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30 Mar 2003, 05:16
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#1
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Bitch
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: North Yorkshire
Posts: 3,848
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"No one should start a war on the assumption that the enemy's army will co-operate"
...so says Robin Cook and you know what? He's right, not only is he right but he's stating one of the oldest rules in the military book but apparently one neither Bush nor Rumsfeld nor even Ms Rice are familiar with.
Finding myself agreeing with Robin Cook is a sad state of affairs but as far as this invasion goes he's got it right.
"I want our troops home and I want them home before more of them are killed.", he goes on to say and I couldn't say it better.
__________________
ACHTUNG!!!
Das machine is nicht fur gefingerpoken und mittengrabben. Ist easy
schnappen der springenwerk, blowenfusen und corkenpoppen mit
spitzensparken. Ist nicht fur gewerken by das dummkopfen. Das
rubbernecken sightseeren keepen hands in das pockets. Relaxen und vatch
das blinkenlights!!!
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30 Mar 2003, 05:19
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#2
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Dirte
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 5,573
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If it was not so deadly serious, i would be laughing my arse off.
The only problem, is that when it goes badly, more civillians die.
If some off the killers die (On either side), i dont give a ****.
__________________
"Freedom, morality, and the human dignity of the individual consists precisely in this; that he makes waffles not because he is forced to do so, but because he freely conceives it, wants it, and loves it."
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30 Mar 2003, 08:20
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#3
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 50
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Re: "No one should start a war on the assumption that the enemy's army will co-operate"
Quote:
Originally posted by Gayle29uk
...so says Robin Cook and you know what? He's right, not only is he right but he's stating one of the oldest rules in the military book but apparently one neither Bush nor Rumsfeld nor even Ms Rice are familiar with.
Finding myself agreeing with Robin Cook is a sad state of affairs but as far as this invasion goes he's got it right.
"I want our troops home and I want them home before more of them are killed.", he goes on to say and I couldn't say it better.
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Some how I seriously doubt they completely planned for the Iraqis army to surrender in droves. That was one of the many possibilities (One they hoped for I Imagine).
No this isnt Pro-war drivel. Its just common sense.
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30 Mar 2003, 08:27
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#4
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Homesick
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Australia
Posts: 399
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I'd say that's a bit to late to realise that. Also, quite pointless as I'm sure every person with only the slightest bit of intelligence would know that. Except maybe the Bush administration.
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Don't hate yourself in the morning. Sleep till noon.
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30 Mar 2003, 08:45
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#5
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Doh!
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Nemo Mortalium Omnibus Horis Sapit
Posts: 1,720
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Re: Re: "No one should start a war on the assumption that the enemy's army will co-operate"
Quote:
Originally posted by IndiaSour
Its just common sense.
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It is a shame you cannot bottle it and sell it, there appears to be a distinct lack of it in both camps.
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Spinner: Kudos to Judge for having big cohones!
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30 Mar 2003, 09:46
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#6
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Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,290
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its all rumsfelds fault.
never let a politician make a decision if there is also someone available who has an idea about the topic.
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im not tolerant, i just dont care.
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30 Mar 2003, 09:49
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#7
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J to the C to the A G E
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Scúnthorpe
Posts: 5,583
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Yes I agree. Rumsfeld was the only polititian in the world that was pro-war.
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30 Mar 2003, 10:05
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#8
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Banned
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Wearing Speedos
Posts: 1,021
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Some "sh|te and awful" assumptions were made over this war.
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30 Mar 2003, 10:19
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: In front of PC
Posts: 156
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I'm not even sure that te assumptions that it'd be an easy war, were heartfelt by the politicians wanting the war.
It was a matter of selling the war to the public, which was not easy, so they had to lie their ass off about what would happen. Trusting of course that in times of war, the people rally around their leaders, no matter how sheit the war goes. They didn't consider it a problem that the same thing would happen on the other side. Arabs never were regarded as people by US or european decision-makers planning things for them...
The Cure's "killing an arab" tune got banned from radio, but they still play Rumsfeld's deadly tune........
__________________
Originally posted by Vaio
I wouldnt want to put anyone off getting married, it is a wonderful thing (for other people !)
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30 Mar 2003, 19:59
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#10
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The Twilight of the Gods
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 23,481
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The trouble is when you get Rumsfeld (a corporate whore come politician) ignoring advice from Powell (a general), and doing things HIS way.
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30 Mar 2003, 20:08
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#11
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Clerk
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 13,940
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`
I think you'll find that most of this conflict has gone as expected. There was a few idiots who thought it'd be a walk-over, but not many - and certainly not many in the upper echelons of government. Obviously prior to the conflict they're hardly going to drum about support with a slogan like "Support the War, Some of our soldiers WILL die"
The war won't be going badly (militarily) for the coalition until US/UK deaths are in the thousands. And that's unlikely to occur, barring some sort of super move by the Iraqi's.
A bigger danger would be poalirising the region even more into an anti-US position to the point where even the Arab governments are forced to act. But they've shown themselves to be either inept, corrupt or plain spineless over the last forty years or so, so i don't expect much.
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30 Mar 2003, 20:08
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#12
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a new low in getting high
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,810
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Re: Re: Re: "No one should start a war on the assumption that the enemy's army will co-operate&
Quote:
Originally posted by Judge
It is a shame you cannot bottle it and sell it, there appears to be a distinct lack of it in both camps.
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You can buy it in cereal form though.
__________________
There’s trouble on every corner,
And you need a place to hide,
All the bad things follow us down,
I want you by my side.
We’re hitting a new low.
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30 Mar 2003, 20:52
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#13
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Klaatu barada nikto
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: St. Paul, Minnesota
Posts: 3,237
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Re: "No one should start a war on the assumption that the enemy's army will co-operat
Quote:
Originally posted by Gayle29uk
"I want our troops home and I want them home before more of them are killed.", he goes on to say and I couldn't say it better.
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He now says that (in his original article in the Mirror) he was not advocating the withdrawal of British forces from Iraq.
Perhaps he was misquoted.
__________________
The Ottawa Citizen and Southam News wish to apologize for our apology to Mark Steyn, published Oct. 22. In correcting the incorrect statements about Mr. Steyn published Oct. 15, we incorrectly published the incorrect correction. We accept and regret that our original regrets were unacceptable and we apologize to Mr. Steyn for any distress caused by our previous apology.
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30 Mar 2003, 21:00
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#14
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Clerk
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 13,940
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Re: Re: "No one should start a war on the assumption that the enemy's army will co-operat
Quote:
Originally posted by Tactitus
He now says that (in his original article in the Mirror) he was not advocating the withdrawal of British forces from Iraq.
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Robin Cook is a twat. He supported numerous similar actions to this but suddenly grew a spine when media attention was on this.
He's better than Claire Short, but that's little praise.
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30 Mar 2003, 22:02
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#15
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Bitch
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: North Yorkshire
Posts: 3,848
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Quote:
Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
The trouble is when you get Rumsfeld (a corporate whore come politician) ignoring advice from Powell (a general), and doing things HIS way.
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There's a saying, "Amateurs talk about tactics. Professionals talk about logistics.".
That's why the coalition now have the logistical nightmare of a 300 mile supply line and enemy forces behind the front line, because Rumsfeld ignored Powell.
__________________
ACHTUNG!!!
Das machine is nicht fur gefingerpoken und mittengrabben. Ist easy
schnappen der springenwerk, blowenfusen und corkenpoppen mit
spitzensparken. Ist nicht fur gewerken by das dummkopfen. Das
rubbernecken sightseeren keepen hands in das pockets. Relaxen und vatch
das blinkenlights!!!
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30 Mar 2003, 22:03
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#16
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The Twilight of the Gods
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 23,481
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You should be on IRC more, you hussy.
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30 Mar 2003, 22:15
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#17
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Bitch
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: North Yorkshire
Posts: 3,848
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Quote:
Originally posted by MrL_JaKiri
You should be on IRC more, you hussy.
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Says the slut himself!
I'm at work till 7am so no IRC for me
__________________
ACHTUNG!!!
Das machine is nicht fur gefingerpoken und mittengrabben. Ist easy
schnappen der springenwerk, blowenfusen und corkenpoppen mit
spitzensparken. Ist nicht fur gewerken by das dummkopfen. Das
rubbernecken sightseeren keepen hands in das pockets. Relaxen und vatch
das blinkenlights!!!
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30 Mar 2003, 22:19
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#18
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Ruler
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 190
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Quote:
Originally posted by Gayle29uk
There's a saying, "Amateurs talk about tactics. Professionals talk about logistics.".
That's why the coalition now have the logistical nightmare of a 300 mile supply line and enemy forces behind the front line, because Rumsfeld ignored Powell.
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Pity all the fools who tried to invade Russia never heard that saying. Guess it is pretty hard for Saddam to use the "Scorched Earth" tactic though, as I imagine sand doesn't burn all that well. But he should bloody well torch those oil-fields at least, as history dictates that burning stuff up is a sure-fire way to victory! I mean, how are they going to refuel those tanks without the oil?
(I'm sitting here writing a piece on swedish-russian wars, I feel like sharing this immense knowledge I now possess about world-affairs and modern warfare in general. )
__________________
No, I don't know that Atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God.
- George Bush Sr
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30 Mar 2003, 23:19
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#19
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Banned
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Further to the right
Posts: 19,441
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If they recall I'm complaining as I'll have nothing to spend my sunday afternoon chuckling at.
__________________
Some might ask what good is life without purpose but I'm anticipating a good lunch.
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30 Mar 2003, 23:24
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#20
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The Twilight of the Gods
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 23,481
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Quote:
Originally posted by Gayle29uk
Says the slut himself!
I'm at work till 7am so no IRC for me
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Brazen hussy.
I'm going to come down to the generic south and teach you a thing or two!
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30 Mar 2003, 23:51
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#21
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Vermin Supreme
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 3,280
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Re: `
Quote:
Originally posted by Dante Hicks
I think you'll find that most of this conflict has gone as expected. There was a few idiots who thought it'd be a walk-over, but not many - and certainly not many in the upper echelons of government.
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http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/...in545725.shtml
Looking at polls etc. from the weeks before the war, there is a definite low-mid 40s % that believed the war would take 'a few weeks.'
I would agree that they are idiots, but "few" doesn't seem the correct word when they make up 42% of the population (the same 42% that said we should invade even if the UN doesn't endorse it presumably).
Anyway, even up to a week ago mainstream pundit-types were predicting that this war would be over by this Tuesday (as per the article). I can't see the future, but I'm guessing we won't have the surrender within the next 48 hours.
Point, the only claim that was getting any media time was that we would be in and out. And with that claim in the media came the support of the ignorant masses. Hence we invaded.
(ps: unrelated, but Saddam is definitely in position to pull off the all-time greatest 'april fools' gag ever)
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31 Mar 2003, 01:46
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#22
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Klaatu barada nikto
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: St. Paul, Minnesota
Posts: 3,237
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Re: Re: `
Quote:
Originally posted by acropolis
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/...in545725.shtml
Looking at polls etc. from the weeks before the war, there is a definite low-mid 40s % that believed the war would take 'a few weeks.'
I would agree that they are idiots, but "few" doesn't seem the correct word when they make up 42% of the population (the same 42% that said we should invade even if the UN doesn't endorse it presumably).
Anyway, even up to a week ago mainstream pundit-types were predicting that this war would be over by this Tuesday (as per the article).
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Not terribly surprising. The smart people know better than to publicly commit to, or even mention, any sort of timeline. That pretty much leaves the field wide open for the hacks and fools. The media will almost always go with "two weeks--tops" soundbite over the "Well, war is an inexact science..."; and then we see the inevitable backlash when the optimistic forecasts don't materialize. :/
We saw the same thing with Afghanistan. A week after the ground war started people were using the "Q" word (quagmire) because they thought it was taking too long.
__________________
The Ottawa Citizen and Southam News wish to apologize for our apology to Mark Steyn, published Oct. 22. In correcting the incorrect statements about Mr. Steyn published Oct. 15, we incorrectly published the incorrect correction. We accept and regret that our original regrets were unacceptable and we apologize to Mr. Steyn for any distress caused by our previous apology.
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31 Mar 2003, 07:22
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#23
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Lonely analytic
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 2,390
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Re: "No one should start a war on the assumption that the enemy's army will co-operat
Quote:
Originally posted by Gayle29uk
"I want our troops home and I want them home before more of them are killed.", he goes on to say and I couldn't say it better.
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On reading this I remembered you are from a military family... And so is Madi...
I just hope you don't have any family over there...
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For real
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31 Mar 2003, 10:51
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#24
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 159
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I just read, that more and more exil Iraqi are returning to defend their country. About 6.000 so far are not interested to be liberated by the USA. I didn't find an english written link because I don't know how to translate some of the keywords.
Syria and old Iraq enemy Iran are supporting the Iraqi militia and Powell tries to stop it by threatening them. If he threatens them enough, perhaps other Arab nations will start to silently support the Iraq too.
Besides Al Jazeera other critical sites are under attack aswell.
__________________
The world never was good, but now it is getting worse.
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31 Mar 2003, 18:45
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#25
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Vermin Supreme
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 3,280
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Quote:
Originally posted by Tactitus
We saw the same thing with Afghanistan. A week after the ground war started people were using the "Q" word (quagmire) because they thought it was taking too long.
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Eh.
I remember before we hit afghani all you would hear about was how Russia and others had tried to take Afghanistan and it turned into the Q. How we were going to be there for years losing thousands.
And we invaded, and knocked em out in weeks. In fact, if I remember right our damn NA boys took Kabul before they were supposed to (actually angering some people).
And after all was done, the people who had predicted quagmire were summarily mocked by the media.
Point, the reason there were very few predictions of quagmire was that those who predicted 'months' were mocked as being the same people who predicted Q in Afghani. And then ignored.
And what was left for the public to hear were the quacks who would predict swift victory.
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31 Mar 2003, 18:48
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#26
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IRC Lackey
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Somewhere in the dark and nasty regions...
Posts: 1,471
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i agreed with him
when he said that the worst thing we could do is leave saddam in power in Iraq.
Now this war has started, we may as well finish it.
__________________
-Mushroom.
"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it."
George Bernard Shaw
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