Classical Music

[SbOlly]

I want to become more cultured. So I've decided I need to listen to classical music. Cos thats what posh people do innit?.

Anyhow.....

I want recommendations for some good classical songs. Not just composers names, but song names as well. And preferably songs with people singing. Or relatively 'exciting' songs.

Go go GD!

[Dante Hicks]

Samuel Barber - Adagio For Strings (from the Platoon theme)

[JonnyBGood]

I remember everything that has ever been posted on the forums.

[MrL_JaKiri]

Orff's O Fortuna from Carmina Burana
Most of Wagner (Hojoto! Hojoto! is probably the most famous (Ride of the Valks))
Jeremy Soule - The TA Soundtrack (especially the theme)
Prokofiev's Monts & Caps (From Romeo and Juliet)
Strauss's Also Sprach Zarathusta (or 'The 2001 thing')
Greig's Piano Concerto in A Minor
Bach's Toccata and Fugue in D
Beethoven's 9th

[edit]

Not really what you're looking for, but Bach's Concerto for Flute, Violin and Harpsichord in A Minor is a piece of genius that no Classical thread should be without.

[SbOlly]

God bless you Jonny.
God bless you.....!

Edit : (And Mark)

[Nodrog]

If you want to actually appreciate classical music more you might want to pick up a book on music theory.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

If you want to actually appreciate classical music more you might want to pick up a book on music theory.

What the ****?

[Dante Hicks]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

If you want to actually appreciate classical music more you might want to pick up a book on music theory.

There is not a sufficient emoticon to express how much I rolled my eyes upon reading that. will have to do, but let it be known it's an understatement.

[NEWSBOT3]

I'm rather partial to a good bit of Wagner.

[Nodrog]

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

There is not a sufficient emoticon to express how much I rolled my eyes upon reading that. will have to do, but let it be known it's an understatement.

lol

[queball]

Nod's right. People who play an instrument and become classically trained seem to get a great appreciation for the details. You could try and pull your own completely seperate set of values out of nowhere but don't dismiss the traditional, academic, perspective for being boring. There's more depth to the arts than what sounds/looks nice superficially. You don't appear to just want something a bit enjoyable.

[SbOlly]

eh?

[Nodrog]

I do think its silly to dismiss out of hand the idea that gaining knowledge about a subject can increase your enjoyment and appreciation of it enormously. I'd imagine that someone with decent knowledge of music would appreciate classical music on a deeper level than someone who just liked it because it sounds nice, in the same way that someone who had studied art for sometime would be more likely to appreciate a painting on a level that goes beyond "it looks pretty and makes me feel good" (or to take a different example, someone who played a lot of football would probably appreciate a complicated passing move more than someone who was watching the game for the first time, simply because they had more understanding of what was involved). But yeah, lets all hold hand and sing hymns to glorious egalitarianism, all music is equally good and objective standards dont exist blah blah blah.

[JonnyBGood]

I think recommending reading a book about classical music theory before actually listening to classical music is a fairly ludicrous proposition nod.


Plus it depends on what you define to be music so **** you. Obviously if the definition includes a clear statement of what is necessary for a work to be a "good" piece of music then it's objective inside the framework of your definition. Personally I find it to be both objective and subjective, there are some elements which are objectively rated and some which merely depend on personal opinion.

[Dante Hicks]

Doctors can appreciate human beauty more deeply than us lower mortals without medical qualifications.

[queball]

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

Doctors can appreciate human beauty more deeply than us lower mortals without medical qualifications.

I agree. Biologists, at least.

[NEWSBOT3]

didn't we used to have moderators to stop this sort of shite thread de-railing ?

[Nodrog]

Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

I think recommending reading a book about classical music theory before actually listening to classical music is a fairly ludicrous proposition nod.

I agree.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

I agree.

I guess I misinterpreted your post then. My bad, or perhaps you could be slightly clearer in future!



PS Get past your irc firewall thing you ****ing shit.

[Nodrog]

Originally Posted by Dante Hicks

Doctors can appreciate human beauty more deeply than us lower mortals without medical qualifications.

I'm not sure why doctors would appreciate human beauty more than non-doctors, since their study of the human body is generally devoted to its function rather than its form (although to the extent that form follows function, I would imagine they would appreciate certain parts of it more, in the same way that a physicist would appreciate the beauty of planetary motion more than someone who had never studied cosmology). However, I'd imagine that someone who studied the human body in an aesthethic sense for quite some time would probably appreciate human beauty more than the average person - for instance I'd expect a great painter of the human form to be able to grasp human beauty to a greater extent than myself.

[queball]

Originally Posted by NEWSBOT3

didn't we used to have moderators to stop this sort of shite thread de-railing ?

This thread should definitely have been a list of everyone's favourite classical mp3s with no commentary.

[NEWSBOT3]

Originally Posted by queball

This thread should definitely have been a list of everyone's favourite classical mp3s with no commentary.

Originally Posted by SbOlly

recommendations for some good classical songs. Not just composers names, but song names as well. And preferably songs with people singing. Or relatively 'exciting' songs.
Go go GD!

[JonnyBGood]

There's about eight threads on Gd which didn't go beyond what the original poster intended.



Seven of them have no replies.

[NEWSBOT3]

are you sure you don't work for some government department ?

[Dante Hicks]

Originally Posted by queball

I agree. Biologists, at least.

Out of interest, if someone asked for some pornography reccomendations, would you advise them to read Gray's Anatomy first, to enhance things?

[Nodrog]

someone who had watched (and studied) a lot of porn would be better equipped to appreciate certain things than the average person (such as length of cumshots, lighting or whatever). Someone who hadnt watched much porn probably wouldnt be able to tell 2 different porn movies apart, whereas someone with more discerning tastes might notice that one was significantly better than the other, and be able to justify his comments in a logical manner (rather than just saying 'it made me more horny' or whatever). How do you think some porn directors can be better than others?

[Nodrog]

With with respect to classical music, I'd say that the greater appreciation would generally consist in knowing _why_ the music made you feel the way it did. I'd say that theres a significant cognitive difference between someone who listens to a piece and feels "sad" or "triumphant" without really knowing why, and someone who actually understands why and how the music is causing his emotional states. Also, I'd say someone with knowledge of the music would be more able to appreciate the more 'diffcult' parts of what he was listening to, in the same way that a guitar player would probably get more out of a hard-to-play riff. These things obviously apply on some level to all forms of music, but I'd say they come through more in classical simply because the complexity of an average piece generally greatly exceeds that of most other genres.

[JonnyBGood]

If I watch porn and start thinking about the director and the lighting effect I'm going to hunt you down and saw your head off with a rusty knife nod.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

With with respect to classical music, I'd say that the greater appreciation would generally consist in knowing _why_ the music made you feel the way it did. I'd say that theres a significant cognitive difference between someone who listens to a piece and feels "sad" or "triumphant" without really knowing why, and someone who actually understands why and how the music is causing his emotional states. Also, I'd say someone with knowledge of the music would be more able to appreciate the more 'diffcult' parts of what he was listening to, in the same way that a guitar player would probably get more out of a hard-to-play riff. These things obviously apply on some level to all forms of music, but I'd say they come through more in classical music simply because the complexity of an average piece generally greatly exceeds that of most other genres.

I way ****ing disagree here. I enjoy music that makes me feel sad/triumphant partly because I don't know how the artist does it. It'd destroy some of the mystique for me personally if someone told me the science behind it. That's why art is call and science is ****ing gay dude.

[Nodrog]

You dont think about it, thats the point. It isnt something you notice consciously, its one of the many things that help to form your subconscious judgement of why a particular movie is 'good'. Someone who had actually studied porn for some time would be able to consciously notice these things, and hence would be able to justify why he liked a particular sex scence more than another in a non-superficial way. Directing porn films is a talent just like directing 'action' films (although perhaps to a lesser extent).

[Nodrog]

Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

I way ****ing disagree here. I enjoy music that makes me feel sad/triumphant partly because I don't know how the artist does it. It'd destroy some of the mystique for me personally if someone told me the science behind it. That's why art is call and science is ****ing gay dude.

This sounds like the people who say that science "takes the beauty" out of nature, when to many scientists the sense of beauty they gain by the greater appreciation of how something works greatly exceeds that which most people get from their belief that "life appeared on earth magically one day okay". Watching magic shows as a kid when you thought that it was 'actually real' was good fun, but so is watching magic now and trying to work out how the tricks are done.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

You dont think about it, thats the point. It isnt something you notice consciously, its one of the many things that help to form your subconscious judgement of why a particular movie is 'good'. Someone who had actually studied porn for some time would be able to consciously notice these things, and hence would be able to justify why he liked a particular sex scence more than another in a non-superficial way. Directing porn films is a talent just like directing 'action' films (although perhaps to a lesser extent).

Dude most people watch porn to get off. Therefore they watch bukkake, anal, asian etc whatever floats their boat. It's hardly of vital importance to be able to justify why you enjoyed a particular film.

[Nodrog]

Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

Dude most people watch porn to get off. Therefore they watch bukkake, anal, asian etc whatever floats their boat. It's hardly of vital importance to be able to justify why you enjoyed a particular film.

With the massive amount of porn available to the average internet denizen, the possibility of discenrment is greatly encouraged. I could justify why I enojoyed something like bangbus or amateur porn more than I enjoyed watching some supermodel being banged in Generica Girls IV, and I'm pretty sure you could as well if you forced yourself to think about it.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

This sounds like the people who say that science "takes the beauty" out of nature, when to many scientists the sense of beauty they gain by the greater appreciation of how something works greatly exceeds that which most people get from their belief that "life appeared on earth magically one day okay". Watching magic shows as a kid when you thought that it was 'actually real' was good fun, but so is watching magic now and trying to work out how the tricks are done.

Yeah but I understand (or attempt to) science, philosophy, history and so on and so forth. Not being able to intellectually comprehend what makes a particular work a masterpiece is hardly going to negatively impact on my life. It's great to be able to watch magic and try and work out how it's done but isn't it nice to have a bit of both, where they're both enjoyable in different ways?

[queball]

People should be legally obliged to study the mechanics of the film-making before watching a film. This would have avoided film culture degenerating into trashy "action films".

[NEWSBOT3]

[02:08:20] <nodrog> this is the best hijack ever
[02:08:26] <nodrog> classical music to what makes porn good in 20 posts

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

With the massive amount of porn available to the average internet denizen, the possibility of discenment is greatly encouraged. I could justify why I enojoyed something like bangbus or amateur porn more than I enjoyed watching some supermodel being banged in Generica Girls IV, and I'm pretty sure you could as well if you forced yourself to think about it.

So? I know what I like and it's not exactly important to know precisely why. I mean I could go off and go into the depths of chemical balances to work out why I enjoy eating chocolate but that'd be a rather pointless use of my time.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by queball

People should be legally obliged to study the mechanics of the film-making before watching a film. This would have avoided film culture degenerating into trashy "action films".

I enjoy action films though. I was watching this review of troy the other night from all these film critics and despite the fact they said the acting was weak, the plot was missing vital elements from the original story and the dialogue was laboured I'll still go to watch it. And unlike that pack of pretentious wankers I can enjoy both reading the Iliad and watching Troy.

[Nodrog]

The point of this thread was that sbolly actually wanted to appreciate classical music, which is why I threw in a recommendation that he might enjoy reading some stuff about it as well as just listening to it. If someone asked me how to 'get into' magic, I'd advise them to read up on how to tricks in addition to just watching it being performed. I wouldnt say that 'reading about stuff' is necessary to enjoy it, nor is obviously a replacement for actually experiencing the stuff yourself, but I think reading can definitely supplement your knowledge and speed up your learning and appreciation in many cases (reading books about Go wont make you a good player, but if you dont actively read about it as well as playing it, youll be lucky to break 20k in a year).

[queball]

Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

I enjoy action films though. I was watching this review of troy the other night from all these film critics and despite the fact they said the acting was weak, the plot was missing vital elements from the original story and the dialogue was laboured I'll still go to watch it. And unlike that pack of pretentious wankers I can enjoy both reading the Iliad and watching Troy.

So? You enjoy it because you've been socialised to enjoy it. And you were socialised to enjoy arts because of the intellectual purpose they serve. Troy is simply a perversion of nature.

[JonnyBGood]

No he didn't. He said he wanted to listen to classical music in order to become more cultured. Therefore you recommend songs which he can listen to in order for him to become more cultured. You dig?

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by queball

So? You enjoy it because you've been socialised to enjoy it. And you were socialised to enjoy arts because of the intellectual purpose they serve. Troy is simply a perversion of nature.

I did not enjoy this post. Society must dislike you qbll

[KaneED]

you guys work on the theory that only by having an indpeth knowledge of something can you express your appreciation or your ideas on something.


now that is stupid and obviously involves wiggling your finger around in your ass and shooting you come in the air so you can catch it in your mouth.

[JetLinus]

You should DEFENITELY have heard

• Beethoven - 5th Symphony

once in your life. I know, the beginning is known by everyone due to ads, mobile ring tones and so on.
But this piece got MUCH more than that. The 2nd movement is one of the most beautiful piece in all history of great orchestra work IMO, for example. The whole symphony is nice.



Also you shouldn't miss

• Mozart - 39th Symphony

which you might know from mobile ringtones as well. Generally, the upper 30s and 40s symphonies (well, up to 41 and thats it ^^) from Mozart are fairly "easy" to listen to and nice indeed.



OFC you might have considered

• Vivaldi - 4 seasons

A "must know" IMO.



Check out

• J. S. Bach - Brandenburg Concerto Nr. 1 - 3

as well, I think Nr. 2 might be well known and nice.



Hmm, then there is

• Smetana - The Moldau

What about

• Tchaïkowsky - Lake of the Swans

Some STUNNING parts in it!



Hmmm, this MIGHT be a bit biased, as I tend to like a piece more and more once I play it. But it's a good opportunity to get to know works.


If you like solo instruments, I myself as a cello player can recommend

• J. S. Bach - Suite for Solo Cello No 1 - 3 (BWV 1007 - 1009)

Or at least the preludium of it.



Got it on my webspace anyway, there' you go².

[JetLinus]

Oh yeah, just checked JJs list given earlier in this thread and I have to add:
Don't forget

• Dvorák - 'New World' Symphony
• Rachmaninov - Piano Concerto No. 2

I'm not particulary fan of piano concerts (yet), but MANY people I know love this 2nd by Rachmaninov.
I don't really like the New World Symphony that much yet, but Dvorak seems alright and I'm about to play it.









Heyyyyyyyy, look how I brought this back to topic by reading the forums late night ^^

[Dante Hicks]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

(reading books about Go wont make you a good player, but if you dont actively read about it as well as playing it, youll be lucky to break 20k in a year).

Skill at Go can be "objectively" measured to an extent : your ability to win against players you are likely to play against. A player who thinks about the moves on a "deeper" level would generally win more against someone who doesn't.

Learning the mechanics of something indeed alters the way you perceive things. I live in a house with a computer programmer, someone who works in the film FX industry and someone who players guitars. Each of them appreciates/enjoys computer games / films / music in a subtly different way as they think about the mechanics of the art while enjoying it. Their cognitive state is different to mine during the art-appreciation process.

However, this does not mean they are enjoying it on a "deeper" level. Deeper implies some kind of objective differention between my enjoyment level and theirs (during a guitar solo, say) which there is certainly no evidence for, even on an anecdotal level. For some people, perhaps it heightens the experience, for other it denigrates it. Trying to generalise for the whole of humanity seems unhelpful and disenguous. But cling to your futile efforts to try and introduce objective standards into art if you wish.

[Radical Edward]

I agree with whatever nod said. he put alot of effort in, so it must be right.

I have a newfound appreciation for Spurges by the way. They are a member of the family Euphorbiceae, a type of plant that have lost their petals. However poinsettia (Euphorbia pulcherrima) are unusual in that they have re-evolved methods of attracting animal pollinators. Rather than use petals again though, the upper leaves have turned bright red, now playing the same function that petals would in other animal pollinated plants. now I think that is just cool, and probably bears some analogy to what nod was about.

some nice pics of poinsettia:

http://images.google.com/images?q=po...-8&sa=N&tab=wi

[Lupin]

Johan S. Bach - Luft (or Air)

you'll like it.

[mpr0733]

Mussorgski - Pictures at an exhibition.

D.O.D.

download or die.

[Deepflow]

Originally Posted by Nodrog

(reading books about Go wont make you a good player, but if you dont actively read about it as well as playing it, youll be lucky to break 20k in a year).

i broke 20k in little over a month, and i didnt need to read any more than the KGS tutorial.

admittedly i have read a tiny bit of senseis library, but hardly any, and only when i got to about 16k. I havent done any reading at all since 14k now and im at 12 atm.

note : this is not me saying 'im great', this is me trying to say that you dont need to read to improve, playing seems to work well enough.

im sorry, but i just couldnt let a mention of Go in any thread go past unanswered.