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Unread 15 Jun 2003, 02:55   #1
nickhall
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Rnd 10 and single players (and why Pa will now die)

Round ten is going to suck.

Sorry i love this game and most of the ppl i have met through it, for me i think round ten will be my last round, and that only because i payed already, no this is not a quit thread i will never have the need to to one of those not enough ppl know me.

The reason for this is the changes in alliance structure, i have never been a fan of large alliances and never will be, i thought round ten was going to change the way alliances work but todays announcment destroys any hope i had in this. Basicaly now allys get a TT advantage for defence this will close groups tighter together and stop anyone geting at them, the dynamic TT will not help this as cluster and para allys (or equivelant) will be void due to alliances being able to defend as soon if not sooner.

I play this game on my own as a single un allied player and i do not do too badly usually (score atm is just under 2mill not massive but nor small) i relly on my friends to defend me who are all in a range of alliances from top ranking allies to very small allies, i also will always defend any of these friends irrelivent of which ally is attacking them. This is why i play Pa to play with these friends, now i could never have all these friends in one ally or even a majoryty of them in one due to compleatly differant sides and also some with HC and officer possitions in alliances which they couldnot/wouldnot leave and who could blame them, they have friends there. This is not a i couldnot get into a good enough alliance thread because i could. I prefer to play as a single player it meens i can help who i like out and not get told what to do where to attack who to defend and who not to defend, i couldnot play the game like that.

My problem is that round ten will stop me playing in this way, if my friends are spread accross the uni then there is no way i will be able to defend them or they defend me.

Spinner this will be the death of Pa i had very high hopes for round ten i hoped it would save a game and a comunity i love but i now belive that this is the end or at least for me and many others who hate alliances.

I thought rnd 10 was going to be full of newbs lmfao no chane this will bring the alliances more power ruin attacks* bring stagnation and screw Pa once and for all. How do you sejest newbs get into these alliances (most of which could fill 150 places easy so no more recruiting) any planet without an alliance will be crushed by those planets around it due to lack of targets (see attacks*).

*ATTACKS How do you sejest people attack spiner? alliances arnt going to beable to attack other alliance members as there alliance m8's will be there with a reduced TT to help them, co-ordinated attacks will be dificult with random varied TT's so defence will be more abundant than rnd 8 and attacks rarer (stagnation once more) so any unallied planet or newb will have constant inc's and will quit or not bother playing after about a week.

Round ten is going to suck! Jolt when ppl said you had bought a dead project i didnt belive it, Pa could be so much but this will kill it for anyone who belives it aint already dead.

Please excuse any spelling mistakes.

Flame away and generaly ignore me!

(when final details are out i may have a round ten account to give away as if it gets any worse - building destroyable, something spiner and co said they hated the idea of and would never introduce, alliance stuff from above etc etc - one more thing and its going to be for offer on here)
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Unread 15 Jun 2003, 03:27   #2
ComradeRob
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It has to be said that allianceless players are probably going to be screwed in r10.

Also, getting friends to sign up will be difficult - "sign up for PA, it's quite hard for newbies but I can defend you if you're under attack" simply won't work any more, as there's a good chance that, after paying their $10, the newbie will end up on the opposite side of the universe to his friend.

It beggars belief that the creators/PA team don't think of these things

One of the great things about r9.5 is all of the old players returning and new players arriving. Most of them don't have alliances, and rely on their friends (often people in big alliances) to defend them. In r10 this simply wouldn't be possible. New players might be able to find allies in their 'local' area, but without even the concept of a cluster/parallel alliance, it will be much harder for the new players to make contacts outside of their galaxy, and past experience (r8) says that a good number of random galaxies will suck, leaving new players pretty much completely alone.
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Unread 15 Jun 2003, 03:32   #3
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Quote:
Originally posted by ComradeRob
It beggars belief that nobody thinks of these things
u sure

Anyway yes so spinner read and take note please!!!!!!!!
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Unread 15 Jun 2003, 03:34   #4
ComradeRob
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Quote:
Originally posted by nickhall
u sure
I meant 'nobody in PA team' (editing now to fix it...)
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“They were totally confused,” said the birdman, whose flying suit gives him a passing resemblance to Buzz Lightyear in Toy Story. “The authorities said that I was an unregistered aircraft and to fly, you need a licence. I told them, ‘No. To fly, you need wings’.”
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Unread 15 Jun 2003, 14:32   #5
Heartless
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First, Planetarion is a MULTIPLAYER-Game. Not a Soloplayer one.

Second, there is nothing definate about alliances/battlegroups/traveltime yet.
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Unread 15 Jun 2003, 15:21   #6
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Quote:
Originally posted by Heartless
First, Planetarion is a MULTIPLAYER-Game. Not a Soloplayer one.

Second, there is nothing definate about alliances/battlegroups/traveltime yet.
True Heartless BUT pa also needs fresh blood and the way Spinner explained the ally system new players wont stand a chance unless their lucky enough to find an alliance.

Personal I think it sounds challenging and fun but its not very newbie friendly...
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Unread 15 Jun 2003, 16:04   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by Heartless
First, Planetarion is a MULTIPLAYER-Game. Not a Soloplayer one.

Second, there is nothing definate about alliances/battlegroups/traveltime yet.
Wasnt that what spinner announced ?
Or was this a pacrew reply that Spinner infact announced a big pile of bolloxs while nothing such has ever been decided or coded yet ?
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Unread 15 Jun 2003, 16:34   #8
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I'm with holding my judgement until its finished. The free pre-view type round will be quite revealing. Regardless, I will probably continue to play if only so I can mock my friend Waidy when he loses his entire fleet attacking a 200k newbie .
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Unread 16 Jun 2003, 13:45   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by Razorback
Wasnt that what spinner announced ?
Or was this a pacrew reply that Spinner infact announced a big pile of bolloxs while nothing such has ever been decided or coded yet ?
It was me missing the next "leak" on r10 (:
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Unread 16 Jun 2003, 15:23   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by ComradeRob
It has to be said that allianceless players are probably going to be screwed in r10.
What's the difference between now and R10 then I wonder?
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Unread 16 Jun 2003, 15:44   #11
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What's the difference between now and R10 then I wonder?
Scale.
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Unread 16 Jun 2003, 15:44   #12
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Now you can get defence from your friends (unless you have a xan attacking), in round 10 they will be too late.
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Unread 17 Jun 2003, 00:45   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by Heartless
First, Planetarion is a MULTIPLAYER-Game. Not a Soloplayer one.

Second, there is nothing definate about alliances/battlegroups/traveltime yet.

Erm yes it is a MULTIPLAYER game and i donot play alone, read te origanl post, my point was i play ALLIANCELESS with my friends who will not be as able to help me next round.
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Unread 18 Jun 2003, 18:19   #14
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PA should have died 5 rounds ago. These 'next round is gonna suck' threads get so boring over the years.

btw lo Rob
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Unread 20 Jun 2003, 01:04   #15
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I also think that PA finally die (the real PA is already dead since 3 or 4 round, R9.5 not counted). nothing else then the allys and ally communitys hold the game alive. Im pretty sure 2/3 of all players still play this game not because its a big fun, they play because they love their ally/community (eg. hirr, ToT, RaH, LDK - anywhere in such allys are the core a couple of friends who know each other RL - mostly - play together since rounds etc.; same with a lot BGs like Dragons, GoldenCircle,...).
now the creators try to "install" more roundbased, game-intern
ally. this means the end of the current allys, some will stay together because they are also strong communitys but if I understood the ally-changes right in the announcement, they havnt really a chances to play successfully.
most allys have to quit PA then or have to splitt.
and Im also pretty sure that a lot of players will quit PA then when they cant play for their ally they love anymore.
I just ask me why the creators never can do this what the players (or the so called "PA-community") want.
the people dont want a multiple war simulation with a lot of stategy options, they want to have a simple wargame and a lot of fun. thats why the people Planetarion once loved.
80% of all people I knew in PA, say that Round4 was the best round they ever played. I started R4 to play PA. I was a total noob. I went random and landed in a gal anywhere in p25, I had regulary 2E5 incs, but also as noob I had a chance to fight against the big guys (eg. through the para allys, I went in the public para channel, asked for defence, and got covered - also through the old salvage rule there). never again noobs had such a great chance to come into this game. you change a lot of game rules to support the big guys and then you wonder why people start to organise more and more, play hardcore, form powerblocks etc. ?
I know powerblock discussions, you can blame us for destroying the game but we werent it who changed the game rules in a way so that you can only win by playing hardcore.
or can you tell me eg how a noob still have a chance to survive in the current universe without an ally? he cant survive if he dont have an ally where is a well organised defence. and thats not the fault of the evil allys which powerblocked...
its a simple result of changing game rules.
and now you want to go "back in time" and get the old roundbased allys back ( like the para-allys R4) by destroying/splitting the last allys which hold the game alive?
are you really trying to ruin your own game?
at the moment it looks so for me.
I hope that Im wrong, but I dont think so.
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Unread 20 Jun 2003, 01:19   #16
Heartless
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Oh Bomber ...

WHAT do you really want? On the one hand you say we kill the hardcore players with their hardcore alliances, on the other you say we give newbies no chance to survive.

That does not just sound paradox, it is paradox. Following your opinion Round X will not be a game.

On the one hand, it cannot be death of alliances: According to the leaks on portal they have a very powerful advantage: ETA reduction for defense to alliance members. And 150 people in a 5k universe still is a lot of potential (3% of the total universe size).

On the other hand, newbies DO have a chance. They just have to face the fact that PA is a multiplayer game as I stated somewhere else and they have to get in touch with other players in order to gain success. Moreover wait for some of the upcoming leaks which will for sure show you that they have other chances to survive, too.

I would not judge that extreme on a game which has not been released yet, not even a public beta.
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Unread 20 Jun 2003, 01:28   #17
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Hearty, if you would read my post a bit more carefully, you would notice that I said, first the noobs were killed out of the game and only the hardcore players/allys survived. and now you kill this allys who hold the game alive.
that are 2 steps...
and do you really think the people who still play (and not quit after the changes) stop playing hardcore and stop blocking?
on this point you will tell me now that blocking doesnt make sense, and I tell you it makes sense if its good organised and it will happen. you just make a block of 4 allys, devid them by coords in 4 groups so that you have the best eta for defence and you have a nice 600 planet block again. do you really think thats a big problem? if allys want to block and are good leaded, they also find ways to do it.
so that noobs also wont have a chance in R10 I think and a lot of old players quit.
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Unread 20 Jun 2003, 01:32   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by Sonnenbomber
Hearty, if you would read my post a bit more carefully, you would notice that I said, first the noobs were killed out of the game and only the hardcore players/allys survived. and now you kill this allys who hold the game alive.
that are 2 steps...
and do you really think the people who still play (and not quit after the changes) stop playing hardcore and stop blocking?
on this point you will tell me now that blocking doesnt make sense, and I tell you it makes sense if its good organised and it will happen. you just make a block of 4 allys, devid them by coords in 4 groups so that you have the best eta for defence and you have a nice 600 planet block again. do you really think thats a big problem? if allys want to block and are good leaded, they also find ways to do it.
so that noobs also wont have a chance in R10 I think and a lot of old players quit.
"Wer lesen kann ist klar im Vorteil" [Sorry, but Bomber will understand this *g*]

I did read your post carefully, maybe you should read mine more carefully.
I never said there won't be any blocks ever again.
I neither disagreed on the fact that first new players had it harder to survive in pa (though the blocks did their best to help keeping them away from the game in the way of not recruiting them / roiding them down).

Neither did I say that we are killing the hardcore players / alliances. Instead I stated current top alliances will still exist in Round X.
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Unread 20 Jun 2003, 01:36   #19
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If current Alliances die and Hardcore players will leave the game (which i hope not cause i still can have "feelings" for communities and friends even without playing a game together)
the game needs to attract new players and it can become a new Game. It will...in fact be a new game just still having the name "Planetarion".

If all this will happen i can just hope Creators and(or Jolt do alot of Advertising to attract new players to have a bigger PA community again.

I wouldnt either judge a game before it started (still i dont know too much about it)

I´ll just sit back an wait
I´m looking forward for a fun round again...we´ll see.

Teas

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Unread 23 Jun 2003, 15:59   #20
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to me it seems spinner is trying to make alliances more localised, whether this will be of benefit to n00bies and less hardcore players is another matter.

And how well existing alliances will fare is almost unknown.
It is certain that the hardcore players will move to wherever the most beneficial position is. if this is the localised alliances then I can envision that we will be returning to a universe not unlike that in round 1 where the dominant alliances were often clusters like c8a and 17th legion. The difference this time being there wont be the advantage of alliances continuing in subsequent rounds.

I fear tho, that ppl know who is good and who is not, and that localised alliances will still become somewhat elitist. So n00bs and less hardcore players will still be more at risk from their local area and less from the universe as a whole.

Imagine the universe as it exists now, without all the hardcore alliances but with much more aggressive/organised p or c alliances.

hmm dont sound so fun.
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Unread 23 Jun 2003, 16:26   #21
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Let's just take everything in Spinner's post as absolute fact and a precise representation of the way things are going to be for a second:

First, it seems that pretty much everyone's forgotten about cluster alliances and are focussing on previous 'big-players' from past rounds. Now, I don't know how the universe will be spread next round, but even if clusters and paras no longer existed, this new system still helps because it gives an advantage to local groups of players when combined with the dynamic travel time.

Second, these smaller, localised alliances are going to need all the members they can get because of their compact nature. It won't be a case of relying on having a handful of huge players dominating an alliance because if they're not strategically placed throughout the universe it won't mean **** for defence and organised attack.

Obviously in my opinion only, this is the first 'not crap' idea Spinner's had in a long, long time. Newbies will be welcomed into small, localised alliances because of a demand for strategic placement of planets for use with defence and attack, and huge alliances become logistically unlikely.

And if there's going to be lots of little skirmishes and wars between rival local 'factions', new players are of course going to be welcomed into one side or another creating a new, less overbearing game dynamic.
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Unread 23 Jun 2003, 20:15   #22
Spinner
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Allthough I can understand it is easy to think that Planetarion X will cater for the Alliances, it will not. On the counterary in fact, it will be much more up to the individual player than it has ever been before. However, certain underlying facts of PAX will not be fully explained or understood until you get there.

If we have given alliances an "advantage" in traveltime, dont forget that we have done a lot more to protect smaller planet, to allow quicker rebuilding, to allow more skill and tactics come in, to get away from the sheer number thing.

An allianceless player will have a LOT bigger chance in round 10 compared to any round before, belive it or not.
Just wait and see.
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Unread 23 Jun 2003, 21:38   #23
Gunn3r-_-
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Quote:
Originally posted by Spinner
Allthough I can understand it is easy to think that Planetarion X will cater for the Alliances, it will not. On the counterary in fact, it will be much more up to the individual player than it has ever been before. However, certain underlying facts of PAX will not be fully explained or understood until you get there.

If we have given alliances an "advantage" in traveltime, dont forget that we have done a lot more to protect smaller planet, to allow quicker rebuilding, to allow more skill and tactics come in, to get away from the sheer number thing.

An allianceless player will have a LOT bigger chance in round 10 compared to any round before, belive it or not.
Just wait and see.
no one but possibly headless ignorants chicken would believe what you have to say.

Do I need to make a list of what you've once said - and never happened?
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Unread 24 Jun 2003, 04:42   #24
Common Tater
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Round 10 sounds fun already as an alianceless player after my planet has been hit i would be able to replace my stolen roids and ships in seemingly short order. who can complain on that?
uhoh hang on a sec i smell farm *sniff sniff* shoot forgot on why its so good to be the small guy as we get to keep the roid quota up for the bigger players who are mostly alliance members.

Well i have heard of some saboteur stuff that may be available next round? not sure just came back on to see the latest in PA... Hopefully my spies etc. can blow up a few ships or PDS.. not like they don't have the income to replace them lol. Sure i could evenly possibly kill off research and construction stuffs(?) well that player already has a nice sized fleet anyhows.

So all in all if you were not in an alliance best case scenario your looking at being a fast food stop on the intergalactic freeway

worst case..they'll be waiting for you again in r11 lol
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Unread 24 Jun 2003, 06:42   #25
Monkehpimp
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all I know is that me and others I know are only playing this round cos its free. Screw round 10.
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