An interesting opinion

[JonnyBGood]

People are not in fact becoming less religious or solely concerned with the quotidian, they are becoming more philosophical and have a far greater interest in areas of belief and morality. The only thing is, we're rejecting the theistic answer.










PS Can't claim originality for this, it's an opinion I've heard expressed in quite a few places recently.

[Radical Edward]

or in other words, they are just making up bo||ocks.

[Dante Hicks]

Which people?

In Europe (or perhaps, some parts of Europe) religion seems to be in a terminal decline in the "native" white population. In the educated elites in other parts of the world (e.g. Southern Africa, Latin America) you might be able to say the same.

But in the United States, Israel or the majority of the world - can we say the same?

And I'm not sure as to the reason. Perhaps there is an increased level of philosophy, perhaps there's been an increase in psuedo-spiritual crap (if I meet one more person who mentions healing crystals...)

where's the interesting opinion i was promised???

[JonnyBGood]

Originally posted by Radical Edward
or in other words, they are just making up bo||ocks.

Actually they're refusing to accept second-hand opinions passed down across many years as absolute truth. Depends on one's perspective does it not? (Hohohoho subjectivism etc)








PS I'm off to study now for a few hours, so don't expect that many replies




PPS Unfortunately Dante it was not my opinion. I judged it against the people I know best and found it to be quite valid. It seems I cannot make huge generalisations based on what I read in newspapers and must resort to actual human contact.

[sigrid]

Originally posted by Radical Edward
or in other words, they are just making up bo||ocks.

i think since we can explain so much more things in a scientific way nowadays ppl dont feel the need anymore to believe in something that could explain all...
I always felt believing in God is some form of seeking security for ones insecurities...anything thats unexplainable would just be God's will. Since in this society most things are more or less known and otherwise explainable, the need to believe in a stronger power is gone, as we humans are the stronger power.


excuse the crappy english at some points:P

[ChubbyChecker]

Originally posted by JonnyBGood
People are not in fact becoming less religious or solely concerned with the quotidian, they are becoming more philosophical and have a far greater interest in areas of belief and morality. The only thing is, we're rejecting the theistic answer.

I agree. I don't really see how you can disagree.

[Radical Edward]

Originally posted by JonnyBGood
Actually they're refusing to accept second-hand opinions passed down across many years as absolute truth. Depends on one's perspective does it not? (Hohohoho subjectivism etc)

indeed, but this doesn't detract from my point. people saying "I believe there is a God/Spirits etc but I don't know what it is/they are like" are just as bad as those who claim to know God... no more, no less philosophical.

As for people's so called philosophy, it is no more deep than conventional religious thinkers; while searching for a reason for existance should they should not ask "why are we here?" but "why should there be an answer to the question why are we here?"

[Dante Hicks]

Originally posted by sigrid
I always felt believing in God is some form of seeking security for ones insecurities...

A quote I never get tired of repeating from Mr Freud....

"To believe in god is a regression to an almost childlike state whereupon man projects upon nature a comforting father figure."

[inf]

It's part of secular reform.

[Radical Edward]

Originally posted by sigrid
i think since we can explain so much more things in a scientific way nowadays ppl dont feel the need anymore to believe in something that could explain all...

perhaps, but many people still believe in something spiritual, whether identifiable or not. there is no difference between them and people who accomodate conventional religious thought

[JonnyBGood]

Originally posted by Radical Edward
indeed, but this doesn't detract from my point. people saying "I believe there is a God/Spirits etc but I don't know what it is/they are like" are just as bad as those who claim to know God... no more, no less philosophical.

As for people's so called philosophy, it is no more deep than conventional religious thinkers; while searching for a reason for existance should they should not ask "why are we here?" but "why should there be an answer to the question why are we here?"

I'm unsure how you were able to evaluate people's philosophy to be quite honest. Also how about "why search for answers at all?" Now there's a question in grave danger of refuting itself.

I suppose I'll just speak for myself, I believe in me, I don't find belief in god relevant, I use what I can and do what I should, I judge myself by the only standards that matter, mine, and I don't follow other people's ideas of what I'm supposed to do with my life. I don't need religion. I don't need god. I don't need you. I don't need anyone else. I'm happy being an individual. Everything else is just a benefit. I find answers to the questions that are vital and I find questions for the answers that aren't truthful. I search for meaning as it affects me, and pointless questions I attempt to ignore. I'm far from perfect and I always will be. However I'm me and that's better than everything else in the universe.





Ta and I'm outta here.

[Radical Edward]

Originally posted by JonnyBGood
"why search for answers at all?"

that is a totally different question though, and often has an answer that is fairly plain. my whole point is that people are no more philosophical than they used to be, just because the deity that they believe in is not second hand.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally posted by Radical Edward
that is a totally different question though, and often has an answer that is fairly plain. my whole point is that people are no more philosophical than they used to be, just because the deity that they believe in is not second hand.

I was merely saying that an increasing number of people nowadays are willing to think for themselves instead of accepting the opinions of others. It's still a small number I must agree, but it is an encouraging sign.

[Radical Edward]

Originally posted by JonnyBGood
I was merely saying that an increasing number of people nowadays are willing to think for themselves instead of accepting the opinions of others. It's still a small number I must agree, but it is an encouraging sign.

I disagree that most are even thinking for themselves to be honest, as I have pointed out.

[Nodrog]

90% of people think that people are sheep.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally posted by Radical Edward
I disagree that most are even thinking for themselves to be honest, as I have pointed out.

Same. I just think the number that are thinking for themselves has increased. It's far from a majority though.

[Radical Edward]

Originally posted by Nodrog
90% of people think that people are sheep.

profound.

[pablissimo]

Originally posted by Nodrog
90% of people think that people are sheep.

90% of me is telling me to call you a sheep.

The other 10% knows you already know this.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally posted by Nodrog
90% of scottish people prefer sheep

90% of sheep are genetically afraid of nodrog.








PS 90% of sheep think that people are sheep.

[Snurx]

Originally posted by JonnyBGood
I was merely saying that an increasing number of people nowadays are willing to think for themselves instead of accepting the opinions of others. It's still a small number I must agree, but it is an encouraging sign.

No, they are not. This new gibberish is still just that, gibberish that somebody "invented". I know a lot of these types, and its the same theme around it all. There are sligth variations, but hey, that goes for every religion/thinking out there.
Of course, there are exeptions, but don't go clapping "huzza" just yet. Most people = still mindless drones.

[Nodrog]

80% of people are smarter than average.

Hay Radical Edward, dont you think that the increased amount of free-time that people (theoretically) have these days, added to the comparative ease of which basic desires (food/water/shelter) etc are satisfied, and the widespread availability of books due to the printing press and mass production and stuff would lead to a more intelligent/philosophical populace than a few centuries ago?

Although we have television to stop us getting too big ideas

[JonnyBGood]

Originally posted by Snurx
Most people = still mindless drones.

Once again, that is not my point. My point is that the numbers have risen (based solely on my own perceptions of course).

[Snurx]

Originally posted by JonnyBGood
Once again, that is not my point. My point is that the numbers have risen (based solely on my own perceptions of course).

Hmm, youre talkig about all this new-age crap? Beacause, i can tell you from personal experience, those people DO not think themselfs.
Generaly, people that can be classified as a big group does not think themself's. (Oh, btw, i love to generalise)

But then, do I think myself?
Do you?
Or are we all just the stereotypes that society has created for us?

[JonnyBGood]

Originally posted by Nodrog
80% of people are smarter than average.

Hay Radical Edward, dont you think that the increased amount of free-time that people (theoretically) have these days, added to the comparative ease of which basic desires (food/water/shelter) etc are satisfied, and the widespread availability of books due to the printing press and mass production and stuff would lead to a more intelligent/philosophical populace than a few centuries ago?

Perhaps it'd just lead to a more impressionable population. If the same people who provided you with the essentials and guaranteed your life told you something that was utterly false I'd wonder whether you'd instantly go out and attempt to ascertain actual truth. Most people would simply mould their worlds around the new ideas rather than disrupt their ease.



PS Aware I'm arguing against myself, just wanted to hear your opinion on this.

[JonnyBGood]

Originally posted by Snurx
Hmm, youre talkig about all this new-age crap? Beacause, i can tell you from personal experience, those people DO not think themselfs.
Generaly, people that can be classified as a big group does not think themself's. (Oh, btw, i love to generalise)

But then, do I think myself?
Do you?
Or are we all just the stereotypes that society has created for us?

I wasn't talking about that whole new age thing. I was talking about the people I know who often offer creative and different opinions and perspectives on scenarios humanity always seems to get bogged down in. To me this is an encouraging sign. I think myself and on my own. Various people can offer opinions and so on and so forth, however in the end I am the one who thinks for me. (If somebody mentions thinking being the activity and I merely being the condition I'm actually going to ban you using JJ's password).

[Radical Edward]

Originally posted by Nodrog
Although we have television to stop us getting too big ideas

you added this one in after. funny isn't it, how people have all this free time and books and decent food and stuff, and they all still do the same things as their friends without engaging their tiny little heads.