In todays news......

[Kal]

Originally Posted by Rumad

I think its a case of Why should you be bothered with it. I don't hold what Kal says to be correct, but I do see his point about training new MH's.

I just wonder if its worth closing the accounts they find....

I think it is, becuase that can then give them some experience of the appeals procedure and the abuse they are going to get next round etc.

[Kargool]

Originally Posted by Kal

I think it is, becuase that can then give them some experience of the appeals procedure and the abuse they are going to get next round etc.

Agreed, the multihunters needs training, and havoc hopefully provided good training for them.

[Mistwraith]

Originally Posted by I am Idler

Since when the flying **** did ANYONE sit down and agree that havoc is supposed to abide by the rules of anything but complete and utter carnage? Can you tell me, because I wasnt invited to the jamboree with your hippy friends.

I cheat during havoc. I have 4 accounts actually.

Why do you say? Because I dont really care about havoc, and anyone who actually does need a ****ing reality check.

Ban thread starter, close topic, lets move along

my hippy friends say hi and they will post u and invite next time they intend to meet :-)

theres many layers to the cheating .. from farming to holding more accounts than 1, some people have issues to resolve during havoc.. others play for the top...
the point being that some people play havoc for fun .. others play for real, surely for the real players cheaters are an issue .

[Kargool]

Originally Posted by I am Idler

Since when the flying **** did ANYONE sit down and agree that havoc is supposed to abide by the rules of anything but complete and utter carnage? Can you tell me, because I wasnt invited to the jamboree with your hippy friends.

I cheat during havoc. I have 4 accounts actually.

Why do you say? Because I dont really care about havoc, and anyone who actually does need a ****ing reality check.

Ban thread starter, close topic, lets move along

http://www.worldtoilet.org/hp/wto_hp.htm

On the bottom there you can apply for membership Idler.

[K-W]

Originally Posted by Mistwraith

my hippy friends say hi and they will post u and invite next time they intend to meet :-)

theres many layers to the cheating .. from farming to holding more accounts than 1, some people have issues to resolve during havoc.. others play for the top...
the point being that some people play havoc for fun .. others play for real, surely for the real players cheaters are an issue .

Nobody could possibly play it for real because it isnt a real round. The rankings are, from the first tick of havoc, completely bogus. It is one thing to play havoc and try to get a high ranking. That can be fun, I did it myself this past havoc. It is an entirely different thing to think that this ranking actually means something.

Whether or not you play havoc to have a high score, to take out enemies, to suicide your ships, whatever, you are playing for fun. That is what makes it havoc and we benefit nothing by losing sight of that fact.

[Squidly]

Originally Posted by K-W

Nobody could possibly play it for real because it isnt a real round. The rankings are, from the first tick of havoc, completely bogus. It is one thing to play havoc and try to get a high ranking. That can be fun, I did it myself this past havoc. It is an entirely different thing to think that this ranking actually means something.

Whether or not you play havoc to have a high score, to take out enemies, to suicide your ships, whatever, you are playing for fun. That is what makes it havoc and we benefit nothing by losing sight of that fact.

In your eyes, sure. In another's, no.

To some, it does mean something. Someone could be doing well in havoc and be quite happy about it. Who are you to rain on their parade so to speak by cheating?

[K-W]

Originally Posted by Squidly

In your eyes, sure. In another's, no.

To some, it does mean something. Someone could be doing well in havoc and be quite happy about it. Who are you to rain on their parade so to speak by cheating?

I AM NOT ARGUING IN FAVOR OF CHEATING

But as far as havoc being real, this isnt subjective at all. Havoc is, as a matter of fact, not a real round. The rankings are, as a matter of fact, not official. Because people do not start out equal and because most of the universe isnt even playing it is fundementally unfair and non-competitive. It isnt even a round, it is an add on week after a round has ended, the scores tallied and the winners named.

So before a single cheater does anything, this hypothetical person, who thinks havoc is a real round has already had thier parade thouroughly rained on by reality.

I played the last havoc. I played it for score. I had fun. At no point during havoc did I ever think my ranking was real, at no point was a I particularly proud of my ability to outscore inactives and barely actives and I certainly didnt think PA team was obligated to monitor my 'competitors' for cheating.

So yah, cheating is lame, but so is asking everyone to take havoc seriously just because a handful of people want to pretend they are playing a real round.

[Assassin]

I think the main thing regarding the concept of 'fun' is the fact i dont see cheating as fun. Anyone that thinks that way deserves to be closed, to perhaps beat it into there head that having ideas along those lines will only result in you being punished.

As Kal said it also provides training for new MHs appointed perhaps near the end of the offical round. And of course, if people are willing to cheat, in a round that isnt even official, then surely the Mhs can train by catching them.

But i have said it before, i dont see anything fun, by being given an account, and suiciding it onto your other account capping all of its ships (a zik scanario) When i played havoc i would of course use it as an opertunity to perhaps roid friends that play, your given huge amounts of resources/roids and its fun to have major battles that you perhaps couldnt have with your friends in the main round. Cheating, no matter now people try to water it down just becuase its havoc, isnt fun.

[Travler]

Originally Posted by Assassin

But i have said it before, i dont see anything fun, by being given an account, and suiciding it onto your other account capping all of its ships (a zik scanario) Cheating, no matter now people try to water it down just becuase its havoc, isnt fun.

As a slight counter point to this from someone who plays zik.

I would not use another account (mulit-cheating for sure) but if your friends wanted to crash their ships into you so that you could steal them is kinda fun as a zik player. Especially if you have some resources to build the proper steal ships.

[K-W]

Originally Posted by Assassin

I think the main thing regarding the concept of 'fun' is the fact i dont see cheating as fun. Anyone that thinks that way deserves to be closed, to perhaps beat it into there head that having ideas along those lines will only result in you being punished.

The idea that cheaters cheat for the sake of cheating is nonsensical. Like any game people cheat in order to do things in the game, things that everyone finds fun, like stealing ships/roids, growing a big fleet, winning a big battle etc. Those things are fun, and you can cheat to accomplish those things.

People who cheat in havoc generally arent evil people who enjoy doing bad things, usuaully they just dont care about havoc and figure nobody else cares about it either, so what does it matter how they build that kickass zik fleet. This is certainly a bad attitude, and even in something as casual as havoc it can be detrimental to other players, but thier pleasure is not as exoctic as you would make it out to be. They are enjoying the game of planetaron like everyone else, they are just cutting corners while doing it.

And nobody deserves to be closed for the things they think, only the things they do

As Kal said it also provides training for new MHs appointed perhaps near the end of the offical round. And of course, if people are willing to cheat, in a round that isnt even official, then surely the Mhs can train by catching them.

Training multi-hunters in havoc is a completely rational and extremely good idea.

But again, you seem to be completely misunderstanding why people cheat in havoc. It isnt that they are willing to cheat EVEN when it is unofficial. A large portion of those who cheat in havoc do so BECAUSE it is unofficial. Because it is a casual play around time, and they figure thier actions arent really hurting anybody.

You and I both disagree with this, probably to differing extents, but regardless its an atttitude we can understand. Many of these people wouldnt cheat during a real round because they respect the importance of fairness in a competitive round, they simply dont think the rules are that important in havoc because nothing is really at stake.

But i have said it before, i dont see anything fun, by being given an account, and suiciding it onto your other account capping all of its ships (a zik scanario) When i played havoc i would of course use it as an opertunity to perhaps roid friends that play, your given huge amounts of resources/roids and its fun to have major battles that you perhaps couldnt have with your friends in the main round. Cheating, no matter now people try to water it down just becuase its havoc, isnt fun.

Yes you do see the fun. The fun of farming ships in havoc is not the actual farming, its taking those ships and using them to do the things you mentioned. The point of farming a big fleet is to be able to "roid friends that play" and to have "major battles".

People who stand by the rules at all times and are not tempted to cut corners deserve our respect, but we should all be able to understand why people cut corners, and it isnt because they derive some perverse pleasure from breaking the rules.

[Rumad]

Originally Posted by Kal

I think it is, becuase that can then give them some experience of the appeals procedure and the abuse they are going to get next round etc.

Its all believable upto and not including the appeals procedure. Who on this earth is going to appeal something that does not matter? As I say I can understand training MH's and fair play as this is a good time to show them blatant cheating (I doubt anyone is subtle during havoc).

And Assassin as Treveler says if you are just going to crash a fleet into your own planet why would you not just get them to do it? I think if you are going to multi you would pyramid farm as its the quickest and easiest way of getting several fleets for only a few hours work using the planets you control to do the hard work for you.

On a side note if people are playing havoc like a real round get a life. At the end of the day concentrate your minds on doing better during the real round when you have 5 to 10 times the amount of players rather than playing a nothing round seriously. Use havoc and keep havoc for what it was always meant for....

GRUDGES, REVENGE and PAYBACK!!!!