Thread: G to the De-tox
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Unread 29 Jul 2008, 19:22   #37
All Systems Go
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Re: G to the De-tox

Reading some of the other posts has made no sense to me, espcially as I didn't read this one first. I'm going over some old ground, but I don't care.

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Originally Posted by Prover View Post
my spiritual experiences, (b) learn in an open-minded environment, (c) practice my evangelicalism.
What is your background? Were you raised in a religious family?

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This will facilitate a holistic approach to understanding the big picture, though we can't fully understand it during our time. It is a paradox to be thinking in 4D.
What is 4D thinking? Why is it a paradox?

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Yet we can infer within our limits some of what it entails. The more we look at paradoxes the more we come to the ineffable, and vice versa.
How so? The complexity of language or a lack of understanding? Or something else?

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Modern thought has mostly been dualistic as a result of what was normally 3D-thinking (modern science approves this with innumerable evidence),
Doesn't careful inspection of particles and shit reject dualism? Isn't it only kept as a simplification?

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but now it is expanding outward as we pervade the scope of time (as a continuous spectrum).
Making 4D thought?

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A most illustrative method is to combine the 3 general aspects we see of life into one. It's supposed to become an image of order and simplicity in your mind...

The following 3 categories include: Art, Science, & Religion
Isn't this rather arbitrary? Why are these three separate categories? At best, isn't it simply a condition of modern society, a continually altering idea?

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- Each of these are important to an extent in our lives (the whole of humanity). My hypothesis is that all these paths in life search for the same thing.
This is a broad generalisation and assumes all people are searching for the same thing.

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1. There is art: Why?

Nature makes its own art (as science suggests), objectively; we tap into nature to bring out its art, subjectively.
No we don't. This literally makes no sense. Science suggests nothing of the sort. I don't believe science is even capable of suggesting such a thing.

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Art usually provokes an emotional response by utilizing a shift in the focus between simple and un-simple things by putting them in and out of context. This spawns pattern, symmetry, irony, ambiguity, etc - all the aesthetics. If you think about why a big twist at the end of a movie gives us a shock, it's because of a suspension of belief, or a shift of context.
There are many kinds of things art does to people. There is no reason why 'simple things' cannot produce as great (or greater) emotional impact than the big shock. I would go far as to suggest that the best works of art are not the ones with the big shocks, which can be simple compensations for a lack of substance.

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On a larger scale, everything we do and create is a work of art on some level. "Art for art's sake" is partly bullsh*t.
Isn't this a contradiction with your earleir point? If art is objective, then art for arts sake could produce the best works ever? Why does there have to be a greater reason than 'I like to do it'? Does the artist need to understand what he is doing? What about autistic people?

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The very fact that art feels a need to become more sophisticated and interesting over time is a hint to the underlying concept that art seeks for a purpose. Thus, art contains objective light.
I would suggest changes in art are usually the result of the socio-economic situation alongside the history of art up until that point. I see no reason to conclude that art is 'going somewhere' rather than 'constantly moving'.

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When we look at many self-proclaimed "artistic" people, we find a very spiritual quality that has come to be implied with a figurative heart and soul.
People talking bollocks about themselves shocker!

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This type of person probably knows about the paradox seen at the root of our feelings. They have seen a seemingly love-hate duality, until they finally recognized it as it truly was, as a love versus fear scenario (or love with its back turned). Call it the "logic" of love, or in any manner, but both men and women have been putting up with it since Adam and Eve. To put it in one sentence: our expression of art and meaning comes from love.
Never underestimate the ability of people to talk absolute bollocks and for other people to take it seriously.

Expression of art can come from love, but it also comes from many other places.

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2. There is science: Why?

"Cogito, ergo sum." All of science is trying to formulate a complete response to this most fundamental proposition on the philosophy of knowledge. We might be able to infer that we exist, but 'why?' is still the lingering question. So rather than only speculating and reacting with our imagination, we mix it up by investigating natural and material substances where our actions and reality take form.
This is where is gets really messed up. Science gets results. Science interests some people. The pursuit of knowledge/truth is one way. Lots of money is another. Being proclaimed a genius and going down in history for a great discovery is another. These are not all noble goals, but they can all progress science.

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Our logic has been reduced to binary distinctions, and to avoid the dualistic quarrel, further to probabilistic relations. Scientists are trying desperately to reduce the paradox of our overextended 4D-vision into worldly knowledge. This brings about a progressive, if not positive, light into science.
What do you mean by 'worldly knowledge?'

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People have realized a body of knowledge through interpretation of their experiences. As a result of this understanding, people feel a sense of power that comes with it. This energy, if you will, is what makes us apply our education in the world and in society, as we feel a sense of responsibility for bringing it about.
Some people do, others don't. Some even oppose science!

Some might suggest that the material benefits are why we utilise scientific discoveries and the spreading of education is accompanied by methods of social control, so only 'useful' knowledge is passed along.

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(It also seems related to the influx we notice at the subatomic level).
No idea what this means.

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But the important point here is that we seek advancement because it gives us more confidence and assurance in our lives.
A generalisation, and a false one at that. I don't believe people feel more confident and asured now than they did 200 years ago.

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The ultimate goal is to find out what is really true. We look at the most basic feature we know of the universe, light, and in between try to uncover both its beginning and its destination. Therein lies the answer to universal truth.
Could you elaborate on this point?

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3. There is religion: Why?

Religion is more of an intermediary aspect than the more polarized aspects of art and science. It is correlated to many pursuits in both the arts and sciences. And despite its interdisciplinary nature, it has the most simplistic approach to living life.
This is a mockery of both science and art. Religion presents lies as both the definition of truth and of beauty. Religion pays lip-service to both, only insofar as they promote religion.

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This peace of mind that religious faith brings to an individual is more than just reassurance they will prevail in the end.
I don't know if any religious person actually has peace of mind.

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It acts as motivation to go on living a balanced and healthy lifestyle (an art to living, so to say, with the aid of science).
It gives a set of rules, which people choose to follow or ignore as they want. To what extent it has a positive impact is debatable.

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Historically, the basis of religion has provided a mosaic of cultures and traditions, churches and synagogues. The emphasis has not only been on personal development, but on building stronger communities and developing social life. Given these missions, religions hope to unite people together so we can live in peace, if not harmony.
Too general. Too many religions. Religious conflicts seem to disagree with these points.

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Even though churches may turn dogma into distraction, there's no denying they help to set priorities in life toward charities, families, friends, and most importantly, unto God.
They set priorites that benefit themselves, generally speaking. Promoting God, it also a benefit to the church.

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[The latest neuroscience is demonstrating a strong correlation between happiness and intercommunicating in the fullest. Our most profound experiences are largely inexplicable in writing and thinking anyway. We feel the greatest sensations when our emotions become loosened in the presence of other people. And according to this science, these vibes (or electrodes) are vitally implanted in our brains to give us pleasure. This gets lost when we're only exposed to virtual means of communication.]
I'm not sure why you have brought this up, or why you think 'different situations stimulate different emotions' is relevent here.

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I. Summary

a + 1, b + 2, c + 3, ...

Art ~ Love
Science ~ Truth
Religion ~ God

Love = Truth = God

That is my proposition, no joke.

Go ahead and make jokes about my sentiments on this kind of forum, if you feel like it, but it just so happens that that's what's new around here. If you try to subdue your machismo for the time being you might just get some of the picture.
No idea why you have concluded this or what you actually believe.
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