is Norway really the best country in the world?

[JonnyBGood]

Originally Posted by G.K Zhukov

I agree Ste.

And nodrog, not everything your grandfather, who worked for IG Farben, told you were true. OK?

Yeah, I think if we can agree on anything it's IG-Farben's massive amount of respect for the twin ideals of civil liberty and justice.

[G.K Zhukov]

Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

Yeah, I think if we can agree on anything it's IG-Farben's massive amount of respect for the twin ideals of civil liberty and justice.

I was just beeing as serious as nod.
(it was a joke)

[JonnyBGood]

Nod is being serious though

[Nusselt]

I hope the norwegians don't take this the wrong way, but Norway sounds like a godawfully boring place, give me the excitement that non perfection brings anyday!

[G.K Zhukov]

Originally Posted by JonnyBGood

Nod is being serious though

If I were to take him seriously, I would have called the men in the white jackets to take him away
So instead, I just mock him a bit.

[JonnyBGood]

But that's what I believe as well



Not exactly, but rather closely.

[Texan]

The Norwegian three-party "Red-Green" alliance, led by Labour former Prime Minister Jens Stoltenberg, said government tax cuts in the last four years have only aided the rich.

[G.K Zhukov]

Maybe Johnny, but you don't seem to be raving mad.

Yes Texan, for once Jens Stoltenberg is true. He's backed up by all the economists in Norway on that point, as its easy to spot.

[Texan]

http://www.aftenposten.no/english/lo...icle702324.ece
I would really go as far as saying that the xenophobia and nationalism is so strong in this country that you almost have a system of social apartheid. Norwegians always come first, always. The only equality that really exists is this: If your are a white, coloured, educated or uneducated foreigner in this country, then we are all equally worthless. The recent newspaper articles here about the blatantly open system of discrimination used by employers to exclude foreigners because they are untrustworthy is a typical example.

I know being a foreigner is tough in any part of the world but Norway is supposed to be an "advanced, enlightened society based on democracy and equality." But I honestly think this only applies to Norwegians. This problem has been occuring in Norway for decades and nothing ever changes.

The rest of us foreigners will draw our unemployment benefits or continue cleaning floors.

Beautiful view though.

James Anderson
Bergen, Norway

[Weeks]

Their welfair system seems pretty cool - although I'm not sure if it's still in "crisis" or not. I like their parliamentry system, it seems less adversial than ours. I have a soft-spot for all nordic countries to be honest. I also like Norse-based languages. I did hear about a 2/3 society though, and I wouldn't like to be a part of that 1/3. But then I suppose the same can be said about most countries.

[Marilyn Manson]

You couldn't get me to live in a place that was mostly cold and empty and at the edge of the civilised world for all the cock in the Pinetree Gym, no matter how good it's social provision was.

[NEWSBOT3]

Originally Posted by Marilyn Manson

You couldn't get me to live in a place that was mostly cold and empty and at edge of the civilised world for all the cock in the Pinetree Gym, no matter how good it's social provision was.

but you already live in stockton ?

[Weeks]

Originally Posted by Marilyn Manson

You couldn't get me to live in a place that was mostly cold and empty and at the edge of the civilised world for all the cock in the Pinetree Gym, no matter how good it's social provision was.

Newcastle.

[Marilyn Manson]

Newcastle is hardly at the edge of the civilised world. Lordy, we were jump-starting Christian civilisation in western Europe up the road at Lindisfarne when everyone south of York was still sucking straw, wearing sackcloth and ****ing turnips.

And I want to get away from Stockton. Hence why I went to Newcastle, and why I shall return to Newcastle in due course.

[G.K Zhukov]

Isnt Lindisfarne some place were they invite any norwegian in for free beer and party?

[Texan]

Originally Posted by Nantoz

Why did you post this, Texan?

It is not a newspaper article, it is just another rant from some unknown person posting on an open, anynomous comments board. It could be you for all I know.

Like in every other country in the world, there excist a measure of hidden racism and xenophbia in Norwegian society.
Horror stories are told of Afrricans that apply for 300 jobs, yet can't even get an interview.
But these occurences are far fewer now than before, and in an international comparison Norway would probably come out quite good.
Granted there's still problems, but they are hopefully improving.

Maybe someday Norway will become the same happy, integrated, colourfull, racist-less, discrimination-less, unxenophobix country as your wondefull US of A......

I was trying to help answer the question that is the title of this post.

[QazokRouge5]

Originally Posted by 1-X

is Norway really the best country in the world?

No, America is. Duh.

[Texan]

Originally Posted by Nantoz

No, you weren't.
And you didn't.
Stupid **** is such an inadequate way of describing just how much of an idiot you are, but it is the closest thing I can come up with at the moment.

**** you, ***hole. And the rascist shithole you live in.

[Ste]

knacker whackers

[Nusselt]

does knacker whackers actually mean anything?


ps ur ded

[Texan]

Originally Posted by Nantoz

Do you really feel comfortable slagging of at a country you are unable to find on a map?

I'm sure I have been to more places than you. Finding a place on a map is fairly inconsequential compared to going there and seeing it.

All I initially wanted to do was point out that conditions in Norway were not quite as ideal as the post was trying to make it seem. Then you decided the proper response was to start attacking me personally. So **** off, ***hole.

Your personal attacks against me are a waste of time, because you don't know who I am. Though you seem to think that everyone born in Texas lives in a mobile home and knows nothing of geography. I think that shows who is the idiot. You.

[JonnyBGood]

I think texan has a valid point here guys. The existence of racial prejudice in norway (I think snurx mentioned it earlier on in this thread although I might be mistaken there) is a negative on the "best country in the world" questionnaire. Undoubtedly it's not an enormous influence, and yes it probably is surpassed by racism in both my country and texan's however I'd like to think we can all judge a man's argument on the merits of the argument itself and not on our views of his political opinions.

[Snurx]

Norwegians, most of them, are ignorant, egoistical, racists and generally shit.

Originally Posted by Texan

**** you, ***hole. And the rascist shithole you live in.

<3

Seriously, thought. Every Norwegian you meet will tell you how great, open and peace loving we are. However, we treat our immigrants like shit and we are part of every war the UN/USA wants us to be in (Afgan, Serbia, Iraq).
The fact that FRP got over 20% shows how ****ed up we really are. This is a party where the party leader has been in contact with right-wing, violent extremists several times (And they love them too, always joining or supporting them even if it's unwanted now that they are big), that promises things every economist i've read slaugthers, and has "cheaper gas, cheaper booze and no ****ing darkies" (althought they say it nice) as their main slogan and attraction.
Several international newspapers have commented on FRP, and particullary Hagen (The foreman), calling him fascists. All the fascists love him (Le Pen sent him a "congratulations" on nationall telly, all nazi forums i've read lately says "hurra" now that FRP is the major rightwing party in Norway, as it's the best chance of keeping norway white) and i could rant about this forever. I trully despise FRP. And the other parties are pretty strict, even the left, comparing our immigration laws to other European countries.

The thing that is maybe even more scary is the fact that most people that could agree with me think that it will all be fixed, now that AP (with their little puppets SV and SP, leftwing parties) got the power. AP started all this shite, this "norway is great" selfpleasing. And they started the immigration laws that just got stricter and stricter and fed the media with the racists and fear propaganda they spew out. I'm trying to get away from this country as fast as I can, it's not really enjoyabale to live in the dregs of Norway. Oh wait, we dont have dregs, thats correct! Sorry, i'm just a leftwing extremist and so called anti-racist.

Zhukov, drug addicts might be treatet like shit elswere, but does that excuse treating them like shit here? Oh, and I'm pretty sure there are many countires that does better things for them than chasing the up and down streets all day, not give proper treatment and encourage people not to give to beggars.

[Vermillion]

When I was at LSE there was a Norwegian woman studying there who was, and remains, the hottest woman I have ever seen, in all the countries I have visted and lived in, in all the many years of my life. I mean overwhelmingly, stop in mid-walk, painfully hot.

Her existence alone surely gave Norway a dozen extra points on the 'best place to live' ladder.


With regards to Texan's entirely undemonstrated point about racism, even if there were any evidence of this endemic racism to be found in an actual reputable news source, please keep in mind that Norway is ethically nearly 100% Scandinavian/ white. The next largest enthic group is the Sami, and there are precious few of them. Like many states which until recently have been ethnically homogonous, they do have some difficulty with immigration issues and how to rebalance the scales.

The Czech republic, where I just spent the last month or so, is in a very similar situation. You could walk the streets of Prague for days and never see a person of colour. Thus this is simply a problem that the nation has never dealt with before, and the national legeslation is lagging behind the west.

This is all a hypothesis of course, based on a similar model, and frankly we do not know if this 'racism' of Texan's actually even exits, none the less, something to keep in mind.

[Blastoderm]

Now we don't get to see a historian posting around here much.

HI VERMILLION!!!

[Vermillion]

Greetings again...

I apologise for my extended absence. My professional life following my move to the UK was consuming rather a lot of my time, and I was out of country researching rather a lot, and, more recently, vacationing. I am giving the GD forums another shot during this quiet moments before Michaelmas...

How have y'all been?

[sigrid]

now thats a long time ago indeed, Hi:P

[G.K Zhukov]

Snurx, yes your correct that Norway treats its heavy drug-users like shit. We also treat people with serious mental problems like shit. And I could go on.
The UN survey isnt messuring everything. And its also quite relative.
Going abroad will find you the same problems, only more of them. In many countries in europe they have just given up on drugs and so on. And if your doing manual labour, Norway is definitivly the place to be, atleast for the time.

FRP has been playing on whatever can get them votes (lower taxes, lower price on booze and petrol, or racism). Since they could only get so much votes on racism, and it excluded them from cooperation with other parties in the parlament, they have tuned it down and excluded the most well known racists from their party (however they got cought using a nazi as a political advisor just recently).

Vermillions point is very valid. Norway is very white. We have a very small part of the population who are from outside scandinavia. And our women are fine

[Ste]

What's the suicide rate out there nowadays?

[Duncan]

Originally Posted by Vermillion

please keep in mind that Norway is ethically nearly 100% Scandinavian/ white.

Yes, because of Norway's racist/xenophobic immigration policies.

Norwegians have discovered the real secret on how to become the best country in the world. And from your own mouths, how to keep the finest woman ;]

Out of curiosty though, what do you think will happen when Norway runs out of oil?

[Deepflow]

Originally Posted by Nantoz

No, you weren't.
And you didn't.
Stupid **** is such an inadequate way of describing just how much of an idiot you are, but it is the closest thing I can come up with at the moment.

it sounds as if Nantoz' nationalism is rearing its ugly head once more.

you really need to keep an eye on that.

[JonnyBGood]

I see norway now has an apparently left-wing (god alone only knows what they're calling that these days) coalition in power of Socialist Left, Labour and the Centre party. The far right Progress party (I'm assuming these are the free market supporting racists we're hearing so much about) is now the second biggest party. No doubt this will be leading to some more rather boring news from norway about meaningless tax increases and social welfare assistance. Also hello vermillion, GD was a duller place in your absence.

[Vermillion]

Originally Posted by Whitetrash

Yes, because of Norway's racist/xenophobic immigration policies.

While I am no expert on the subject, a quick look at statistics on the topic shows that this is quite a questionable statement.

In terms of percentage of asylum seeks granted asylum, Norway ranks 7th in the world, behind Denmark, Canada, Finland, Sweden, United States and the UK, but ahead of every other nation in Europe.

Its net immigration rate is 2.09 migrant(s)/ per 1,000 population, again one of the higher numbers in Europe. Of course that number consists of all foreign immigration, not just visible minority immigration. In terms of new citizenships handed out per Capita, it is 12th in the world.

However, in terms of Norway as a target for immigration, it is relatively low; Norway receives a tiny percentage of the annual asylum claimants that France or the UK does. Put quite simply, not many people seem to want to go to Norway, probably because of the climate.

In terms of methods of immigration, Norway ascribes to the common international standard. Birth/ancestry, marriage, extension of award, and business. In fact the Descent clause is MORE liberal than in the UK where the grandparentage is still patriarchal; it is not in Norway.

According to Statistics Norway, immigration in 2003 was 71% from non-western countries. Immigrants from Pakistan formed the single largest nationality of origin, then (in order) people from Sweden, then Denmark, then Iraq.


So... given all this, Norway seems to have quite an enlightened policy on immigration and asylum, more enlightened in fact then most of continental Europe.

Aren't facts wonderful?

Out of curiosty though, what do you think will happen when Norway runs out of oil?

Not terribly likely. Or at least, not likely until the same has happened to the rest of Europe. According to Statistics Norway, Today Norway sits on approximately half of the remaining reserves of oil and gas in all of Europe.

Interestingly, the Norweigian oil extraction laws are some of the strictest in the world, as are the environmental restrictions on this. It is possibly because of these laws that Norway has not had any significant oil spills since 1977. And, when the oil and gas actually does run out some time in the distant future, Norway is one of the first countries in the world to already be planning for this eventuality.

(From the Government of Norway)
"The National Petroleum Fund was worth NOK 1.09 trillion (US$ 170 million) at the end of the first quarter, an increase by NOK 74 billion, or 7 per cent during the quarter. This was announced by the Norwegian National Bank, which manages the fund.

This means NOK 240,000 in savings for each and every Norwegian.

The fund, which was set up in 1996, receives part of the surplus from Norway's income from the country's oil and gas production, and will act as a savings bank for Norway's future generations for the day when nation's oil and gas resources run out."



The more research I do, the more I understand the ranking this country has received.

[Yahwe]

Originally Posted by Blastoderm

Now we don't get to see a historian posting around here much.

HI VERMILLION!!!

well now we get one who loves writing convoluted prose; a wonderful antidote to insomnia.

lucky us.

[Vermillion]

Ah, I see many things have not changed. After my long absence nothing makes you feel more welcome than the initial gratuitous, irrelevant insult from good ol' reliable, predictable Yahwe.

And how have you been?

[Yahwe]

Originally Posted by Vermillion

After my long absence nothing makes you feel more welcome than the initial gratuitous, irrelevant insult from good ol' reliable, predictable Yahwe.

perhaps if you hadn't abandonded grammar, syntax and word meaning your posts would be less awful.

I mean honestly! How is it gratuitous? Why are those commars there? And what sort of a word order is that?

I'm so very very glad that I have no recollection of who you are (save for the fact that about a month ago you posted a thread saying 'Iam back' or somesuch rubbish). Frankly given the quality (and i use that word in it's loosest possible sense) of your posts I simply must have ignored whatever you posted. I can't really see that situation changing.

[Vermillion]

Of course you remember me, you made reference to that fact in your response to my post several months ago. Lying just to score weak rhetorical points is so crass.

Insulting punctuation? Seriously? Perhaps I am mistaken, the Yahwe I recall from so long ago was not so petty and childish.

As for the quality of my posts, I will let them speak for themselves. I quite like the juxtaposition between my post on Norway above, followed immediately by your unprompted insulting little one-liner.

I have returned, but it was not to engage in petty banter with the likes of you, prompted by nothing more than your unchanging need to bring everyone around you down in the vain desire to make yourself seem slightly more intelligent. There is no denying you have some wit about you, in fact as I recall from before I left, you were just finishing your undergraduate law degree. How unfortunate you temper your learning with sheer obnoxiousness. I can only hope you stick to your word above, and promise to ignore everything I post from now on.

Can I have your word on that?

[Yahwe]

you have all the skill of a politician.

[Blastoderm]

Originally Posted by Yahwe

you have all the skill of a politician.

What, lie?

[G.K Zhukov]

To add to Vermillions post about oil/money and so on.

First off all, we have now more gas left than oil (in known deposits).

In addition to the oil fund, there is three other things.
1) The other (old) oil fund. This is not usually reported. Its holds about 200mrd NOK I belive. Its hidden so the population should not start to demand its use.
2) The pension fund (Folketrygdfondet). I belive this holds about 170mrd NOK.
3) The state owns shares in various companies. 78% of Statoil(oil). 34% of Hydro(oil&aliuminum) and Yara(biggest fertilizer comp. in the world). 34% of Telenor(tele-company). 49%8?) of Cermaq(fish-food). And then there is a large sharepost in one of the biggest banks, DNBNor.

[Minty]

Originally Posted by Ste

extremely high suicide rate.
The only people i've met from Norway are quite wierd.

Idler

I rest my case...

[G.K Zhukov]

Seems scandinavians are quite upbeat about the future:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4246778.stm

[Yahwe]

everyone likes the swedes

don't start stealing their glory you lutefisk loving looney

[sigrid]

somebody is getting owned