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Unread 9 May 2005, 00:49   #101
The_Fish
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Re: Validation

Also, I think any rank other than #1 would be a valid rank. Merge or not, you don't get to end a round in a high position without a lot of effort and dedication.

However, winning the round after a merge would take the shine off winning a round. It certainly wouldnt be as valid as if we'd won R12.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 00:49   #102
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Re: Validation

tbh i just came across the point that out of the top3 alliances, the only alliance i would like to see win is SINNED, which just show who are the top alliance right now
:/
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Unread 9 May 2005, 00:49   #103
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Re: Validation

We've played the exact same round that you have.

We're not in it to win anyway, I just want to attack a few people.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 00:52   #104
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kargool
Why didnt ND and SiN do more to recruit new members then?
Is this a serious question?

What relevance does recruiting have to any of this?
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:01   #105
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zh|l
To reiterate for the hard of reading/understanding - I have not been involved in any inter-alliance discussions involving 1up. In conclusion if even I can come to this summary for the reasons 'WHY' then I despair for the people who can't do this and must think with their e-penis.

Oh ofc, I just meant your deductions were correct not that you were involved in it.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:02   #106
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kargool
Why didnt ND and SiN do more to recruit new members then?
I think I can answer this... there were none to recruit. As the foremost recruiter for ND I can say that the candidates we have had this round have generally been of very poor quality, the return of some old alliances and the creation of some new ones has stretched the player base to the point where there were very few people who fell within our recruiting criteria and those that did have often been borderline. We started this round with a core of sixty members and we have added a handful more, today when we weeded out the wheat from the chaff so to speak we returned to that active core and added the active core of SiN to our members, I doubt it would be possible for any alliance to recruit 35 active dedicated members with the same spirit as the current member base in a single round and yet tonight through our merge we have found 35 members who are as active and as dedicated as our members and who share our spirit.

3rd position or 30th wouldnt matter to me, tonight I met a bunch of people that I can enjoy talking to
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:04   #107
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Re: SiNND

Alliances merging, allways funny
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:05   #108
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by Haarken
3rd position or 30th wouldnt matter to me, tonight I met a bunch of people that I can enjoy talking to
*AND* They have 14 year old female asians. My Planetarion experience is complete.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:07   #109
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Re: SiNND

The validity of victory is only defined within the context of the meta-game. If you don't break any rules to get to where you are it's a valid or deserved victory. Of course the meta-game could have crap rules, but that's a different question.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:07   #110
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Re: SiNND

So the 2 alliances victim of possibly the most undeserved witchhunt for the best part of 2 rounds do something to dick everyone off.

Good on em.

Valid tactic, Ely did it to manipulate the rankings (with FAnG members wasn't it?), quit whining and get on with it.

Sometimes people on this forum are a barrel of laughs, they really are.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:12   #111
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by lokken
So the 2 alliances victim of possibly the most undeserved witchhunt for the best part of 2 rounds do something to dick everyone off.

Good on em.

Valid tactic, Ely did it to manipulate the rankings (with FAnG members wasn't it?), quit whining and get on with it.

Sometimes people on this forum are a barrel of laughs, they really are.
Cant be said better.. unless barrow says it tho..

I dont get the beef with you all.. Its a very valid decision.. I really dunno why people is questioning it, if you were in the same position, you would have done the same, unless you got bad judgement skills..
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:14   #112
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Re: SiNND

at the end of the day, yes we're paying customers and should be allowed what we want, but so are SiN and ND - they should be allowed what they want, and if this is what they want then so be it.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:24   #113
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Re: SiNND

Well, I want a golden goose, but who's counting.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:31   #114
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by sniborp
Oh ofc, I just meant your deductions were correct not that you were involved in it.

Sorry, that post wasn't aimed at you. I was using your post to support mine.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:31   #115
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gumbie
I would like to highlight that Angels did in fact last round switch a member in the last tick to gain over 10 million points and nudge SiN out of the top 10.
The tables have turned KJ, and I'm not one to look favourably on hypocrites.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:44   #116
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Re: SiNND

My thoughts on this even though they dont matter, as do the 99% of stuff posted in this thread.

I say well done to ND and SiN, its the logical thing to do, it gives them the chance to revitalise both alliances that have been targeted heavily. Not only that but it takes the load off the MOs and Command, and gives the members a new goal.

To be honest I only see one or two people getting upset over such a thing. I would rather pa keep these two good alliances and players, rather than both being anhilated into nothing, by alliances that are afraid of going for number 1. What sin and ND both displayed this and last round is, that they are not afraid of making an impact of the game.

What I said to clogg earlier still stands now, good luck, I hope you do well, and will watch with support at your actions.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:45   #117
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Re: SiNND

By way of analogy, what do Angels (and other like minded folks) think of galaxies who exile inactives, and of planets who exile around trying to get into a good galaxy? Do they earn their ranks?
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:56   #118
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Re: SiNND

ok, the truth it, it was all Barrows fault... SiN HC bought him a shiny new computer, and promised to give him cyb0r
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Unread 9 May 2005, 01:58   #119
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Re: SiNND

Who could resist that?
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Unread 9 May 2005, 02:01   #120
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Re: SiNND

Ive thought more on it and have read more posts on the subject and have come to these conclusions.
First off I dont believe sinnd will have an abnormal increase of incoming from what they are used to due to the merge. If anything theyll be better suited to stop random attacks due to the increase of members/dc's I dont see that they will be targetted soley in the next week or so, as the rest of the top 10 are allready involved in other things. This should give sinnd a nice window to increase size fast. If they can squeeze 2 weeks of not being targetted by anything other than above normal incoming, they have a very strrong chance (with some nice attacks) to sweep away the number one spot at the end. So to answer my own question about would a sinnd win be valid, id have to say yes...tarnished, but valid
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Unread 9 May 2005, 02:10   #121
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by aNgRyDuCk
SiN HC bought him a shiny new computer
Almost true.. btw, I need a computer, anyone?

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Unread 9 May 2005, 02:11   #122
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by lokken

Valid tactic, Ely did it to manipulate the rankings (with FAnG members wasn't it?), quit whining and get on with it.
Some Fang members stayed, some went to Ely, major difference is the fang who left had to be allianceless for 3 days.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 02:15   #123
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fyodor
Some Fang members stayed, some went to Ely, major difference is the fang who left had to be allianceless for 3 days.
Didn't webangel kick every member of FAnG that round and pateam had to step in and put them all back into the alliance? Fangtastic that was.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 02:17   #124
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Re: SiNND

i think a valid tactic shouldn't involve a PA team member to manipulate the data. It should be done within the game by the players : Sin kicking players and asking ND to join (with the 72 ticks 'pants down' penalty).
Now the best answer is probably on the battlefield. Let's all the angry ally join force to put back this artificial #3 where it belongs.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 02:20   #125
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Re: SiNND

no, he pasted his login info in support i believe and then some1 logged into his account and kicked everyone. I believe he pasted his info so that he cud be closed and deleted not for that to happen. Pretty stupid either way ^_^
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Unread 9 May 2005, 02:22   #126
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
Didn't webangel kick every member of FAnG that round and pateam had to step in and put them all back into the alliance? Fangtastic that was.
http://www.clawofdarkness.com/pawiki...ng_pwns_itself \o/
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Unread 9 May 2005, 02:24   #127
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
Didn't webangel kick every member of FAnG that round and pateam had to step in and put them all back into the alliance? Fangtastic that was.

Nah, webangel posted his login info in #support or some such channel and some enterprising lad took that info, logged in, and saw that he was a HC of Fang, and started deleting members.
(i just read what I wrote and could it have been webby who did this? maybe, its a valid thought)

This caused the PA team to get involved and make all angels members again. They then stated anyone who leaves will be subject to the same 3 day rule as the rest.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 02:27   #128
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fyodor
Some Fang members stayed, some went to Ely, major difference is the fang who left had to be allianceless for 3 days.
how does the method of how it was done make it different, exactly?

alliance mergers are sanctioned by pa team, so you can't fault them for superior execution.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 02:29   #129
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Re: SiNND

FAnG members my child FAnG, not angels
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Unread 9 May 2005, 02:32   #130
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by lokken
how does the method of how it was done make it different, exactly?

alliance mergers are sanctioned by pa team, so you can't fault them for superior execution.

Im not faulting them. Given their situation, they did what they needed to do. i questioned that if they won, would it be considered valid. Which i deem as a legit question. You jumped in, pointed at Fang, and I patiently explained to you how the scenarios differed.

As to how it was done making a difference, have you been out of the game so long that you cant see the difference between being allianceless for three days or not?
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Unread 9 May 2005, 03:03   #131
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sun_Tzu
Ok, obviously anyone can see the opposition are pissed off, but I wanna know how SiN/ND's allies are feeling, especially those loosing ranks due to this or those having one more contender for the top3-ranks to beat :P

Naturally, we won't be allowed to see this side of the story though as I'm sure it's been clamped down on to uphold a showing of unity.
I knew about the merger when it was first proposed - maybe a week back. It sounded like a good idea to me and my view was that they should do it. The conditions for merging are clearly defined in the manual - there's no exception or special case being made here.

I have no problem with the fact it's cost 1up an alliance rank - why should I? If we overtake the alliances at #1 and #2 then i'm sure we'll overtake SiNND as well. And if we don't get to #1 (which looks more likely) then eactly which losing rank we get is of no concern to me.

Rank 2 at the end of the round is just the highest placed loser. Arguing over just how badly you lost because of some merger seems pointless to me.

Alliance merges aren't allowed in last 4 weeks of the round. If someone looks like finishing #1 because of a merger with 4 weeks to go, then that's 4 weeks in which the other alliances can do something about it. That's 4 weeks more than if some alliance tried to recruit their way to #1 in the last few days of the round.

1up wish SiN and ND all the best with their merger - and hope it works out well for you.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 03:10   #132
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fyodor
Im not faulting them. Given their situation, they did what they needed to do. i questioned that if they won, would it be considered valid. Which i deem as a legit question. You jumped in, pointed at Fang, and I patiently explained to you how the scenarios differed.

As to how it was done making a difference, have you been out of the game so long that you cant see the difference between being allianceless for three days or not?
I read this and thought

'stop whining then'

you've answered your own question.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 03:27   #133
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by lokken
I read this and thought

'stop whining then'

you've answered your own question.
I do understand that I am not as bright as many of the AD posters, but could you please clarify this for the less enlightened as ive not a clue what you are saying or what your point is.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 03:42   #134
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Re: SiNND

If you say you'd have done the same, you can't call foul play.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 03:53   #135
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Re: SiNND

If you can be arsed, check through my posts on this thread, i dont think ive called foul play in one of them.
Infact i think ive said numerous times that I understood why it was done. Which is why I did not understand lockens post
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Unread 9 May 2005, 04:45   #136
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Re: SiNND

I was just clarifying what lokken said, maybe he just lumps you with the other angels leaders.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 04:48   #137
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Re: SiNND

Sorry, didnt mean to sound rough with you . I realise it was locken doing the lumping.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 08:10   #138
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zh|l
You caught us. 1up orchestrated this. Our next phase is to combine with NoS and get the #2 position and then hold the top 3 and rape you all. We'll slowly be mixing/matching the memberships between us, SiNND and WP in order to get #1,#2 and #3.

But then, it doesnt really affect you. It's not like you're aiming for #1 after all.
not sure if you even read what i wrote
i was saying ND couldnt make it on their own, it had nothing to do with 1up WP or NoS
and ofc, we aint aiming for #1 we just want wanna end top50 O_o
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Unread 9 May 2005, 10:04   #139
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Re: SiNND

kk im still annoyed that were not called Ponies...
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Unread 9 May 2005, 11:06   #140
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Re: SiNND

I have no difficulty understanding the actions of ND and SiN, I do not like them much for the obvious reason that it pushed Ven down a rank, mind you. However, I wouldn't have liked it much if they'd pushed us down a rank by beating us in a war either. What they used was nothing but a valid tactic to manage a rise in rank and ensure increased activity as well as a more entertaining round. Whining will acomplish nothing, if people feel as indignated as they seem, the best way to went their anger would be to beat SiNND downwards no? Complaining about the unfairness of a completly legitimate move will get you nowhere. Perhaps the rules are flawed, but if so then the only crime ND and SiN HC have comitted is to find and exploit a weakness within the system to gain an edge, can they be blamed for that?

I'd like to point out though, that I do not agree with all of SiNND's arguments as to whether they deserve the top third position. Two mediocre alliances does not make one good. You got your new position fair and square but do not claim that your new placement is a direct result of military prowess, it has in fact very little to do with that. If you manage to keep your position or even climb further then I'll accept you have both the intelligence and the skill to deserve said position, if you are unable to then you'll have to settle with the intelligence part only
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Unread 9 May 2005, 11:10   #141
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elder
Two mediocre alliances does not make one good. You got your new position fair and square but do not claim that your new placement is a direct result of military prowess, it has in fact very little to do with that. If you manage to keep your position or even climb further then I'll accept you have both the intelligence and the skill to deserve said position, if you are unable to then you'll have to settle with the intelligence part only

Something can work better than the sum of its parts, like in football. I think last night shows we are giving as good as we got.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 11:20   #142
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Re: SiNND

Uhm i see noone has asked the obvious now that the two have merged--
will you be running defcalls as one alliance or stay as two separate allainces?
im sure we already know youll be attacking together
as you need all the help you can get.
I dont condone it but i can understand why u done it, but tbh i think its greedy hcs that have forced it upon members and in my view if u cant take 3rd place at the 1st attempt you shouldnt be awarded it at the second sitting.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 11:34   #143
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Re: SiNND

defence is shared between alliances. This way ND can whore defence off SiN a lot easier. true story.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 11:40   #144
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Re: SiNND

Our members were 100% behind us when they knew they wouldnt get kicked out for watching too much porn.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 11:43   #145
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rinoa
but tbh i think its greedy hcs that have forced it upon members
I can't think of one SiN member who was against it.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 12:00   #146
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Re: SiNND

I want to congratulate both ND and SiN leaders for their tactical, wise and within the rules decision. You boys and girls really think of your own members' welfare instead of these twisted whiners.

Not to mention effective, as they are so far the alliance that gains most roids for the attacks today. A few more score and you'll be in 2nd place
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Unread 9 May 2005, 12:03   #147
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Re: SiNND

[Off-topic]


Quote:
Originally Posted by _ryzekiel_
Funny how angels keep being mentioned alongside Exil and ToT, almost as if they're close allies.
Unless you were asleep yesterday evening, you might have noticed Angels attacking planets that were attacking a certain Exilition top planet at the time. Given these "coincidences", we can fairly well assume who gave Angels those targets. Further assuming, if it was so, giving and accepting targets sounds like coordinating attacks and cooperating with retaliations to me.

If these assumptions hold, it looked, at least to me, like a step into the war on Exilition's side more as an ally than not.


[/Off-topic]
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Unread 9 May 2005, 12:13   #148
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Re: Validation

Quote:
Originally Posted by _ryzekiel_
What happened to the other weeks of the round? Where do you think their already-possessed score came from? Magically absorbed from thin air? All that happened was a clearing of inactives and merging into a more functional alliance, Rock and VGN did it a few rounds ago, same with MISTU and Phraktos, etc.
Minor correction: VGN and ROCK decided BEFORE the round to cooperate for that round, and our combined memberbase was LESS than 100, so we didn´t have to kick people to fit in the ingame alliance.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 12:27   #149
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Re: SiNND

Tbh. those that were kicked, were going to be kicked regardless of the merger due to inactivity etc.
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Unread 9 May 2005, 12:33   #150
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Re: SiNND

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tietäjä
[Off-topic]




Unless you were asleep yesterday evening, you might have noticed Angels attacking planets that were attacking a certain Exilition top planet at the time. Given these "coincidences", we can fairly well assume who gave Angels those targets. Further assuming, if it was so, giving and accepting targets sounds like coordinating attacks and cooperating with retaliations to me.

If these assumptions hold, it looked, at least to me, like a step into the war on Exilition's side more as an ally than not.


[/Off-topic]
Hush, Angels are going completely solo remember? :eek:
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