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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 13:43   #101
laputa
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

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Originally Posted by Texan
What leaders in Europe would you say are more influential than Schroeder?
Blair and Chirac. German diplomacy has always sucked. Plus Germany has no aircraft-carriers. And no nuclear weapons. And no veto in the security council.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 13:59   #102
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

actually id say Blair is the most influential. Chirac is suffering a problem of confidence in his own country and will no doubt be ousted from power soon (recent figures show his popularity at low) and shroeder is in a hell of a mess with unemployment. Plus theres the above reasons too (no veto)
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 14:02   #103
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

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Originally Posted by sniborp
I'm waiting for someone to rip this to shreds.
I'd like to see them try. But no one has.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 14:03   #104
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

The USA can blame themselves for Katrina.

How much, we'll never know, but all the trees cut down in the Amazon rainforest to build their houses (which later get blown away haha.), and the levels of pollution they emit, arent exactly making this world a better place.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 14:05   #105
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

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Originally Posted by laputa
Blair and Chirac. German diplomacy has always sucked. Plus Germany has no aircraft-carriers. And no nuclear weapons. And no veto in the security council.
they don't even have a permanent seat on the Security Council.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 14:06   #106
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

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Originally Posted by sniborp
The USA can blame themselves for Katrina.

How much, we'll never know, but all the trees cut down in the Amazon rainforest to build their houses (which later get blown away haha.), and the levels of pollution they emit, arent exactly making this world a better place.
And all that had anything to do with the hurricane how???????
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 14:10   #107
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Trees in the rainforest suitable to make houses makes no sense either. You need to do a little better than that.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 14:10   #108
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

If anything you should blame the Africans. its because of them most of the hurricans form. It starts as a tropical wave of the west coast of the african continent and forms in the atlantic....

damn bastards and their hot weather
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 14:11   #109
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Exclamation Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Blame Nodrog. It'll make evewryone feel better.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 14:13   #110
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

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Originally Posted by Cuddley_Battleship
I'd like to see them try. But no one has.
while it is impossible to say that one specific hurricane was caused by global warming, a warmer climate means more hurricanes and more hurricanes mean a higher chance that such a vulnerable area is hit.
thats not so difficult to understand now, is it?
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 14:16   #111
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

I think it must have something to do with the amount of knights on the planet. The less knights there actually are the more natural disasters we are facing!
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 14:20   #112
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

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Originally Posted by wu_trax
while it is impossible to say that one specific hurricane was caused by global warming, a warmer climate means more hurricanes and more hurricanes mean a higher chance that such a vulnerable area is hit.
thats not so difficult to understand now, is it?
Not at all, but it is the chance, which isn't definitive. Everyone seems to think that a percentage higher emissions from one country would cause it, which is bullshit. Just a drop in the bucket.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 14:26   #113
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuddley_Battleship
Just a drop in the bucket.
A big drop though. An unnecessary one, too.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 14:30   #114
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Still not enough to make a real difference. Plus even if we were more efficient, oil prices would drop and third world countries would pick up the slack by being able to afford more.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 14:40   #115
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

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Originally Posted by Cuddley_Battleship
Still not enough to make a real difference.
Maybe, yes. But if the States would at least try to be not so wasteful the Europeans would react only with compassion and not with Schadenfreude.

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Originally Posted by Cuddley_Battleship
Plus even if we were more efficient, oil prices would drop and third world countries would pick up the slack by being able to afford more.
Huh? I do not understand.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 14:44   #116
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuddley_Battleship
Not at all, but it is the chance, which isn't definitive. Everyone seems to think that a percentage higher emissions from one country would cause it, which is bullshit. Just a drop in the bucket.
ofc it isnt definitive. however, if there are suddenly , lets say, 10 big storm per year where before there was only one, you have to admit that the chance are siginificantly higher.
and no, noone here says its only the emissions from the us, the point is that produces a lot more greenhouse gasses per capita than any other country and while others at least tried to do something you people dont do a shit at all.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 15:06   #117
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wu_trax
ofc it isnt definitive. however, if there are suddenly , lets say, 10 big storm per year where before there was only one, you have to admit that the chance are siginificantly higher.
and no, noone here says its only the emissions from the us, the point is that produces a lot more greenhouse gasses per capita than any other country and while others at least tried to do something you people dont do a shit at all.
There's still no proof. I agree that burning that much shit into the atmosphere isnt a good thing, but it is absolutely preposterous to think that 'we brought it on ourselves'. It shows how desperate people are to get in a few cheap shots at those they love to hate.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 15:37   #118
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Exclamation Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wu_trax
while it is impossible to say that one specific hurricane was caused by global warming, a warmer climate means more hurricanes and more hurricanes mean a higher chance that such a vulnerable area is hit.
thats not so difficult to understand now, is it?
I don't believe that the relationship between global warming and hurricanes is that well understood. Furthermore, there's little evidence that either the number or severity of hurricanes is increasing. In the past 3 decades (1970s, 1980s and 1990s) both the numbers and severities of hurricanes striking the US mainland have been below average (based on 150 years of data). Global warming may eventually lead to more hurricanes and/or more severe hurricanes hitting the US, but it doesn't appear to have done so yet.

One factor that has changed is a substantial increase in human development in coastal areas in the US (and worldwide for that matter). Far more homes and businesses are closer to the ocean than ever before. Thus the damage caused by hurricanes may increase regardless. And what gets noticed, and reported, and remembered is the damage caused by hurricanes; not the hurricanes themselves.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 16:44   #119
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

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Originally Posted by laputa
Blair and Chirac. German diplomacy has always sucked. Plus Germany has no aircraft-carriers. And no nuclear weapons. And no veto in the security council.
Very good post. Please notice the part of my post from earlier that you snipped after quoting me. Also please note the order in which I listed them.

I think Blair, Chirac and Schroeder are the most influential leaers in Europe. Putin, too, if you consider Russia to be in Europe. I am not making a mistake. I am calling it the way I see it. Perhaps you see things differently. What leaders in Europe would you say are more influential than Schroeder?
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 17:11   #120
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

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Originally Posted by Texan
But since the treaty has no actual value, there is no way to know if the United States would sign the treaty if it had value. Except the United States has signed many other environmental treaties that do have value.
you've lost our trust.
we do not believe that the present administration will do anything about climate change. we've seen too much evidence.

you can try to argue out of this situation if you want. but the fact is that you've lost trust.


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Originally Posted by Texan
I think Blair, Chirac and Schroeder are the most influential leaers in Europe. Putin, too, if you consider Russia to be in Europe. I am not making a mistake. I am calling it the way I see it. Perhaps you see things differently. What leaders in Europe would you say are more influential than Schroeder?
German Environmental Minister Jürgen Trittin made the comments.

If you bothered to read the facts. just once, then it might make it easier for us to believe you actually have a point. as it is it looks like you are doing the standard reaction of:

someone criticised something american + i am an american = they are wrong and must be attacked

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Originally Posted by Texan
I think it has been proved worng many, many times. It is only that the "school of thought" you are discussing is not really a "school of thought," but a bunch of hysterical wackos who refuse to allow facts to interfere with their "thoughts."
a bunch of hysterical wackos .... any one who dares to criticise america is instantly dismissed as an hysterical wacko.

do you have any idea what form anti american feeling takes in Britain? We don't flag burn and froth at the mouth. we sigh, we feel disapointed and we laugh at you as much as we can.

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Originally Posted by Texan
Refusing to sign one lousy (and I mean very lousy) treaty does not exactly equate to never. I think you need to search out a list of the environmental treaties the United States has signed. I'm sure you are familiar with the CIA World Fact Book. You can find a list there. Or you can probably find some far left blog that claims the United States has broken every treaty it has ever signed, even though none of those treaties deal with the environment. Just missile defense, nuclear proliferation, testing and other defense-related treaties.
your argument here seems to be:
"just because we didn't sign this environmental treaty, we might sign others. we wouldn't breach an environmental treaty either. we only breach nuclear proliferation and ballistic missle treaties"

are you insane?
do you not realise, did it never occur to you, that breaking a nuclear proliferation treaty or a ballistic missle treaty is worse than breaking an environmental treaty?

so you're trying to defend america's appalling environmental policy by pointing out that your nuclear weapon and ballistic missle policy is worse???

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I realize you are not a far left wing nut case, but I'm sure someone will come along shortly to post a link to their favorite blog with all the "facts" on U.S. participation in environmental treaties.
'left wing nutcase'

you've got no idea what the left wing is. but you know it isn't america, so it is bad and anyone who criticises america must be a 'nut case'.

do you people ever actually want to be liked? ever ever again?
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 17:13   #121
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

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Originally Posted by Tactitus
I don't believe that the relationship between global warming and hurricanes is that well understood. Furthermore, there's little evidence that either the number or severity of hurricanes is increasing. In the past 3 decades (1970s, 1980s and 1990s) both the numbers and severities of hurricanes striking the US mainland have been below average (based on 150 years of data). Global warming may eventually lead to more hurricanes and/or more severe hurricanes hitting the US, but it doesn't appear to have done so yet.
so its enough if we start doing something once it does?
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 17:34   #122
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

The criticism is fine, but it always comes packaged with events like this. The fact is that a hurricane the strength of which was strong but nothing unheard of hit New Orleans. The city is BELOW SEA LEVEL and surrounded by the Mississippi river and 3 lakes which are held back by levees. The storm swelled the river and lakes enormously and broke holes in the levees which flooded the city. Even a small hurricane would have done a lot of damage. The reason why the criticism gets jumped on is because it almost always comes in threads like this. If you'd like to argue, post it in a real thread and don't tack it on to something which has very little to do with the subject. It makes you look like a bunch of whiners that are itching to make a quip or two and will use any opportunity (legit or not) to do it.

So yes, I agree with you on the environment I wish we would do more about it (I'd support something even more tight than Kyoto if it were fair to all the countries and someone would actually write it), but relating it to this is 'weak' and hurts your own argument. A lot of us do understand your points and even agree with you, but the points only come up in threads like this one or in bash-fests, both of which are a bit of a turn-off.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 17:50   #123
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuddley_Battleship
A lot of us do understand your points and even agree with you, but the points only come up in threads like this one or in bash-fests, both of which are a bit of a turn-off.
let's just clarify your points, i need to make sure that they're clear in my mind.

So you're saying that criticising america is ok?
and that there are valid criticisms to be made?

but
what you don't like is the threads these criticisms appear in?
that's why you get angry and flame?
because of the 'threads' not because of the ideas?

now this thread was started, contains in it's first post and is titled as a criticism of america.
but that's not valid?
because you argue, it is wrong to tag criticism onto events?
but those events they are just evidence for the criticism aren't they? It's not really 'tagging on' is it; it's more taking an argument that exists in logic and then supporting that argument with a factual reality isn't it?
but even if you don't agree with that. you must accept that any criticism made about say 'america's environmental policy' that is made when there hasn't been a crisis will be met with the counter argument nothing has gone wrong so we musy be doing alright

and you describe two types of thread you don't think are acceptable places to criticise america:
threads like this one or in bash-fests
1) 'threads like this one' must mean threads started because an event (usually a crisis) has occured and that crisis is used as evidence to support criticism
2) 'bash-fests' must mean threads started without an event having occured where the criticism is not supported by recent evidence

now if you're saying that both of those types of thread are unacceptable places to criticise america. you are basicly saying there is no valid place to criticise america

and that. that seems a little bit silly, and i dare i say, a little draconian.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 18:04   #124
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuddley_Battleship
And all that had anything to do with the hurricane how???????
Increased global warming leads to extreme weather conditions. Anyone heard of El nino?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuddley_Battleship
Trees in the rainforest suitable to make houses makes no sense either. You need to do a little better than that.
Trees made of wood. American houses made mostly of wood. Americans cut down trees. Lack of trees upsets the ecology in oh so many ways.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 18:11   #125
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sniborp
American houses made mostly of wood.
something i never quite understood. surely a 'real' house would do better in a storm? youd still lose the roof but i guess at least a few walls would remain.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 18:15   #126
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
you've lost our trust.
we do not believe that the present administration will do anything about climate change. we've seen too much evidence.

you can try to argue out of this situation if you want. but the fact is that you've lost trust.
The signatories to the Kyoto treaty have not done anything about climate change either. Don't give me crap about losing your trust. No one has done anything yet. They are unlikely to do anything in the future. Kyoto is not about global warming, it is about world socialism.

Quote:
German Environmental Minister Jürgen Trittin made the comments.

If you bothered to read the facts. just once, then it might make it easier for us to believe you actually have a point.
That was my mistake. I read the original post at 4:42 a.m., and two hours later misremebered as being Schroeder. It is like him to do something like that.

Quote:
as it is it looks like you are doing the standard reaction of: someone criticised something american + i am an american = they are wrong and must be attacked
More like someone made an idiotic statement with no basis in reality and must be attacked.


Quote:
a bunch of hysterical wackos .... any one who dares to criticise america is instantly dismissed as an hysterical wacko.
The wackos are the ones who make the newspapers.

Quote:
do you have any idea what form anti american feeling takes in Britain? We don't flag burn and froth at the mouth. we sigh, we feel disapointed and we laugh at you as much as we can.
Now you are confusing me. Is the German Environmental Minister based in Britain now?

Quote:
your argument here seems to be:
"just because we didn't sign this environmental treaty, we might sign others. we wouldn't breach an environmental treaty either. we only breach nuclear proliferation and ballistic missle treaties"
My argument is that we have signed other environmental treaties, many of them, and we might sign more. My other point, which you seemed to have missed, is that the wackos claim we break other treaties. We have in the past legally withdrawn from treaties. We did not break them. That was my point. Read a little slower next time.

Quote:
are you insane?
No, but I wonder about the people on this forum sometimes. Did failure to sign Kyoto cause Cat 5 hurricane?

Quote:
do you not realise, did it never occur to you, that breaking a nuclear proliferation treaty or a ballistic missle treaty is worse than breaking an environmental treaty?
Yes, it did. See above.

Quote:
so you're trying to defend america's appalling environmental policy by pointing out that your nuclear weapon and ballistic missle policy is worse???
No. you misunderstood me.

Quote:
'left wing nutcase'

you've got no idea what the left wing is. but you know it isn't america, so it is bad and anyone who criticises america must be a 'nut case'.
I know about Europeans, and I know what people on this forum post. Two different things by the way. You lot are not representative of the European people in general. And the European people are around 10 percent of the population of the world. That does not make the European people politically balanced. I would guess that it makes the European right (I believe that is you Yahwe) left of center for the world. That means someone like Wu-Trax (SPD voter) is far left of the rest of the world. I think I have some grasp of it. I may be a bit off on some things, but I'm not as far off as you seem to think.

Quote:
do you people ever actually want to be liked? ever ever again?
My posts on here are not going to change the way the world looks at the United States. It would be nice to be liked, but we are not going to embrace European economics and run our country into the ground to make a few Europeans happy. And it is a few. I know plenty of people in Europe who vote conservative, like the United States, and trust the United States.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 18:15   #127
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Was that disagreeing with me?
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 18:19   #128
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wu_trax
so its enough if we start doing something once it does?
When you actually start doing something constructive about global warming, perhaps others will follow your lead.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 18:24   #129
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sniborp
Was that disagreeing with me?
I think he was agreeing with you. Have any of you ever actually seen the houses in teh United States, except on tv after a tornado or hurricane? Most houses (that I have seen constructed) are built from brick and have been for the last 30 years or more.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 18:34   #130
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Texan
We have in the past legally withdrawn from treaties. We did not break them. That was my point. Read a little slower next time.
i'm a lawyer.

don't tell me what's legal and what isn't.

otherwise you can keep your head in the sand for as long as you want.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 18:35   #131
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Texan
When you actually start doing something constructive about global warming, perhaps others will follow your lead.
tell me, what others, except the US did not follow?
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 19:08   #132
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
i'm a lawyer.

don't tell me what's legal and what isn't.

otherwise you can keep your head in the sand for as long as you want.
I know you are a lawyer. I also know there are different types of lawyers specializing in a large variety of areas. I bet yours is not international law and teaties.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 19:10   #133
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by wu_trax
tell me, what others, except the US did not follow?
Can you please rephrase the question?
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 21:19   #134
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Texan
I think he was agreeing with you. Have any of you ever actually seen the houses in teh United States, except on tv after a tornado or hurricane? Most houses (that I have seen constructed) are built from brick and have been for the last 30 years or more.
Most of the non-wooden houses are in the cities, and houses normally last for longer than 30 years, so theres still more wooden ones around (i believe)
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 21:25   #135
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sniborp
Most of the non-wooden houses are in the cities, and houses normally last for longer than 30 years, so theres still more wooden ones around (i believe)
Brick houses are everywhere now. Many old wooden houses still exist, but no one is cutting down the rainforests to build houses entirely of wood.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 21:31   #136
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Well of course they arent entirely of wood. But surely many deprived areas (new orleans for example) wouldn't have the money to buy/build expensive brick houses?
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 21:39   #137
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sniborp
Well of course they arent entirely of wood. But surely many deprived areas (new orleans for example) wouldn't have the money to buy/build expensive brick houses?
I don't really know about New Orleans. I have not seen a house built of wood in many years. I have only seen brick houses since the 1970's.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 21:46   #138
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by sniborp
The USA can blame themselves for Katrina.

How much, we'll never know, but all the trees cut down in the Amazon rainforest to build their houses (which later get blown away haha.), and the levels of pollution they emit, arent exactly making this world a better place.
1. Most of the destruction of the rain forest in South America is caused by slash and burn agriculture in the Amazon basin. Areas are burned off to create new places to farm on a subsitance level. It is done by indigenous peoples who don't care that the fires, once started burn over huge areas. They have their new fields. They do not do this at the request of the US.

2. The US is a wood exporter not an importer, mostly to Japan, which has driven up the price of lumber here.

3. The wood from the rain forests in South America is not pine or redwood or oak or spruce or any of the other commonly used lumber in the US.

4. The building of US houses is completely unrelated to what is happening to the rain forest in the Amazon.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 21:49   #139
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

I dunno if theyre to blame for the hurricane , but theyre definetely to blame for building a city below sea level with two huge **** off sea-bearing lakes on their borders.

New Orleans is now the Blub Easy. And itll never be the same again.

Now lets see if the need for $26 billion in government aid is enough for him to stop funding the war in Iraq and look a little closer to home.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 21:51   #140
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Okay :/


But they shouldnt be living in wooden houses in 'tornado alley'.

Nor being so wasteful with their energy
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 22:12   #141
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yahwe
let's just clarify your points, i need to make sure that they're clear in my mind.

So you're saying that criticising america is ok?
and that there are valid criticisms to be made?

but
what you don't like is the threads these criticisms appear in?
that's why you get angry and flame?
because of the 'threads' not because of the ideas?

now this thread was started, contains in it's first post and is titled as a criticism of america.
but that's not valid?
because you argue, it is wrong to tag criticism onto events?
but those events they are just evidence for the criticism aren't they? It's not really 'tagging on' is it; it's more taking an argument that exists in logic and then supporting that argument with a factual reality isn't it?
but even if you don't agree with that. you must accept that any criticism made about say 'america's environmental policy' that is made when there hasn't been a crisis will be met with the counter argument nothing has gone wrong so we musy be doing alright

and you describe two types of thread you don't think are acceptable places to criticise america:
threads like this one or in bash-fests
1) 'threads like this one' must mean threads started because an event (usually a crisis) has occured and that crisis is used as evidence to support criticism
2) 'bash-fests' must mean threads started without an event having occured where the criticism is not supported by recent evidence

now if you're saying that both of those types of thread are unacceptable places to criticise america. you are basicly saying there is no valid place to criticise america

and that. that seems a little bit silly, and i dare i say, a little draconian.
I believe that what most Americans find distressing in many of the posts which are critical of the US in a thread like this is the gloating nature of many of the comments. Our country, which we love as much as you love yours, has just undergone the largest environmental disaster in the history of our nation. Regarless of whether or not we are profligate in our ways, gloating over tragedy (not your post but others) is unseemly. The Germans have a word for it but then they would wouldn't they?

It is about like going to the funeral of a friends loved one and saying well he/she deserved to die because they were always smoking. It could be true but it is still a nasty thing to say and not likely to be appreciated by the friend. It is made ever so much more personal.

Even in the second type of thread, there is usually a very definite inclination toward saying well the United States is shit and if it weren't for them this would be a paradise. Again, this may or may not be true but it is not the best way to approach someone with a complaint or an argument.

This having been said, I will also say that from time to time, each of us on GD over-react to criticisim of not only ourselves but of those things which we cherish.

I think everyone would do well to try and determine what their purpose is in particular posts.

If to persuade? Then try to be persuasive and don't react angrily when you aren't successful

If to anger? Then be as nasty and confrontational as possible. Don't be surprised when people respond as nasty an confrontationally as possible.

If to shame? Then try to rub the other person's nose in it as hard and as long as possible, don't allow them any room to save face. However, don't be surprised when they do not say thank you.

If you want to say that the US does not have as enlightened a policy, in your opinion, as the European community, you may be right. However, I may be unconvinced.

Lastly, I would point out to the community that if a Christer were to make a similar post on the basis that it was god's punishment, most of you would go absolutely ballistic in response.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 22:45   #142
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

by assuming, as americans seem to tend to do, the poise of the wounded or the unjustly attacked, they are claiming a right. they claim a position of power.

we none americans, we lesser mortals, are not allowed to speak freely to the great united states. we must cow tow. we must worry terribly about your oh so delicate feelings.

it smacks of an american self belief of superiority.

are you feelings greater than our own? Is your pain greater than ours?

It also smacks of disigenuity. your media is robbing the suirvivors of that poor city of their dignity as we speak. the latent and inherent racism has already been demonstrated in the other thread. has your army mobilised yet? have you sent aid? food? doctors? the mayor of new orleans can't even get enough buses for god sake. you knew this was coming and like spoilt children you have done nothing to prevent a crisis turning into a disaster. this is how you treat your own kind and you have the gall to tell me it is 'insensitive' to criticise now?

forgive me if i am not moved by such crocodile tears.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 23:12   #143
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Why aren't the other american posters more like DDA?
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 23:18   #144
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vampire_lestat
Why aren't the other american posters more like DDA?
Because there are bad americans, and good americans.
unfortunately the bad ones tend to be the most vocal

its the same in most countries too. You dont judge britain for instance, on the Neds, Chavs, Scum etc.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 23:20   #145
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

but they don't post on the forums do they?

I do judge scotland on dace though.
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Unread 1 Sep 2005, 23:20   #146
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil^
Because there are bad americans, and good americans.
unfortunately the bad ones tend to be the most vocal

its the same in most countries too. You dont judge britain for instance, on the Lib Dems, Labour, Scum etc.
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Unread 2 Sep 2005, 00:00   #147
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

but labour ARE scum, so shouldnt they be under the same word?
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Unread 2 Sep 2005, 00:06   #148
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

lib dem may be on the whole pathetic, but my local mp is a top bloke.
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Unread 2 Sep 2005, 00:10   #149
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dda
1. Most of the destruction of the rain forest in South America is caused by slash and burn agriculture in the Amazon basin. Areas are burned off to create new places to farm on a subsitance level. It is done by indigenous peoples who don't care that the fires, once started burn over huge areas. They have their new fields. They do not do this at the request of the US.
Sorry, but your mostly wrong here.
The indigenous people are not growing in numbers, rather declining.

It's the poor brazilians, having no land of their own, who's the worst offenders. Driven by extreme poverty, they are moving into new areas.
Also there is also wealthier people who uses the Amazonas as a source for cheap wood or large plantations.

As USA have f***** up South America for decades*, the USA have a responsibility for the ammount of poor people and the lack of strong states. And therefore, a certain resposibility for the deforestation of Amazonas.

* Not only Chile, Guatemala, El Salvador, Argentina etc, but also Brazill.
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Unread 2 Sep 2005, 00:19   #150
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Re: USA can blame themselves for Katrina?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Texan
The signatories to the Kyoto treaty have not done anything about climate change either. Don't give me crap about losing your trust. No one has done anything yet. They are unlikely to do anything in the future. Kyoto is not about global warming, it is about world socialism.


More like someone made an idiotic statement with no basis in reality and must be attacked.



The wackos are the ones who make the newspapers.


I know about Europeans, and I know what people on this forum post. Two different things by the way. You lot are not representative of the European people in general. And the European people are around 10 percent of the population of the world. That does not make the European people politically balanced. I would guess that it makes the European right (I believe that is you Yahwe) left of center for the world. That means someone like Wu-Trax (SPD voter) is far left of the rest of the world. I think I have some grasp of it. I may be a bit off on some things, but I'm not as far off as you seem to think.

Ive just underlined a few things I felt was a bit.... weird.

As a communist, Im confused that nobody of my party comrades have told me that Kyoto was about world socialism. Thanks for clearing that and a few other things up Texan.
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