[football] england
 

well, bloody encouraging if you ask me, although we should really have scored in the first half, and i dont think that anyone did themselves any harm (re: being picked for the world cup) tonight either.


although i do think that uruguay should have had someone sent off just before the end, as that was just silly

Re: [football] england
 

Joe Cole played well. I thought we missed Michael Owen, but as you say, noone played badly.

Re: [football] england
 

Carrick looked a bit wooly but then he seemed more intimidated than bad. Didn't make many mistakes though.

The worrying thing for me is i'm beginning to come round to the idea of Crouch being a not entirely shit substitute come June. :(

Re: [football] england
 

I thought Ferdinand played tat in the first half, but everyone else was :up:.

I missed why the Uruguyans started with all the lip towards the ref - did he do something shit?

Re: [football] england
 

SWP knocked into the guy, the foul was given but the guy started giving SWP lip, some other blue shirt went over, and, quite frankly, SPW isnt the biggest of people, neville went over , then the ref, the uruguayans were being so vocal that the ref actuall had to push one of the players away repeatedly (watch the ITV news i think they are going to show the incident lol)
the guy who the ref has to push away should have been off, no question.


also: why the hell was neville always in their half, some good play with SWP especially, just wasnt expecting it

Re: [football] england
 

He regularly ends up in the opposing half week-in week-out for United so i guess he's just been encouraged to do it more for England.

Re: [football] england
 

I thought we controlled the game from start to finish, there was nothing that could be done about Pouso's wonder goal. Good result. :)

Re: [football] england
 

Ah i saw that, i was under the mistaken impression that that was the continuation from a previous event.

I'm usually critical of Gary Neville, but i really liked him going forward and thought he linked up well with both Beckham and SWP. Him going forward also gave us the opportunity to see a couple of super tackles at right-back by Rooney.

I don't usually enjoy watching a game when England go behind, but i was uncharacteristically enthusiastic tonight.

Re: [football] england
 

to be fair, i dont actually think anyone could have done anything about that goal, as the commentators said, he didnt even step either way, he just launched it, it may be the best goal i have seen all season

Re: [football] england
 

Yeah the goal was an absolute freak goal, amazing, but its one of those goals you can do nothing about.

Re: [football] england
 

England havent missed Owen for about two years, it's absolute madness that his place is the squad is guaranteed when there are atleast four strikers ahead of him, those being(Rooney, Crouch, Defoe and Bent)

Cole and SWP will be match turners for us during the WC
________
Pattaya Heights

Re: [football] england
 

What?
Let me get this straight, you are saying that Crouch, Defoe and Bent are better than Owen?

All in all a pretty decent game from England.
I still think that we play better with one of Lampard or Gerrard not playing.

Re: [football] england
 

It's not about who's better, it's about who is playing better! Its no use taking the best striker in the world in a WC if he hasnt played well for x month's.

The four i mentioned have to work their nuts off in the premiership just to get considered, Owen can play bollox and still get picked.

It's not how things should work.
________
IHNO

Re: [football] england
 

you pick the players that will win you a match.

Defoe and Bent are not proven in Europe let alone International football.

There are plenty of players that play well all season but are still nowhere near as good as Englands first XI.

Re: [football] england
 

i think its called 'the heskey effect'

Re: [football] england
 

looking forward to see England play. i'm curious how they'll perform this time. on a good day they could beat any team, but it seems to me the team overall has too few topplayers to have a fair chance on winning the WC. and then there's also the factor of dealing with pressure, that will be without doubt incredibly high again.

goalie: mediocre
defence: poor
midfield: superb
offence: mediocre

i think the adventure will end in the quarterfinal.

Re: [football] england
 

Joe Cole is starting to look at home on the left side and I also thought he was our best player last night, Carrick put in a good performance, i'm still not sure if Stevie G and Lamps should start together and I would have liked to have seen Scott Parker given a chance. I don't think international teams know how to deal with Crouch and SWP looked great when he came on (imagine how good he would have been if he was playing regular first team football).

Shame Rio can't concentrate for a full 90 mins, we all know he can play but he looks like he can't keep his mind on the job for a full game, personally I would like to see Terry and Carragher given a go. And lets just hope Robinson doesn't bust up any more first teamers in the world cup. (Who will be our left back?)

Re: [football] england
 

england have the best cente-back pairing in the world, even with two injuries. rooney is one of the top three or four forwards in the world (with henry, shevchenko, and imo ibrahimovic, all of who he will be better than in two to three years), and owen has a phenomenal goalscoring record. he's lost what he had five or six years ago, but still: england's weaknesses are in the fullbacks if there is an injury, the keeper (why is martyn not being considered right now? WHY??), and in tactics. I don't think they'd beat brazil, but on a good day, it could happen.

Re: [football] england
 

I think we've got as many top players as any other team, barring (perhaps) Brazil.

Re: [football] england
 

dont mind the dutchie, 75% of what he says is complete bollocks.

Re: [football] england
 

:salute:

Ronaldinho?
Eto'o?
Totti?
Adriano?
Van Nistelrooij?
Makaay?
Ronaldo?
Toni?
Robinho?
Trezeguet?


Rooney is topclass, but definitely not better than players mentioned above.
and if you speak about 'in potential far better in 2/3 years', i can add another 10 strikers to this list.

Re: [football] england
 

"perhaps"

heh.


ah well whatever. who am i to kick you off your pink cloud eh? we'll see how England performs when it matters. untill then i'll shut up about the (lack of) quality in your national team.
as i said, i'm looking forward to England's matches.

Re: [football] england
 

To be honest I think our side might proof to be too fragile to be a high end contender at the world cup. A lack of high tension experience and I wonder if Cocu can be enough to carry our midfield on that department. Defense wise I think this might be a huge problem.

Here's hoping though.

Re: [football] england
 

Cocu, Maduro and Van Bommel to control, Van der Vaart and Sneijder for creativity. if we keep initiative there's no problem. but the point is we have to keep pressure on our opponent (regardless who) as our defence is piss poor. especially our back-positions are extremely weak.

i don't see us getting further than a semi-final, again.

Re: [football] england
 

What is a team you would say has a "good" defence?

After yesterdays fabulous match from Italy, I'd say they're Europes strongest team at the moment.

Re: [football] england
 

ronaldinho isn't a forward. eto'o is the only player on that list who i accept as being arguably better than rooney right now.

and by "potentially in two or three years" i mean "if he adds a couple of nuances to his game", not "assuming he gets eight or nine times better in every way". he is already a consistently outstanding player, with far more to his game than nistelrooy ever ad or ever will have. nistelrooy scores goals, fine, but he doesn't create them. If you mention the unfairness of the offside rule, then at least I can take comfort in the fact that the bollocks you are spouting is not based on watching the sport.

Re: [football] england
 

Rooney has pace, power, accuracy, dribbling ability, he can tackle and he inspires others simply by doing what he does.

In short, he's not the best player in the world yet, but he's better than most of the players you've mentioned above. You can't compare him to an out and out striker like Ruud, he plays more like a Nedved, dropping deep to start things as well as possessing truly formidable shot power, pace and accuracy.

If had to pick a world XI i would definitely include Rooney, Gerard, Lampard, Beckham and Terry.

And before you say, of course i'm slightly biased but they are the best players in those positions that exist imho.

EDIT: i'm not so sure about the Lampard AND Gerard thing actually as for some reason they dont combine well. Wouldn't like to pick one above the other though.

Re: [football] england
 

next to Italy, Serbia and Montenegro also have an excellent defence (only 1 goal against in qualifying).

Re: [football] england
 

I'd say Italy have the strongest defence but considering the absolute shambles that is the German team i don't think this result paints a true picture of their ability.

I'd expect a full strength England, Holland, Czech, France, Portugal, Brazil and Argentina all to be able to beat Germany 3-0 on home soil.

Re: [football] england
 

Rooney's a lot better than Robinho, who is a highlights reel player at best. I didn't actually realise he was on the field for a lot of Real Madrid vs Arsenal, for example. The same is true for others on that list - Totti never really turns it on for the national team.

Re: [football] england
 

Ronaldo:

season/club/matches/goals
2001/02 Internazionale 10 7 Serie A
2002/03 Real Madrid 31 23 Primera Division
2003/04 Real Madrid 32 24 Primera Division
2004/05 Real Madrid 34 21 Primera Division
2005/06 Real Madrid 17 10 Primera Division

not that bad imo.

Rooney:

season/club/matches/goals
2002/03 Everton 33 6 Premiership
2003/04 Everton 34 9 Premiership
2004/05 Manchester United 30 11 Premiership
2005/06 Manchester United 26 10 Premiership


look above and compare Rooney to Toni now:


season/club/matches/goals
2000/01 Brescia 32 9 Serie A
2001/02 Brescia 28 13 Serie A
2002/03 Brescia 16 2 Serie A
2004/05 Palermo 35 21 Serie A
2005/06 Fiorentina 27 22 Serie A


not even discussing about how much harder it is to score in the Serie A than it is in the premiership.

also, to you lot who claim i should see Rooney as a goalcreator, not as goalscorer: why can't i compare him to Ronaldinho then?


this Rooney-hype reminds me a lot of '98.

search on "Owen, Michael". :p

Re: [football] england
 

He also has a broken leg and might not even be fully fit for the finals.

Re: [football] england
 

NOW. Have you seen him play recently? Even ignoring the fact that they're different kinds of players and can't be compared just through goals scored.

Ronaldinho is a creative midfielder, not a creative forward. They play in different positions.

Re: [football] england
 

yes, i have.


and what do you think Nedved is then?

Re: [football] england
 

I was replying to your response to phang, not phalon's post. I don't think Nedved can really be compared to Rooney.

Please don't assume that everyone arguing against you holds exactly the same position.

Re: [football] england
 

as you can see quoted phalon in that post, not phang. :rolleyes:

Re: [football] england
 

Something got lost in translation.

My oppinion of Nedved may be different to Jakiri's, i think that was his point.

You phrased it as if to suggest our oppinions were one and the same.

Re: [football] england
 

no i didn't. but some people first post, then read.

we're going offtopic now. :/

Re: [football] england
 

Rooney will offer a team far more than the other players listed in his sheer work rate.

On top of this he has the vision and technical ability as a striker.

What some people fail to understand is that Owen and Rooney works. Rooney unlocks defences because of his great vision, and Owen can always make killer runs even if the defence is sitting deep.

Crouch is a fantastic option to have to change things. I'm glad he scored last night, as it means he'll be on the plane to Germany no problem at all.

Re: [football] england
 

You forgot Henry. He does fade out in international games and important, big games (bar the Real Madrid game) but he's currently one of the top club strikers in Europe, if not in the world.

EDIT: and you can compare Rooney with him too.

Re: [football] england
 

Not the one I was replying to you slack-brained imbecile. I can quote Leshy saying you're retarded but that doesn't mean that you support the statement because you posted in the same thread as him and you're both dutch.

Some people involve their brain. Unfortunately, you are not one of them.

Re: [football] england
 

No he didn't, he made a list exclusively of the players that Phang didn't list.

Do try to keep up, 007.

Re: [football] england
 

Oh I missed that. Sorry. :yawn:

Re: [football] england
 

ok. since you are my speshal friend on here i shall try to explain things one more time:

when you scroll up, you'll notice i never even gave a reply to phang about the subject* to begin with. (that's why i quoted phalon and not him). i understand this might be a bit hard to understand as phang first made the comment about Ronaldinho being a midfielder, but still i wasn't talking to him in my reply.

comprende? if you have any further questions about the matter you can always pm me on IRC.



oh and please stop using those shitty one-liners please. they make me cry. big :careface: about leshy having said such a thing about me though. :(



*the subject being: "when phalon (phalon, not phang) compares Rooney to Nedved, then why can't i compare him to Ronaldinho?"

Re: [football] england
 

have i just logged onto AD or am i on the wrong forum

Re: [football] england
 

Damn i missed all the good discussions :(

Anyhow my two cents.

I was also impressed by Italy last night and i think they are perhaps the strongest european team at then moment(though i dont see why camoranesi plays, he is imo pretty shit).

Owen is without a doubt the player i would use next to Rooney, when hes in form hes a great forward and a big asset to England. Defoe i am a huge fan of and hes my 3rd choice for England. Peoplem has got to face that Crouch is shit, he is anv will always be a VILLA REJECT.

Koen: as for your dear holland you have a good team on paper atleast offesively, but imo you dont have the defensive strength needed and you also lack a really great forward(ronaldinho, henry, torres etc.). Sure Makaay and Ruud are good, but imo they dont quite cut it versus the best teams.

Re: [football] england
 

The world best forwards ni my opinion is:

Ronaldinho
Shevschenko
Eto`o
Torres
Henry
Rooney


Beneath those there a a myriad of other great attackers.

P.S Ibrahimovic is about the worlds most overrated player. Sure hes got some nice dribbles but he is too slow, too egoistic and is far from top5 attackers.

Re: [football] england
 

we lack a 'really great' forward? hm that one is new...

let's see:

Robben (Chelsea)
Van Persie (Arsenal)
Salomon Kalou (Feyenoord) *possibly, if he gets his passport sorted in time*
Van Nistelrooy (Man. utd.)
Kuijt (Feyenoord)
Huntelaar (Ajax)
Makaay (Bayern Munich)
Castelen (Feyenoord)


i'm sure you never heard about the Feyenoord guys, nor Huntelaar, but i can assure you they are about the best players we have in our league now. let me give a short introduction:

- Kalou has the same technique Robben has. he's 10 times better than his brother is. Van Basten and Cruijff want him to get the Dutch nationality, but a minister is against. it's a major news-item here atm.
- Huntelaar shows a lot of similarities to Ruud in his old days. Ajax payed 9 million euros to Heerenveen for him, which makes him the most expensive Ajax-player in history. so far he scored 24 goals in 24 matches this season.
- Kuijt is the national teddybear. works hard, scores always and everywhere. can play on both the rightwing and striker-position. could get a transfer to Newcastle but refused as he may get an offer from real topclubs after the WC. you could say Kuijt is the Dutch version of Rooney. stats so far:

season/club/matches/goals
2002/03 FC Utrecht 34 20 Eredivisie
2003/04 Feyenoord 34 20 Eredivisie
2004/05 Feyenoord 34 29 Eredivisie
2005/06 Feyenoord 26 18 Eredivisie

- Castelen is the best rightwing we have, part of the golden trio Feyenoord now has. was injured for a long time though.

i don't think Makaay will play at the WC, since he's best at a 4-4-2 system and we always play with wings. apart from that, he also sits at the bench in Bayern now the last weeks.


to summarise things: i think we may not have the very best striker on the planet, but we do have 2/3 guys who should be able to do a fine job there. as for the wings, i can't think of any country that has better players there. not 4/5 of them anyway. :)

Re: [football] england
 

I apologise in advance, but this is one of my pet peeves.

I (admittedly, a Liverpool supporter) cannot for the life of me see how some people judge Lampard to be a better player than Gerrard.

Re: [football] england
 

both are phenomenally good attacking midfielders, but some people feel that gerrard's superior accuracy of passing and strength in the air are outweighed by lampard's better crosses, shots and work rate?