be used for every other fleet. (bar Cath Fi/Co )
I agree on that, but don't you think ETD would be more fun to play with another steal ship, preferably one that can help you make a better roiding fleet?
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Unread 20 May 2010, 14:33   #20
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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I agree on that, but don't you think ETD would be more fun to play with another steal ship, preferably one that can help you make a better roiding fleet?
yeah. Investor, as it is, could well be a BS stealer, since it fires after the wyvern (although before the mantis, but why does cath need mantis for attack...)
So, why not make it a BS stealer? that would help Etd BS roid fleet.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 18:21   #21
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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Mjeh, volunteering to do something you're not qualified for isn't really worth much, and there's very few of us qualified for this crap.

Anyway, I do agree that people should just take a fcking chill pill and enjoy the break between rounds.
Done em before.
Thanks for continuing to be clueless
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Unread 20 May 2010, 18:46   #22
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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Done em before.
Thanks for continuing to be clueless
Doesn't mean you're qualified. There's been more unqualified people bumbling around with these things than qualified people, to be quite honest.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 19:29   #23
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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Doesn't mean you're qualified. There's been more unqualified people bumbling around with these things than qualified people, to be quite honest.
Id say most of them comes from the pa-clones.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 19:47   #24
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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Id say most of them comes from the pa-clones.
Oh, well good thing I started out here then, right? And that I got my start on these here strategy forums long before any of you guys wandered in here. Damn, did your quip just backfire a bit, Hanzi dear?
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Unread 20 May 2010, 19:48   #25
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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Originally Posted by guzlic View Post
I agree on that, but don't you think ETD would be more fun to play with another steal ship, preferably one that can help you make a better roiding fleet?

I'm sure Cathaar would be more fun to play with a Co stealer, that alone doesn't mean they should get it. I'll admit, the Investor seems a bit useless to me, but changing it to Steal does more harm than it fixes in my opinion.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 20:42   #26
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

Current set of stats seems like something that may even be useful to discuss.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 20:46   #27
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

qebab is correct, there's no quite so obvious signs that it's not yet out of alpha any more.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 20:52   #28
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

My initial reaction is: It's been 3 years and I remember nothing.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 20:53   #29
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

Appoco said he'd have a basic set ready for friday so I guess it looks something like that. I'll hold off commenting until he actually says it's a proper beta version though!
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Unread 20 May 2010, 21:33   #30
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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Appoco said he'd have a basic set ready for friday so I guess it looks something like that. I'll hold off commenting until he actually says it's a proper beta version though!
My thoughts exactly.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 21:38   #31
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

My thoughts were, why would he open Beta (regardless of how pointless some of you might find it) if the stats weren't 'ready'?
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Unread 20 May 2010, 21:40   #32
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

The beta was open while last round's stats were still in use. Presumably for testing changes to the game code.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 21:44   #33
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

I suppose. But even if they weren't beta-ready, I'd still find it an interesting and entertaining pastime. Doesn't mean you (in general) have to declare me an idiot for it. My time is, after all, mine to waste.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 21:59   #34
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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I suppose. But even if they weren't beta-ready, I'd still find it an interesting and entertaining pastime. Doesn't mean you (in general) have to declare me an idiot for it. My time is, after all, mine to waste.
You are free to do as you like, the only reason anyone would call someone an idiot, was if they make assumptions based on that about the nature of something else down the line, without knowing the amount of permutations it will go through or the variance between permutations before the final product. And even if you knew those things, the subset of possible conclusions makes it rather obvious that the whole pursuit is, at this point, nearly useless for predicting anything.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 22:01   #35
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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The beta was open while last round's stats were still in use. Presumably for testing changes to the game code.
Isn't beta.planetarion.com server always online anyway? I mean, even if they turn off the signups, doesn't mean they'd take down the manual or the stats. As no official beta has been announced that I know of, he's essentially not opened the stats for beta testing, so the point is mute, unless someone would want to suggest the beta server should be taken down between rounds?
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Unread 20 May 2010, 22:05   #36
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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Originally Posted by Sun_Tzu View Post
Isn't beta.planetarion.com server always online anyway? I mean, even if they turn off the signups, doesn't mean they'd take down the manual or the stats. As no official beta has been announced that I know of, he's essentially not opened the stats for beta testing, so the point is mute, unless someone would want to suggest the beta server should be taken down between rounds?
Yeah it's always on. The beta is open though, someone mentioned it to me a while ago and bread joined #beta this evening and it was up and running.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 22:14   #37
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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You are free to do as you like, the only reason anyone would call someone an idiot, was if they make assumptions based on that about the nature of something else down the line, without knowing the amount of permutations it will go through or the variance between permutations before the final product. And even if you knew those things, the subset of possible conclusions makes it rather obvious that the whole pursuit is, at this point, nearly useless for predicting anything.
I find it good practice for when the actual set is presented. Analyzing a set basically comes down to algorithms, going through fleets one by one, can X attack Y, Z, etc. (of course it goes deeper when accounting for efficiencies)

And I'm sure that the current set won't be dramatically changed, so there most likely will be a fair few similarities.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 22:35   #38
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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I find it good practice for when the actual set is presented. Analyzing a set basically comes down to algorithms, going through fleets one by one, can X attack Y, Z, etc. (of course it goes deeper when accounting for efficiencies)

And I'm sure that the current set won't be dramatically changed, so there most likely will be a fair few similarities.
Well, if you need the practice, then go ahead I suppose.

And I don't know what you're basing that second assumption on, because there's nothing that would indicate that, in fact quite the opposite, I'd say all indicators imply that volatility is still high.
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Unread 20 May 2010, 23:18   #39
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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Originally Posted by Sun_Tzu View Post
Well, if you need the practice, then go ahead I suppose.

And I don't know what you're basing that second assumption on, because there's nothing that would indicate that, in fact quite the opposite, I'd say all indicators imply that volatility is still high.
I'm not sure what you're basing that first assumption on. Simply because I practiced a particular activity does not imply that I need said practice. Quite the opposite, actually, I'd say I could live my life without analyzing a set of shipstats for an MMO just fine.

My 'assumption', however was based on the fact that someone has a general vision of what his set of stats should look like. Once the outlines are set, they're unlikely to change dramatically.

I'm basing that on personal experience of having followed the evolution of the past 4+ sets of stats quite actively. Which might not be enough for you, but it's enough for me to accept these stats as a first basis and analyze them.
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Unread 21 May 2010, 00:06   #40
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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My 'assumption', however was based on the fact that someone has a general vision of what his set of stats should look like. Once the outlines are set, they're unlikely to change dramatically.

I'm basing that on personal experience of having followed the evolution of the past 4+ sets of stats quite actively. Which might not be enough for you, but it's enough for me to accept these stats as a first basis and analyze them.
I'm going off a bit bigger sample set. At any rate, there are two basic principles which I doubt anyone would refute:

-A set is more volatile early in its development than late in its development.
-A set is more volatile when it's built from scratch than when it's based on an existing set (essentially an extension of the first principle).

This set fulfills both principles atm, meaning it is about as volatile as any set can be and still actually be existent.
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Unread 21 May 2010, 00:50   #41
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

I'm not refuting either of those principles, all I'm saying is that the 'volatile' state they're in will result in tweaks, not complete overhauls.
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Unread 21 May 2010, 01:17   #42
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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I'm not refuting either of those principles, all I'm saying is that the 'volatile' state they're in will result in tweaks, not complete overhauls.
Maybe, but even tweaks upon tweaks can change the outcome drastically. Really, sometimes these things set off quite unexpected chain reactions, and you don't always see them going into it. It's sort of like chess, how a better player sees multiple moves ahead, except those players are usually relying on their knowledge of chess chunks, and the defined ways these known entities will play out. In this metaphorical game, there are no such means of predicting how something will work out, making us prone to errors and failures of judgement.
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Unread 21 May 2010, 02:46   #43
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

ok and sorta back onto topic

Running Terr bs fleet using phoenixes for ally def seem viable no?
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Unread 21 May 2010, 03:10   #44
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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Running Terr bs fleet using phoenixes for ally def seem viable no?
That really depends on what else your alliance consists of (and I don't mean the male/female/alien ratio!).
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Unread 21 May 2010, 06:11   #45
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

ofc but that imo looks the strongest out and out fleet setup - you strong against what you target and your strong against what targets you

If you add pegs into a base fleet later on then you looking good as i see it
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Unread 21 May 2010, 06:28   #46
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

Is it normal that both cath and zik have SK in their roid class ?
Normally it's a different class not ?
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Unread 21 May 2010, 08:35   #47
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

ETD got 8 ships instead of 9, add one more steal ship please.
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Unread 21 May 2010, 12:42   #48
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

right, 36 sets of stats and this is what popped up.... im impressed o/
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Unread 21 May 2010, 13:54   #49
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

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Originally Posted by E-Choke View Post
Is it normal that both cath and zik have SK in their roid class ?
Normally it's a different class not ?
I'd imagine this is something appoco will fix.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zazas
ETD got 8 ships instead of 9, add one more steal ship please.
Balanced stats don't actually depend on numbers of ships.
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Unread 21 May 2010, 14:04   #50
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Re: Round 37 shipsstats discussion thread

Maybe it's a bit early to say this but please don't make xan fico too powerful appoco!
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