The BNP
 

Since the tv/newspapers/politicians everywhere are giving the BNP endless coverage to try and boost their vote in future elections, I thought I'd do the same here.

From my own viewpoint, I have actually been tempted to vote BNP for many years now, but have restrained (I refused to vote at all last week, or I probably would have gone BNP). And yes, I live in lancashire up in t'north like the rest of the scummy BNP supporters.

But I stayed up watching the elections show last night until 2am or so, and it seemed to me like the BNP were consistently getting 5-10% of the vote in every region in England. They came close to a few other seats (within 25-50k votes in some regions). I think it was the east midlands where the BNP got 8% of the vote - the same % of the vote they got in yorkshire? and more than they got in the north west - but didn't get an MEP through it. But yet its Lancs/Yorks getting all the abuse atm.

One thing that annoys me is the massive anti-BNP sentiment amongst politicians. This country is a democracy, they're a legit party, and they're getting 5-10% of the people's vote (some would say that means 1 in every 10-20 MPs should be BNP ;)) - so stfu! Most of them come out with gems like "the BNP is a racist evil party! But people that vote for them aren't, they just don't understand their policies" - HAHAHAHAHA. The BNP must be the ONLY party in the UK who's policies are known by all. If you ask the layman on the street to explain the difference between conservative and labour policies, they'd be clueless. Choosing which of them to vote for is effectively a leader-personality competition - poor gordon brown.

I myself am surprised the BNP's vote was so little - but I guess now that they've got a foothold in politics, people will take them more seriously and their vote will increase year by year. That is, unless another mainstream party comes in with ""radical"" ideas to try and solve the problems faced in this country, particularly society wise.

Also, politicians that hate the BNP. Do they realise that by sitting on tv going "OMG THE BNP IS EVIL EVIL ARRGGHHHHH THE WORLD IS ABOUT TO END OMGOMG" like retards, they are not only giving the BNP publicity, but also going to make more people in the "hmm i might vote bnp, but i won't"-category more inclined to vote for them.

All that said, although I'm tempted to vote BNP, I hope they never actually get in power - my prediction is they'll be the #2 party by 2020. The BNP just needs to become large enough to make the other parties realise that their liberal views to try and please everyone (but ****ing the country up and doing nothing to solve the country's problems) are shit.

edit: as for my own personal racist views (I like to think this is an accurate description of myself): I am racist against ethnic groups collectively, but not in the slightest bit against individuals, nor do I stereotype said individuals when I first meet them (nearly all of my friends from 1994-1999 were indian/pakistani <3 most left my school then and nearly everyone in my A-level classes were white so meh).

Re: The BNP
 

The only reason they got seats is because Labour voters stayed at home (their vote in pure numbers decreased this time). And make no mistake, they'll be back at the general election to stop Cameron and BNP in those areas won't stand a chance. Much like UKIP voters will vote tory in the general election to get rid of Labour. Because in first past the post, many of these parties don't stand a ****ing chance. Except maybe the Greens in places like Brighton, but even then I think they're being a bit hopeful.

Re: The BNP
 

Your prediction will certainly be true for the next general election :up: But the one in ~2014, I'm not so sure :p Problems in this country are going to get worse, apathy will increase and so will the BNP following. I'm assuming that now the BNP has got some kind of footing in politics, their growth will increase almost exponentially compared to previous years. If only because previously, BNP's coverage was huge (to get people not to vote for them), now it'll be nonstop by the other parties. Any publicity is good publicity!

Re: The BNP
 

Retarded people voting for fascists during economic crisis non-shocker!

Re: The BNP
 

Yes, because we were in an economic crisis in 2004 when the BNP virtually did jsut as well as they did this year.

Retards making retarded assumptions about the BNP non-shocker

Re: The BNP
 

Retard misunderstanding that assumption was made about voters and not political party non-shocker.

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Retard who continues to dig a hole for himself instead of realise he's a retard non-shocker

Re: The BNP
 

And what hole would that be?

Re: The BNP
 

To get the discussion back on track:

I think the BNP will find it even harder to do well in ~2014 because by then there will be even more non-white people voting due to interbreeding and increasing immigration!

:up:

Re: The BNP
 

That implies more people are voting for facist parties now than when our economy was doing awesomely. The BNP is the only such party (that gets more than 0.5% of votes at least).

So your hole is that you didn't realise that the BNP was just as popular (if not more popular) before the economic crisis.

Or maybe you acknowledged you were wrong on this, and then decided to try and save face by nitpicking on me saying 'BNP' instead of 'BNP voters' - which I think is wrong anyway. I vote conservative, therefore I am a conservative (its how I would describe myself). Someone that votes BNP would similarly think of themselves as BNP. Thus making:

just fine!

and back on track: I disagree! -_-

Re: The BNP
 

Uhm, I wasn't really thinking much about the BNP.
I was thinking of the truism that throughout recent Western history, fascists have exploited economic hardship to hoodwink less than intelligent voters.

That is how I believe Hitler came to power, not that I can be bothered to find any evidence. I daresay that most of the people that voted for the BNP in 2004 came from economically deprived shitholes which I would argue backs up my lazy assertion.

Re: The BNP
 

Well, aye, its mostly people with hardships in life that will tend to vote for parties like the BNP. However, I daresay there's plenty of civilized people out there that on the one hand, don't want to vote for out-and-out-racists, on the other, accept that the BNP is the only party with decent policies on immigration & similar things. Or maybe the UKIP has too, no idea - the main parties certainly don't.

If the BNP gradually starts to come across as a serious party that doesn't actually have overly racist policies (I don't consider their actual policies racist ... ofcourse their leaders are blatantly racist though :()... their votes migth start to change

Re: The BNP
 

Well I personally disagree with both Lok and your claims that the BNP aren't getting more popular. I don't know what Loks politics are, but his post came across as a Labour supporter looking for excuses regarding bad election results. I think Labour will lose the next election because the British electorate are too stupid to realise that a global economic crisis is not necessarily the fault of the Labour Party (although God knows there are plenty of other reasons to not vote for them).

And if I believe that they are too stupid to understand that, I think vast numbers of them are certainly capable of swallowing the shite that spews out of Nick Griffins mouth...

It's worth noting that the BNP are not the only far right party to have done well in the European elections. Fascists are celebrating all over Europe.

Re: The BNP
 

I'd just like to clear up the offensive part of your post: I don't support Labour and never have in any way shape or form.

Re: The BNP
 

Oi, don't talk about my MEP like that! :(

Lokken is right tbh (or the tv agrees with him!), its basically supporters of labour (and to a lesser extent, the tories) simply haven't bothered voting. This is indicated by the low overall turn out compared to 5yrs ago, and the fact that everyone's % support has gone up (but not actual number of votes), apart from labour's which has gone down.

Of course, that might not be the correct explanation of the statistics.

And also, the elections were soooo based on the expenses scandal, not the economy. Most people will appreciate that Brown has handled the economic crisis very well - though he might be to blame for it (not the american housing market, but the fact our country was in so much debt). Ok, tories might have done just as well - but then again, they might not have done. Is finding out worth the risk? On a similar note, even the most ardent BNP supporter knows that labour & co would be much better in an economic crisis than relatively uneducated inexperienced BNP candidates.

So I'd argue the economy has hindered the BNP, but the expense scandal has helped them - all balanced out.

Only ones I can think of are holland (their #2 party) and, though not in europe, Australia. Tbh, Australia is how I would like to see England - immigration & such is allowed though monitored, but if you move to the country you have to accept their way of life, and live by it. Just like when people go to saudi arabia, or nearly any muslim country.

Re: The BNP
 

the problem of democrary rears its ugly head...

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I did say I didn't know what your politics were! ;)
But I would expect a Labour supporter with his head buried firmly in the sand to come up with a very similar post to yours.

I think that the true picture is that they haven't got a prayer in the next election unless they can somehow acquire the services of Rupert Murdoch, the Barclay brothers, Max Clifford and whoever wins this series of Big Brother as Gordons replacement.

Re: The BNP
 

Didnt britain get affected so badly by the economic crises due to the lax laws imposed on the bankers from the goverment? which labour was in power during that time?

But they're not stupid when they believe the shite that labour and consev's throw at them!

Politics doesnt work, as it requires politicians.. and all politicians are corrupt, selfish and lazy.

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Everyone expects labour to get thrashed - but the number of seats the tories (who are not that popular) need to win off labour is huge. Can't remember, but must be around 80? A swing of ~7% anyway. It isn't a foregone conclusion just yet!

Also, I mean like last election, more people voted tory than voted labour in england (but england is governed by a labour government with a large majority - democracy huh!) - so labour could scrape through similarly again.

Re: The BNP
 

This seems like a fairly bizzare argument if you're in favour of any sort of representative democracy. The arbitrary boundaries have to be drawn somewhere.

Read up and saw this. This is an actual quote from the BNP's website (from their "policies" section).

I don't really know how you can think this isn't a racist policy. It's explicitly and unashamedly racist by any sensible standards.

Re: The BNP
 

Princeton:
You see?!

Newt's a little bit racist.

Kate Monster:
Well, Newt's a little bit too.

Princeton:
I guess Newt's a little bit racist.

Kate Monster:
Admitting it is not an easy thing to do...

Princeton:
But I guess it's true.

Kate Monster:
Between me and you,
I think

Both:
Newt's a little bit racist
Sometimes.
Doesn't mean he goes
Around committing hate crimes.
Look around and you will find
Newt's not really color blind.
Maybe it's a fact
We all should face
That guy Newt makes judgments
Based on race.

Re: The BNP
 

I've been away.

Please name these policies.

Aren't their policies (and party in general) based on race?

Re: The BNP
 

When the rat came to Australia, it destroyed the basis of life for many indigenous species. Now, we do what we can to stop them / kill as many of them as possible before it too late.

Cant you draw the same line in regards to human races?
If we all interbreed there will eventually be no more blond blue eyed hotties left! I demand to be allowed to fight for my blond hotties! Scandinavia just wont be the same without them! :(

Re: The BNP
 

Well, it was more to do with scottish/welsh votes determining our parliament, whereas we don't have a say at all in their governments.

That isn't even remotely racist. Its spotting a main problem in our country - immigration - and putting an end to it. That means, french people, australians, irish, polish, muslims, chinese, and so forth. Fine, if you want to say the BNP is racist against every single race on the planet, including their "own race", then fine dude :up:

It would also make a hell of a lot of countries worldwide extremely racist too - especially countries run by the ethnics the BNP are accused of being racist against. Or to prove me wrong, you go and try to emigrate to a muslim country and becoeme a citizen there. Good luck man!

"just because they're all racist fags doesn't mean we should be too" or something along those lines will be the reply to that - but again, this isn't racism. Its looking after the interests of your country.

Re: The BNP
 

I don't know if this a serious post I'm expected to make an actual reply to or what. I'm going to go with "rats aren't people" and "the concept of individual rights prohibits you interfering in who other people choose to have children with".

Re: The BNP
 

Trow all people who migrated to Europe out, BRING BACK ON THE REIGN OF THE NORWEGIAN ELKS!

Re: The BNP
 

can I counter rats arent people, with ******s aint people?

Or would that be racist!? :p

( it wasnt a serious post btw )

Re: The BNP
 

Are you saying the life of a rat is less meaningful than that of a human? Some animal activists would be calling you the scum of the earth right now.... while you sit back and think "****ing retard". Thats kinda where we are at now with your wierd over the top views on racism. You should maybe read up on what racism actually is yourself instead of jumping on the liberalistic media bandwagon.

Re: The BNP
 

Okay, so you're in favour of an English parliament?


It's racial discrimination man. If you do not agree you are speaking a different language to the rest of us. Here's a quote from the United Nations Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination

The rest of your post doesn't seem to bear any relevance to what we're talking about. I'm not arguing over whether or not BNP policies are justified.

Re: The BNP
 

You would make a bad republican

Re: The BNP
 

btw I assume this thread is a wind up?

Re: The BNP
 

Oh look we've resorted to wild ad hominems. Here, let me challenge you to an internet joust whereby we each count up the number of times we've encountered the word racism and rate them according to whether or not it was on the internet, while talking, in an academic article, in a book or on tv. I'm on 15923.62. You?

Regardless of animal rights activists I think most animal rights supporters are able to accept the fact that "rats aren't people" expresses a wider range of differences than "Africans aren't British", or whatever you want to say here.

Re: The BNP
 

Well, literally any legislation anywhere at all related to stopping any kind of immigration will be racist then. If thats your stance, and you genuinely think that any such law = racist faggotry, then fine. I will concede to you.

But I still maintain (in that particular policy) that the BNP are being racist against EVERYONE - including their own race. As such, I personally don't consider it racism [ie a bad form of racism] - and neither will most tbh.

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I'm saying there is a problem in this country, and it is caused by mass immigration, something no party will do anything about because as soon as they do, its racism. Re: Enoch Powell.

Re: The BNP
 

I don't think an immigration policy aimed against preventing mass murderers or war criminals entering your country is racist. Just policies based on "race, colour, descent, or national or ethnic origin".

Racism is a fairly vague and confused concept, especially when you compare popular understanding to legal or academic notions of it.

What do you think the problems are that are caused by immigration in the UK.

Edit: for some bizzare reason I said the problems caused by racism there originally.

Re: The BNP
 

Newt does not spend 20 minutes typing out threads to wind up the users of the Planetarion forums! We all know this!!

Sort of makes me laugh how the majority of you are moaning at the working class (poorer families of Britain) voting for BNP, and calling them retards. Isn't that racism/discrimination? it can just as easily be based on the econonic state of a family as it can the colour of someones skin.

Re: The BNP
 

A majority doesn't consist of one person man. And no it isn't racism as it's based on something people actually did, go out and vote for the BNP, as opposed to being something directly related to race, colour, descent, or national or ethnic origin.

Re: The BNP
 

So JBG's argument is that any kind of immigration that stops one race from migrating into another country is racist?

Then every single political party is racist, as no-one (as far as im aware) has been campaigning for completly open borders? and those damm australians are extremly racist for there closed border policy.

the BNP want the borders to be closed or tightend, I dont see anything racist in that? unless you say what you've been saying and call every political party racist (then it isnt just BNP so your point is moot).

Re: The BNP
 

JBG, so you basicly want open borders then?

Re: The BNP
 

Are these all Newt's alts?

Or is this just a meeting of spastics-r-us?

Re: The BNP
 

I disagree. The BNP's policy is to stop anyone becoming a british citizen that isn't already one. So that's not based on race or colour. As for the others - the BNP is being elitist perhaps with regards to nationality and ethnic origin - i.e. extremely pro-british, and anti-everything else. I don't see how you can be racist without actually being racist at something. Unless "the rest of the world" counts.

I'm sure that question is worthy of a phd thesis - someone sponsor me and I'll consider answering it thoroughly :(

edit: Its a bit sad that you chose this BNP policy as an example of racism (when many will say it is not) .. when there are plenty of others for you to choose from that are more borderline - eg, not allowing non-whites into their party (ok, not exactly a policy as such). But then there are all-black associations out there that aren't racist? :/

Re: The BNP
 

So to assume that the lower class only voted for BNP, and consequently call them retards isn't discriminating?

What are you after, open borders or something? BNP merely want to tighten/stop the immigration into the United Kingdom, i don't see anything racist about that despite what their alternate motive might be.

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Shouldnt a british party be pro-british? :p

as thats why they're voted in, to look after british interests.

Re: The BNP
 

If it's based on the principles of race etc then yes. If it happens to do as part of some other set of principles then it's not racist. You could argue that a lot of political parties have implicitly racist immigration policies though.

If it was based on, say, economic reasons or something it wouldn't be explicitly racist. However it's not. It's based on the point I quoted above.

I haven't expressed any preferences on immigration policies. I've pointed out that the immigration policy of the BNP, preventing immigration based on arguments concerning ethnicity, is a racist policy.

Re: The BNP
 

Being 'elitist with regard to national origin' sounds pretty much like the nazis ranking races in order of superiority in the 1930s to me. But lets not a bit of history get in the way of things!

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wtf man?

toot is a racist? he voted bnp?

I fail to see the relevance here! :p

Re: The BNP
 

Shit, didn't manage to delete it in time. :(

Re: The BNP
 

The rest of the world does count man...

I mean even most dictionaries will say something about racism usually involving a belief that your own race/ethnic group is superior to all others.

The BNP doesn't just support preventing people becoming British citizens by the way, it also supports transferring British citizens of non-British ethnic origin back to their "original countries" or whatever way you want to phrase it. Not sure if you knew this, just thought I'd point it out!

It was the first one on their policies page and it's racist. That's good enough for me to choose it heh.


The only person who talked along these lines, crab, said that it was primarily less intelligent people who voted for the BNP (and then said that if they came from economically deprived areas that would support his assertion). That's definitely discriminatory. It's not racist though.

Re: The BNP
 

You dont want to stop immigration of skilled, educated people with equal views on how a society should be.
You might wish to stop certain people from other countries who cant read or write, smokes khat, and in general are an expence.

Thats not racism. Its economics.

Re: The BNP
 

Have BNP ever referred to a points system as the determinism of being allowed in though?
Or will they just closed the gates on everyone?
I haven't personally read through their policies as i'm passed the apple books on the school shelf, however i haven't even heard them suggesting it anywhere that they would even let a Medical Practitioner in?