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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 16:11   #51
Storebo
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Re: FAnG situation

Normaly HC shouldn't step down because of cheating. But considering all the heat they gave Elysium for Walken, I think it is the right thing to do. They throwed the first stone and now the mob turned against them aswell :P

With that said.. Leff is/was one of the HC's in FAnG i liked the best, and I like honourable endings in films. Might be why I respect this decision so much =)
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 16:13   #52
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Re: FAnG situation

Also.. back to dragons... if not dragons hc wanna make such a thread.. can't atleast the cheating dragons hc make one?
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 16:37   #53
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted by [DDK]gm

This few people may have destroyed fangs chances of winning if they are deleted and have wasted all the hard work the honest gamers have put so much into the alliance.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

They are not only destroying the chances of their alliance but are also destroying the round for their gal m8s.
So there is more to it then just alliance ranking.

And LEFF if I may say, A very honorable thing you did.
Not many HCs would do what you announced in first post.

(edited to fix typos)
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 16:54   #54
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by WebAngel
I dont know much about the reason why they have been closed but I have been told its for account sharing. If it's true then its laughable, one doesn't need to account share when online all the time
So how much did you fork out to pay for those LDK planets? And is the embarrassment causing you to miss the 2 gaping flaws in your logic there?
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 17:01   #55
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rumad
I like how you try and manipulate this. Walken was deleted for taking advantage of a bug and thats as bad as cheating. Leff has resigned for some members cheating. At least he didn't defend those that digressed.

Anyway A HC's job imo is to help and be seen to keep an alliance together through good and abd, and quitting isn't always the right decision.

No one person can be accountable for anothers actions as such I find this all very extreme and ironic.

Leff you should reconsider for those that have supported you so far and remember that you can only do your best (for good and for bad).

Anyone else getting bitchy should remember each of there alliances has cheats even if they haven't been caught.

Oh well home time now - see you all afte rthe weekend
Ofcourse.. silly me should be more like the honourable fang/dragons hc's in that log who where only thinking about the game and the community and not their greedy little selfs.
Also Walken thingy was a bug, and it was not clear what would happen to him. And whole of Elysium was practically accused for this bug. Sertain Fang/dragons hc's where specially happy to put the blame on the whole alliance. dragons who've lost more hc's for cheating this round then any alliance through all their rounds

And I meant what I said.. It is a honourable way for leff to go. And this way FAnG hc got to make the thread, and not their enemies. And by sacreficing himself he takes away some of the focus on the cheaters in his ally. And also it seems a bit like the ally allready got their punishment. It is a noble act of him, and it deserves respect.
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 17:01   #56
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Remy
15 fang closed now (not including some reopened)

This is getting silly...
I know about 4 of them, it seems that ToT knows more than me about FAnG... propaganda?
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 17:05   #57
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by xtothez
So how much did you fork out to pay for those LDK planets? And is the embarrassment causing you to miss the 2 gaping flaws in your logic there?
What will you do if they are unlocked?
Pay me back for their accounts?
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 17:10   #58
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by WebAngel
What will you do if they are unlocked?
Pay me back for their accounts?
No, only one of us is stupid enough to give money to LDK :o)
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 18:49   #59
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomkat
So let me get this straight (sorry if I am a little confused)...

You found out some of your inactive members were cheating, but had absolutely no knowledge of this beforehand. Because of this, even though you knew noting about it, and none of it is your responsibility, you are stepping down.

This all just seems a little strange to me. Sure there aren't some other ulterior motives, and this is just a little PR stunt to try to say FAnG cheating is a very unusual thing?
I guess LEFF has to shoot himself first before pple like you quit acting like a fool with silly remarks etc. Yes, LEFF FEELS miserable and it's ALL part of a FAnG PR stunt ...

get real

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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 18:51   #60
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by [DDK]gm
It is the honourable thing, when as HC you find your officers are closed I am sure you would feel that you should step down, an alliance's command should lead by example and not be even suspected of cheeting.

Leff must feel that he cant continue as HC when the people he has entrusted to help run his alliance are closed.

This few people may have destroyed fangs chances of winning if they are deleted and have wasted all the hard work the honest gamers have put so much into the alliance.
is it? I mean does this mean I'm not honourable cause I didn't decide to resign cause of some cheaters we had no controle in?
I don't think resigning is the good solution but it's his choice and I'll respect that. Becides, PA is a dying game in FAnG and we're probably not gonna waste too much efforts on it nway.

rgds Kj
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 19:01   #61
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Re: FAnG situation

I got a question to all the hypocrits who posted in this thread so far. It seems most of you are happy that there are cheaters. Not only do you love laughing with the enemy, but you also wish we have more cheaters so more could get closed.

All this is you fair right, tells us enough about you but that's not related to the game nway.

BUT, what strikes me the most is that pple here wanna make sure PA is free of cheaters, that they want a game without cheaters or bug abusers. YET, they wish the enemies are cheaters ...

I call that being hypocrit. The pple this was meant to know who they are (lo Storebo).

pld to those who yet again managed to act like selfish whining trolling idiots, even in a thread like this ...

rgds Kj
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 19:04   #62
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kjeldoran
is it? I mean does this mean I'm not honourable cause I didn't decide to resign cause of some cheaters we had no controle in?
I don't think resigning is the good solution but it's his choice and I'll respect that. Becides, PA is a dying game in FAnG and we're probably not gonna waste too much efforts on it nway.

rgds Kj
Honour just means different things to sertain people. And some accept more responsibility then others even tho they didn't have direct control over it.
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 19:10   #63
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Re: FAnG situation

Sorry to hear LEFF.

Kjeldoran: Do you always have to open your mouth on every matter? You are becoming the joke of AD this round.
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 19:17   #64
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Storebo
Honour just means different things to sertain people. And some accept more responsibility then others even tho they didn't have direct control over it.
there's no logic in that statement. IF you think LEFF deserves to take the hit, then I'm waiting till Stress or any other Ely HC resignes for the same reason (with Warden). HC's should not resign cause OTHER pple cheated.

And Guran, this post is about FAnG, what do you expect? LEFF is my best IRC m8, nobody I trust or like more so I guess you made a VERY valid point Guran ...

rgds Kj
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 19:22   #65
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Re: FAnG situation

and some just try to conceal everything.

Honour was what fang once had back in the good old days of r7.

Every alliance has cheeters but it is disgusting when it its officers, I dont beleave in winning at all costs if that meens destroying the good name of an alliance.
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 19:25   #66
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kjeldoran
IF you think LEFF deserves to take the hit,
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Leff isnt taking the hit he obviously feels he cant continue to be HC of an alliance he had worked so hard for and loved when his officers have destroyed that work and soiled the name of FAnG.
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 19:33   #67
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kjeldoran
there's no logic in that statement. IF you think LEFF deserves to take the hit, then I'm waiting till Stress or any other Ely HC resignes for the same reason (with Warden). HC's should not resign cause OTHER pple cheated.

And Guran, this post is about FAnG, what do you expect? LEFF is my best IRC m8, nobody I trust or like more so I guess you made a VERY valid point Guran ...

rgds Kj
You continue to misunderstand people =)

Didn't say he should quit, but it is a very honourable thing to do. It might put rest of FAnG in a bad light tho, but right now it have helped against all the flaming that normaly would have happened. So a sacrefice for his alliance maybe... a noble one =)
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 19:42   #68
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by [DDK]gm
Leff isnt taking the hit he obviously feels he cant continue to be HC of an alliance he had worked so hard for and loved when his officers have destroyed that work and soiled the name of FAnG.
I'm as disguested as LEFF is about all this m8. And like it or not, but I've spent this entire round rebuilding FAnG and whether that got appreciated by some or didn't doesn't matter here.
I'm in exactly the same situation as LEFF here, but I will not resign to dissappoint the FAIR players even more .
Imo I don't think he should have resigned. An apology FROM FAnG would have been enough, cause even when Eclipse and Ely prayed for the day that FAnG had cheaters (lo to a few hypocrits), FAnG feels ashamed that we have pple that spoiled it yet again. I think some alliances should take an example to this.

Pple should stop blaming FAnG etc, since we're the ONLY alliance that openly apologized AND did NOT support cheaters so far this round. Yet we get treated like a bunch of cheaters. Sometimes I ask what is worse, being a cheater (and have human values) or being a hypocrit ...

btw gm, that last bit was NOT meant for you, just so we don't have a conflict over a missunderstanding.

rgds Kj
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 19:56   #69
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by [DDK]gm
Leff isnt taking the hit he obviously feels he cant continue to be HC of an alliance he had worked so hard for and loved when his officers have destroyed that work and soiled the name of FAnG.

you were officer, weren't you?
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 20:00   #70
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Re: FAnG situation

ofc some will if their alliance was blamed by fang in the past but I know that as an alliance FAnG never condoned cheating, just don’t expect people to say its not FAnGs fault if FAnG in the past had used a similar case as propaganda.

If FAnG is honest enough to tell the world about what has happened and name and shame those responsible then the alliance will not be blamed by good and fair people.
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 20:02   #71
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kjeldoran
Pple should stop blaming FAnG etc, since we're the ONLY alliance that openly apologized AND did NOT support cheaters so far this round.
What's it called for a fang hc to pay a bg full of accounts for known ldk cheaters (didn't these same people get closed even in ******** recently)?
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 20:03   #72
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Re: FAnG situation

yes I was scorpio, but I left for reasons that is not appropriate for this thread and I dont want to drag the subject up again.
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 20:29   #73
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by rnd|One
What's it called for a fang hc to pay a bg full of accounts for known ldk cheaters (didn't these same people get closed even in ******** recently)?
So, just cause Webby payed alot of our accounts it means we're guilty of supporting cheating?

get a clue
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 21:01   #74
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kjeldoran
I got a question to all the hypocrits who posted in this thread so far. It seems most of you are happy that there are cheaters. Not only do you love laughing with the enemy, but you also wish we have more cheaters so more could get closed.

All this is you fair right, tells us enough about you but that's not related to the game nway.

BUT, what strikes me the most is that pple here wanna make sure PA is free of cheaters, that they want a game without cheaters or bug abusers. YET, they wish the enemies are cheaters ...

I call that being hypocrit. The pple this was meant to know who they are (lo Storebo).

pld to those who yet again managed to act like selfish whining trolling idiots, even in a thread like this ...

rgds Kj
Did you even read my post KJ ??

Quote:
They are not only destroying the chances of their alliance but are also destroying the round for their gal m8s.
So there is more to it then just alliance ranking.

And LEFF if I may say, A very honorable thing you did.
Not many HCs would do what you announced in first post.
/Quote

Think before calling all pll hypocrits.

Ace
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 21:19   #75
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Re: FAnG situation

A sad situation indeed. To see a hard-working HC quit the game over such obviously personally important issues as this is not something anyone wishes to see. One hopes that people take note for the future of the individuals involved in this. I'd hope that both sides in this recognise what actually happened here and act in the appropriate fashion.
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 21:43   #76
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnyBGood
A sad situation indeed. To see a hard-working HC quit the game over such obviously personally important issues as this is not something anyone wishes to see. One hopes that people take note for the future of the individuals involved in this. I'd hope that both sides in this recognise what actually happened here and act in the appropriate fashion.
agreed, rgds Kj
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 22:36   #77
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by rnd|One
What's it called for a fang hc to pay a bg full of accounts for known ldk cheaters (didn't these same people get closed even in ******** recently)?
I take this one for myself....
First of all, they are locked and not deleted yet, it means that they are SUSPECTED and not guilty yet.
Then all are not LDK (wow 3 lithuanian players are getting locked what a big deal, how many norvegian or english players have been closed this round???)
Moreover those 'LDK' players have been active all round long they were online all the time and I cant believe that they have given away their passwords, it cant be true. They are good and active players and you dont know them at all how can you judge them then?
And finally the people I pay the account for is none of your business, I have paid for about 3% of the PA universe (70 players) because they were not able to do it themself, some are eclipse some are fang some are ldk some are wp, whatever the alliance. At least I am trying to do something positive for PA what about you?
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 22:52   #78
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Re: FAnG situation

lets get some things straight here.

1- no single alliance or planet that has ever won has done this without (as planet) cheating/sharing/multiing or as alliance without having a single cheater in it's ranks. every alliance has cheaters, its the only truth, it is sad, but the truth.

2- noone is guilty until proven otherwise, closed != deleted (yet)

3- why didnt the 'low ranking' planets i reported ever get closed, even when they posted on galaxy forum about abusing the exile bug, or asking for peoples login in pa mails? im afraid just like in every round, the PA team will let the average cheater (no matter reported or not) get away with it and is closing some t10/100 planets to 'make a point' by letting the pa players think they are actually doing something about cheating.

PA is a game with cheaters, has been, and will be, and no PA team will ever be able to stop that, especially not if they don't close the small cheaters who r getting away with it in anonymousity.

Well, to me all of this is deja vu.. same will happen next round :-)
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 23:14   #79
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by rnd|One
What's it called for a fang hc to pay a bg full of accounts for known ldk cheaters (didn't these same people get closed even in ******** recently)?
The thought that WA is a very nice person ever stroked you? I mean.. if there were more peoples like him, PA would have been a lot bigger today.. Not everyone is 'keen' on spending a shitloads of moneys on a game just to keep the community going..! I think you should go sit in a corner and rethink what you said. As someone mentioned above somewhere: Get a clue!
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 23:25   #80
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nadar
Not everyone is 'keen' on spending a shitloads of moneys on a game just to keep the community going
I wouldn't call it 'keeping the community going'. Giving free planets to people with LDKs history is like placing boxes of matches in the hands of convicted arsonists. You can't later claim you were 'just keeping their group going' when the street behind you is in flames.

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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 23:31   #81
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Re: FAnG situation

What part did you miss xhothez? If you read WA's post above you'll see it wasn't only FAnG earning on this. Get a clue
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 23:37   #82
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Re: FAnG situation

What part did you miss Nhtodar? If you read xtothez's post above you'll see it was only LDK being refered to on this. Get a clue!
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Unread 21 Nov 2003, 23:39   #83
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Re: FAnG situation

As I consider you a friend WebAngel, I would suggest you should stop posting on this thread.

I agree with XtotheZ on this issue, and I guess the final closeures will tell.
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 00:09   #84
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Re: FAnG situation

In all honesty, paying for 70 accounts is a really nice gesture and something worth one hell of respect - not everything should be worth the propaganda... but thats as always just the simple opinion of myself

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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 00:33   #85
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by xtothez
I wouldn't call it 'keeping the community going'. Giving free planets to people with LDKs history is like placing boxes of matches in the hands of convicted arsonists. You can't later claim you were 'just keeping their group going' when the street behind you is in flames.

"Get a clue!"
true, but does that also mean you support cheating? that you knew they were cheating? That's what your friend Ohm claims. It's a bunch of rubbish he's saying. Nothing more then trolling, cause like WA told us all, he even payed Eclipse pple their accounts so ...

But aslong as your crew can make up accusations or causes to it, I guess it's ok, not?

rgds Kj
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 01:02   #86
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Re: FAnG situation

I dont often post on AD, but..

KJ u always have to make an ass of urself ?

Let PaTeam decide and when the decission from them is made,do like Ely did and kick out thoose caught.

My 5 cent
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 01:22   #87
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by [Racer]
KJ u always have to make an ass of urself ?
yes
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 01:27   #88
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Re: FAnG situation

Someone stole kjel's login again!

(You missed the 'rgds' from your post)
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 01:34   #89
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by xtothez
Someone stole kjel's login again!

(You missed the 'rgds' from your post)
naughty
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 01:43   #90
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kjeldoran
yes
Nice honest, straight to the point answer. Bit odd for these boards
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 01:50   #91
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by xtothez
What part did you miss Nhtodar? If you read xtothez's post above you'll see it was only LDK being refered to on this. Get a clue!
Did every LDK member go to FAnG? mbopp... afaik: no

and btw... Nhtodar?
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 03:19   #92
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Re: FAnG situation

*sigh* Its sad to see everyone just trying to get there 'stab' in at the so called 'enemy'. grow up.

Unless you know these people, there no basis, bar rumour, of the accusations. Alas its natural to bend and twist things and make assumptions. It just really does make you all look silly.
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 03:43   #93
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Re: FAnG situation

That LEFF resignes isnt honorable in my eyes as he is letting us others down when we need him most. Its 100% wrong HC that resigned LEFF is one of the few HC`s that is actually doing smth.
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 04:40   #94
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Re: FAnG situation

i cant believe ppl r actually flaming WebAngel.

surely he shud be congratulated. no matter who he pays for he is one of the ones trying to keep the community going. without him we wud be ~70 ppl smaller.

surely PA needs all the ppl to band together atm to keep the community going and keep PA what it is (a good laugh with ppl u hav known for longer than u dare to admit, in most cases anyway)
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 13:16   #95
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Re: FAnG situation

well i can vouch for WA on this issue, hes stopped me from quitting pa more than one time and the meetings he organised for FAnG members were often about thinking of ideas and suggestions on how to improve the game of PA.. I am sure that elysium HC has never ever considered having a member meeting just about PA and its future and how to improve it more. lamers.
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 15:37   #96
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kjeldoran
Pple should stop blaming FAnG etc, since we're the ONLY alliance that openly apologized AND did NOT support cheaters so far this round. Yet we get treated like a bunch of cheaters.
First of all: I can sincerly understand your frustration over LEFF stepping down. And i don't know all the facts, but as long as LEFF did not cheat himself nor knew about cheating going on, i think he made wrong decicion stepping down.

However, in reply to the quote: not every alliance have to go public saying they kick cheaters, it's many alliances out there, and i'm pretty sure some of them are "clean". Don't give yourself too much cred. for not supporting cheaters, cause 90% of the alliances out there don't support cheaters, i'm sure you know this. But whats happened has happened, on all sides. Cheaters are closed, and PA moves on, no?
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 16:06   #97
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrunkenViking
First of all: I can sincerly understand your frustration over LEFF stepping down. And i don't know all the facts, but as long as LEFF did not cheat himself nor knew about cheating going on, i think he made wrong decicion stepping down.

However, in reply to the quote: not every alliance have to go public saying they kick cheaters, it's many alliances out there, and i'm pretty sure some of them are "clean". Don't give yourself too much cred. for not supporting cheaters, cause 90% of the alliances out there don't support cheaters, i'm sure you know this. But whats happened has happened, on all sides. Cheaters are closed, and PA moves on, no?
I'm not bittered cause leff stepped down. I know leff better then all of you together and I do play other games with him and we are buildinig a FAnG gaming community nway. So to me, this isn't something I'm bittered about.

What I do regret to see atm is the amount of critics we get on this. I can't believe that there are pple out there blaming the alliance or the HC for the cheaters. Any sane person knows that there is no way an alliance can be 100% sure if someone is clean. I'm sick and tired of pple pointing to the alliance or the HC (like they did with webby and leff).
And the worse part here is, LEFF feels ashamed that some FAnGers failed him and cheated, yet what does he get from the community? He gets pple pointing fingers, blaming him etc.

rgds Kj
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 17:11   #98
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by xtothez
What part did you miss Nhtodar? If you read xtothez's post above you'll see it was only LDK being refered to on this. Get a clue!
Maybe some people don't differentiate.
WebAngel treats them (LDK or not) with equal respect.
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 17:52   #99
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kjeldoran
I'm sick and tired of pple pointing to the alliance or the HC (like they did with webby and leff).
first of all kj you were the first person to mention blames on fang, before then no one was blaming fang or its hc.

Second people here are supporting leff and not blaming him.

Third Webby was not hc when he paid for a hell of a lot of fang members and he was calling for anyone who needed their accounts paid to come forward, he didn’t quiz people on their past he just paid for their accounts. He should have some respect for this. Refusing one person because he/she is from a certain country is racist and I am sure not all LDK members were cheaters.

Finally kj you go on about hypocrites yet you demand people not blame FAnG, have you not blamed other alliances on the actions of their members in the past??? Dont do to others that that you wouldn’t like done to you!!


Do FAnG a Favour, name the Cheaters and be first to shame them, I think we all know who they are anyway but dont give another alliance the chance to. Show People you mean it when you say FAnG dont supports Cheating.
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Unread 22 Nov 2003, 18:41   #100
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Re: FAnG situation

Quote:
Originally Posted by [DDK]gm
first of all kj you were the first person to mention blames on fang, before then no one was blaming fang or its hc.

Second people here are supporting leff and not blaming him.

Third Webby was not hc when he paid for a hell of a lot of fang members and he was calling for anyone who needed their accounts paid to come forward, he didn’t quiz people on their past he just paid for their accounts. He should have some respect for this. Refusing one person because he/she is from a certain country is racist and I am sure not all LDK members were cheaters.

Finally kj you go on about hypocrites yet you demand people not blame FAnG, have you not blamed other alliances on the actions of their members in the past??? Dont do to others that that you wouldn’t like done to you!!


Do FAnG a Favour, name the Cheaters and be first to shame them, I think we all know who they are anyway but dont give another alliance the chance to. Show People you mean it when you say FAnG dont supports Cheating.
First of all, that reply was meant on the pple who found nothing more usefull and post on this thread pointing fingers or claiming this is one big PR stunt etc. It's meant to those pple.

I have never pointed a finger at an alliance for being cheaters, I do point to those that cheated and pple knowing me enough know I don't judge an alliance because of a few cheaters. Yet I've talked to several alliance HC's these past days, and most do blame FAnG for cheating, not the cheaters but FAnG and esp the HC. And that's what I'm tired about. An HC can only TRY to keep cheaters out, we do not possess the tools and means to actually check if they share accounts or not.
Or pple saying WA promoting cheaters cause he payed accounts for some FRIENDS (some were idd LDK). That's pure trolling and I think everyone knows that.

And finally, yes, once they get deleted and are proven cheaters, I don't mind giving out their names. But untill then, PA got this "guilty on default, deleted on default UNLESS you can prove your innocence" standard atm, so we're waiting till a final decision is taken.

rgds Kj
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