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17 Sep 2005, 03:05
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#1
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Eat My Roids
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 143
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resource stealing ships
Just as a minor addition to the game, there could be a resource stealing ship included in each race which would basically be a ship that, on landing an attack, would steal resources based on its attack damage.
There would be no cap, the res stolen would be a direct factor of damage. (1 dmg = 10 of each res). This means that even if the planet liquidates its resources, the attacker has the opportunity of stealing at least 1 tick worth.
Another thing, ship class. The possible classes would be either the large roid class or the small roid class. I would suggest the smaller roid class as with the current stealing options, this prevents normal races (Ter Cat Xan) from stealing another class of res steal ships and it also prevents a run from including both SKs and res stealers.
Please discuss ideas and any problems
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17 Sep 2005, 08:12
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#2
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Commodore
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 3,176
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Re: resource stealing ships
Well, the old Cargo Ships from R3 and before used to steal resources as well, but they did it directly from the planet's stash. Mind you, they also used to attack for three ticks and they were most popular mainly due to their high armour as opposed to the amount of resources that they stole, but still. I dont see why you cant just steal a proportion of the planet's stash and/or make combat such that it would deduct that tick's worth of resources during the combat tick, and not during the resource tick.
That way, an attacker will have at least 1 tick's worth of resources stolen, and still have the usual armour flak benefits along with it.
I dont think that resources should be stolen be a function of the amount of damage that is done - as either way Cathaar are unbalanced; either through doing no 'real' damage with their EMP weapons, or doing significantly more damage if you compare raw values and equate EMP with conventional killers. It puts races like Terran and Zik at a disadvantage in general. Quite frankly, i dont see why you would want to make it a function of damage done - surely stealing from a planets stash and having first dibs on that tick's resources would be enough?
As for what class the ship is in, it would make sense to be in the class that the structure killer is not - ie, one pod class steals cash, whilst the other destroys structures. But i think it would require an additional type (ie from 12 to 13 types per race) as otherwise all races would have to give up a ship that targets another class of ship in order to have them, and tbh i think the stats really do need all of the existing types as they are.
I like the idea in general, as resources invested in flak without weapons means that your fleet is more surviviable, at the cost of doing less damage to the enemy. So less death all round - ups from me .
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#Strategy ; #Support - Sovereign
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"The Cake is a Lie."
Last edited by Ultimate Newbie; 17 Sep 2005 at 08:17.
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17 Sep 2005, 09:02
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#3
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PA Team
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 7,449
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Re: resource stealing ships
I like the idea of bringing back resource stealers. It would have to be a function of damage, but on the opposite class to the structure killer, as UN said.
It'd have to be a function of damage as otherwise you'll have De fleets and Fi fleets with their resource stealing ships all stealing the same amount - which wouldn't be very fair. We'll just modify the ships slightly according to the cost of the pod (and perhaps the race)
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r8-10 RaH r10.5-12 MISTU
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17 Sep 2005, 09:18
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#4
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The Original Terran
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Afghan atm
Posts: 1,633
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Re: resource stealing ships
Cargo ships is bad very bad and naughty and evul and guess who will have more cargo ships than anyone else?
Only make the bigger players get more access to free resources which is what i thought roids where for.
Stealing ships and roids and killing structures and getting cov opped and now getting bashed for your resources :/ sounds like a "i am gonna quit coz this happened to me constantly from the bigger players" idea.
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introduction-Gramma
The following is a list of problems found in various places throughout the manual and game. We love you Noah!
Written by Kloopy Wed Mar 16 22:06:43 2005
Retired just for a bit....
Proud to have been 1up, SiN, Wolfpack, Bluetuba and the leader of ARK.
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17 Sep 2005, 11:38
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#5
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Commodore
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 3,176
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Re: resource stealing ships
Quote:
Originally Posted by Appocomaster
It'd have to be a function of damage as otherwise you'll have De fleets and Fi fleets with their resource stealing ships all stealing the same amount - which wouldn't be very fair. We'll just modify the ships slightly according to the cost of the pod (and perhaps the race)
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Oh, i see what you mean by damage now!! (i thought you meant that your fleet had to kill x amount of enemy in order to get y amount of resources etc).
Why would you need to do that though? why not just amalgamate the value of the cargo ships; ie Attacker 1 has 100000 value worth of Cargoes and attacker 2 has 200000 value, thus attacker 1 gets 1/3 of the available salvage etc etc?
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#Strategy ; #Support - Sovereign
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"The Cake is a Lie."
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17 Sep 2005, 11:40
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#6
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Insomniac
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 3,583
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Re: resource stealing ships
if cargo ships replaced structure killers for some races ( like zik ) it might be an idea too.
it would fit in with the zik - steal stuff - ethos
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17 Sep 2005, 12:18
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#7
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Commodore
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 3,176
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Re: resource stealing ships
plus the obvious benefits of reducing the number of structure killers flying around in the universe.
prolly make Terran also steal resources, cos that way newbies dont use them on eachtoher. heh
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#Strategy ; #Support - Sovereign
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"The Cake is a Lie."
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17 Sep 2005, 13:11
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#8
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Insomniac
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 3,583
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Re: resource stealing ships
i'd say cath and zik personally to have resource stealers rather then structure killers.
Zik because ' they steal stuff' and cath because they're more peaceful with their emp weapons
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17 Sep 2005, 16:09
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#9
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The Original Terran
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Afghan atm
Posts: 1,633
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Re: resource stealing ships
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil^
i'd say cath and zik personally to have resource stealers rather then structure killers.
Zik because ' they steal stuff' and cath because they're more peaceful with their emp weapons
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So peaceful that they always kicking gryphon butt.
Oh and there that peaceful a cat is number 1 in a war game with his oh so nice EMP.
Stealing is bad enough as it is coz PPL NOOB BASH FOR SHIPS wether we like it or not and we trying to live with that.
But now you want ppl to have steal ships to steal roids steal ships and also steal there income?
Why dont you just steal there xp and steal there score and steal the value while ur at it maybe throw in a steal there enjoyment of wanting to play the game.
"hey look i logged in this morning and guess what!!! i had all my battleships nicked from some 1m player I am only 400k value and he stole 25 of my roids and also stole most of my resources and i got no salvage whatsoever so no i am gonna ask the PA team if i can go back into protection for 72 ticks while these 4 other waves are after my fighters and the rest of my resource and my 120 roids only been playing for 3 weeks to "
Note: This little story does not include SK but if did then you can understand how that could be even worse as you get no salvage whatsoever from losing them either.
__________________
introduction-Gramma
The following is a list of problems found in various places throughout the manual and game. We love you Noah!
Written by Kloopy Wed Mar 16 22:06:43 2005
Retired just for a bit....
Proud to have been 1up, SiN, Wolfpack, Bluetuba and the leader of ARK.
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17 Sep 2005, 16:26
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#10
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Hi there ...
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 481
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Re: resource stealing ships
having the resource stealing AFTER the combat tick is really a 'great' idea : that really encourages to do max. kill to gain even the salvage from the target which makes the salvage as refund for the defenders pretty worthless.
a good thing would be that you can actually 'force' ppl to spend their resources when they sit on let's say 100 mil of each and dont even spend it when they get incomings :
"if you dont spend it - i take it with pleasure ty "
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#Reunion
[Ascendancy] - While you were trying, we were sleeping
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17 Sep 2005, 16:56
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,081
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Re: resource stealing ships
Quote:
Originally Posted by noah02
So peaceful that they always kicking gryphon butt.
Oh and there that peaceful a cat is number 1 in a war game with his oh so nice EMP.
Stealing is bad enough as it is coz PPL NOOB BASH FOR SHIPS wether we like it or not and we trying to live with that.
But now you want ppl to have steal ships to steal roids steal ships and also steal there income?
Why dont you just steal there xp and steal there score and steal the value while ur at it maybe throw in a steal there enjoyment of wanting to play the game.
"hey look i logged in this morning and guess what!!! i had all my battleships nicked from some 1m player I am only 400k value and he stole 25 of my roids and also stole most of my resources and i got no salvage whatsoever so no i am gonna ask the PA team if i can go back into protection for 72 ticks while these 4 other waves are after my fighters and the rest of my resource and my 120 roids only been playing for 3 weeks to "
Note: This little story does not include SK but if did then you can understand how that could be even worse as you get no salvage whatsoever from losing them either.
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Exactly. While this suggestion moves us into a more 'realistic' style of game, we have to remember that its exactly that: a game. If we want people to continue to play, and indeed start to play, we have to make it fun for everyone.
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Dynamic Salvage!
[16:10:34] <[lfc]stif|afk> "dont be the worst in your alliance, join CT. We have Arfy!"
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17 Sep 2005, 20:04
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#12
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Eat My Roids
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 143
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Re: resource stealing ships
Quote:
That way, an attacker will have at least 1 tick's worth of resources stolen, and still have the usual armour flak benefits along with it.
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yes, thats what i was going for. so that the attacker cant land on a planet who just donated all his res to the fund for a tick. Maybe make it max 1 tick res cap to be fair, cant bash small players as itd be a waste of a slot.
Quote:
i'd say cath and zik personally to have resource stealers rather then structure killers.
Zik because ' they steal stuff' and cath because they're more peaceful with their emp weapons
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i agree with this, it would help lessen the amount of SKs in the uni while further differentiating the races. Plus cat and zik make sense. If you want res, you already have a 10 stealth bonus for res hacking.
As for Noah, getting res stealers landed on you shouldnt be too harsh for noobs. with the max cap being 1 (maybe 2?) ticks of resources. A small planet will suffer almost no losses and a larger planet will quickly regain the resources.
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17 Sep 2005, 21:50
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#13
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The Original Terran
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Afghan atm
Posts: 1,633
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Re: resource stealing ships
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron7684
As for Noah, getting res stealers landed on you shouldnt be too harsh for noobs. with the max cap being 1 (maybe 2?) ticks of resources. A small planet will suffer almost no losses and a larger planet will quickly regain the resources.
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yes but from your previous threads you dont like noobs anyways so ur opinion on n00bs dont count.
And read my thread properly it might not be a probs for you but for that n00b ur on about it will be.
A ticks worth is more important when your small trust me I know.(Still important to me now tbh damn hate them cov oppers stealing my resources )
nuff said.
__________________
introduction-Gramma
The following is a list of problems found in various places throughout the manual and game. We love you Noah!
Written by Kloopy Wed Mar 16 22:06:43 2005
Retired just for a bit....
Proud to have been 1up, SiN, Wolfpack, Bluetuba and the leader of ARK.
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17 Sep 2005, 22:02
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#14
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Hi there ...
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 481
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Re: resource stealing ships
i think capping 1 tick of the resources of someone else is not that interesting to really invest money into it. i'd rather have some additional firepower or pods instead of gaining 100k of each resources.
Maybe it could be race specific - Terran steal Metal , Cath steal crystal that would even out the 'unfairness that xan/zik/cath have from weighted shipscosts to 1 resources (metal for ter etc) but balanced roidcounts all over the place - losses through trading ---> xtothez made a thread about it before here
So you could steal what you need. no idea what xan could have in that case - maybe the only SK as the "damage"-race ?
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#Reunion
[Ascendancy] - While you were trying, we were sleeping
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18 Sep 2005, 04:28
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#15
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Eat My Roids
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 143
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Re: resource stealing ships
Noah, stop flaming me for that post. thats not what i meant by it. and maybe you should read what i have to say before flaming me for something i said in a different thread.
My point is that with the max cap as a percentage of tick income (50%-100%). Planets dont have to liquidate their resources, there will be no exploition of the galaxy fund if they lose 1 ticks resources. And this also makes it equal for smaller planets because if they only make 10k res a tick. They lose 10k res (which is regained in 1 tick ofc). Can i please get some other comments on what people think of this
oh, and as for the Mr n00b hater. Im a noob to the forums, if you go flame me on my 10th post, isnt that like me bashing a planet that just started out. if you want to encourage people to play PA by making less ways to bash noobs, maybe you should encourage more people to use the forums by not constantly flaming then for 1 thing when they just start out.
sorry if this isnt the place to put this but that reply was pretty hostile
Last edited by Ron7684; 18 Sep 2005 at 06:34.
Reason: noah
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19 Sep 2005, 16:58
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#16
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Planetarion Forum Moderator
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,289
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Re: resource stealing ships
One interesting spinnoff from this thread, what about rather then stealing from a planet, they steal from salvage? So rather then cargo ships, they are salvage ships, allowing attackers to regain some of their lost resources from an attack? I would keep the percentage small to limit abuse, but they might be useful. Thoughts?
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Romans 10:9-10
#strategy
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19 Sep 2005, 22:23
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#17
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Eat My Roids
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 143
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Re: resource stealing ships
well, being a cat its different cause my CR attacks kill no ships. but i tihnk salvage stealing isnt that good because you gain nothing on a ran attack. And if you send your whole fleet to defend a planet with the hopes of salvage then log on to see the attacker stole half (even a quarter) of what you deserve. You'd be pretty pissed
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20 Sep 2005, 01:02
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#18
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Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 1,081
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Re: resource stealing ships
Yes Ron7684 you're right. Hell, I was pissed when 3 of us killed 1mil value of ships and lost just 50k ourselves. I barely got enough to rebuild what I lost. Steal my salvage and I shant be happy.
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Dynamic Salvage!
[16:10:34] <[lfc]stif|afk> "dont be the worst in your alliance, join CT. We have Arfy!"
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